Crash beats Brokeback!!! Yay!

[toto2]

I must be the odd one here. I never go to the movies to change my life or learn anything. I go to escape for a few hours and laugh. I for one love comedies, good horrors and Disney animation and will take any of them any day over a drama or preachy movie.

I never go to have my life changed ! My movie going would almost always be unfufilling. Being touched by a movie is a byproduct of the experience, as is learning. You go see "Life is beautifull" because it is a fun comedy , but you travel to Italy , you see how people live there , what they eat etc. It is a by product of the experience.

 

[conciergekelly]

Oh my, and here I was expecting to be flamed!

I don't think that most people feel like Spoon. I just think that most people on our side of the argument aren't as vocal. I for one think that being judmental, unaccepting, hateful, and spiteful, is morally wrong. I loved your post and think that you are brave. You are paving the way for your daughter and being a good role model.You should be commended not flamed. Keep up the good fight.

 

[RickinNYC]

I was very glad "Crash" won Best Picture over "Brokeback Mountain."

I don't condone the gay lifestyle at all and for "Brokeback" to win Best Picture would be further proof of the decline in morals and values in people. I know more and more people are accepting the gay lifestyle, but just because people are accepting it doesn't make it right.

I was very disappointed the "pimping" song won for best song, the other two up for the award were MUCH better, especially Dolly's. It is very sad to see a song like that win an Oscar.

Personally, I don't condone indivuals who place judement on entire groups of people. Particularly when you likely have little to no personal interraction. Now THAT, is the absolute height of immoriality.

 

[RickinNYC]

In my original post I said that there were major problems in the fifties, but, people weren't afraid to go outside at night. I would like to bring THAT part back, duh. Stop trying to twist my words. By the way, I'm part Jewish and part Native American, so my ancestors had to put up with things you wouldn't believe. My great grandmother was raised on a reservation, that wasn't lovely. My great grandfather was a jew in the backwoods of West Virginia, what fun. Today I have alot more harrasment issues with being female than being jewish or indian. And I think it's a real joke that YOU middle class white people are telling me about discrimination .

Given your family's history, I would expect someone like you to be a bit more sensitive to minorities.

And by the way, "duh" was completely unneccessary and pretty immature. If your thought flow were so clear, a number of highly intelligent DIS'ers wouldn't have requested clarification.

 

[RickinNYC]

Chuck S I'm guessing your not a big John Wayne fan . Cowboys have ALWAYS been portrayed in American mythology as loners. Every cowboy book you read has the bachelor for life character in it. This wasn't considered strange, hell no real man wants to be tied down to some woman and a passle of kids. So, it wasn't necessary for them to marry to hide their secret from the world so they weren't murdered , they married to hide it from themselves. To prove to themselves that they weren't "some damn queer". That is supremely selfish and dishonest. Why do you keep making excuses for it?

You clearly need to realize the state of today's society still does not allow the freedom to love whom one chooses. You brought up Matthew Shephard in an earlier post. That wasn't that long ago. The fear being of beaten or killed still exists in the gay community. In fact, I do not know a single gay man or lesbian who does not harbor a fear of becoming a victim of a bashing to one extent or another. Whether mild or escalated, that fear is still alive and well. I live in New York City, and "f-g bashings" do still occur whether folks like to admit it or not.

And it's pretty obvious you don't or won't admit it. Fear still exists in the gay community, and the root cause of that fear is indeed at the feet of society at large. Once homosexuality is recognized as not being the root of all evil as some feel, or the acceptance thereof is not seen as the end of society as we know it, that fear will still be there. There are men and women who would rather see a gay man be murdered than married.

So what does that fear of reciminations do to a person? It makes them assimiliate themselves to the norms established by society. Hence, a gay man will remain in the closet, marry a woman, have a family. Is that wrong? You're damn right it is. It's wrong for that man to deny himself the ability to be truly in love. It's wrong to the woman to be married to a man whom she thinks is madly in love with her. It's wrong for the children. It's wrong, period.

I know a few women, from real life and on the DIS, who have been hurt, if not emotionally destroyed, because the man they thought they knew, left them and came out later. Whether "later" was a couple of years into their marriage, or 20 years into it. It was and is devastating.

Hopefully one day, dear poster, you will recognize and understand that your view of the world is rather rose colored and people are people. Don't judge, it doesn't become you.

