Buying at Riviera

[jennywren5]

We have an appointment Saturday at the DVC office to sign our purchase of 325 points at Riviera. We are buying through Disney but we are new to DVC and I am wondering if there is anything I need to consider? I don’t know much about DVC, is 325 points enough? We are a family of 4 and right now we come 1 or 2 times a year. What do you think?

 

[Sneaky3]

If you can wing it I would buy two contracts instead of one big one. Much easier to sell if need be.

 

[Marionnette]

We have an appointment Saturday at the DVC office to sign our purchase of 325 points at Riviera. We are buying through Disney but we are new to DVC and I am wondering if there is anything I need to consider? I don’t know much about DVC, is 325 points enough? We are a family of 4 and right now we come 1 or 2 times a year. What do you think?

Have you looked at a points chart to see how many points you most probably will need?
https://www.wdwinfo.com/disney-vacation-club/riviera-points.htm
Do you know what a use year is?
https://www.disboards.com/threads/understanding-use-year-updated-march-10-2019.1942668/
Are you aware of the resale restrictions on Riviera contracts and how that may affect the value of your contract should you need to sell? Or how it may affect your ability to book your home resort years from now?

Have you looked at the resale market? Or considered a direct purchase at one of the other DVC resorts?

Are you aware of what the annual maintenance fees are on 325 points and that they will undoubtedly increase each year?

If you’ve done your homework and know what you’re getting into, then Welcome Home. Otherwise, study up and consider postponing that purchase until you’ve read these boards...a lot.

 

[zavandor]

Are you buying Riviera because it's what you want or because it was what was sold to you?
Do you know you could buy any resort or buy resale to save (a lot of) money?
Do you know about the resale restrictions and how they could affect the value of the contract?

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

We have an appointment Saturday at the DVC office to sign our purchase of 325 points at Riviera. We are buying through Disney but we are new to DVC and I am wondering if there is anything I need to consider? I don’t know much about DVC, is 325 points enough? We are a family of 4 and right now we come 1 or 2 times a year. What do you think?

Honestly, that's a lot of money to pay for something you say you don't know a lot about. And it's hard to comment if it even makes sense for you at all

My suggestion? Wait to purchase and investigate more. Learn the system, availability, when you need to book, what resort you really want to stay at most, the size accommodations you want, when you want to go, will you consistently go 1-2 times for the foreseeable future, does direct make sense or would resale be better.

DVC will be there to sell to you whenever you want so take the time to learn more.

 

[SG131]

I agree with PP idea to buy smaller contracts. Much much easier to sell if needed. I would also make sure you truly understand the resale restrictions. Right now people who bought in at the original resorts can sell their contracts and make a profit on what they bought. That most likely will not be the case for Rivera. It's very risky.

I know it's about a vacation and not a financial investment, however, a lot can happen in 50 years including unforeseen circumstances where you would NEED to sell. Most people don't buy DVC with the intentions of selling it, but it's nice to have that safety net. On the one show they DVC Store listed the top 3 reasons to sell and it was death, divorce and one other, maybe job loss. None of which you can plan for. In another thread it was mentioned that the first Rivera contract was sold on the resale market. The sellers agent said it was listed at $130 and could not disclose the sale price, but it sold for substantially less than the asking price. Resale contracts for beach club, grand floridain and bay lake towers sell for more than $130 and in the case of beach club it only has 23 years left on the contract.

If you're sure Rivera is the resort for you and don't mind the risks involved, go for it. Just make sure you're going in with eyes wide open.

 

[vikequeen]

If you can wing it I would buy two contracts instead of one big one. Much easier to sell if need be.

This is important. I did not know about this when we bought our first contract at Aulani, and I really regret the fact that I have one large 300 point contract. We split our riviera contract into two. it doesn't add much to the costs. Will help if you ever need to sell, or if you want to split it to pass down to your kids.

 

[vikequeen]

Have you looked at a points chart to see how many points you most probably will need?
https://www.wdwinfo.com/disney-vacation-club/riviera-points.htm
Do you know what a use year is?
https://www.disboards.com/threads/understanding-use-year-updated-march-10-2019.1942668/
Are you aware of the resale restrictions on Riviera contracts and how that may affect the value of your contract should you need to sell? Or how it may affect your ability to book your home resort years from now?

