Beginning in January - 18% Gratuity....

[fla4fun]

On the other hand, someone who I know who usually has VERY good info said it IS across-the-board. It just doesn't seem logical to me. I didn't vote in the poll because I don't know what the exact outcome is, I just believe it's DDE/groups of 6 only.

Denise

If it's completely across the board, for every TS meal on property, how will this affect people on the DDP, where the gratuity will no longer be included on the credits in 2008? Will there be an automatic gratuity calculated and presented as a separate bill for you to pay at the end of the meal? On the one hand, it would cut down on the servers who might get nothing due to the 2008 DDP changes, but it won't be any less confusing, especially to people who aren't as in the know as we DISers are.

I usually just paid the total bill calculation before any DDE was subtracted, so I was paying 20% anyway. So if I get good service, I'll keep paying the 20% and if not, I'll pay what they calculate or ask for a manager. I've very seldom had BAD service, but I've had some mediocre service that would be worth around 15% instead of 18%.

 

[jacstangler]

Does Disney calculate the tip on the total bill including a tip on the tax?

John

 

[bicker]

I would prefer to not have the gratuity be automatic, but in many venues it has become apparent that too many customers can no longer be relied on to provide fair and appropriate compensation for service. The poor conduct of the few yet again have adverse impact on the rest. Many cruise lines now do it, forcing passengers to argue the point with the purser if they want to reduce the gratuity in response to perceived lack of service, and now we see a major vacation destination doing it. It's a natural progression.

Since when did the tip become required?

What is the context of your question? A gratuity has always been expected. The patron has discretion with regard to how much of a tip is warranted, based on their perception of the quality of service provided, but tipping has never been "optional". There are no laws requiring people to tip, but there are also no laws saying that a restaurant cannot require people to tip, so that's a wash.

Looks like Disney, the Union, and the general public has decided that all servers get 18%-20% as fair and appropriate compensation for service. I'm sorry but automatically paying someone to take my order, bring me the food that I payed too much for, and taking back their dirty dishes is included in the cost of doing business.

That's silly. The price is based on the value as perceived by the general public not by any one customer in specific. You can choose to be disappointed with the perception of quality as exhibited by most folks, but that doesn't obviate that reality.

I see things different than most. bicker posts, "The poor conduct of the few yet again have adverse impact on the rest". I agree, but from a different prospective. Paying a food service person a automatic tip is poor conduct and the adverse impact is that everyone expects it.

That is simply incorrect. Paying an automatic gratuity is completely appropriate if the restaurant determines it is necessary. This isn't a matter of disagreement; you can agree or not with regard to whether you are contented or disappointed by restaurants applying an automatic gratuity, but there is absolutely no foundation to assert that restaurants "cannot" do so, and there is absolutely no foundation to assert that if a restaurant does so that paying the automatic gratuity is anything but the only proper conduct.

Regardless, the poor conduct I was referring to was pretty explicitly described in my earlier message: "[Those] customers [who] can no longer be relied on to provide fair and appropriate compensation for service." It is surely bad conduct to fail to live up to a societal expectation.

 

[jackskellingtonsgirl]

Does Disney calculate the tip on the total bill including a tip on the tax?

John

I'm not clear on that, but if my numbers are correct it only makes a $1 difference on a meal that costs $100 (before any discounts).

Does anybody know for sure what the procedure is?
Cost of food + Tax + 18% gratuity - 20% DDE? Or does it go some other way?

We were tipping the 20% discount back to the server anyway, so I don't think the change makes any difference to us.

 

[kaytieeldr]

If it's completely across the board, for every TS meal on property, how will this affect people on the DDP, where the gratuity will no longer be included on the credits in 2008?

It generally won't, because it's completely across the property/board for DDE users.

Does Disney calculate the tip on the total bill including a tip on the tax?

No, just on the price of the food/drink (although I don't think any server would mind if the Guest/patron tipped on the entire check...)

 

[jackskellingtonsgirl]

So let's say our bill for food & drinks is $100. They add the 18% "tip" which brings it to $118. Then they add the 6.5% tax to the food/bev total, which adds another $6.50 bringing it to $124.50. Is the DDE discount $20, which is 20% of the pre-tax food total?

 

[kaytieeldr]

Yes.

