Candlelight Processional/Manners Please!

[bobbiwoz]

In '02 we ate at Mexico after the CP and we sat next to a couple from Scotland. They asked us why people stood during the Hallelujah Chorus. I was surprised that THEY didn't know, but apparently it is not a universal tradition.

Bobbi

 

[nuttylawprofessor]

Ay yay yay, I didn't mean to turn this into a "standing" discussion.

 

[4theloveofdisney]

I had a similar problem at the Beauty and the Beast show last month. A family of 3 came in the theater late and sat in front of us. The dad had a huge hat on and sat right in front of me, I asked him nicely to take it off so he did, but I could tell he wasn't happy about it. In general the dad wasn't happy to be at the Beauty and the Beast show in the first place, and he made everyone around him know that his wife dragged him there. Then the wife got PO'd that I said something to him and she put the hat on the little girls head and placed her right on the dads lap, now really blocking mine and my dd's view! The mom and dad talked loudly during the first part of the show, and we asked them about 4 times to please be quiet, my dd really wanted to hear Belle sing. We would have moved but the theater was packed. Then finally I got mad enough to tell them to take the hat off the kids head and stop talking, they were ruining the show for everyone around them! Everyone around us agreed loudly and the annoying family left. I felt bad for the little girl that her parents were being so selfish.

I had a similar experience at MVMCP last year. We were in the castle forecourt for the Christmas show and *everyone was sitting on the ground except for these two men, who were videotaping. They were blocking about eight other families views during the show. These families asked them to sit down many times politely and they kept turning around and yelling at them to "shut up" and saying "it's a free country". A CM came over once and they sat briefly, raised on their knees but quickly returned to a standing position. One Mom went up to one of the guys, asking politely for them to sit and pointed out the families and CHILDREN behind him who couldn't see (and couldn't move either) and the guy screamed at her to "Get a CM and make me". So she did! Needless to say I have about 15 minutes of a great Christmas show interlaced with boo's and "SIT DOWN"! Afterwards, they were sneering at everyone in the crowd. Our view wasn't obstructed at all and in fact we only felt bad (we didn't know about the tape until we watched it later at home) for those involved but after the show was over, we were arranging our strollers and waiting for the crowd to disburse when they passed us and gave US a nasty sneer! I was so mad! I really hope they wound up getting kicked out because with an attitude like that, I can't imagine that the night would be any better!!!

 

[beattyfamily]

I had a similar experience at MVMCP last year. We were in the castle forecourt for the Christmas show and *everyone was sitting on the ground except for these two men, who were videotaping. They were blocking about eight other families views during the show. These families asked them to sit down many times politely and they kept turning around and yelling at them to "shut up" and saying "it's a free country". A CM came over once and they sat briefly, raised on their knees but quickly returned to a standing position. One Mom went up to one of the guys, asking politely for them to sit and pointed out the families and CHILDREN behind him who couldn't see (and couldn't move either) and the guy screamed at her to "Get a CM and make me". So she did! Needless to say I have about 15 minutes of a great Christmas show interlaced with boo's and "SIT DOWN"! Afterwards, they were sneering at everyone in the crowd. Our view wasn't obstructed at all and in fact we only felt bad (we didn't know about the tape until we watched it later at home) for those involved but after the show was over, we were arranging our strollers and waiting for the crowd to disburse when they passed us and gave US a nasty sneer! I was so mad! I really hope they wound up getting kicked out because with an attitude like that, I can't imagine that the night would be any better!!!

IMHO, your example is a tad different then the Candlelight Processional because the Candlelight Processional is a show with seats...and some there even pay for a meal to get better seats...but at the Castle show at MVMCP or for example a band playing in Epcot, you can't really force the people around you to sit. Or if you have a curb seat for the parade and there are people behind you and you decide to stand, the people behind you can't force you to sit.

