Cap on increase of dues?

[VanessasMom]

I am missing 2 details in my research....maybe I skimmed over them somewhere and didn't realize it. Your help would be greatly appreciated.

1. Is there a cap on the increse in dues every year?
2. Is there a restriction on how much point values for each unit can increase/decrease in any given year?

Just want to have all the facts before diving in. Thank you!

 

[vicki_c]

1 - yes, I think it might be 15% but it's never increased anywhere close to that.

2 - Only that they can't charge more points in TOTAL for the resort. Not for individual room sizes or anything or dates that I have ever heard of or seen.

 

[spiceycat]

I am missing 2 details in my research....maybe I skimmed over them somewhere and didn't realize it. Your help would be greatly appreciated.

1. Is there a cap on the increse in dues every year?
2. Is there a restriction on how much point values for each unit can increase/decrease in any given year?

Just want to have all the facts before diving in. Thank you!

florida law say 30% might be higher
Disney say they would try to kept it to 10% - the only exception was OKW

for points increase no more than 20% - think it is in your contract.

 

[vicki_c]

Guess I might have misspoke! I didn't think there were any caps on shuffling the points around within the resort.

 

[cayman01]

I am missing 2 details in my research....maybe I skimmed over them somewhere and didn't realize it. Your help would be greatly appreciated.

1. Is there a cap on the increse in dues every year?
2. Is there a restriction on how much point values for each unit can increase/decrease in any given year?

Just want to have all the facts before diving in. Thank you!

1: Almost certain the cap is 10%

2: Each DVC has a finite number of points assigned to it. Disney cannot increase this. What they do do is re-allocate how the points are spent. They have done this the last two years to even things out pointwise between weekday and weekend stays. I believe before 2009's reallocation they had only changed the system one other time. Don't look reallocation to happen every year.

 

[jlewisinsyr]

1: Almost certain the cap is 10%

I believe this is 15%, but again, the percentage has never been close to being reached.

2: Each DVC has a finite number of points assigned to it. Disney cannot increase this. What they do do is re-allocate how the points are spent. They have done this the last two years to even things out pointwise between weekday and weekend stays. I believe before 2009's reallocation they had only changed the system one other time. Don't look reallocation to happen every year.

Although re-allocations do not happen every year, they have happened over the past two years. There is a good chance they will occur in 2012. There is a maximum number of points that can be reallocated each year as well, which I believe is 20% per night/category per year. This has been part of the reason, IMO that there has been more then re-allocation recently because Disney hit the threshold on the reallocation between nights for the smaller, low season rooms and needed multiple years to rebalance the points.

 

[chalee94]

I believe this is 15%, but again, the percentage has never been close to being reached.

this is true - i also think the 15% cap does not apply to the property tax component of dues.

 

[RobDoc]

The limit on a maintenance fee increase is 15% - not counting the property tax component. A greater increase would have to be voted on by the owners. There have even been years when the fees actually went down.

The limit on point chart reallocation is 20% in any given year. Speculation was made that the point chart changes in 2010 and again in 2011 were made to stay within this 20% limitation.

 

[erionm]

In 2008, FL voters approved a property tax reform which put an assessment cap of 10% on properties not already capped.

http://www.flgov.com/reform

Here is a portion from the above linked webpage:

Provides an assessment cap of 10 percent for all properties not previously capped: While homestead properties are already capped at three percent, now all other properties, including rental properties, second homes, and business properties, will be protected from huge tax increases. This new exemption does not apply to school taxes.

 

[NewDCLGuy]

The cap is higher for VGC. 25% I believe.

But all caps are essentially meaningless as Disney can get around them with votes and special assessments.

What "protects" us is not the contractural limits. All we have is DVC's integrity. So far they have a nearly 20-year track record that is pretty darn good.

 

[VanessasMom]

hmmmm...interesting numbers. Thanks!

 

[YourEveryDayAdam]

Another note:

Disney is also forbidden, by law, to make a profit on the member dues. The annual dues collected must be kept separate from Disney's general operating budget. Those funds can only be used for expenses related to the operation of the resort.

