Casey Anthony TRIAL thread #2

[horseshowmom]

Sorry about your friend's collar bone, hope it heals quickly.

The doctor gave her a shot and said that should help significantly. By the time we got back, she seemed to be a little less uncomfortable.

 

[horseshowmom]

I was having this scenario in my head: ok she can have her fit, but:
could everyone in the courtroom heck even the judge take turns smacking her like that scene in airplane?

 

[MaryAnnDVC]

Except maybe we'd call it Shady and the Tramp

Yeah, once again, I can't figure out where he is going with that. Was he trying to say the dog only alerts because he wants affection from the handler? Well, Bozo, you fool, then poor Gerus would be alerting all day long.

I have to believe this is all just inexperience on Bozo's part because he can't be that incompetent of an idiot, can he? (is there an head scratching smilie?)

I think what he's not getting is that the dogs "get" that it's the success of their actions that bring the reward, not doing something "fake". Geez, that man.

Well, I forget if its Websleuths or HinkyMeter, but they are casting the movie for this... They have pretty much decided Jon Lovitz would be perfect to play Baez

PERFECT!!!

I was having this scenario in my head: ok she can have her fit, but:
could everyone in the courtroom heck even the judge take turns smacking her like that scene in airplane?

I wonder how she'll react (and just saying that brings the fear that she won't HAVE TO react because she'll be found "not guilty" ). I'm sure it will be quite the scene as her new little family (Baez, Mason, Simms) tries to comfort her. I can just imagine the press conference and Baez and Mason disparaging the jury, who no doubt must be idiots. Just as long as they be nice to my Judge Perry.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I think what he's not getting is that the dogs "get" that it's the success of their actions that bring the reward, not doing something "fake". Geez, that man.

Maybe Baez is pining for his own treat.

Maybe he wants Perry to give him a twizzler.

Good Boy, Baez.

*woof*

 

[pigletgirl]

Ahhhhh, I missed the entire day today! We had Uverse installed, so that took time. Anyways, catching up now.

 

[Belle0101]

Does anyone recall reading or hearing much about a Frank McKeever?

He is reported to be someone that Casey had texted on July 10, 2008. He's also rumored, or reported, to be someone involved in a car parts scam. He's supposed to have also been involved in another scam, renting apartments or houses, but I can't find any solid links about it.

She's mentioned to Amy that her car smells, she leaves it at Amscot, it gets towed, she told a friend that she was looking at buying a car and she's texting a guy that's involved in a car parts scam. Makes me wonder what she was up to.

 

[hereyago]

Maybe Baez is pining for his own treat.

Maybe he wants Perry to give him a twizzler.

Good Boy, Baez.

*woof*

 

[denisem]

You guys are killing me tonight - Mrs. Casey Baez, Shady & the Tramp, etc.

I was having this scenario in my head: ok she can have her fit, but:
could everyone in the courtroom heck even the judge take turns smacking her like that scene in airplane?

Wow. You just gave me an idea! FL could recoup all the trial expenses if (after found guilty) they sent KC on tour to all major cities. $50 to smack her. Heck, I'd go to $150 if I could smack KC AND Baez!

 

[hereyago]

Wow. You just gave me an idea! FL could recoup all the trial expenses if (after found guilty) they sent KC on tour to all major cities. $50 to smack her. Heck, I'd go to $150 if I could smack KC AND Baez!

I almost spit my milk out with that, but here's the odd thing: after my post about smacking her, I began to think-because I'm bored and giggly-she would have several years of appeals right? like you said, why not have the nation just slap her? heck make it the world.

 

[pknox]

Casey sure is busy playing paralegal today. Hasn't stopped taking notes.. or writing notes, or doodling... ..

I heard several of the talking heads say that she is a forensic nut. Guess that is why she was such a busy beaver. Guess she missed that CSI segment that mentioned the kind of purifier that the Anthony's use does not contain chlorine.

 

[denisem]

I almost spit my milk out with that, but here's the odd thing: after my post about smacking her, I began to think-because I'm bored and giggly-she would have several years of appeals right? like you said, why not have the nation just slap her? heck make it the world.

