Catholic Guilt

[Wishing on a star]

ROTLEX,

I agree with ead above.

I know that you simply cannot graap this, but I believe that all of these expectations and rules and demands are NOT from the Bible...

I see many, many, many, things in the Catholic church that are not biblical, and many that are actually completely contrary to the scriptures and the words of Christ.

I truly do not care about tracing anyting to Peter... I am not a follower of Peter.. I am a follower of Christ. Christ, and Christ alone.

If you want to truly trace the history of the Catholic Church go back to Roman Catholocism and the atrocities that were commited in the name of the holy roman empire.

The Pope and the Vatican are what is left of the Roman Empire, and their very human quest for wealth, power, and domination... Of 'man', not of 'Christ'.

When one can become a young adult, thru the Cathlic faith, and study reams and reams of 'Catholic Doctrine' but never the Scriptures... I think it behooves one to ask is it the Catholic church who is making up the rules, changing what is layed out in scripture, to suit their purposes and changing the scriptures... or churches whose followers actually study the follow the scriptures.

 

[Buckalew11]

Well, I think that Peter/ rock thing is one of the things that seem to be taken literally, although, in general, the Bible is not taken literally.

Had God wanted a lot of pomp and circumstance and lavish buildings for "His church", I think Jesus would have at least had a building. But alas, He didn't. We are taught that the body is temple of Christ and the Holy Spirit lives in each of us as believers. Believers and followers of Christ are the "True Church", imho. One might be Catholic, Baptist, Methodist or even perhaps unchurched but believe in and follow Jesus Christ as Savior. The whole thing is really so simple (not simple to live out though) but we, for some strange reason, complicate it and give it a bunch of rules.
I believe this is why, so often, people think the church makes one feel guilty, tries to control you by giving you these rules etc. I mean, if you believe the fate of your soul depends on what you do and how well you follow the rules, you'd have to admit that there is some control going on there. Control by people, not by God. This can happen in any type of organized religion, not just a Catholic church. IMHO, people should never, ever be given that type of power in our lives. The church has gotten rich off of people because of guilt, fear, and demand. Scary stuff.

 

[Chipmunk89]

Well, I'm an atheist and guilt-free. However, my parents and all my family are Catholics. So imagine my family get togethers.

 

[JoyG]

As I am FAR from a well spoken apologist, I won't comment deeply on these statements, but again, these answers are exactly what confuse me. Arrogance in considering the Catholic church to be the "one true church"? What other church, Christian, can trace it's roots all the way back to Peter? The rock, etc.? Most protestant denominations were started hundreds of years after Christ died. Sorry, I'll stick with the Church, and teachings, that Christ himself started.

Since this thread is about Catholic guilt, I think Castleview might have a point that people might feel guilty about leaving what they have been taught is "the one true church."

I agree with you that I wouldn't consider that claim arrogant...no more than I would consider "Jesus is the only way to Heaven" an arrogant statement.

I think the Catholic church's claim that it is "the one true church" is a bold statement.

If someone is feeling conflicted about being in the Catholic church, and that statement is bothering them...perhaps they should really get into the Bible and spend some time researching what Jesus meant when he said "upon this rock I'll build my kingdom."

I would also say some research into what the early church looked like would be in order to.

I'm not Catholic (and never have been) but at one point in my journey that statement did give me some pause. I researched it for myself and through prayer, Bible reading and studying the history of the church I came to a point where I could firmly disagree with the statement and I know why I disagree with it. After that, there was no looking back.

I guess people who are experiencing "Catholic guilt" need to really pray and study to find out what the truth is about issues they're conflicted about. Once you are satisfied you have found the truth, it shouldn't matter what anyone else claims.

Then there are some people who after research might find that what they're feeling is not so much "guilt" but conviction by the Holy Spirit that there's an area of their life that needs to be changed.

 

[Tigger Woods]

I spent eight years in Catholic schools. I definitely feel the 'guilt' 30 years later. All in all, it's made me a better person.

 

[doxdogy]

You hit the nail on the head. If you feel guilty, then deep down inside you realize what you are doing is wrong. Many of them assuage their guilt by blaming the Catholic church.

Interesting thread. Cradle Catholic here. I was away from the church for quite some time however. Finding my faith if you will. I was baptized Catholic, raised Catholic etc. etc.

I'm now back in full force as an adult, and in my early 40's, not feeling guilty at all! I feel I now understand things far better than I did in my early years, and have accepted, IMO, and belief, that the Catholic church is the one true church, started by Christ. I'm not looking for any backlash on that, but I am wondering why anyone stating they feel guilty, relieves that guilt by simply moving to another denomination?

I AM NOT looking for argument, or massive debate here, but I get rather confused when protestants, particularly those that are formerly Catholic, are happier outside of the Catholic church. It seems to me as though many other denominations simply change the rules to suit them, as they don't feel like being that "strict". Many of these "rules" are from the Bible itself, not necessarily the Catholic church. (i.e., birth control, abortion, attending mass etc. etc).

Anyway, don't mean to offend at all, but I'm finding the responses here rather interesting, as well as confusing.

 

[luvmy3]

When one is talking about 'religion' that has been impounded into ones psyche (brainwashing and psychological control) it has NOTHING to do with whether something might be 'wrong'...

It is a widely know fact/phenomenom that individuals who have been forcibly held hostage for any length of time often end up feeling a psychological connection to their captors and actually feel guilty and have to be 'de-programmed'... It has NOTHING to do with whether the situation is wrong or right.

I think that those who are saying that those who have left the Catholic Church must be feeling guilt because they have done something 'wrong' are WAY OUT OF LINE.

