culture wars and my DD(8)

[MiniGirl]

i don't think anyone will argue that the child should have been allowed to read erotica, i believe that the parents who don't censor would never freely hand out pornography to children.

I never said they would. My friend didn't hand this book to her dd either -- nor were they hanging out in that section in the book store. Someone else had left it out and it caught the eye of my friend's dd. However, many on this thread have said they would NEVER censor what books their children read.

All I'm saying is that I do think there are times when it is alright to tell a child that a book is not appropriate for them. This was one of them. There are also others. I will not allow my oldest to read anything too dark or spooky because she has nightmares. (That is why I debated about the Nate Saint book I mentioned earlier.) Each family is different and even each child within that family is different. I don't know the OPs family or children, so I don't feel I have any right to tell her that she is wrong for making the choices she does.

 

[dicar123]

My parents never censored my reading and I'm usually extremely flexible about reading material. That said, I wouldn't allow Twilight at 8 years old either. I've read them and think they reinforce a lot of really lousy things for teenaged girls.

I would allow it at 11 or 12, although I wouldn't be at all thrilled with it.

 

[NMAmy]

I just wanted to add that while I realize she will read these things when she is older. I'm still not going to spend my money on it. There is a distinction here. I'm not naive enough to think that she will not be exploring these books. But, I am wise enough to not use my money to propogate the marketing of it.

Can you see the difference?

I can but I don't quite agree with you. If you feel that you will have a problem with your child reading a certain book, then I think if you read it with them or before them you can then discuss the issues that you have with your child. It becomes a chance to discuss things and share your point of view. If you believe your child will read the book on the sly, then you lose that opportunity. If you feel very strongly about not giving the author your money, then get the book from the library.

I was pretty lenient with dd's book choices. Heck, I let her read The Picture of Dorian Grey when she was about your child's age. I was surprised she wanted to read it and thought it was a weird choice but she and I discussed it as she read it and had a lot of good discussions.

My dd was 16 or 17 when she read Twilight and she did pay for it with her own money. She liked it a lot and, as she tends to do, she gave it to me and asked me to read it. Frankly, I'm not a fan and told her my issues with the books and she ended up agreeing with me when I explained what I found objectionable (it wasn't the vampires or werewolves but the character of Bella). I gave her several other vampire books that I felt were better written.

A book can show the reader a different world--but just because it expands a child's view of the world doesn't mean they are going to follow along in the protagonist's footsteps.

 

[Mouse House Mama]

I just wanted to add that while I realize she will read these things when she is older. I'm still not going to spend my money on it. There is a distinction here. I'm not naive enough to think that she will not be exploring these books. But, I am wise enough to not use my money to propogate the marketing of it.

Can you see the difference?

Also, just because I won't allow it at 8, does not mean that she will NEVER see it. That is just extrapolating my current view onto an older child. When a child reaches the teen years, they have a better ability to discern more abstract concepts. At 8, a child reading about vampires, or ghosts, or werewolves, may develop some fears that are very real to them. I know that after the sun goes down, ideas about what is real, and what is not become blurry to an 8 year old.

I think that you are not giving children their proper due. I have kids younger than that and they are well aware of what is real and what is not. Kids aren't as meek minded as you think. I will agree that Twilight would not be on my list of books for an 8 year old but I wouldn't discount other books that might be about vampires and ghosts etc. Heck I've got younger children who love Ghosthunters and even like to read about haunted places!

 

[NC State]

It's been a weekend of disappointment for my DD(8)...why, you may ask. Because Mommy said, "no".

We went to the bookstore, because DH and I were treating everyone to a new book. I told the kids ahead of time that their choices had to be approved.

She was immediately drawn to the products that I won't spend my money on. This is primarily the dark-themed stories. You know, the vampire, ghost, and otherwise occult stories that are so agressively marketed to children. I've told her before that I won't spend my money on that, and while she is under my roof, neither will she spend her money on that. She eventually found something that is allowed (there's actually a lot to choose from), but she pouted the entire way home because I wouldn't agree to buy her "that other book".

Fast forward to this morning. She asks me if she can have an account on Mileyworld.com. I have no idea what this is, so I told her that I would look at it and then decide. She showed me the site and I see that it has chat rooms and blogs. I'm just not sure that I want my 8 year old to participate in a chat room, or read older kids blogs for that matter. So, for now, my answer is, "no".

I'm sure she is left wondering what she is missing out on. She is a good girl and will obey me (for now). But I realize that at some point she is going to explore these things anyway. I just think 8 is too young.

It is frustrating to me that these things, that are intended for older kids, are marketed to children this young. There are many kids in her class that are well versed in matters that are beyond their ability to accurately interpret. Kids this age are concrete thinkers and cannot discern some of this stuff independently.