 

[denisem]

Does anyone recall reading or hearing much about a Frank McKeever?

He is reported to be someone that Casey had texted on July 10, 2008. He's also rumored, or reported, to be someone involved in a car parts scam. He's supposed to have also been involved in another scam, renting apartments or houses, but I can't find any solid links about it.

She's mentioned to Amy that her car smells, she leaves it at Amscot, it gets towed, she told a friend that she was looking at buying a car and she's texting a guy that's involved in a car parts scam. Makes me wonder what she was up to.

Ran across a thread on WS referring to an old thread about FM. Same as you, no solid links.

 

[castmember19]

So I just got caught up with this case today and now I'm addicted.

While googling, I came across this blog post. It downright made me roll my eyes and be angry.

I know it's long, bear with me. But I couldn't help but feel the urge to share. From the opinion of somebody who thinks Casey Anthony should be set free even if she did murder her child...

The Casey Anthony trial is currently still in progress. However, for the sake of this blog post, I’d like for you to imagine along with me that Casey Anthony ends up going to jail for life. Let’s imagine she is found guilty and convicted of her daughter’s death.

I don’t want that to happen.
I hope Casey Anthony isn’t convicted. I want her to win.

Many people would immediately, without thought, call me crazy or wrong. They would call me a supporter of a murderer. It would be almost criminal to even consider.

But here’s my reasoning. I want people to begin to change their perspective on situations, and this case is an excellent example of possibilities.

I think that if a jury of her peers were to consider the situation….they might possibly see that there are obviously issues here WITHIN a family. There seem to be mental issues connected with Casey Anthony and the dynamic between her and her parents, her boyfriend, and suredly, herself.

It seems that there is no other evidence or information coming to the surface to show reason for Caylee’s death. We know she was murdered, but by who…and why, and under what circumstances…are all, years later, still gray. There’s nothing truly physical being shown as evidence or proof. This case looks to be one that deals in the realm of the psychological.

In that light, I feel like a conviction…would lead to a complete failure of the opportunity for growth, change, and mending of problems. A conviction…in effect, would cut short the massive amount of possibilities that are available for this family to be mended, fixed, and to go on to be an example of what can happen when honesty and issues…when TRUTH…is the focus…

If Caylee goes to jail…and murdered her daughter…then what comes of it all? Nothing. For some reason, the public would feel justified that a killer went to jail. But we’d slowly forget about it and move on with a head nod and a thumbs up.

But the situation and the Anthony family would be stuck with the pain of it all…for the rest of their lives. Casey would go to jail and may even possibly be put to death herself. Her mother and father would lose their daughter…their granddaughter…and most likely, any reason to live whatsoever. Death, loss, permanence…that’s what a conviction would be.

However, if Casey were set free…maybe this family could mend itself. Maybe this experience would have taught her how clouded her thinking was…maybe her parents would be finally aware of the intense mental issues their daughter has had and suffers from…and would understand her in ways they have always looked over or disregarded.

Maybe, if Casey were set free…other people who are holding a weapon and considering killing someone….would stop for two seconds and instead of going through with it…they’d think back to the Anthony family…and they’d see how that family went through pure HELL…before they reached resolve. Maybe they’d see how the Anthony family came out the other side BETTER….and closer…because the truth and facts and reality were brought to the surface. Maybe those would-be murderers would think of all this…and decide to SKIP the killing step…and instead, give the truth option a good go….and instead of killing…they’d talk…and maybe reach resolve.

In all instances…the option to look at the possible positives…outweighs the negatives, in my opinion. We could probably never know how Casey Anthony’s story could ripple out and affect people in situations never known except by those involved. Who knows how many lives could be saved…and mental issues remedied…because Casey Anthony didn’t go to jail…she had her personal life dragged through the public eye….and things got better in the end.

I think that a conviction for a murderer who kills for killing’s sake…without remorse…is the correct outcome.