I just got back and at the Castle show at MVMCP everyone was sitting till it started and then most stood because it was hard to see it over the fake trees they put around the stage. I don't see anything wrong with that. I was at Epcot and a Beatle-type group was singing at UK and we went to take a peek. There were many benches with old people sitting and some people standing around. I accidentally got in front of someone on a bench and they yelled at me to move. I did but my DH told me I shouldn't have had to move.

Just wanted to give a different perspective. I don't think standing to see a show in front of the castle is exactly the same as standing at the Candlelight Processional. IMHO.

 

[Talking Hands]

Then, many people did not stand at the beginning of the Halleluiah Chorus. Several of us did and then, eventually, others stood. I thought everyone knew to stand during the chorus.

This is something I hate. It frankly ruins that portion of the show for me. When you stand up in front of people that are deaf or hard of hearing we can't see the interpreter so get none of this beautiful song. ANd if I remain in my wheelchair it is even worse. ALl I have is a view of people's butts. Yuck.

 

[goofy4tink]

I didn't see any rude behavior, but I was suprised. At one point while the choir is singing Silent Night, the conductor turns to the audiance and begins conducting. The audiance is supposed to sing along. Several people in our row, including DD and myself, began singing. People turned around in front of us and gave us dirty looks.

Then, many people did not stand at the beginning of the Halleluiah Chorus. Several of us did and then, eventually, others stood. I thought everyone knew to stand during the chorus.

We had the exact same experience!!! Were you there on Wed, the 30th?? We had people look at us like we had 3 heads when we started singing Silent Night, and as I stood for the H. Chorus, I noticed there were a few others over on the stage left side that beat me to it!!! People then slowly stood. The man next to me asked when it was done why I stood, I explained the meaning as I understood it (as explained here) and told him that it wasn't actually a rule or anything and could just be an old rumor but I stand anyway. And I sing it also.....no way can I stand to sit and just listen to it being sung...I have to join in.
Phil Donahue was better than I expected. I loved Heather Headley last year though..she was incredible.

 

[Robo]

Just to weight in on the Hallelujah Chorus standing..

I had the opportunity in a choral group to perform Handel's Messiah at the US Naval Academy in front of many politicians and esteemed, decorated Naval personel.

None of them stood, to my recollecton.

Of course we were standing, but we were the choir.

So I don't think everyone is aware of that tradition.

This is not an opinion or an unusual occurrence.
Here are more links. Some with clips from the text they contain.
(Many, many more if you Google "Hallelujah Chorus Stand".)
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http://www.festival-singers.org.nz/haleluia.htm

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http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/h2g2/A698268
The 'Hallelujah' Chorus

...the first London performance of Messiah took place at the Covent Garden Theatre (now the Royal Opera House, Covent Garden) on 23 March, 1743, in the presence of the King, George II. When he heard the words, 'The kingdom of this world...' the King rose to his feet and remained standing until the end of the number. Various explanations have been put forward for this startling behaviour. It may have been in recognition that George's earthly kingdom was subservient to the Kingdom of Heaven. It may have been as a mark of awed tribute to the composer. Or it may have been that His Majesty had nodded off and jumped up startled by the loud music. As a matter of protocol, no-one could remain seated while the King was standing, so the whole audience stood throughout. The tradition remains to this day of the audience standing for the 'Hallelujah' chorus and is often observed even when there is no royalty present and even, it seems, among peoples who bear no allegiance to the British or indeed any monarch. On a later occasion, when the great composer Joseph Haydn heard the 'Hallelujah' Chorus in Westminster Abbey, he also stood with the rest of the audience, exclaiming with tears in his eyes 'He is the master of us all!'.
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http://www.gramophone.co.uk/mainforum.asp?messageSectionID=47&threadID=24927&type=chrono

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http://www.bbhq.com/this1217.htm
I love traditions... traditions of my childhood... and nothing can match the traditions of Christmas.

