Camera advice needed.

Accident

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Jun 13, 2015
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I've kind of hit the point that I'm looking for something better than a mobile phone to get some pictures. I also don't want to do the jump to DSLR for both cost and size reasons. I have a few different bags and tripods i'm already bringing around for my new found love of 360 video depending on what I expect to record that day. while filming I tend to be hands free as there is nothing to do but click record and hope for the best with 360 cameras.

Is there any cameras that is somewhere between a point and shoot and a dslr that I should consider? I'd really like to stay away from digital zooms and hopefully someone still makes a halfway decent smaller camera with a pretty aggressive optical zoom.

any help is appreciated.
 
I forgot to mention I'm lightly eyeing the sony a6000. It seems to be that camera that is in the middle of point and shoot and dslr that I think may work well for theme parks.
 
I forgot to mention I'm lightly eyeing the sony a6000. It seems to be that camera that is in the middle of point and shoot and dslr that I think may work well for theme parks.

The a6000 is essentially a dslr -- without the R. DSLR means digital single lens reflex camera. Typically, it's an interchangeable lens camera, with a large sensor, and an inner mechanism that includes a mirror to allow for an optical viewfinder. In the days before digital, that mirror was the best way to get a true "live view." Now in the days of advanced digital. You're getting cameras that drop the mirror. Instead of using an optical viewfinder, they use an electronic viewfinder powered by the camera sensor. Thus "mirrorless" cameras. Technically, all p&s cameras are mirrorless, but the term usually refers to dslrs without mirrors. P&s are typically small sensor cameras with fixed lenses.
By removing the mirror,the a6000 becomes slightly more compact than a small dslr. (Compare to the Canon sl1 and Nikon d3400, you'll see it is slightly more compact and a few less ounces).
Just like a dslr, uses interchangeable lenses. It has the same types of settings and functions. It has the same type of sensor found in dslrs. Price is right in line with comparable dslrs. (Some complain that the lenses are sometimes a bit more costly than dslr lenses).
 

So I guess that model isn't a bad choice. I'm not going to be going nuts with a lot of lenses and such, I just want something reasonable for theme park usage. I think it actually uses the same batteries my FDX-3000 4K sony actioncam that I use so I'm loaded up on batteries already.

does photography generally have a certain time of year when new models and things come out? Is it big at CES that is about to happen? I'm probably going to wait until febish anyway and see if i would really use it.
 
While the A6000 and FDX3000 are both Sony.... they appear to be using different battery sizes.

A quick search on BH Photo shows it uses the NP-FW50, but I think the FDX3000 uses NP-BX1. So you need to carry two sets of batteries.
 
While the A6000 and FDX3000 are both Sony.... they appear to be using different battery sizes.

A quick search on BH Photo shows it uses the NP-FW50, but I think the FDX3000 uses NP-BX1. So you need to carry two sets of batteries.

thanks, I didn't really look that close. I carry 5 extras now plus a mega portable usb charger because I have to constantly swap and recharge the 360 batteries to have any chance of using the camera more than 1 or 2 rides. a couple more isn't really going to get noticed.

So in general, nobody has another suggestion and the A6000 is probably the ideal camera for this need for a little decent quality vs size/cost?
 
There are others: Panasonic and Olympus make micro 4:3 cameras with a wide range of lenses to choose from (and the lenses fit each others cameras). These are mirrorless, most with LCD viewfinders. The sensors (micro 4:3) are smaller than APS-C but the lenses are smaller as well. Somehow, prices didn't seem to get smaller. ;)

Some current models are G7, GX85, OMD-E-M10, and PEN-F (other PEN models do not have a viewfinder).

boB
 
A6000 is probably the ideal camera for this need for a little decent quality vs size/cost?
Without a mirrorbox.... the mirrorless looks smaller. However, when you visit a camera store. Do compare product cost. I found mirrorless cost more for lenses and accessories. The weight savings are minor.
With the above cost and weight issues... my next camera is NOT likely a mirrorless.
 
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So many choices :(

I think it's going to come down to size as most of what I want to do is video related (360 so this camera doens't work for that). I just want something in the bag that can take a halfway decent photo to use when walking around or I'm just standing there as you don't move around 360 cameras (aka getting those great shots to use for custom images on youtube, etc).