But in a situation that seems to have nothing BUT circumstantial evidence…nothing BUT signs pointing to a mental and family turmoil that got out of hand….I think in those situations…jail or death is not the best option. I think if we would all think a little bigger pictures. If the members of that jury would see past “did she do it” or not…and look at this hurting girl and family….they might choose to side on the reasonable doubt side of law….and give her then benefit of the doubt….because there’e a huge chance for positive change.

If they send her to prison or she gets sentenced to death….I’m overwhelmingly sure beyond a reasonable doubt….that nothing good will come of it. Casey Anthony should be set free…so the positive possibilities…so good can have a second chance.

I know someone will have something to say about that.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

So I just got caught up with this case today and now I'm addicted.

While googling, I came across this blog post. It downright made me roll my eyes and be angry.

I know it's long, bear with me. But I couldn't help but feel the urge to share. From the opinion of somebody who thinks Casey Anthony should be set free even if she did murder her child...



I know someone will have something to say about that.

Well, I would like to think that person's heart is in the right place. But we don't find people "not guilty" and not hold them responsible just so that we can be nice to them and help them heal. The viewpoint seems rather naive...so I think we should explore it:

The Casey Anthony trial is currently still in progress. However, for the sake of this blog post, I’d like for you to imagine along with me that Casey Anthony ends up going to jail for life. Let’s imagine she is found guilty and convicted of her daughter’s death.

Okay--let's do that...

I don’t want that to happen.
I hope Casey Anthony isn’t convicted. I want her to win.

If Casey is found "not guilty"--she doesn't 'win'. Her parents don't win. Caylee does not "win".

Many people would immediately, without thought, call me crazy or wrong. They would call me a supporter of a murderer. It would be almost criminal to even consider.

The blogger is highly naive. I will give the BOD that she isn't condoning and supporting a murderer. What she is doing is falling for Casey's spell.

But here’s my reasoning. I want people to begin to change their perspective on situations, and this case is an excellent example of possibilities.

This case is an excellent example of--if you stick with a lie long enough and get away with it--you have no incentive for honesty. It is an excellent policy that her parents are in grave danger if Casey were given an excellent opportunity to have access to them by not being in jail.

I think that if a jury of her peers were to consider the situation….they might possibly see that there are obviously issues here WITHIN a family. There seem to be mental issues connected with Casey Anthony and the dynamic between her and her parents, her boyfriend, and suredly, herself.

They can consider it--but it NEVER has been a defense against murder. Especially the murder of a child. Now if she murdered her dad...okay. That could be considered. Maybe if she weaves a tale of self defense, the jury could and should consider that possibility. There is no denying there are issues. But IF Casey was BORN a SOCIOPATH--then likely she is the root cause of those issues. If she were to be clinically diagnosed and confirmed a sociopath, then we must consider that she made George and Cindy the way they became and not the other way around.

There most definitely is a mental issue. But again, it is NOT a defense for murder. But it surely is a consideration in the penalty phase. But since the writer is merely talking about letting Casey go free and not being penalized at all--then Casey's mental state is irrelevant in whether or not she did the crime and whether or not she should be convicted. Her mental state is actually a mitigating factor, but not a reason to find her "not guilty".

It seems that there is no other evidence or information coming to the surface to show reason for Caylee’s death. We know she was murdered, but by who…and why, and under what circumstances…are all, years later, still gray. There’s nothing truly physical being shown as evidence or proof.

This seems to be the battle cry of the skeptics. There is no video of the murder and no smoking gun. But cases can and have been tried and convictions handed down on the circumstantial evidence alone. As long as it shows that Casey is the only one who *could* have done it--then she should be found guilty as charged.

As it is--there is great incentive for criminals to hide all their evidence so that they do not get busted. Thankfully--while they are entitled to a fair trial and for the state or feds to prove their case, there is wiggle room in the justice system for the evidence to speak and show that that person is the only one who could have done it. It is up to the defense attorney to show reasonable doubt to save their client. Unfortunately, Casey's attorney has only done so weakly.

This case looks to be one that deals in the realm of the psychological.

If I am not mistaken, so was the case of Charles Manson. To my knowledge he did not commit a single act of murder. However, he was still successfully convicted. Psychological to the extreme, that one!