Of course, many of the traditions of Christmas began long before the boomer years. Handel's "Messiah" was first performed in London in 1743. According to an account written over thirty years later, when the chorus began "For the Lord God Omnipotent Reigneth" (what we call the "Hallelujah Chorus"), King George II stood up and remained standing throughout the chorus. Out of respect for the king, so did the members of the audience. Many people have speculated on the reason the king stood up; some even question whether the event happened at all. But 250 years later, that does not matter. The "Hallelujah Chorus" is a wonderful, majestic piece of music and a Christmas favorite. Standing for it is a tradition, and a sign of respect... for Handel, for the meaning of the "Messiah," and for traditions in general. I love it! I always stand up for the "Hallelujah Chorus," even when I play it at home. Of course, usually I am conducting an imaginary orchestra and chorus as well; but that still counts.

 

[manning]

I had a similar experience at MVMCP last year. We were in the castle forecourt for the Christmas show and *everyone was sitting on the ground except for these two men, who were videotaping. They were blocking about eight other families views during the show. These families asked them to sit down many times politely and they kept turning around and yelling at them to "shut up" and saying "it's a free country". A CM came over once and they sat briefly, raised on their knees but quickly returned to a standing position. One Mom went up to one of the guys, asking politely for them to sit and pointed out the families and CHILDREN behind him who couldn't see (and couldn't move either) and the guy screamed at her to "Get a CM and make me". So she did! Needless to say I have about 15 minutes of a great Christmas show interlaced with boo's and "SIT DOWN"! Afterwards, they were sneering at everyone in the crowd. Our view wasn't obstructed at all and in fact we only felt bad (we didn't know about the tape until we watched it later at home) for those involved but after the show was over, we were arranging our strollers and waiting for the crowd to disburse when they passed us and gave US a nasty sneer! I was so mad! I really hope they wound up getting kicked out because with an attitude like that, I can't imagine that the night would be any better!!!

They did nothing wrong. That is in their mind and their world. I use to get upset with types like those, but finally realized they will never change. Sometimes I do get revenge and I do it in a way they have no clue it happened. Just a mysterious happening. If you know what I mean.

 

[Stacerita]

We were at the Nov 28 show and were surprised by the bad manners and rudeness of others in the crowd. People talking and goofing around during the show and just being plain disruptive. I was bothered by it. Especially during the readings. Granted, not everyone has the same beliefs and so the readings dont mean as much to them, but why ruin it for the rest of us. We had one family behind us talking practically through the entire show. And their children were not behaving one bit. Screaming and going on and on about the popcorn they were eating and not getting to hold the bucket. I was totally annoyed. And they weren't the only ones. People talking and laughing at whatever they were talking about during the whole thing.

I must have not gotten the memos on joining in on singing Slient Night and standing during Hallelujah. We never joined in on the singing and no one around us did either. And we only stood up because everyone else was and we couldn't see. We asked each other and a few around us if we were supposed to stand. Didn't know we were to.

No matter what, we enjoyed the show. I probably wouldn't make it a point to go out of my way to see it again, but if it worked out right we would see it. Everyone should see it at least once though.

 

[dkrfla]

It's funny because I never knew of the standing during the Hallelujah Chorus tradition but everyone else did so I just figured we were supposed to and did. I am not an overly relgious person but I wasn't offended by it and really enjoyed the whole performance...well except for the people talking during the narration and singing.

Dusty

 

[seashoreCM]

>>> Narration for the video camera: "Down in front! Down in front" over and over

>>> Standing argument: OT: In an earlier lifetime (high school) we had these sports awards ceremony asssemblies every now and them. I had this gut feeling that we should not have had to give every coach a standing ovation as s/he introduced his.her team. But I also had a tendency to fall asleep when sitting still for a long time.

>>> hats, cell phones, popcorn bucket, video cameras too: Maybe the time has come to remove the offending object and return it after the performance.