It truely is a culture war.

I think you're doing a great job parenting. I was the same way with my daughter. Just remember that you are doing what you feel is right. One day she will be old enough to understand and will thank you...my daughter did.

 

[Pigeon]

I think trying to blow this out of proportion to buy into the "culture war" thing is ludicrous. It's a parenting decision. Period. I'm OK with reading Twilight, but there are other things I don't allow my kids to do, that the OP might be fine with. That doesn't make it a Big Political Deal. It makes it a simple parenting decision.

There are plenty of factors that have divided the country without laying it at the door of Twilight.

 

[The Mystery Machine]

I think trying to blow this out of proportion to buy into the "culture war" thing is ludicrous. It's a parenting decision. Period. I'm OK with reading Twilight, but there are other things I don't allow my kids to do, that the OP might be fine with. That doesn't make it a Big Political Deal. It makes it a simple parenting decision.

There are plenty of factors that have divided the country without laying it at the door of Twilight.

Esp. for those of us that love the genre. I am in heaven with True Blood, Being Human, Vampire Diaries, Demons, Supernatural, Apparitions (rerun), etc...

It is about time the genre came around.

 

[SnowWhite607]

I think that you are not giving children their proper due. I have kids younger than that and they are well aware of what is real and what is not. Kids aren't as meek minded as you think. I will agree that Twilight would not be on my list of books for an 8 year old but I wouldn't discount other books that might be about vampires and ghosts etc. Heck I've got younger children who love Ghosthunters and even like to read about haunted places!

But OP knows her own child and if she fels it will bother her, it probably will. Some of our children are more sensitive or tend to scare easier than others. I know my DD wouldnt sleep for a week.

I applaud OP for making a decision that she thinks is in the best interest of her child and reflects her morals and values. Too many times today, parents will let their children have free reign of the computer and let their children be sicked into something that could ultimately turn out very badly. My DD is 9 and she is not allowed to go on any site with a chat room and I have explained to her WHY (because there could be people in there who are not really children but people who are trying to do bad things to little girls, people who want information from you, etc).

As far as the book thing....my DD reads about 2-3 grade levels ahead and I would not allow her to read Twilight or any of the series. Yes I have read it and I know that in the later books, they get very racy and sexual in nature. I do not think this is censorship, only doing what is best for your own child. If she expressed a desire to read them at a later age, then she can but I personally think 9 years old is too young for that. Also vampires, witches and ghosts may be against some people's religious beliefs and this may be why some children and teens are not allowed to read these types of books.

My goodness, our kids grow up so fast now days. Why do we want to throw things at them that force them to grow up before they are ready?

For all the people who said they dont censor, if your 8 year old wanted to read Lolita or Claiming Georgia Tate (a book about a girl being raped over a period of years by her father) or Push (book that the movie Precious is based on, filled with graphic rape scenes and much foul language), would you hand it to her and say "have fun!"??

 

[Mouse House Mama]

But OP knows her own child and if she fels it will bother her, it probably will. Some of our children are more sensitive or tend to scare easier than others. I know my DD wouldnt sleep for a week.

I applaud OP for making a decision that she thinks is in the best interest of her child and reflects her morals and values. Too many times today, parents will let their children have free reign of the computer and let their children be sicked into something that could ultimately turn out very badly. My DD is 9 and she is not allowed to go on any site with a chat room and I have explained to her WHY (because there could be people in there who are not really children but people who are trying to do bad things to little girls, people who want information from you, etc).

As far as the book thing....my DD reads about 2-3 grade levels ahead and I would not allow her to read Twilight or any of the series. Yes I have read it and I know that in the later books, they get very racy and sexual in nature. I do not think this is censorship, only doing what is best for your own child. If she expressed a desire to read them at a later age, then she can but I personally think 9 years old is too young for that. Also vampires, witches and ghosts may be against some people's religious beliefs and this may be why some children and teens are not allowed to read these types of books.

My goodness, our kids grow up so fast now days. Why do we want to throw things at them that force them to grow up before they are ready?

For all the people who said they dont censor, if your 8 year old wanted to read Lolita or Claiming Georgia Tate (a book about a girl being raped over a period of years by her father) or Push (book that the movie Precious is based on, filled with graphic rape scenes and much foul language), would you hand it to her and say "have fun!"??