In that light, I feel like a conviction…would lead to a complete failure of the opportunity for growth, change, and mending of problems.

I simply do not follow this---There was THREE YEARS for growth change and mending of problems. Casey has demonstrated that she is very unwilling to cooperate, even when her life is on the line. She continues to lie. Her own defense acknowledges that she lied A LOT. If she goes free, what incentive does Casey have to "grow, change or mend her problems". If she is guilty, but goes free--she has grown, she has changed, and she eliminated her problem. Her financial problems would be gone temporarily as she makes money off of the death of her child. Her parents would be nothing to her unless they did what she wanted.

And holding people accountable for their actions via conviction is not necessarily a failure of these opportunities. Many convicts (not sure the percentages) actually better themselves in jail so that when they are released, they can be contributing positive members of society. IF Casey is a sociopath--no conviction if she were not innocent (as this blogger seems to maintain)--is just positive reinforcement of all of her prior behaviors.

A conviction…in effect, would cut short the massive amount of possibilities that are available for this family to be mended, fixed, and to go on to be an example of what can happen when honesty and issues…when TRUTH…is the focus…

And this is the crux of the problem. Casey is dishonest. She is not telling little white lies--she tells huge high stakes lies, lies when it isn't needed, lies to get her way, lies at all costs....given the opportunity to speak the truth, when her life is on the line--she simply cannot do it. I no doubt she told Baez some elaborate lie about how she confided in Tony all the evil things her dad and Lee did to her. And Tony had nothing of any use to defend Casey. He was told (hearsay of course) that dad disciplined her ("hit her") and Lee attempted to feel her up but failed.

This whole trial is about TRUTH AND HONESTY. And it will be found regardless of how many lies Casey has told.

A not guilty verdict would be a grave injustice and would no further encourage her to be an honest person.

It is great to WANT to believe there is good in all people, that all people can atone for their "mistakes" and learn to be honest. It is Naive to believe that everyone's brain is wired in the proper way to make that possible.

Every day in our court system--there are many on trial "who didn't do it" and "for once" are "telling the God's honest truth". We can't take them all for their word. That is why EVIDENCE...even the circumstantial kind are so very very important. We wouldn't need a court system to find out if people are guilty if honesty made those who were guilty to confess their crimes.

If Caylee goes to jail…and murdered her daughter…then what comes of it all? Nothing. For some reason, the public would feel justified that a killer went to jail. But we’d slowly forget about it and move on with a head nod and a thumbs up.

I won't every forget about Casey. What comes of it--is that she is held accountable for her actions. What came of Susan Smith? We still remember her and it has been a few years since she was convicted. Her babies won't come back. But their killer is in jail. Someone willing to kill a child who is in the way of their life--is behind bars for a reason.

But the situation and the Anthony family would be stuck with the pain of it all…for the rest of their lives. Casey would go to jail and may even possibly be put to death herself. Her mother and father would lose their daughter…their granddaughter…and most likely, any reason to live whatsoever. Death, loss, permanence…that’s what a conviction would be.

I empathize with the Anthony's--but we can't and should not worry about the feelings of the relatives when it comes to holding someone accountable for their actions.

I hurt when my child gets a reprimand because she was misbehaving out of my care. I feel bad for the child and I feel bad for me. However, it would be a mistake--a grave mistake for her development as a citizen of the world to not hold her accountable. Heck, I feel bad sometimes for the grown ups--and have had times where I have GRANTED PERMISSION for them to do something such as remove my child from a class if she misbehaves. Oftentimes, they are afraid for the wrath of the parents. I don't want them to be afraid that I Will get mad if they have justifiably reprimanded my child.

The Anthony's have not held Casey accountable--pretty much ever. It is a travesty that the first time she is to be held accountable is to be in the Court of Law.

But how they would feel if she is locked up--is not relevant at all to whether or not she should be convicted. Much like if your child gets a detention at school for breaking school rules...the school should not be worried that you will be upset that your angel is perfect.

