Considering taking the (small) plunge into DVC

[WithASmile&ASong]

Hi, I'm an infrequent poster but a frequent lurker. My family, myself, DH, and 2 boys and 1 4yr old girl have loved our Disney vacations. But we don't have a big Disney budget. Here is our history:

April 2010 - MIL Took us after FIL died. We had 2 boys 22mo and 6mo. I was initially against it b/c kids were so young. But she said trip was for her. We stayed offsite and spent 3 1/2 Days in Parks. Well DH and I were hooked - it was magical seeing things through our babies' eyes. We decided we could get back every four years.

March 2014 - We had 4 days in the parks. This time we had a 5 yo, 4 yo & 3mo old. I messed up on planning and we went during FL spring break. Even though it was crowded, we still had a great time and couldn't wait to return.

Feb 2016 - we were gifted a 4 night trip on site at AsSports. 3 1/2 Park Days. Even though it was cramped with 5 in room, We loved staying on site (esp DH who hates driving in traffic). DH says he doesn't want to stay off site again.

Dec 2017 - 10 Days - time enough not to rush through parks and more leisurely enjoy. We went week after Thanksgiving into 1st week of December for Christmas offerings and low(er) crowds. After research here, we rented DVC points at BWV and WL. BWV b/c of location and wow such LOW points for standard studios; we will be able to afford it! Side note - on previous trip, DS says to me on seeing BWV from friendship boat, "Mom, I want to stay there next time". Me, "I'm sorry, I don't think we will ever be able to afford it." Of course, it turned out that I wanted the hardest to get reservations. I rented through private owners and both went above and beyond to get me what I wanted. The BWV owner even got my reservation on Christmas morning. Of course, I didn't expect such service and don't expect it in the future.

Next scheduled trip is 2021: during anniversary year. (Yikes!) So where to stay?

We so enjoyed our time at BWV and WL that we would be estatic to stay there again. But the likelihood of being able to rent points for a studio during our ideal week is not good. Plus rental costs are going higher and I'm sure will be in even higher demand during Ann. Year. Can possibly get a 1 Bed, but will have to shorten trip beyond what we would like.

Can book 2 value rooms. While we were perfectly content w/ room on 1st stay, it was a short trip with almost no resort time.
And well- we're spoiled now.

Stay at Caribbean Beach - legitimate option esp. if we could get free dining and skyline will be operational. But I'm doubting free dinning will be available in Ann. Year and thinking skyline will raise prices.

AoA suites - same as above.

Buy 50 Points resale at BWV.

Plan to bank, use & borrow 3 years of points. Doing so would give us 10-13 days at a standard studio. (Our ideal time frames are during the lowest points weeks. We homeschool, so are not limited to school breaks and two youngest are very sensitive to heat. So winter months are best.) I'm willing to do the work to get us the room we want but understand I may need to be flexible w/dates, types. (Willing to waitlist & do split stays)

We would get 7 trips like this plus a shorter trip at end of contract.

Doing the math with the following assumptions:
50 BWV points @ $150.00 a point plus $500 closing costs = 8,000.00.
1100 Points over length of contract (2020-2041)
Cost per point = 7.27

Using 6.55 MF /point with 3% increase every year. Per night cost would range from $164.00 in 2021 to $234.00 in 2039. (assuming using all 150 points for 13 night stay at standard studio - ***most likely we will not use all points, and will probably switch #days, resort & room type/size as time goes on - just using this for standardizing)

With a 5% MF annual increase - it would range from $168 to 298.

I *think* these rates will remain cheaper than moderate w/discounts. We have about 3 trips remaining with the boys before college and 4 with DD. DH and I wouldn't *mind* going alone and we might even get a trip with a grand toward the end. In the beginning we thought a trip or two to Disney would suffice but each time we go we just want to return more.

Sorry for such a long post, But was wondering if this is a "reasonable" Disney financial plan.

