Bush was told levies could break ....

wvrevy said:
My, my...what a surprise. The usual suspects all spinning frantically to make sure Shrub doesn't look like the incompetant fool that he is. :rolleyes:

I swear, sometimes I think that anyone in this administration could literally shoot someone in the face and you guys would go out of your way to find excuses and blame somebody else.

Oh...wait...

Kind of like you guys saying Cliinton only lied under oath to having sex with an intern, no big deal right?
 
TCPluto said:
Kind of like you guys saying Cliinton only lied under oath to having sex with an intern, no big deal right?

I'm sorry...maybe you could point out where anyone said that lying under oath was "no big deal"?

Yeah...didn't think so.

There is a difference though. Clinton's lie resulted in a dry cleaning bill. Bush's lies result in people in body bags. Bit of a difference in degree there, don't ya' think? :rolleyes:

Wait...what am I thinking...of course you don't see the difference. Otherwise, you wouldn't keep defending the guy.
 
TCPluto said:
Kind of like you guys saying Cliinton only lied under oath to having sex with an intern, no big deal right?

Guess that answers my question. You are incapable of seeing the current administrations faults. You can't admit to it, so what do you do? The old Clinton standby. :rolleyes:
 
wvrevy said:
There is a difference though. Clinton's lie resulted in a dry cleaning bill. Bush's lies result in people in body bags. Bit of a difference in degree there, don't ya' think? :rolleyes:

Wait...what am I thinking...of course you don't see the difference. Otherwise, you wouldn't keep defending the guy.

They're ticked he used their tactics against them, twisting words and facts to get out of what should be a open and shut case.
 

wvrevy said:
My, my...what a surprise. The usual suspects all spinning frantically to make sure Shrub doesn't look like the incompetant fool that he is. :rolleyes:

I swear, sometimes I think that anyone in this administration could literally shoot someone in the face and you guys would go out of your way to find excuses and blame somebody else.

Oh...wait...

No different than you guys blaming the guy for the bird that pooped on your car today. I'm not a Bush fan, but its funny to see how determined the left is to blame Bush for everything and the how determined the right is to defend him regardless. It's funny and sad at the same time.
 
With Bush its just one lie and one scandal after another. What does he have to do to get impeached? All Clinton has to do wrong is have sex, and bam- he was impeached by Congress.

What Bush has done is far worse, between spying, Katrina, lying about WMDs, the Iraq war, the Arabas in the ports, the corrupt people surrounding him, etc, etc.

I think even if Bush murdered a child by slicing him or her with an axe on national tv, he'd still get support in certain circles. They'd say, "Oh its the LIBERAL MEDIA trying to make him look bad! That kid got in the way of his axe!"
 
goofygirl said:
All Clinton has to do wrong is have sex, and bam- he was impeached by Congress.

The sex had nothing to do with it, he was accused of lying under oath about the sex. That is why the impeachement hearings happened.
 
/
LoraJ said:
Guess that answers my question. You are incapable of seeing the current administrations faults. You can't admit to it, so what do you do? The old Clinton standby. :rolleyes:

Not true. It's just the case that you want to make on the NOLA issue is not the presidents fault.

Read the posts of those that live there, they seem to have known for the past, oh 150 yrs that they were in danger.

Army Corps has been saying for decades that the levees needed work. No one has listened, or at least responded.

Federal money allocated for levees maintenance has been diverted by state and local politicians, for their own pet projects not related to the levees.

The Governor tells the feds that the levees had not been breached. Why should they assume she is wrong?

It's simply not the president's fault.
 
Clinton lied under oath. That is what he was impeached for. If Bush lies under oath I would want him impeached too. I know that all Presidents lie to us and many times it is necessary.
 
Viking said:
OK, let's assume he didn't know that the levees would break and that it's not his fault. But what about this: Half a year later there are still dead bodies rotting in their houses. Wrecked cars, damaged houses, debris are still cluttering up major portions of New Orleans.
Ok, all of the homes have been checked twice for dead bodies. So any dead bodies that were going to be found have been. I believe many were washed away. Most of the wrecked cars have even been moved. As for the damaged homes...well many people have not contacted the city. The city is trying not to just bulldoze a home before getting the homeowners permission first. Many people don't want their homes bulldozed b/c they think they can save it. My grandparents, who lived inLakeview, still hope that they can keep their house. It is impossible due to the structure damage and mold growth caused by 10 feet of water.