Unfortunately--this is the big leagues and the stakes are much higher. However--these type of things--I think weigh in on the penalty phase of the trial. If they make a victim impact statement that it would kill them to see Casey die--I do feel that should be considered in not handing down a DP. But in this phase--they were not asked their feelings if Casey should be found guilty or not, for a good reason.

However, if Casey were set free…maybe this family could mend itself. Maybe this experience would have taught her how clouded her thinking was…maybe her parents would be finally aware of the intense mental issues their daughter has had and suffers from…and would understand her in ways they have always looked over or disregarded.

I don't think they will mend itself by virtue of her being found not guilty when she isn't innocent. She will not learn her thinking was clouded. She is convinced she has done nothing wrong. She is convinced that her parents do not love her. Casey is trying to convince her attorneys that her dad did bad things to her. They are now fully aware of what she "suffers" from. However--she is fully competent to stand trial and once again, what she "suffers" from is not a valid defense for murder.

Her parents did not make her this way.

Maybe, if Casey were set free…other people who are holding a weapon and considering killing someone….would stop for two seconds and instead of going through with it…they’d think back to the Anthony family…and they’d see how that family went through pure HELL…before they reached resolve. Maybe they’d see how the Anthony family came out the other side BETTER….and closer…because the truth and facts and reality were brought to the surface. Maybe those would-be murderers would think of all this…and decide to SKIP the killing step…and instead, give the truth option a good go….and instead of killing…they’d talk…and maybe reach resolve.

This is Utopia.

OJ was found "not guilty". It did nothing to encourage people to not commit murder. What it taught was to make sure that the glove doesn't fit and you will be set free so that you can play golf until you get busted for another crime.

People in Casey's shoes are not looking at her thinking "gee, I will take the honest path, now". They look at her and see that the world is out to get her just like the world is out to get them.

In all instances…the option to look at the possible positives…outweighs the negatives, in my opinion.

There are no positives.

We could probably never know how Casey Anthony’s story could ripple out and affect people in situations never known except by those involved. Who knows how many lives could be saved…and mental issues remedied…because Casey Anthony didn’t go to jail…she had her personal life dragged through the public eye….and things got better in the end.

Socipaths and narcissists are not inspired by Casey to do what is right. If Casey is found "not guilty", they will be inspired to "get away with murder" just like she did--even if they don't commit a murder. She lied so convincingly and so easily--she will be their case study into how to do it "well".

Casey will not get better. And I do fear for her family's safety if she is let go.

I think that a conviction for a murderer who kills for killing’s sake…without remorse…is the correct outcome.

Okay--what does this mean?

Casey shows no remorse--and in the state of Florida, if child abuse causes a death...it is indeed killing for kiling's sake. You can't cry "accident" if you were harming the child to begin with.

But in a situation that seems to have nothing BUT circumstantial evidence…nothing BUT signs pointing to a mental and family turmoil that got out of hand….I think in those situations…jail or death is not the best option.

Scott Peterson?

I think if we would all think a little bigger pictures. If the members of that jury would see past “did she do it” or not…and look at this hurting girl and family….they might choose to side on the reasonable doubt side of law

Mental illness or families in pain and turmoil are NOT reasonable doubt.

….and give her then benefit of the doubt….because there’e a huge chance for positive change.

To my knowledge, there is no cure for a sociopath or narcissism. So the only "positive" change is that Casey gets to once again be a party girl while she continues to hurt her family if not one day killing them.

If they send her to prison or she gets sentenced to death….I’m overwhelmingly sure beyond a reasonable doubt….that nothing good will come of it. Casey Anthony should be set free…so the positive possibilities…so good can have a second chance.

The only good I can see is that Casey will be held accountable if she is found guilty. And that enough good for me.

It is rather unfortunate that this blogger has fallen for Casey's spell.

I, too, want to believe that something positive could happen--that Casey would tell the truth just for once in her life. However, most experts are of the educated opinion that she is in a state where that just is not possible.

She had many second chances. She blew them all.

I can appreciate someone wanting to see the good in all people--but the outcome she sees that is possible could only be a wish granted by a genie at this point.



Okay--time to get on with my day. Last day of soccer . It will be a long day.