 

[RickinNYC]

I don't disagree (gosh I love those double negatives), but if you are gonna live the lie, then live the lie. Once you have other people depending on you and trusting you, you only have two choices. The two characters were NOT WILLING TO PUT THERE OWN FEELINGS ASIDE. In my mind, they were selfish.

Most of the people on this board are females. Just for a second, put aside the point of view that the director gave you. My point is, imagine yourself as the wife of one of the leads.

Dude, see my post above.

And to your second point, I aint a chick.

 

[RickinNYC]

This is why the leader of some gay rights group I can't think of the name of (doesn't really pertain to me didn't pay that much attention) has said that their "agenda" (sorry if he didn't send you all the memo) is to get gays into the public eye as much as possible. The more gays are seen in TV shows and movies, the more they will be percieved as normal to all those straight people out there. I kid you not. If I can find the link I'll post it. Now I'm not saying that gays shouldn't be accepted into society, what I am saying is that if he can understand how this works, why can't you? My problem with this is the pimp culture being validated and adulterery being validated because they were gay and had to . Sorry if I jumped around to much for some of you to follow. Real life is complicated.

I think that person was from the Human Rights Campaign. As for that tactic, would your rather my people go door to door in black suits?

 

[mickeyfan2]

I think that person was from the Human Rights Campaign. As for that tactic, would your rather my people go door to door in black suits?

Oh please, I need some new faces to slam the door on!!!!

 

[toto2]

When we paint with a wide brush some people , we dont see things. The argument that the caracteres from Brokeback are immoral because they cheat on there wifes . We al, agree that cheating is bad. But we cannot paint everybody the same way , and yes , I think that you have to look into these people lifes and try to understand. The movie is set in a place and time are integral part of the story.

I've just found a very interesting piece about "Brokeback marriages" that shed a lot of light on this situation. here is the link :

http://aolsvc.news.aol.com/news/article.adp?id=20060307093709990001

 

[va32h]

I was very disappointed the "pimping" song won for best song, the other two up for the award were MUCH better, especially Dolly's. It is very sad to see a song like that win an Oscar.

I guess you don't know that Dolly's song came from the movie Transamerica, which is about a male to female transgendered person, or you'd be hating on that too.

 

[T&KHayes]

Here's the thing though, we are not going to go door to door, that would be just way to convenient for some of you homophobes who would love to get us "immorals" on your property so that you can bash us to your liking!

I just don't understand the mentality of homophobic, judgemental, holier than thou people. Trust me we do not want you in our lives any more than you want us in yours. But we are an unflinching group of people and we will not be silenced until we have the same basic human rights as the rest of you.

To all of you Cool Straight People (CSP) who have posted here on this thread, , we can never have too many supporters like you!

 

[HoneyPooh]

I know how I feel about this subject but I'm just not good enough with words to make it understandable. Thanks to those who posted so eloquently! Everytime I think we've come so far as a society, I see, hear or read something that makes me cringe and realize that we haven't come as far as I had hoped in so many ways.

Do we have to apply to be a CSP or can we just decide we are a CSP

 

[dis ms.]

To all of you Cool Straight People (CSP) who have posted here on this thread, , we can never have too many supporters like you![/size][/font]

To spoon full:

I've had some fun joking with you (although, sadly, you appear to be serious), but it's really getting old. I don't think you've succeeded in swaying anyone here with your endless, pointless ramblings. All I've garnered from you is that ignorance is not bliss, because you don't seem all that chipper. What an ironic user name you chose.

All this over some FICTIONAL gay cowboys and a pimp? Ridiculous!

ETA: If either of my kids came to me and said they were gay, I wouldn't be the least bit ashamed. Now, if they came to me and said some of the bigotted crap I've read here, shame doesn't even begin to describe what I'd feel.

 

[nordkin]

Here's the thing though, we are not going to go door to door, that would be just way to convenient for some of you homophobes who would love to get us "immorals" on your property so that you can bash us to your liking!

I just don't understand the mentality of homophobic, judgemental, holier than thou people. Trust me we do not want you in our lives any more than you want us in yours. But we are an unflinching group of people and we will not be silenced until we have the same basic human rights as the rest of you.

To all of you Cool Straight People (CSP) who have posted here on this thread, , we can never have too many supporters like you!

Thank you. I agree totally. We need more people who understand our desire for basic human rights to join us in our fight and speak with their vote. We have come a long way, but there is still a long road ahead of us.