I have a trip to nyc in early feb, i have time to hit some better places to actually touch and demo the cameras before purchase.
 
So I guess that model isn't a bad choice. I'm not going to be going nuts with a lot of lenses and such, I just want something reasonable for theme park usage. I think it actually uses the same batteries my FDX-3000 4K sony actioncam that I use so I'm loaded up on batteries already.

does photography generally have a certain time of year when new models and things come out? Is it big at CES that is about to happen? I'm probably going to wait until febish anyway and see if i would really use it.

No, they stagger their releases through the whole year.

What Sony has done, as they introduce newer models, they cut the prices of the older models and leave them as entry level.
So the a6000 was a high level camera when first introduced, but it now serves as their sub-$500 entry model. The a6300 is their enthusiast $900 model. The a6500 is their semi-pro $1400 model.

They aren't due to release anymore a6xxx cameras for at least another 18 months. It's not impossible, but they released 2 of them in 2016, and they should have life spans of 2-4 years, so I'm not expecting any new a6xxx models until 2018 or later.
For 2017, I suspect Sony will introduce a pro-level a9 for $4000+, and likely an upgraded entry-level full frame a7iiii for $2,000.
 
Without a mirrorbox.... the mirrorless looks smaller. However, when you visit a camera store. Do compare product cost. I found mirrorless cost more for lenses and accessories. The weight savings are minor.
With the above cost and weight issues... my next camera is NOT likely a mirrorless.

I agree the weight savings are exaggerated by mirrorless fans.
Costs tend to be similar for most users. Really depends which lenses, and whether you are willing to consider used.

The real advantages of mirrorless have little to do with weight.

I shoot both. I shoot Nikon d750 with about $5,000+ in lenses, and Sony a6300 with about $2,000 in lenses.
Depending on developments in the next 1-2 years, I may replace my d750 and go completely mirrorless.

I love having completely accurate autofocus, including face detect and eye detect, over virtually the entire frame. I love being able to use the LCD seamlessly with the viewfinder, not a slower AF if I choose to use the LCD. I love being able to access my menus, review my photos, utilize a full level, check white balance... etc, all in the viewfinder.

If Sony or Nikon come out with a full frame model that well-matches my needs, it may be my next camera to replace my d750.
 
thanks, I didn't really look that close. I carry 5 extras now plus a mega portable usb charger because I have to constantly swap and recharge the 360 batteries to have any chance of using the camera more than 1 or 2 rides. a couple more isn't really going to get noticed.

So in general, nobody has another suggestion and the A6000 is probably the ideal camera for this need for a little decent quality vs size/cost?

If you have no interest in changing lenses and you want to keep things small, loom at the Sony rx100 models, the Canon g9x, etc.
 
They aren't due to release anymore a6xxx cameras for at least another 18 months. It's not impossible, but they released 2 of them in 2016, and they should have life spans of 2-4 years, so I'm not expecting any new a6xxx models until 2018 or later.
Some say A6300 was released with problems and quickly came out with the A6500. While there was no exploding batteries like the Note 7, the A6300 did have a overheating problem when in 4K video mode.
https://lensvid.com/gear/sony-a6500-v-s-a6300-overheating-test/
 
I too hate frequent lens swaps.... love the 18-200mm and 18-300mm lenses when travelling.

When I go with my dSLR, you'd hate my camera bag-- about 15 pounds. Typically my 18-35 or my 14/2.8, 24-70/2.8, 45/1.8 and 85/2.8. Plus tripod and flash.

Travel is where my a6300 mirrorless really does shine if I want to go really light weight. I hate sacrificing image quality, so I haven't used a 18-200 in years.
My a6300 + 10-18 + 16-70/4 + 24/1.8 +50/1.8 + gorillapod +flash all fit together in a fairly small camera bag, and weigh next to nothing.
Unless it is a wildlife vacation, I skip telephoto lenses. Pointless for how I shoot.
 
