College entrance cheating scandal

[cabanafrau]

So, in other words, like the scenario that Bill Cosby is presently in, as cited by Imzadi...???

Although I still am not certain I understand the arrangement they worked out for Martha Stewart during her incarceration...

Martha Stewart was in a minimum security facility -- which is not where violent felons are incarcerated. She was living with a bunch of people who committed similar crimes to herself, not murderers, rapists, armed robbers, etc. Highly likely Martha was simply a number where she was at.

Bill Cosby's crimes are classified as violent and therefore he would be incarcerated in a maximum security facility where other violent offenders are held. Even if he were not a celebrity he would likely be in a protective custody placement due to his age and claimed infirmities.

 

[gwynne]

Lori Loughlin and her husband, Mossimo Giannulli, both entered a plea of not guilty this morning. The pretrial process should move forward from here, assuming there isn't a change.



(edited to add Giannulli)

 

[cabanafrau]

Lori Loughlin entered a plea of not guilty this morning. The pretrial process should move forward from here, assuming there isn't a change.

Wonder if they have hired extremely high powered attorneys who are advising them this is the path to the best deal possible? I find it highly unlikely competent counsel believes the government can't prove the case.

Starting to wonder if some of the reports I've seen about extreme arrogance and entitlement with these two has them convincing themselves they can get through this? Reportedly Mossimo had showed up at the high school in a complete rage about the counselor making an inquiry regarding the crew team notation associated with the college admission. Apparently he showed up and raised a major ruckus and word got back to the conspirators, causing extreme concern he would cause the scheme to be uncovered at that point.

 

[msminniemouse]

I read that maybe lawyer thinks this strategy may lead to better plea deal than what was originally offered, because prosecutor won't want to waste time going to trial.

 

[Searc]

I read that maybe lawyer thinks this strategy may lead to better plea deal than what was originally offered, because prosecutor won't want to waste time going to trial.

I think at this point, the prosecutor will make it a point to go to trial, because if pushed, they have a pretty open and shut case. Pleading not-guilty is idiocy and I certainly hope they went against their lawyers advice with that plea.

 

[gwynne]

This is a serious new development. Target letters have gone out to some of the adult children in this scandal.

"Prosecutors have sent target letters to adult children who were believed to have known about the scheme and who were at least 18 years old when it was conceived, according to a source familiar with the letters who spoke to ABC News on the condition of anonymity."

https://abcnews.go.com/US/feds-sign...sity-blues-cheating-scandal/story?id=62373521

 

[neverlandsky]

A lot of times a plea deal is offered right before jury selection. Had a judge tell us that 80% of the time that is what happens. We were about to enter the room for jury selection to begin and the defendant took the plea deal. Kept us waiting outside for almost 2 hours. Then judge brought us in the empty count room to thank us, told us our importance, and told us what happened. Along with telling us how our presence pushes things and how it benefits plea deals.

 

[cabanafrau]

A lot of times a plea deal is offered right before jury selection. Had a judge tell us that 80% of the time that is what happens. We were about to enter the room for jury selection to begin and the defendant took the plea deal. Kept us waiting outside for almost 2 hours. Then judge brought us in the empty count room to thank us, told us our importance, and told us what happened. Along with telling us how our presence pushes things and how it benefits plea deals.

Many times here if there have been extensive plea negotiations judges are reluctant to send a jury pool home on day of trial. Some judges have policies where they will not allow a deal to go forward at the eleventh hour. Other judges have accepted pleas a few days into trials.

 

[rigs32]

99.999999999% of defendant plead not guilty at arraignment, which is what happened today - they were arraigned on a superceeding indictment. Even if all parties know the case is likely to resolve, it would be asinine to go in and plead guilty having no idea what the possible sentence would be.

A lot of times a plea deal is offered right before jury selection. Had a judge tell us that 80% of the time that is what happens.

There's a world of difference between a plea being offered on the day of trial and one offered previously being accepted on the day of trial. If you want to accept an offer a week or more before trial? Fine. I've started preparing for trial, but a guaranteed resolution is worth it. But if I've worked a 70-80 hour week leading up to trial, including the whole weekend, my offer is off the table. That said, a defendant in my state can always plead guilty to the entire indictment and then their sentence is in the hands of the judge.