Have you looked at the resale market? Or considered a direct purchase at one of the other DVC resorts?

Are you aware of what the annual maintenance fees are on 325 points and that they will undoubtedly increase each year?

If you’ve done your homework and know what you’re getting into, then Welcome Home. Otherwise, study up and consider postponing that purchase until you’ve read these boards...a lot.

Great advice. I will say that after doing all of this research, we decided 325 points was the right amount for our family of four, as was Riviera. We book at least 1 BRs. We ultimately ended up buying 350 because, at the time, the pricing promotion was such that the last 25 points were very cheap. So you might want to look at what the promotion is for 350 versus 325 and see if that is the same for you.

 

[mjlash22]

How many days from that 1-2 time a year trip do you stay? 2 full weeks a year or smaller trips? Are you fine with booking studios or for a family of 4, would you book a 1 bedroom?

Booking a standard view studio would get you 2 full weeks a year in 4 out of the 5 seasons. If you're looking at a 1 bed room, you wouldn't be able to do 2 full weeks in any season time frame.

Also, look at how much you spend currently for your twice a year vacations (hotel cost only), does it equate to more or less than $3922.75? If you spend less, might not be a good fit. If you spend more, could be a good fit assuming you can go the same amount of days you're used to currently going.

If you're wondering where I got that amount from:
- First year dues on 325 points = $2700.75
- Cost of points over 50 years = $1222/year

That last figure is rough as it does not include closing costs, and assumes you're paying all up front (no financing).

 

[Doberge]

I'd definately consider splitting into at least two and maybe even three contracts, maybe 125, 100, 100. If you ever need to sell, moving 325 with the resale restrictions will be more difficult that moving smaller contracts. Plus you'd have option to "downsize" but keep some Riviera points, which may be attractive if you decide to add on or really fall in love with a future resort.

 

[The Jackal]

Just be aware of the resale restrictions DVD put on Riveria contracts. For some it’s no big deal, for others it is. It appears the first resale RIV contract went for BWV/AKV resale price. This is not a good start for RIV. Time will tell.

 

[Dicentras]

Just be aware of the resale restrictions DVD put on Riveria contracts. For some it’s no big deal, for others it is. It appears the first resale RIV contract went for BWV/AKV resale price. This is not a good start for RIV. Time will tell.

I really think people are reading waaaaay too much into this one early sale as an indicator of future resale prices. The current promotions with Riviera are a nice incentive to buy direct, plus you get a much fuller product when buying direct. And, it’s not even open yet... Of course resale is selling super cheap *right now*. I suspect it will be a desirable, hard to book resort once it’s sold out, making used contracts more appealing then for those that want an Epcot area resort with a longer expiration date.

 

[The Jackal]

I really think people are reading waaaaay too much into this one early sale as an indicator of future resale prices. The current promotions with Riviera are a nice incentive to buy direct, plus you get a much fuller product when buying direct. And, it’s not even open yet... Of course resale is selling super cheap *right now*. I suspect it will be a desirable, hard to book resort once it’s sold out, making used contracts more appealing then for those that want an Epcot area resort with a longer expiration date.

Really, I’m not saying I saw the first CCV resale to hit the market but the the early ones I saw were in the 140-145 range, there were still great incentives at CCV. Don’t forget CCV was listed for less than RIV is now. The RIV contract was listed for $130 and the resale agent has been quoted as saying it sold for less than asking. Only time will tell. At some point we would like to try the resort out.

 

[SG131]

Really, I’m not saying I saw the first CCV resale to hit the market but the the early ones I saw were in the 140-145 range, there were still great incentives at CCV. Don’t forget CCV was listed for less than RIV is now. The RIV contract was listed for $130 and the resale agent has been quoted as saying it sold for less than asking. Only time will tell. At some point we would like to try the resort out.

The timeshare store also commented on the one DVC show that when new resorts open they usually have a list of clients waiting for sales to open, but they didn't have that for Rivera.