Some say A6300 was released with problems and quickly came out with the A6500. While there was no exploding batteries like the Note 7, the A6300 did have a overheating problem when in 4K video mode.
https://lensvid.com/gear/sony-a6500-v-s-a6300-overheating-test/

I have the a6300, it didn't have any particular problems that called for replacing quickly. Supposedly it has an overheating issue when 4K used extensively, but I've heard similar reports on other cameras.
 
So many choices :(

I think it's going to come down to size as most of what I want to do is video related (360 so this camera doens't work for that). I just want something in the bag that can take a halfway decent photo to use when walking around or I'm just standing there as you don't move around 360 cameras (aka getting those great shots to use for custom images on youtube, etc).

I have a trip to nyc in early feb, i have time to hit some better places to actually touch and demo the cameras before purchase.

good idea - check out the cameras at B&H or Adorama

I use a Canon DSLR for sports and action shots and use a pocket-size mirrorless camera and 'pancake' lens for traveling, events, and lightweight walking around. The good news is they can both take the same lens
www.flickr.com/photos/mmirrorless
 
Thought it might be an interesting exercise to compare some price and weight differences.
Now some notes -- when dealing with full frame cameras and premium lenses, I believe mirrorless will typically not offer any significant weight savings. Furthermore, Sony is the only big full frame mirrorless player, and they have priced their premium lenses with an extra premium... so they are more expensive. It's among the reasons that for my full frame pro work, I am continuing to stick to dSLR for now.

On the other hand, for APS-C use -- There are really only 2 big players in APS-C mirrorless -- Sony and Fuji. Samsung withdrew from the market. Canon is finally starting to get serious in the market, but for now, they offer very few lenses truly designed for mirrorless.
On the smaller sensor, the weight savings can really be maximized, if lenses are designed specifically for it. Particularly wider angle lenses.

Anyway, I'll stick to 2 brands I know for this comparison:
Sony's current mirrorless entry level dSLR equivalent is the A6000.
For Nikon, it is the D3400. The D3400 is newer, but Sony no longer updates their entry level models. They simply allow yesterday's upper model to become today's entry level.
So is it a fair comparison? They both offer 24mp sensors, probably variants of the same sensor. DXO suggests the image quality is very similar, the D3400 having an edge as lower ISOs while the A6000 has an edge at higher ISOs, but very similar. Neither camera can shoot 4k, they both shoot HD video. D3400 has an ISO range of 100-25600. The A6000 has ISO range of 100-51200. They both have wifi. They both have 3" screens, but the A6000 has a tilt non-touch screen and the D3400 has a fixed non-touch screen. The A6000 has a much bigger 100% viewfinder, but it is electronic. The D3400 only has a 95% viewfinder, and it is much smaller, but it is optical. (some prefer electronic, some prefer optical) . The A6000 can shoot 11fps with full autofocus, the D3400 is limited to 5fps.
So overall, they both are on a similar playing field, the A6000 being a bit richer in features.

So price:
Unfortunately, I can't even find the D3400 being offered as body only. But with kit 18-55 lens, it is running $496 on Amazon.
Amazon lists it as 394 grams in weight, I believe this is without lens.
Sony A6000, you can buy it body only for $400, or with the kit lens 16-50 for $550.
Weight -- 345 grams, body only.

Thus so far, you are paying $50 more for the Sony system, and saving 50 grams on the bodies.
Now, weight of the kit lenses:
The new Nikon 18-55 is 205 grams.
The Sony 16-50 116 grams.

Now, in fairness, in this case, the Nikon lens is the better lens by a little bit.
Still, we are now at an almost 150 gram difference between just camera + kit lens.

Now, I'll build out my typical travel bag. Other people will have different experiences, based on the types of lenses that carry.

I MUST have an ultrawide lens when I travel. Even if I stuck to a kit lens, I'd need something wider.
For Sony, it is their pretty good 10-18/4. It isn't cheap, $750. Weight, only 225 grams. That is with constant f4 and image stabilization.
The Nikon equivalent is not constant aperture and lacks image stabilization. It is their 10-24. It runs $899 and weighs 466 grams.

Now I'll add a normal view prime to the bag. Both Nikon and Sony have APS-C designed 35/1.8 lenses.
Sony's 35/1.8 for APS-C has image stabilization, it is $399 and weighs 154 grams.
Nikon's 35/1.8 for APS-C lacks stabilization, it is much cheaper at $199, and weighs 200 grams.