Viking said:
We had a big flood here too in 2002.
-Large portions of Eastern Germany were flooded, dozens of levees and dikes broke.
-A year later virtually no traces of the flood were to be found anymore.

-The flooding included Dresden, a major city.

-We didn't have any looting.
Which is probably why help was able to get to the city as early as it did. You have to understand the fear and panic that was in New Orleans the days following the hurricane. People were unprepared, they didn't (for whatever reasons) stock up on supplies or food or water. Many who were in their homes thought the worst was over when a 10ft wall of water came pouring into their homes. Many sat on their rooftops holding on to loved ones waiting to be rescued. Sadly it took a while for first responders to come into the cuty, for many had also evacuated. This is what happens when the local govt calls a mandatory evac...you will not get immediate help.
Viking said:
-Our military forces were called in to help reinforce the dikes and levees.
As were ours, the National Guard, which is under our Govenor's jurisdiction, so if they were called in later than they should have, it was her fault.
Viking said:
-They didn't have to shoot at anyone, they didn't even bring weapons.

-They were not shot at.
Which again was the problem of the remaining citizens panicing and reverting to a mob mentality. My Dh's uncle stayed in the convention center and and said it was very scary. Many people in the mob were armed. I believe this hurt us in the long run for two reasons: first of all FEMA told our Mayor flat out, they do not carry firearms and they wouldn't being coming into the city until it was under control. Secondly, it made us look bad. I don't begin to understand how my DH or I would have acted under the same conditions, but it was all on camera, and as you can tell by some of the posters it has left a memory. Again if people were shooting and the National Guard and the local police felt they needed to be armed, how is that the fault of the President?

Viking said:
-Some weeks later all the rubble was cleared.
Some weeks later New Orleans was still partly underwater. I live in Jefferson Parish and we weren't even allowed back into our beighborhood(and this was only to check our homes and grab what we needed and get out) for over a month. Keep in mind that many of the city's employees were in other states, with no home to come back to.

Viking said:
-All affected citizens were either compensated by their insurance or helped by the state/federal government.
Well, many have been compensated. Whether they were fully compensated is another thing. We never received anything from FEMA, but we were able to get some help from the Red Cross. Is it fair that I had to go into debt, and Dh and I are still struggling just to get caught up...no. My grandparents lost everything, and when I say everything, I REALLY mean everything. Their home was paid off, their car was paid off, they had very valuable furniture, and my dear cheap grandfather, who never buys anything for himself, had just purchased a brand new 54" HD TV...and yet they were WAY underinsured. Is that the govt's fault. No, it is their own. They know this, and are working hard trying to get their life back together.
Viking said:
If a small country like ours can handle something like this, a large one like the USA should be able to do it too!! Perhaps it would be wiser to spend money for one's own citizens, instead of 'burning it' abroad in an unjustified war.
That's the thing though, even if we weren't in Iraq, the federal govt wouldn't be doing much more than it already is. We choose to pay less in taxes, to be a capitalist nation...I am not saying it is good or bad, it just is what it is.
 
wvrevy said:
I'm sorry...maybe you could point out where anyone said that lying under oath was "no big deal"?

Yeah...didn't think so.

There is a difference though. Clinton's lie resulted in a dry cleaning bill. Bush's lies result in people in body bags. Bit of a difference in degree there, don't ya' think? :rolleyes:

Wait...what am I thinking...of course you don't see the difference. Otherwise, you wouldn't keep defending the guy.

You answer your question in your own post. "Clinton's lie resulted in a dry cleaning bill".

Sounds to me like you think it was no big deal.
 
TCPluto said:
Not true. It's just the case that you want to make on the NOLA issue is not the presidents fault.

Read the posts of those that live there, they seem to have known for the past, oh 150 yrs that they were in danger.

Army Corps has been saying for decades that the levees needed work. No one has listened, or at least responded.

Federal money allocated for levees maintenance has been diverted by state and local politicians, for their own pet projects not related to the levees.

The Governor tells the feds that the levees had not been breached. Why should they assume she is wrong?

It's simply not the president's fault.
It doesn't matter that I live here...everyone else in the country but us it seems KNEW that this was going to happen :rolleyes:
 
eyeoreismyhero said:
The sex had nothing to do with it, he was accused of lying under oath about the sex. That is why the impeachement hearings happened.