Basically, they can't just decide to increase dues by 15% each year and pocket the money. If they expect the operating expenses to go down one year, then they MUST decrease the dues.

 

[JWG]

I have to say I find dues fascinating. For example, Animal Kingdom Villas has a significant amount of money toward Animal Programs. Likely preservation of the Savannah and its inhabitants. That's unique to AKV.

Yet, dues around the system are relatively the same/in-sync with each other. Meaning other resorts operational, maintenance or other program fees must be higher to offset that.

You could argue that AKV has lower operational/admin costs (I haven't looked so could be very wrong) because they share a check-in desk and such with the hotel. And that's an offset to the animal programs.

I'd expect BLT to have and maintain the lowest dues because it has the least exterior surface area for mainteance (one roof, more durable siding/exterior surface), shared services with CR, etc. But bet that doesn't happen.

Just interesting.

 

[erionm]

You could argue that AKV has lower operational/admin costs (I haven't looked so could be very wrong) because they share a check-in desk and such with the hotel. And that's an offset to the animal programs.

AKV actually has two check-in desks. The shared one in Jambo House and one in Kidani Village. Jambo House and Kidani Village don't share any services except for transportation. Jambo House only has 134 units which is just under 1/4 of the total AKV units.

 

[hakepb]

BLT dues should remain lower because it requires more points per room. If there's available real estate, high rises are never more affordable than more common construction.

An easy math example: a resort with $3 dues but takes 50 points a night has the same maintaince/operational expense as a resort with $5 dues but only needs 30 points /night. Both examples take $150 in dues expense per night.

 

[tjkraz]

I have to say I find dues fascinating. For example, Animal Kingdom Villas has a significant amount of money toward Animal Programs. Likely preservation of the Savannah and its inhabitants. That's unique to AKV.

Yet, dues around the system are relatively the same/in-sync with each other. Meaning other resorts operational, maintenance or other program fees must be higher to offset that.

You could argue that AKV has lower operational/admin costs (I haven't looked so could be very wrong) because they share a check-in desk and such with the hotel. And that's an offset to the animal programs.

I'd expect BLT to have and maintain the lowest dues because it has the least exterior surface area for mainteance (one roof, more durable siding/exterior surface), shared services with CR, etc. But bet that doesn't happen.

Just interesting.

The biggest influence on the annual dues rate is the points charts at each resort. BLT, VGC and Aulani all have noticeably higher daily point rates than the others. In a nutshell, this means that the resort's operating costs are spread over more points, leading to lower per-point dues rates.

Then you need to look at how things like transportation and resort amenities vary from location-to-location. SSR has bus service to 4 theme parks (plus DTD and the water parks.) BWV and BCV only have bus service to two of those resorts. There are boats to Epcot and DHS, but those costs are probably much lower than buses given the infrequency of service and the fact that costs are shared among BWV, BWI, BCV, BC, YC, Dolphin and Swan.

AKV has the savanna.

HHI and Vero don't have any transportation costs but things like insurance tend to be higher due to their coastal locations.

Things like the design and materials of the resorts do play a role in some of the numbers (Maintenance, capital improvements), but in most cases the other factors above play a much larger role in determining variances from one resort to another.

 

[psac]

The biggest influence on the annual dues rate is the points charts at each resort. BLT, VGC and Aulani all have noticeably higher daily point rates than the others. In a nutshell, this means that the resort's operating costs are spread over more points, leading to lower per-point dues rates.

Interesting... So using points from another home resort at those higher point resorts is actually a double-whammy. Not only are you spending more points, but you've paid more maintenance for each point.

The equalizer is if you buy in to those other home resorts at a lower initial $/pt, such as through resale...

 

[tecodis]

Interesting... So using points from another home resort at those higher point resorts is actually a double-whammy. Not only are you spending more points, but you've paid more maintenance for each point.

The equalizer is if you buy in to those other home resorts at a lower initial $/pt, such as through resale...

And that's only if you OWN the other resort as a contract. If I own at AKV but use those points at BLT, I'd be paying AKV fees staying at BLT.