Disney hints:
http://members.aol.com/ajaynejr/disney.htm

 

[Niagara2]

We went opening weekend and this show was the most disruptive in years. We usually get the package and sit closer. This year we sat near the back, center. The family in front of us talked between themselves, passed the adorable grandkid back and forth, turned on her lighted princess wand, dropped something and crawled around looking for it, stood up for pictures etc. The family next to us had a crying baby but didn;t leave when the baby wouldn't settle down. I think Rita Morano did the best reading ever that Sat. night but we missed alot of it. I thought I saved $200 on the package but I missed the show. Next year back to Lecellairs (Sp) Yea.

 

[CheshireVal]

IMHO, your example is a tad different then the Candlelight Processional because the Candlelight Processional is a show with seats...and some there even pay for a meal to get better seats...but at the Castle show at MVMCP or for example a band playing in Epcot, you can't really force the people around you to sit. Or if you have a curb seat for the parade and there are people behind you and you decide to stand, the people behind you can't force you to sit.

Actually, CMs will force you to sit if you're at a curb on a parade route. And generally they force people in front of the stone benches in front of hte castle to stay seated during the parades, too.

 

[beattyfamily]

Actually, CMs will force you to sit if you're at a curb on a parade route. And generally they force people in front of the stone benches in front of hte castle to stay seated during the parades, too.

I guess it depends on the circumstances because while watching Spectro on Main Street last week it started pouring and our feet were in big puddles so we stook on the curb. No one said a word. Same thing at the curb at Country Bear (one of the only curb/seated spots in that area); I sat but my kids and DH stood.

YMMV.

 

[MHTeacher]

We were at the Monday, Nov. 28 CP. The rains poured forth that night, and unfortunately..we didn't have any rain jackets with us. We were some of the people who had to jump up and head for cover. I really hated to walk out during the performance, but it was raining pretty hard at times. We stood under the umbrellas at the tables across from the theater and could still hear the singing. It was beautiful and I hope to be able to see the entire performance again some day.

 

[Kristi1357]

We attended last night's CP and loved it! Well, except for the crazy lady in front of us in the white & red striped scarf that had to hold up her "Merry Christmas Chris" banner twice (I think it was 'Chris' anyway)! PEOPLE!

And we did have a cranky 2 year old, but hubby took him out early and waited for us.

 

[ES0412]

Aaah, we were also there on the 28th and boy did it pour! Of course we were seated back in the theater not under the roof and we got soaked! We just figured we couldn't get any wetter so we stuck it out until 3 songs from the end and the thunder and lightning came then it was time to head back to Boardwalk.

One big problem we had were inconsidered folks who thought it was perfectly fine to just open up huge golf umbrellas and didn't care that the people behind them couldn't see anything. I think they should have made them put them down and either leave or get wet.

We literally ran into Haley Joel Osment at the Belle Vue Lounge at the Boardwalk and then again at the Rock N Rollercoaster. It was kind of sad to see him going through WDW all by himself except for 1 security guard. We saw his performance later in the week and really couldn't hear him all that well.

It was our first time seeing this and we were really pleased with all of it.

 

[Stacy's a freak]

We literally ran into Haley Joel Osment at the Belle Vue Lounge at the Boardwalk and then again at the Rock N Rollercoaster. It was kind of sad to see him going through WDW all by himself except for 1 security guard. We saw his performance later in the week and really couldn't hear him all that well.

Please don't be sad for us Solo WDW'ers! It's really a fun time if you know how to do it.

 

[Feralpeg]

We literally ran into Haley Joel Osment at the Belle Vue Lounge at the Boardwalk and then again at the Rock N Rollercoaster. It was kind of sad to see him going through WDW all by himself except for 1 security guard.

If we'd only known. DD (17) would have been more than happy to show him around WDW! LOL!

 

[Danauk]

Thanks for the tips on standing during the Hallelujah Chorus, I didn't know it was tradition either! As an English girl who has sung or played in the orchestra for the whole of Handel's Messiah more times than I can count I have never performed the work when people have stood for the Hallelujah Chorus. I'm glad to know I can sing along and join in though, I would find it difficult not to!