 

[SeattleRedBear]

I must be the odd one here. I never go to the movies to change my life or learn anything. I go to escape for a few hours and laugh. I for one love comedies, good horrors and Disney animation and will take any of them any day over a drama or preachy movie.

DH is exactly the same way (except he doesn't even seen the horror movies...if he wants to be scared, he talks to one of his adult children). One year, we were going to be informed voters and see all of the films nominated for major awards. But The English Patient on Saturday followed by Slingblade on Sunday was just too much for him and we've never been informed voters again!

 

[mickeyfan2]

DH is exactly the same way (except he doesn't even seen the horror movies...if he wants to be scared, he talks to one of his adult children). One year, we were going to be informed voters and see all of the films nominated for major awards. But The English Patient on Saturday followed by Slingblade on Sunday was just too much for him and we've never been informed voters again!

I was begining to think I was the only one. Most years all the movies nominated I have never seen. This year I did see one - Hustle and Flow and as I posted earlier, it was free and I had free time too.

 

[Pooh67_68]

I know how I feel about this subject but I'm just not good enough with words to make it understandable. Thanks to those who posted so eloquently! Everytime I think we've come so far as a society, I see, hear or read something that makes me cringe and realize that we haven't come as far as I had hoped in so many ways.

Agreed. I am never good at putting into words what I would like to say, but enough people here have done it for me, thank you.

I keep hoping that one day homosexuals will have the same rights as everyone else and also hope it will happen in my life time.

 

[brerrabbit]

Wow, I read all 11 pages. First, movies are meant to be out there. They are a reflection in many instances of the cutting edge of society. I really don't think we should get terribly caught up in the individual characters actions as a reason to not like a film. It's a movie for heavens sake. I have not seen Brokeback Mountain but from reading here I have a pretty good summary of the picture. It would seem that the Movie is dead on topic for the struggles that Gays face every day in their lives. Large portions of society are trying to tell them "there's something wrong with you if feel that way". Well consider this for a minute, maybe if we were more accepting as a society in whole then they would not face those struggles. There would not be cases of people living lies only to leave a marraige 10 years into it because they can't continue the lie. If these kinds of things in a movie bother you because its a celibration of infidelity then maybe if we all accepted the fact that some people are Gay and some people are not then these things would never happen. End of story. As far as thinking a movie about prostitution and the horrible men who lure young girls into it is unworthy for Oscar nomination well, you may be Polyannaish enough to not want to believe it exsists in this world but fact is, it does. A good movie apart from having quality production values should stop and make you think. If it does not then it probably won't be nominated for an Oscar. A good movie expands your horizons, makes you think and shows you personal struggles that people face every day of their lives. I have not seen any of the movies that were nominated for best picture but form these discussions I am sure that all five fit my criteria.

As far as some peoples views of "Gay agendas" and their overall views about Gays. Get real. Most of the Gay friends I have are just trying to live their lives without hassle, and fit in and be accepted for who they are. They did not choose a lifestyle, its who they are. Failure to accept that is no different than saying you can't accept a person because they are black, or brown, or yellow or whatever. I proudly was raised in Texas as someone who likes to hunt, fish, drink beer, chew a little tobacco and raise a little h--- every now and then. It's who I am and as a result is has earned me the stereotypical nickname of "Redneck". But who I really am is an MBA educated man who in addition to his Redneck tendencies enjoys cooking, wine tasting, gardening, performing in community theatre, singing in a church choir, and volenteering in numerous organizations for the benifit of children. So before you are so quick to "classify" someone, get to know them first, you might like who they are.

 

[SeattleRedBear]

When we paint with a wide brush some people , we dont see things. The argument that the caracteres from Brokeback are immoral because they cheat on there wifes . We al, agree that cheating is bad. But we cannot paint everybody the same way , and yes , I think that you have to look into these people lifes and try to understand. The movie is set in a place and time are integral part of the story.

I've just found a very interesting piece about "Brokeback marriages" that shed a lot of light on this situation. here is the link :

http://aolsvc.news.aol.com/news/article.adp?id=20060307093709990001

I was going to respond to Spoon (who apparently hasn't seen the movie) about why Enis & Jack didn't leave their wives, but this article does a better job than I could.

 

[macntosh]

I saw both movies and thought Crash was better. I think Heath and Jake are good actors, but the only thing I enjoyed about Brokeback was the vista's, the movie was slow!

On the other hand, I thought Crash was a more involved film. I would have voted Crash best picture of the two, but didn't see the others.