 

[kdonnel]

Lori Loughlin is apparently going to use the defense that she knew she was breaking rules but did not know she was breaking the law.

https://www.foxnews.com/entertainment/lori-loughlin-college-scandal-manipulated-scam

"[Lori and her husband] claim they were under the impression they might be breaking rules, but not laws.They feel they were manipulated by those involved and are planning that as part of their defense," a source told the outlet. "They realize how serious the charges are, but feel that once the judge hears their story he will see they had no bad intentions."

I am no lawyer but it seems that ignorance of the law rarely works as a defense.

 

[RedAngie]

Lori Loughlin is apparently going to use the defense that she knew she was breaking rules but did not know she was breaking the law.

https://www.foxnews.com/entertainment/lori-loughlin-college-scandal-manipulated-scam


I am no lawyer but it seems that ignorance of the law rarely works as a defense.

Ah, the "I know I did wrong but it's someone else's fault" routine.

 

[gwynne]

Lori Loughlin is apparently going to use the defense that she knew she was breaking rules but did not know she was breaking the law.

https://www.foxnews.com/entertainment/lori-loughlin-college-scandal-manipulated-scam


I am no lawyer but it seems that ignorance of the law rarely works as a defense.

From the article:
"[Lori and her husband] claim they were under the impression they might be breaking rules, but not laws.They feel they were manipulated by those involved and are planning that as part of their defense," a source told the outlet. "They realize how serious the charges are, but feel that once the judge hears their story he will see they had no bad intentions."

That, uh, is quite a statement. Good luck with that. This case is real life. It's not an episode of Full House where all the "misunderstandings" are cleared up and everyone shares smiles around the dining table.

 

[cabanafrau]

From the article:
"[Lori and her husband] claim they were under the impression they might be breaking rules, but not laws.They feel they were manipulated by those involved and are planning that as part of their defense," a source told the outlet. "They realize how serious the charges are, but feel that once the judge hears their story he will see they had no bad intentions."

That, uh, is quite a statement. Good luck with that. This case is real life. It's not an episode of Full House where all the "misunderstandings" are cleared up and everyone shares smiles around the dining table.

If any of these reports are at all representative of the truth, the level of entitlement and how far out of touch these two are is astounding.

 

[kaytieeldr]

From the article:
"[Lori and her husband] claim they were under the impression they might be breaking rules, but not laws.They feel they were manipulated by those involved and are planning that as part of their defense," a source told the outlet. "They realize how serious the charges are, but feel that once the judge hears their story he will see they had no bad intentions."

That, uh, is quite a statement. Good luck with that. This case is real life. It's not an episode of Full House where all the "misunderstandings" are cleared up and everyone shares smiles around the dining table.

In 23 minutes. You forgot the time restriction .

 

[Imzadi]

Lori Loughlin is apparently going to use the defense that she knew she was breaking rules but did not know she was breaking the law.

TMZ said the same thing yesterday, but really emphasized that someone can break the rules of an organization, and not be breaking the law. AND they think she may be able to get away with that defense. Like if we discuss religion or politics here in the DIS, (NOT recommended, ) we are breaking established rules. But, we aren't breaking any laws.

Another example, some people on social media trash others and come really close to defamation, yet, they are careful to not cross any lines of breaking the law and they get away with what they are doing.

I suppose Lori & DH will use the excuse that they know some parents donate a lot to get their kids accepted into colleges. While that's not right, those parents aren't breaking any laws. She & DH did other stuff instead, to get their children into USC. They also knew it wasn't right, and were told by the ring leader that they weren't breaking any laws.

The prosecution got Felicity Huffman on mail fraud & tax evasion. Had she and the other parents indicted with her kept this "transaction" out of the mail, out of being wire tapped, and they somehow legally paid taxes on it, siting another reason to be paying the same amount, would they have gotten away with it?