I think you are going a little over the top here. Nobody is saying they are letting their kids read things like the Kamasutra or other clearly adult books like you have mentioned. I also agreed that Twilight was not something I personally would let a child read but that is only because of the sexual themes which I personally think are too much for a child that young to understand and I don't think they need to. I also agreed about not letting the child go on the computer to chat etc. We do have strict computer rules here that are not up for negotiation. So I do get that. I don't get what witches, vampires, ghosts etc. have to do with anything. If it is not something your religion believes in then isn't it the same thing as reading any fiction book? Would you ban The Three Little Pigs? Surely it would be impossible for pigs to build houses? I don't get where people draw the line with stuff like that. Do they only read stuff that is non-fiction? Not being snarky but it seems inconsistent at best.
I also agree that the OP knows her child best and if the kid gets easily scared etc. then of course I can see her not allowing those types of books until she is older. I don't get the whole "Not while you are in my house!" thing. The kid is 8. If my kids want to read something I think it too adult I simply say that I don't think that is appropriate for young children and we move on.
Different strokes for different folks I suppose.

 

[golfgal]

But OP knows her own child and if she fels it will bother her, it probably will. Some of our children are more sensitive or tend to scare easier than others. I know my DD wouldnt sleep for a week.

I applaud OP for making a decision that she thinks is in the best interest of her child and reflects her morals and values. Too many times today, parents will let their children have free reign of the computer and let their children be sicked into something that could ultimately turn out very badly. My DD is 9 and she is not allowed to go on any site with a chat room and I have explained to her WHY (because there could be people in there who are not really children but people who are trying to do bad things to little girls, people who want information from you, etc).

As far as the book thing....my DD reads about 2-3 grade levels ahead and I would not allow her to read Twilight or any of the series. Yes I have read it and I know that in the later books, they get very racy and sexual in nature. I do not think this is censorship, only doing what is best for your own child. If she expressed a desire to read them at a later age, then she can but I personally think 9 years old is too young for that. Also vampires, witches and ghosts may be against some people's religious beliefs and this may be why some children and teens are not allowed to read these types of books.

My goodness, our kids grow up so fast now days. Why do we want to throw things at them that force them to grow up before they are ready?

For all the people who said they dont censor, if your 8 year old wanted to read Lolita or Claiming Georgia Tate (a book about a girl being raped over a period of years by her father) or Push (book that the movie Precious is based on, filled with graphic rape scenes and much foul language), would you hand it to her and say "have fun!"??

No one here had said they would let an 8 year old read Twilight--what we are commenting on is that she has forbid her daughter to EVER read the books while living in her house--BIG DIFFERENCE.

 

[Ember]

If there is anyone in her class reading it, she may get her hands on it anyway. I know in my school the books were passed around quite a bit and I've seen them in the hands of the grade 4's. And if this is the case, having told her not to read it, it will be the first thing she does.

This sometimes backfires, of course. I was told I would never read "War and Peace" in about grade 9... Yep. Most boring book ever. I read it, but I couldn't tell you much about it expect that there were too many darn characters and I had lists of them to keep them straight.

 

[MiniGirl]

No one here had said they would let an 8 year old read Twilight--what we are commenting on is that she has forbid her daughter to EVER read the books while living in her house--BIG DIFFERENCE.

Actually, people have said they would -- indirectly. Those who said they would not censor the books their children read are saying they would allow their 8 yo dd to read Twilight.

If we are going to hold the OP to her statements, we should hold others to theirs as well.

 

[SnowWhite607]

I think you are going a little over the top here. Nobody is saying they are letting their kids read things like the Kamasutra or other clearly adult books like you have mentioned. I also agreed that Twilight was not something I personally would let a child read but that is only because of the sexual themes which I personally think are too much for a child that young to understand and I don't think they need to. I also agreed about not letting the child go on the computer to chat etc. We do have strict computer rules here that are not up for negotiation. So I do get that. I don't get what witches, vampires, ghosts etc. have to do with anything. If it is not something your religion believes in then isn't it the same thing as reading any fiction book? Would you ban The Three Little Pigs? Surely it would be impossible for pigs to build houses? I don't get where people draw the line with stuff like that. Do they only read stuff that is non-fiction? Not being snarky but it seems inconsistent at best.
I also agree that the OP knows her child best and if the kid gets easily scared etc. then of course I can see her not allowing those types of books until she is older. I don't get the whole "Not while you are in my house!" thing. The kid is 8. If my kids want to read something I think it too adult I simply say that I don't think that is appropriate for young children and we move on.
Different strokes for different folks I suppose.

I believe that Claiming Georgia Tate is a young adult novel, FYI

I dont remember ever saying that people were giving their children the kamasutra either!!

I live in the Bible belt and teach at a Christian school...books about vampires, witches, etc are not allowed! In fact many of the churches around here will hold "Fall Festivals" instead of Halloween because in their religion, Halloween is not celebrated. No it is not the same as reading any fiction book. Many fiction books out there do not have witches, ghosts, vampires, werewolves, etc in them. I dont really get how you dont see the difference.