 

[_auroraborealis_]

I would not buy assuming Standard Studio for any dates between Labor Day and MLK Day. They are often gone before 11 months out. It would be safer to assume a Pool/Garden view.

An additional risk of your plan is difficulty finding a 50 point contract in resale. $150pp is less than direct pricing, so I am assuming you are hoping for resale. Small contracts go quick.

 

[4luv2cdisney]

The one thing to realize with 3 years of points is that it is never going to be a "perfect number" with using your points.

I'm going to be generic and not take UY into consideration and say:

in 2021 you use 2020, 2021 and 30 2022 points. You can't go over 150 (unless you buy OTU points and can only do that @ 7 mo) So, say you end up booking a 130 pt stay and banking 20 points.

You need to go in 2023 to use those 20 points. You have 20, 50, and 50 (2024). So only 120 to use this time. You
shorten your stay and book at 108 points. You bank 12.

In 2025, you have 12 + 50 + 50 (2026) So now only 112 pts.

If you skip 2025, and go back in 2026, you lose your banked points.

It's easier to only use roughly 2 years of points consistently rather than 3 years and there is no way I'd plan on a trip every 3 years on 3 years worth of points. You will almost certainly be throwing away at least a few points every 3 years or buying OTU points to supplement (and therefore booking at least part of your stay at 7 months)

 

[Mumof4mice]

The very small contracts are rarer and a lot more expensive per point. The plan of using 3 years of points in one trip also increases your chance of losing stray points. And BWV standard view can be very challenging to secure.

Is buying bigger contract (100-150pt), an option for you? If you went with a 100pt contract, you and "the renter" can alternate. For example,

In 2020 - you use 140 points (100 2020, borrow 40 2021)

In 2021 - rent out 60 2021 points plus as much of 2022 points as you can.

In 2022 - bank remaining 2022 points into 2023.

In 2023 - use banked 2022 points, full 2023 points, borrow 2024 points as needed.

Repeat cycle.

The rental income could potentially cover all/most of the MF - no more out of pocket after the initial purchase. But, beware, it will be hard not to find use for all the points yourself!

 

[WithASmile&ASong]

Yes, resale, I believe you have to buy 75 points for direct. And I don't plan on being there enough to enjoy the direct *perks*

Yes, I'm aware of the difficulty to get standard (which is why I want to buy). The owner I rented from walked a reservation starting on Christmas Day for me. I wouldn't expect that of anyone. But would be willing to do it myself. However I still could get 9 Days at P/G and that's fine.

I know I would be essentially tossing a few points every few years. (Assuming I get standard -a 13 day trip would be 146 - 2 Weekend nights). That's why I figured the cost of a trip using the cost of all 150 points. Even though technically I wouldn't be able to. I think I still come out *ahead*.

I wish we could do a hundred point contract- but can't. I know those small point ones go quick, but since I don't *need* any points until 2020, I have a bit of time to secure one. I'd also be willing to buy at BRV. Lately I've seen BWV going b/w 130. -148 a point. (They're all sale pending) So I've estimated 150.

 

[zavandor]

You say you are flexible when going and winter months work best. Would you plan on going in January after marathon week end and February instead? Those are two low demand months with low points requirement (especially January) and you can find much greater availability at 7 months. This would allow you to buy SSR points and use them to stay around different resorts. Standard and value rooms will be difficult but having cheaper points will allow you to buy a few more and be able to use them also at resorts requiring more points per night.

 

[WithASmile&ASong]

You say you are flexible when going and winter months work best. Would you plan on going in January after marathon week end and February instead? Those are two low demand months with low points requirement (especially January) and you can find much greater availability at 7 months. This would allow you to buy SSR points and use them to stay around different resorts. Standard and value rooms will be difficult but having cheaper points will allow you to buy a few more and be able to use them also at resorts requiring more points per night.

Hmmm, Yes we would be willing and are planning on going end of January and into February at times. Though ideally we would like to make at least one more Christmas time trip.