Then I need a portrait prime -- for APS-C, a nifty fifty.
Nikon does not have an APS-C designed 50/1.8, so you have to use their FX 50/1.8. It lacks stabilization. It is $220 and weighs 185 grams.
Usually, Nikon will have more lens choices than Sony. But in this case, Sony actually has more choices.
For Sony, you can get their FX 50/1.8, which also lacks stabilization, for $199 and weighs 186 grams --
Or, you can get their DX/APS-C 50/1.8, which has stabilization. It costs more, at $299 and weighs 202 grams. So in this case, there is no weight-savings no matter which Sony lens you pick. So keep things even -- so neither lens has stabilization, I'll go with the cheaper Sony.

Now, I could be done right there. I don't generally see a need for telephoto when I travel.
But for the sake of completeness, let's add telephotos to the bag.
We can either go with a cheaper kit-type telephoto, or a more premium telephoto options.
Going with the kit option: Sony 55-210 -- $350 and 345 grams.
Nikon 55-200, $350 and 300 grams. The Nikon also has a slightly faster aperture. As I said above, at telephoto, mirrorless doesn't really have any weight savings. In this case, the Nikon weighs less than the Sony, while likely delivering slightly better performance.

Now if we switch to premium telephoto:
Sony 70-200/4 -- 850 grams and $1500
Nikon 70-200/4 --850 grams and $1400
I actually own and use both these lenses. They both deliver very similar and very good performance.

Now, let's assemble our bag (I'll go with the premium telephotos as they are directly comparable:
Sony A6000 + 10-18 + 16-50 + 35/1.8 + 50/1.8 + 70-200/4
Price: $3400
Weight: 1876 grams or 4.1 pounds

Nikon D3400 + 10-24 + 18-55 + 35/1.8 + 50/1.8 + 70-200/4
Price: $3215. (so about 6% cheaper than the Sony bundle)
Weight: 2300 grams or 5 lbs.

When I started this comparison, I wasn't exactly sure how it would conclude.
I think we see overall that the Nikon options are a bit cheaper, but there are some lenses where Sony is cheaper. So when you balance it out, the Nikon is slightly cheaper to assemble a full kit. Lenses are not 100% equivalent... in some cases, Sony is offering the better lens, in some cases, Nikon is offering the better lens.
In weight... as you get to lenses that are 50mm and longer, there are no weight differences. At wider angles, there can be somewhat significant weight differences.
In my example, the Sony kit weighed 20% less. A real difference but not massive. Not sure how much my shoulder would see the difference between 4 lbs and 5 lbs.

But, if you limit yourself to the wider angles -- if I removed the 70-200 from both bags..
Then the Sony bag would be only 1026 grams. The Nikon bag would be 1450 grams.
So Sony bag only 2.3 pounds -- And this is my real typical travel kit.
The Nikon bag -- 3.2 pounds. So now the Nikon bag weighs 50% more than the Sony bag. I would definitely bring an extra batter for the Sony, but that's only another 80 grams, or .2 pounds.

So in other words, if you think a dSLR has to be 10 lbs and a mirrorless is only 2 lbs... then you are way off. The differences are never anywhere near that. But for some users, you may be talking about a moderate noticeable weight advantage to mirrorless... comparing 3 lbs to 2lbs.
And in terms of price... while there will be examples where the mirrorless is much more expensive due to the lack of cheaper 3rd party options (typically when talking about premium, professional and semi-pro lenses), there are also plenty of examples where the price differences are rather negligible (when sticking to consumer grade lenses).

You really need to look closely at what gear you really expect to add over time, what options exist in each system, etc. For me, personally, Sony allows me to carry a light weight, easy, fun, option capable for very good photographs. For my professional work, I need a full frame camera + 24-70/2.8 + 85/1.8. In this case, the Sony options didn't give me any real weight savings, and were much much more expensive (Nikon premium lenses aren't much cheaper than the Sony premium lenses, but I shoot with some Tamron lenses which deliver fantastic bang for the buck).
 
I love my Canon PowerShot G16! It's compact and takes AMAZING photos...oftentimes better than my old Olympus DSLR.
 




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