 

[zavandor]

I really think people are reading waaaaay too much into this one early sale as an indicator of future resale prices. The current promotions with Riviera are a nice incentive to buy direct, plus you get a much fuller product when buying direct. And, it’s not even open yet... Of course resale is selling super cheap *right now*. I suspect it will be a desirable, hard to book resort once it’s sold out, making used contracts more appealing then for those that want an Epcot area resort with a longer expiration date.

This is the Riviera doomsday scenario.
Resale owners will be only able to stay at Riviera, this means there is no plan B, not even SSR is an option, they HAVE to book their home resort or they risk losing their points. This means they'll all book at 11 months, especially for high request periods. This may lead to direct owners too to rush and book as soon as possible as availability will disappear soon after the 11 months window opens.
So, since everyone rush to book the high demand periods, people will start to walk reservations, creating problems also outside the high demand periods. And walking means that people will find single nights availability here and there, causing more split stays, i.e. higher mouskeeping costs and even higher MF.
To fix the problem DVC might decide to modify the home resort advantage and restrict resale to booking only 10 months out instead of 11 (this is already an option in the Riviera POS), causing the resale value to crumble to pennies, as a resale owner will never have a chance to book a high demand period.

Will it happen? If I knew I would rather apply my divination powers to winning the lottery. If I have to guess, probably not to this level and at least not for many years. It seems resale averages on 1% per year after a few year the resort is sold out. It may take many years for a critical mass of resale owners to develop in order to cause the doomsday scenario and who knows what might happen in the meantime. And the fact that resale might be a bit lower than average, may convince owners to keep their contract rather than sell.
However there is a risk and every one should give it a thought.

 

[vikequeen]

I personally think location (reliance on the new gondola transport) and expense (price per point and maintenance fees) have at least as much to do w slow sales as the resale restriction. But we will never know ...

 

[Matty B13]

With almost VGF point charts and high maintenance fees, I think the direct buyers who don't understand the system are in for a huge surprise every year with maintenance fees. Almost every contract I bought resale was purchased directly and then resold within 2 years, I think this might be accelerated with RRV.

 

[SG131]

I personally think location (reliance on the new gondola transport) and expense (price per point and maintenance fees) have at least as much to do w slow sales as the resale restriction. But we will never know ...

Agreed. I think the resale restrictions are just part of the puzzle. I have a lot of faith in the new gondola system, but it doesn't have the same benefit of proximity as boardwalk and beach club. And it takes a lot more points to stay at Rivera (well other than the Tower Studios which will be snapped up prior to 11 mo by walking).

With almost VGF point charts and high maintenance fees, I think the direct buyers who don't understand the system are in for a huge surprise every year with maintenance fees. Almost every contract I bought resale was purchased directly and then resold within 2 years, I think this might be accelerated with RRV.

I feel like there's always some people that are sold on the story and don't know what they're getting into and get blindsided by the realities. I think that may be exacerbated here with buyers who THINK they know what they're getting into because they've heard about how DVC works from a friend who has been a member for years etc, but don't realize that there are differences between Rivera and some of the other resorts.

 

[vikequeen]

With almost VGF point charts and high maintenance fees, I think the direct buyers who don't understand the system are in for a huge surprise every year with maintenance fees. Almost every contract I bought resale was purchased directly and then resold within 2 years, I think this might be accelerated with RRV.

Excellent point. So many people overextend for purchases like this and the maintenance fees would only make that worse.

 

[vikequeen]

Agreed. I think the resale restrictions are just part of the puzzle. I have a lot of faith in the new gondola system, but it doesn't have the same benefit of proximity as boardwalk and beach club. And it takes a lot more points to stay at Rivera (well other than the Tower Studios which will be snapped up prior to 11 mo by walking).

I feel like there's always some people that are sold on the story and don't know what they're getting into and get blindsided by the realities. I think that may be exacerbated here with buyers who THINK they know what they're getting into because they've heard about how DVC works from a friend who has been a member for years etc, but don't realize that there are differences between Rivera and some of the other resorts.

I agree. Beach club was my first choice. But it was so much more expensive that riviera made sense for us. DH will only buy direct. (I know I know ...)