I haven't really thought of SSR as we really don't want to stay there. I mean we would be OK with it but disappointed. We don't have any big desire to go to Disney Springs, so that advantage would be lost on us. But I will contemplate how that works out. Thanks

 

[Mumof4mice]

Hmmm, Yes we would be willing and are planning on going end of January and into February at times. Though ideally we would like to make at least one more Christmas time trip.

I haven't really thought of SSR as we really don't want to stay there. I mean we would be OK with it but disappointed. We don't have any big desire to go to Disney Springs, so that advantage would be lost on us. But I will contemplate how that works out. Thanks

If you're willing to walk, and would not be disappointed staying at AKV, you could consider AKV for the value category rooms. You could do AKV for Sep-Dec high demand season and try to switch for late January trips.

AKV also works out more economical vs BWV due to the length of contract.

ETA:
http://www.dvc-resales.com/listing-detail.cfm?ID=AK50-12-0929

Nice contract. I'd still try to bargain a bit off the asking

 

[WithASmile&ASong]

If you're willing to walk, and would not be disappointed staying at AKV, you could consider AKV for the value category rooms. You could do AKV for Sep-Dec high demand season and try to switch for late January trips.

AKV also works out more economical vs BWV due to the length of contract.

Thinking about both SSR and AKV value, we have 5 in our family - so they wouldn't work. I'd possibly consider getting AK points if cost was low enough to get points for a 1 Bedroom Kidani - which I think is the only 1 bed that sleeps 5.

 

[Deb & Bill]

Buy where you don't mind staying if you cannot get a non-home resort at seven months out. If you never plan on staying at SSR, don't buy your points there.

As for one bedroom villas that have beds for five - OKW, BLT and AKV (both KV and JH, but not the value villas) have one queen sleeper, one king bed and a twin sized sleeper chair. GFV sleeps five, one king, one queen sleeper, one bunk sized murphy bed. SSR, BCV, BWV, BRV all permit five, but only have one king bed and a queen sleeper, no murphy no chair bed - you have to bring your own bed and any linens for the bed, plus a towel for the fifth person.

 

[Mumof4mice]

Thinking about both SSR and AKV value, we have 5 in our family - so they wouldn't work. I'd possibly consider getting AK points if cost was low enough to get points for a 1 Bedroom Kidani - which I think is the only 1 bed that sleeps 5.

One of the challenges of having more than the "standard" two kids!

 

[gharter]

Before considering buying into DVC, read the stickies at the top of the page. There is a HUGE amount of really good information there.
DVC makes sense for some and doesn't for others.
If you frequent WDW often, it probably makes sense. If you don't, you need to work with the numbers to see if its worth it.
Even if you frequent often, it takes several years before you break even.
If you want to stay somewhere other than your home resort, that may or may not work out. If you want a value studio, you almost must book that at 11 months.

 

[ziravan]

Given the size of your family and the commitment in finances for what you'd really need to make DVC work (probably at least a 150 point contract, realistically), I'd consider other options. I'm a huge DVC fan and owner: when it's a good fit.

From what you describe, you'd be chasing points and cramped rooms to make the points work.

I would expand my horizons and look at something like Wyndham Bonnet Creek. I bought resale points there for next to nothing, and for what you're considering spending, you could routinely stay in 2BRs for the same price as a cramped DVC studio. It's next door to Caribbean Beach on Disney property and to quote the name of a long running thread here, We Love Bonnet Creek.

You don't have to buy a Wyndham "Bonnet Creek" contract, really it's a huge resort so any contract would work, so the goal would be to find one with low maintenance fees.

It doesn't give you 60 day fast passes, but there are ways around that.

Also, you'd really need a car to stay there, either a rental or drive. And if you do that, since you're talking about staying for more than a week at a time, buy you or your DH an annual pass (just one ticket needs to be) and get free parking in the parks plus the discounts.