Well, we don't have any independent counsels investigating the president's every move (and even things he may have done before he was president) like we did with Clinton, and Bush has never had to testify under oath, so of course he will never be caught lying under oath. Nobody is holding Bush's feet to the fire for any of his "mistakes" (pre-war intelligence, WMD, Katrina, violating FISA, etc.) So if you don't hunt for dirt, you're not going to find any dirt. But it's pretty clear Bush is as big a liar as Clinton ever was.
 
MrsKreamer said:
It doesn't matter that I live here...everyone else in the country but us it seems KNEW that this was going to happen :rolleyes:

It's that they are so blinded by the hate of the president, they want to blame every ill in the world on him.

Never mind the facts, they just interfere with their position.

Good luck to you and your family.
 
TCPluto said:
Not true. It's just the case that you want to make on the NOLA issue is not the presidents fault.

Read the posts of those that live there, they seem to have known for the past, oh 150 yrs that they were in danger.

Army Corps has been saying for decades that the levees needed work. No one has listened, or at least responded.

Federal money allocated for levees maintenance has been diverted by state and local politicians, for their own pet projects not related to the levees.

The Governor tells the feds that the levees had not been breached. Why should they assume she is wrong?

It's simply not the president's fault.

Spin spin spin! twist twist twist.
No one said it was all of his fault, but he does share part of the blame in the lack of response AFTER. And again, you are twisting the words of Blanco. You would think homeland Security would be getting the same reports she is?
 
TCPluto said:
It's that they are so blinded by the hate of the president, they want to blame every ill in the world on him.

Never mind the facts, they just interfere with their position.

Good luck to you and your family.


And you are so blinded in your love for him that you can't see any fault in what he does. That is scarier. I wish he would do something good for this country instead of constantly putting us in jeapordy. You hate Clinton because he lied under oath about an affair. Yet you love Bush even though he manipulated us into going into an unjust war. Do you not see the difference and the danger of your blind loyalty?
 
TCPluto said:
It's that they are so blinded by the hate of the president, they want to blame every ill in the world on him.

Nope. Just want him to take some part of the blame, where applicable. That's all. Nothing more, nothing less. If some want to spin that around to whatever feels good for them, so be it. This thread has seen better days, so I just want to say good luck and God bless to all the gulf shore residents affected. I hope your lives get better soon. :sunny:
 
MrsKreamer said:
Ok, all of the homes have been checked twice for dead bodies. So any dead bodies that were going to be found have been.
? Well, many have been compensated.
That's the thing though, even if we weren't in Iraq, the federal govt wouldn't be doing much more than it already is. We choose to pay less in taxes, to be a capitalist nation...I am not saying it is good or bad, it just is what it is.
#1 We just saw pictures from last week's Mardi Gras and the camera teams also toured the parts of the city not yet cleared: The reports showed dozens of car wrecks still polluting the area. But it is a well known fact that the American public doesn't get to see as much as we do - Be it Iraq-coverage or be it of the conditions in your country.
#2 Just for your info: Germany is a capitalist nation as is the whole of the European Union. Nevertheless we like to care of our people. Capitalism and caring for your people do NOT exclude each other.
 
LoraJ said:
And you are so blinded in your love for him that you can't see any fault in what he does. That is scarier. I wish he would do something good for this country instead of constantly putting us in jeapordy. You hate Clinton because he lied under oath about an affair. Yet you love Bush even though he manipulated us into going into an unjust war. Do you not see the difference and the danger of your blind loyalty?

Goodness Lora, you're wrong again.

I can see faults, but this is a thread discussing the levees, right?

I don't think the war is unjust, I don't think he lied about the intelligence.

Was the intelligence absolutely correct? Doesn't look like it. It doesn't mean that everyone i the free world didn't believe it though.
 
TCPluto said:
You answer your question in your own post. "Clinton's lie resulted in a dry cleaning bill".

Sounds to me like you think it was no big deal.

The whole world meant it was no big deal. He screwed an intern - so what ? :confused3 As long as he does a good job as a president he should be allowed to have some fun and it shouldn't be anyone's business.
The problem with your hero, the Shrub, is: He screwed his country and does a bad job as a president- And as he also messed up a lot of international affairs it's also our business.
 














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