 

[joviroxx]

Lisa, thanks for all that work! Saves me the trouble as you said pretty much exactly what I was thinking.

One last think that I would tell the blogger. This case and verdict isn't about Casey Anthony. Its not about her parents or her surviving family. This case is about little Caylee Anthony. In all this mess and analyzing Casey, sometimes, the fact that a little 2 yr old child was killed and is gone gets lost.

I don't see this family fixing itself if Casey is set free. I just don't. I see more trouble and I certainly do not see Casey "seeing the light" and becoming anything else than what she is...a sociopath. She doesn't get it, doesn't see her guilty nor does she want to.

There are consequences for actions, especially those actions that she still refuses to acknowledge. This is a girl that doesn't want help nor does she think she needs it. Therapy? She will lie to the doctors. She belongs put away.

 

[usnuzuloose]

This blogger thinks that they need time to heal. Casey has no conviction of doing this. As for healing, I cant see that happening as sitting in jail for three years and now you are acussing family members of molestation. Healing wont even begin until Casey admits to doing something. If that ever occurs, which I hope it would then and only then could healing start to happen.

Casey actions speak louder than words. She has also sucked Baez into believing all this garbage. I am looking at the actions he has done in reguards with improper meetings in the jail with her. I feel he needs to be held accountable for those as well. Casey says she is the victim, her daughter is the one who is the victim, her life was taken away due to a mother who wanted to party. I think George and Cindy never really set rules with her and as a result has gotten her own way and the parents now have no control because they chose not to make her accountable for anything she has done.

I am glad she is right where she is, it is some accountability now. I dont think she even thought things would get this far. I also find it very disturbing her attorney keeps questioning peolpe if they are making money off trial, when in fact he took money after his own client sold videos and pictures to pay him. Does he think that is ok? I wish the court system had a law that you can not make money from a person who has died, especially if the person in question is sitting in jail for the crime. Sorry dont know if that came out worded right.

 

[MaryAnnDVC]

I heard several of the talking heads say that she is a forensic nut. Guess that is why she was such a busy beaver. Guess she missed that CSI segment that mentioned the kind of purifier that the Anthony's use does not contain chlorine.

Welcome to the DIS and this thread.

So I just got caught up with this case today and now I'm addicted.

While googling, I came across this blog post. It downright made me roll my eyes and be angry.

I know it's long, bear with me. But I couldn't help but feel the urge to share. From the opinion of somebody who thinks Casey Anthony should be set free even if she did murder her child...

I know someone will have something to say about that.

Everyone has a right to their opinion, but since the blogger isn't here, I will say that I believe that blog is an attempt to pull people's legs. Forgive me if the fact is that he/she is just very naive.

No one should be set free "EVEN IF" she did murder her child. And the idea that Casey and her family as a unit would heal is about naive as it gets. How many people are in prison because they grew up in dysfunctional families? Let's get them all out, get them together with their families, and fix it all. I don't think so. And Casey is no more special that any of them. JHMO

This is a girl that doesn't want help nor does she think she needs it. Therapy? She will lie to the doctors. She belongs put away.

 

[Samba]

If only we knew how to "heal" people with her pathology. It has a large genetic component and is hard to treat. If released, her swath of destruction of lives will widen, IMO.

I do wonder where this came from. GAs side or CAs side....or both?

The person I know of who is very much like KC.....she has huge family support from the parent whose family has had this sociopathy in it. I wonder if guilt about this or just further sociopathy that lends itself to the support!?!

Wide awake and ready to cheer for Gerus, Bones and working German Shepherds everywhere! This case has really helped to educate people as to how dogs work. JBs attempts to discredit have backfired again.

 

[joviroxx]

Back in court! Miss Anthony is in court looking very smiley this morning.. Cindy and George are back in the courtroom.. First up should be Bones handler, right?

 

[kinntj]

So I just got caught up with this case today and now I'm addicted.

Welcome to the addicted! Well, I'm going to turn on WESH and get some coffee for another day.

Have to take DD to the dr. at 2:30, so I'll miss the end. I'll dvr it downstairs.