There would be some tradeoffs here, but you'd be essentially "on Disney" in a room that would actually accommodate your growing family at a price that you can afford.

Just tossing it out as another option.

If you're interested, PM me, and I can tell you how to go about finding a decent contract for your needs for peanuts. People are literally giving them away.

 

[ldo]

we started with 50 points resale and loved it! we did the bank and borrow and it worked fine. Don't plan on standard room, but if you can book at 11 mths you have a very good shot at it. If you are an owner, you can also get points transferred form another owner 1X a year for times that you want bigger places or longer trips. We did this 2X and that also worked great. of course, we loved DVC so much that we added on. good luck.
IMHO, the studios are a pretty good value, unless you can get a deal like free dining.

 

[rg35]

I think with going every 3-4 years and being limited to a very specific room type, you're really fitting a square peg into a round hole. I don't think DVC is ideal for your scenario.

 

[ldo]

We also have a family of 5. I have to concur with rg35 for 5 persons. For our 50 points, several trips were just me and the kids or our older child was then in college and did not go. For 5 persons, you either need a studio that sleeps 5 or to move to a 1 BR. Once you are at the points for a 1 BR, it is likely more cost effective to book Port Orleans, etc., esp. if you can go at low seasons where WDW is offering room discounts or free dining. 2 values during low season also tend to be fairly inexpensive.
If you really "Want" DVC, and I understand that, consider a larger amount of points, such as 100, at a cheaper resort. AKV, OKW and SSR are about $110 for 100 points. OKW and AKV 1 BR are excellent for families of 5. Both are easy to get at 7 months. You cannot use AKV value bc you have 5 persons. Our fav is OKW with a pull out sofabed and sleeper chair. Tons of space--we have had 11 people for dinner in a 1 BR. Never feels cramped even with older teens. Realize SSR 1 BR do not have a sleeper chair, so you would never have 11 mth advantage to book a 1 BR that can actually sleep 5 in beds/pullouts.
Due to longer contracts than at OKW, we bought at AKV. AKV annual fees are a bit more. We usually stay there, but have switched a number of times to OKW at both high and low seasons.

 

[rg35]

Yeah, FWIW, we are a family of 5 and have 250 points at AKV. We generally visit each year but I knew I wanted to stay in 1 BRs when we bought. Even this might be tight as the kids get older, but I'm not sure that I would buy enough points for a yearly 2BR stay of ~2 weeks. Either we'll go less or the kids can stay home lol

 

[mustinjourney]

Honestly, I would seriously consider buying the points direct. You can buy 50 direct for $171 and closing costs will be about $200 -- so you're not paying a whole lot more for the points as compared to resale. Plus, if you buy another 25 points down the road when you do have the cash available, you will then be eligible for member perks.

Keep in mind -- not only will finding a 50 point contract on the resale market be very difficult and time consuming, there's a strong likelihood that it will be stripped of points. So even if you do succeed in getting one, the likelihood is that you won't be able to use it like you want to use it for that first stay.

If you buy direct through Disney, you get the current UY points -- so getting an extra 50 or 100 points by buying direct, you're actually getting a much better deal by buying direct than you would if the resale contract were stripped at all.

 

[WithASmile&ASong]

Thanks everyone for you honest opinions. I know that this is not the ideal situation for DVC. And I don't want to appear argumentative. We don't really want to stay offsite.

We actually have an every other year 3 bedroom timeshare that was left to me when my uncle passed. It's about 8 miles from Disney property - so definitely not as close as WBC. We stayed there our first two trips. When gifted our stay at All Star Sports, (with 5 in the room!) we liked it better than our 3 bedroom - not having to deal with traffic, driving & parking was that much less stressful for DH.

We don't spend much time in our rooms. We did have much more resort time at our last trip at BW & WL. But not much time in rooms. Time was spent at pool & community hall, DH enjoyed early mornings at Bellevue lounge & Carolwood Pacific Room I like sitting on balcony at night. We have only 1 shower at home - so that's not any different. And I don't cook on Disney vacations.