I really feel for those who felt so much of the brainwashing and false 'guilt' that they actually felt that they had to return to have their children baptized, etc... But, know, years of psychological control and brainwashing that if you do not do this in a CATHOLIC church your children will die and suffer... that will have that effect... Has NOTHING to do with whether one is right or wrong... has everything to do with control and fear....

We are programmed to feel 'guilty' when we do not meet the 'expectations' of our parents, our church, our family, friends, etc... This has NOTHING to do with whether those expectations were right or wrong to begin with.

I think its really you thats hit the nail on the head

 

[pr surfer]

So imagine my family get togethers.

Imagine mine

On my dad's side of the family, ll of them (ALL) are catholic... donate money to the vatican, have had audiences with various popes, no meat on friday, catholic charities royalty, papal seal front license plate owning, know the prayers in Latin Catholics

(mom's side is Jewish, and ironically, my background on my dad's side includes Sephardic Jews who converted in Spain during the inquisition)

I'm a respectful agnostic who attends a Friends (Quaker) prayer and discussion group and is dating a Buddhist/former Jew (although technically and ironically, due to the circumstances in both of our births, we're both Jewish, albeit she wasn't raised in a religious family, and I was raised in a predominantly catholic household, learning of my Jewish background and the Jewish community from my maternal grandparents).

Needless to say, I've seldom stay for dessert

I love my parents (and my aunt and uncle who took me in when my folks died)... but the extended family scares me sometimes.

 

[jack hannah bananah]

Well, I think that Peter/ rock thing is one of the things that seem to be taken literally, although, in general, the Bible is not taken literally.

Had God wanted a lot of pomp and circumstance and lavish buildings for "His church", I think Jesus would have at least had a building. But alas, He didn't. We are taught that the body is temple of Christ and the Holy Spirit lives in each of us as believers. Believers and followers of Christ are the "True Church", imho. One might be Catholic, Baptist, Methodist or even perhaps unchurched but believe in and follow Jesus Christ as Savior. The whole thing is really so simple (not simple to live out though) but we, for some strange reason, complicate it and give it a bunch of rules.
I believe this is why, so often, people think the church makes one feel guilty, tries to control you by giving you these rules etc. I mean, if you believe the fate of your soul depends on what you do and how well you follow the rules, you'd have to admit that there is some control going on there. Control by people, not by God. This can happen in any type of organized religion, not just a Catholic church. IMHO, people should never, ever be given that type of power in our lives. The church has gotten rich off of people because of guilt, fear, and demand. Scary stuff.

This is an interesting view point. I have always loved the Catholic Church for exactly the opposite reason. I don't go to church because of the man on the altar (the priest). I go because of the beauty in the prayers and rituals that are universal in all Catholic churches around the world.
Some of my non-Catholic Christian friends often move from church to church looking for that preacher that appeals to them. Only one preacher is necessary for me - Jesus.

 

[Chipmunk89]

Imagine mine

On my dad's side of the family, ll of them (ALL) are catholic... donate money to the vatican, have had audiences with various popes, no meat on friday, catholic charities royalty, papal seal front license plate owning, know the prayers in Latin Catholics

(mom's side is Jewish, and ironically, my background on my dad's side includes Sephardic Jews who converted in Spain during the inquisition)

I'm a respectful agnostic who attends a Friends (Quaker) prayer and discussion group and is dating a Buddhist/former Jew (although technically and ironically, due to the circumstances in both of our births, we're both Jewish, albeit she wasn't raised in a religious family, and I was raised in a predominantly catholic household, learning of my Jewish background and the Jewish community from my maternal grandparents).

Needless to say, I've seldom stay for dessert

I love my parents (and my aunt and uncle who took me in when my folks died)... but the extended family scares me sometimes.

Glad I'm not there.

 

[Buckalew11]

This is an interesting view point. I have always loved the Catholic Church for exactly the opposite reason. I don't go to church because of the man on the altar (the priest). I go because of the beauty in the prayers and rituals that are universal in all Catholic churches around the world.
Some of my non-Catholic Christian friends often move from church to church looking for that preacher that appeals to them. Only one preacher is necessary for me - Jesus.

I'm not sure what you are talking about...I did not mention anyone going to church because of the priest, preacher or any leader (man or woman).
I'm not talking about rituals or sacraments or whatever either.
I'll be the first to tell anyone (and I have said it here on the DIS) that going to church because of the minister is not a good thing to get caught up in.

You've loved the church because of the beauty in the prayers and rituals? But not for the beauty of the building or all the pomp (which were examples I gave)? Those are opposites? I see things like that as very similar but that is just one of those things that we all can have an opinion about. I'm not into ritual and recited prayers so much but I can definitely see the comfort those bring to people esp. if it were the denomination that you were raised in.

Move from church to church? Nah, I'd just run mine off first! We've had the same one for 15 years. He preaches biblically based sermons and that is all I really ask of any minister.

 

[jack hannah bananah]

I'm not sure what you are talking about...I did not mention anyone going to church because of the priest, preacher or any leader (man or woman).
I'm not talking about rituals or sacraments or whatever either.
I'll be the first to tell anyone (and I have said it here on the DIS) that going to church because of the minister is not a good thing to get caught up in.

You've loved the church because of the beauty in the prayers and rituals? But not for the beauty of the building or all the pomp (which were examples I gave)? Those are opposites? I see things like that as very similar but that is just one of those things that we all can have an opinion about. I'm not into ritual and recited prayers so much but I can definitely see the comfort those bring to people esp. if it were the denomination that you were raised in.

Move from church to church? Nah, I'd just run mine off first! We've had the same one for 15 years. He preaches biblically based sermons and that is all I really ask of any minister.

I was responding to your idea that we are some how controlled by people. Maybe I misunderstood. From this post. It sounds like we mostly agree