The Feds got Al Capone for tax evasion as they couldn't get any other legal charges. Capone was careful to hide all his misdeeds so he couldn't be prosecuted. (Although some infamously made front page news. )

 

[cabanafrau]

TMZ said the same thing yesterday, but really emphasized that someone can break the rules of an organization, and not be breaking the law. AND they think she may be able to get away with that defense. Like if we discuss religion or politics here in the DIS, (NOT recommended, ) we are breaking established rules. But, we aren't breaking any laws.

Another example, some people on social media trash others and come really close to defamation, yet, they are careful to not cross any lines of breaking the law and they get away with what they are doing.

I suppose Lori & DH will use the excuse that they know some parents donate a lot to get their kids accepted into colleges. While that's not right, those parents aren't breaking any laws. She & DH did other stuff instead, to get their children into USC. They also knew it wasn't right, and were told by the ring leader that they weren't breaking any laws.

The prosecution got Felicity Huffman on mail fraud & tax evasion. Had she and the other parents indicted with her kept this "transaction" out of the mail, out of being wire tapped, and they somehow legally paid taxes on it, siting another reason to be paying the same amount, would they have gotten away with it?

The Feds got Al Capone for tax evasion as they couldn't get any other legal charges. Capone was careful to hide all his misdeeds so he couldn't be prosecuted. (Although some infamously made front page news. )

That all sounds somewhat plausible, bright and shiny on the surface. Kind of falls apart when you bring up the producing staged photos and the money being paid to a "charity", not directly donated to the school.

 

[lifesavacation]

TMZ said the same thing yesterday, but really emphasized that someone can break the rules of an organization, and not be breaking the law. AND they think she may be able to get away with that defense. Like if we discuss religion or politics here in the DIS, (NOT recommended, ) we are breaking established rules. But, we aren't breaking any laws.

Another example, some people on social media trash others and come really close to defamation, yet, they are careful to not cross any lines of breaking the law and they get away with what they are doing.

I suppose Lori & DH will use the excuse that they know some parents donate a lot to get their kids accepted into colleges. While that's not right, those parents aren't breaking any laws. She & DH did other stuff instead, to get their children into USC. They also knew it wasn't right, and were told by the ring leader that they weren't breaking any laws.

The prosecution got Felicity Huffman on mail fraud & tax evasion. Had she and the other parents indicted with her kept this "transaction" out of the mail, out of being wire tapped, and they somehow legally paid taxes on it, siting another reason to be paying the same amount, would they have gotten away with it?

The Feds got Al Capone for tax evasion as they couldn't get any other legal charges. Capone was careful to hide all his misdeeds so he couldn't be prosecuted. (Although some infamously made front page news. )

They can obviously afford the best lawyers money can buy. The trial will be interesting, that's for sure.

 

[Imzadi]

That all sounds somewhat plausible, bright and shiny on the surface. Kind of falls apart when you bring up the producing staged photos and the money being paid to a "charity", not directly donated to the school.

I'm sure their legal team will blame the ringleader guy. They are all turning on each other. They will probably say HE said it was still legal. Or that they didn't quite understand what he was using the pics for. Like "maybe" their DDs would someday join the rowing team, once at college. They just needed to get into college first. . .

 

[lifesavacation]

I'm sure their legal team will blame the ringleader guy. They are all turning on each other. They will probably say HE said it was still legal. Or that they didn't quite understand what he was using the pics for. Like "maybe" their DDs would someday join the rowing team, once at college. They just needed to get into college first. . .

And if they bring it to a jury, it only takes one star struck fan to vote not guilty and she walks. That is probably what they are counting on. I’m sure they’ll also hammer home the argument that she was only trying to be a good mommy by helping her kids out.

 

[cabanafrau]

I'm sure their legal team will blame the ringleader guy. They are all turning on each other. They will probably say HE said it was still legal. Or that they didn't quite understand what he was using the pics for. Like "maybe" their DDs would someday join the rowing team, once at college. They just needed to get into college first. . .

Unfortunately for them Prosecutors don't need information from them to make a case against the ringleader. That's a more typical way to get a plea deal, negotiate a sweeter plea deal. Somehow I don't think a strategy of claiming they believed false representations about the legality of the arrangement will work out. Particularly if the govt. has evidence they were contacted by the conspirators and told to zip it after Mossimo reportedly stormed into the high school and confronted the counselor who questioned the rowing team information on the application.