I think the "not in my house" thing may have been a little over the top, that much I will agree with. I think this sets kids up to rebel later in life. And I suppose that at 15 I had rather her read books about vampires (since I do not subscribe to the religion stated above) than go out drinking and smoking and having sex. Its all about choices and picking your battles I guess.

 

[SnowWhite607]

Actually, people have said they would -- indirectly. Those who said they would not censor the books their children read are saying they would allow their 8 yo dd to read Twilight.

If we are going to hold the OP to her statements, we should hold others to theirs as well.

Um yeah, I thought so until someone said they didnt....I thought I was reading a different thread.

 

[golfgal]

Actually, people have said they would -- indirectly. Those who said they would not censor the books their children read are saying they would allow their 8 yo dd to read Twilight.

If we are going to hold the OP to her statements, we should hold others to theirs as well.

Censoring and suggesting they wait until they are older a two very different things. I wouldn't censor my kids' books but I would suggest they waited until they were older to read some (well not now because they are older but when they were 8 I would have). HUGE DIFFERENCE. The OP said she would NEVER let her DD read the book--that is censoring, telling your child that she should probably wait a couple years to read that book is being a parent.

 

[zachnsamsmommy]

Well...I'll give you the view of a mom of an 8 yr old (boy) and someone who really enjoys 'Twilight' (please, no ribbing...one of my guilty pleasures ).

I don't think boys are as into Twilight as much as HP or the Diary of a Wimpy Kid books. But...even though I enjoy Twilight, there is some stuff in the later Twilight books that I would be really uncomfortable with him reading. Reading it at 12 or older wouldn't bother me quite as much, I think.

If he did ask to read Twilight, I'm not sure what answer I'd give. I probably would just try to talk him out of it...but not flat out say 'no'. But, then again...I was reading Stephen King by the time I was 12, and I turned out fine.

 

[MiniGirl]

Censoring and suggesting they wait until they are older a two very different things. I wouldn't censor my kids' books but I would suggest they waited until they were older to read some (well not now because they are older but when they were 8 I would have). HUGE DIFFERENCE. The OP said she would NEVER let her DD read the book--that is censoring, telling your child that she should probably wait a couple years to read that book is being a parent.

Okay. I hear you. We are thinking of the word "censor" in different ways. I see telling a child that a book, movie, etc is not appropriate as censoring -- even if I would have no problem with the child reading it a few years down the road. I guess I don't see censoring as a permenant thing. After all, through the years things that were once censored on television no longer are so what is deemed appropriate is a fluid thing -- both for society and for individuals.

Now, you say you would "suggest" they wait. What if they decided not to follow your suggestion?

 

[luvsJack]

Well...I'll give you the view of a mom of an 8 yr old (boy) and someone who really enjoys 'Twilight' (please, no ribbing...one of my guilty pleasures ).

I don't think boys are as into Twilight as much as HP or the Diary of a Wimpy Kid books. But...even though I enjoy Twilight, there is some stuff in the later Twilight books that I would be really uncomfortable with him reading. Reading it at 12 or older wouldn't bother me quite as much, I think.

If he did ask to read Twilight, I'm not sure what answer I'd give. I probably would just try to talk him out of it...but not flat out say 'no'. But, then again...I was reading Stephen King by the time I was 12, and I turned out fine.

This is my thought on it too (and don't worry I have an 11 year old girl and I enjoyed Twilight too!).

DD has not read the books and probably won't for awhile; or at least not the last book. The entire set is here in the bookshelf and she is welcome to read at least the first two, just not the last until she is older. In fact I have already told her that when the last movie comes out, it will depend on the rating and the report I get back from her db and dsil (they will see all of them the night the come out) before she see it.

As for banning books, I am totally against ever telling your child that they may NEVER read something. But, there is absolutely nothing wrong with telling them they need to wait until they are a bit older. Even if dd's reading level is on target for reading a book written for older people does not mean the subject matter is appropriate.

 

[AKL_Megs]

This makes me think about the time when I was about 12 and wanted to read Stephen King's Needful Things which we owned, and had on the shelf of our office bookshelves. My mom said it was "too sexual for a girl my age". I used to sneak a few pages here and there when she wasn't looking. Most of it went over my head.

 

[golfgal]

Okay. I hear you. We are thinking of the word "censor" in different ways. I see telling a child that a book, movie, etc is not appropriate as censoring -- even if I would have no problem with the child reading it a few years down the road. I guess I don't see censoring as a permenant thing. After all, through the years things that were once censored on television no longer are so what is deemed appropriate is a fluid thing -- both for society and for individuals.

Now, you say you would "suggest" they wait. What if they decided not to follow your suggestion?

I would have let her read it because most likely after a chapter at age 8 they would have put the book down as being too boring. Most of what goes on in Twilight would have gone over their head anyway.