I shouldn't have been so specific in my breakdown. Yes, ideally on our 2021, I'd like to get a standard studio (booking 11 months) for most of our days and maybe waitlist for a few days at BRV or Poly. But really OK with 9 days P/G category. But after that trip, with boys in upper teens we'd probably have to take a shorter 6-7 day trip. I'm thinking I'll be able to get a 1 bed AKV at 7 mo.

After that it's anybody's guess. DD will (possibly) be only one home so possible to do studio but again shorter 1 bedroom stay might be better. Boys might want to come and transferring/renting or buying more points are all options.

What I'm thinking about is what would be the comparison to staying at CBR/POR/AoA suites/ or two values. Comparison in terms of location, resort common areas and $. I think for comparable money per stay, I'd get better value out of the DVC.

The biggest issue I see would be the possibility of losing borrowed points b/c of a last minute cancellation. We would get trip insurance but I have to imagine it would still be painful.

 

[kboo]

What I'm thinking about is what would be the comparison to staying at CBR/POR/AoA suites/ or two values. Comparison in terms of location, resort common areas and $. I think for comparable money per stay, I'd get better value out of the DVC.

I think the CW has been that if you're only looking at saving $, with DVC you are essentially getting deluxe at moderate prices. Some families are happy to stay at value or mods and not have the long term financial commitment of DVC, and those resorts work for them. Sounds like you have given considerable thought to the additional amenities that DVC provides (nicer resort, closer to parks, etc) and find that it's worth it. (or *just* worth it - like for the same price, you are willing to plan ahead, pay money very year, to know you will have a deluxe place to stay on property when you go.)

I shouldn't have been so specific in my breakdown. Yes, ideally on our 2021, I'd like to get a standard studio (booking 11 months) for most of our days and maybe waitlist for a few days at BRV or Poly. But really OK with 9 days P/G category. But after that trip, with boys in upper teens we'd probably have to take a shorter 6-7 day trip. I'm thinking I'll be able to get a 1 bed AKV at 7 mo.

One of the nice things about DVC is the flexibility in terms of shorter stays in larger units, etc. One thing you should really take seriously is that although right now you are saying you would go every 3 years with your next trip in 2021, in the last 3-4 years (2014 -2017) you have actually gone 3x! It's possible that once you buy DVC, if that's what you decide, you will end up going more often, possibly for shorter trips or lower-points cost times to stretch your points. Your recent frequency of stays suggests that may happen with you. Our first contract had "extra" points, which we banked into a following year. As a result, we had 310 points to use our first year when we had actually bought "only" 185 points. Sure, they say you can rent them out, but it takes a lot of willpower and there's recordkeeping and tax issues, so instead we planned extra trips to use up our "extra" points, and then (of course) realized we liked going more than once a year...

After that it's anybody's guess. DD will (possibly) be only one home so possible to do studio but again shorter 1 bedroom stay might be better. Boys might want to come and transferring/renting or buying more points are all options.

Or (as above) you might find that since you're already financially committed to a certain number of points and MFs, you might find that you'd want to go more often before the kids leave home...

The biggest issue I see would be the possibility of losing borrowed points b/c of a last minute cancellation. We would get trip insurance but I have to imagine it would still be painful.

I'm not sure trip insurance would really be the best idea because of the admin issues and quantifying how much you "lost." One possibility might be to rent the dedicated reservation if you had to cancel at the last minute.* Also, if you planned loosely on going every other year instead of every 3 years, you have a little more flexibility with your points and are less likely to risk losing points.

*For example, a 100 point reservation (for ease of calculation) would rent pretty easily depending on the time of year. And you could rent at a deeper discount if the reservation is close in time - your loss could easily be someone else's quick surprise trip, and even renting at a discount would likely cover your MFs that year.