 

[fmed845]

Anytime its mandatory it shouldn't be called a tip. I have no problem paying 18% for good service but for poor service no! I don't believe service is as good when it's automatically added. We never complain about service, just let the tip reflect it but now we'll be asking to see the manager. Don't take this wrong because service at Disney has almost always been good. Only twice can I remember poor service - large party tip included.

 

[Colson39]

lol, I can't believe this thread has gotten this big. It's just a tip people, it's not a big deal. You would have left it anyways, it's not like they are forcing you to give up your first born.

I could understand if they were putting in a 25% mandatory tip, THEN it would be ok for everyone to be in such a fuss. But jeesh, they're not even making it 20%, and people are acting like Disney is robbing them.

Judging from a bunch of posts in this thread, I'm glad Disney made this change, cause it's obvious quite a few people don't tip their servers

And I agree with the others, this won't hurt Disney a bit, and if anything, a couple of empty spots from people eating offsite just means easier reservations for me. Lots of vacation places already do mandatory tips, this is nothing new.

Although I think I'm going to find it hilarious when it turns out that this is for DDE members only...lol

P.S. If you have poor service, you can always have it reduced, they are not FORCING you to pay 18% no matter what. I also love the rumours floating around that you'll have to pay 18% tip when getting a water from an ice cream stand, that one is classic

 

[kaytieeldr]

Adding Colson39 to the small but growing list of sensible posters....

 

[RickinNYC]

I have to agree with the seeming minority. It's a tip and the servers rely on them as the larger portion of their salary. 18% is the going rate across the country, and I would like to assume that everyone follows that rule. Seems on this thread, most don't. I find that horribly sad.

They work pretty hard. You can't get upset over a new 18% implementation just because you "might" get bad service. If you get bad service during a meal, deal with it at that time. But you can't fault every single server in all of Disney World for that one bad moment.

Why, doing so would be like making the sweeping generalization that most diners out there stiff the waiters and give them less than 18% if anything at all, now wouldn't it?

 

[Beca]

lol, I can't believe this thread has gotten this big. It's just a tip people, it's not a big deal. You would have left it anyways, it's not like they are forcing you to give up your first born.

I could understand if they were putting in a 25% mandatory tip, THEN it would be ok for everyone to be in such a fuss. But jeesh, they're not even making it 20%, and people are acting like Disney is robbing them.

Judging from a bunch of posts in this thread, I'm glad Disney made this change, cause it's obvious quite a few people don't tip their servers

And I agree with the others, this won't hurt Disney a bit, and if anything, a couple of empty spots from people eating offsite just means easier reservations for me. Lots of vacation places already do mandatory tips, this is nothing new.

Although I think I'm going to find it hilarious when it turns out that this is for DDE members only...lol

P.S. If you have poor service, you can always have it reduced, they are not FORCING you to pay 18% no matter what. I also love the rumours floating around that you'll have to pay 18% tip when getting a water from an ice cream stand, that one is classic

ITA!! We are usually in such good moods in WDW, that we tip "standard" 20%....so, for us this is giving us a "tip break".

What I do not get, is that people posted they cannot afford to tip 18%. I'm sorry, but I just do not get that. When we go to LeCellier, our bill usually totals around $60. 18% of that is $10.80, and 15% is $9. The difference on a $60 check is $1.80. And, people are saying that they cannot afford the mandatory tipping?? I just do not understand that 3% could make a difference between being able to afford a restaurant and not being able to.

I don't mean to be snarky, but I really don't get it. When money is tight on our trips to WDW, we either 1) eat our TS meals at lunch where prices are cheaper (if we eat late enough in the day, this will be our ONLY meal out...we'll just "snack" for dinner), 2) choose CS food, or 3) eat out of our room (we stay in the villas with a kitchen).

The only thing I can think, and maybe I am wrong here, is that people are routinely tipping a lot less than the standard 15%. If that is the case, then I completely understand why WDW is taking this step. If people regularly tip 5-10%, then yes...18% could add a big chunk to their bill.

For us, the "value" of the DDE hasn't changed (well, okay it has actually improved a bit since we will be spending 2% less on tips). We pay $65 once, and then our tips are covered for a year. Considering we will get 4 trips out of our DDE, that is quite a bargain for us (that comes to $16.25 total tips per trip, no matter how many TS meals we eat).

 

[Mickiethepooh]

It has been confirmed by several Disney sources now that it means EVERYONE no matter how your are paying.

I personally sent them a very unDisney email informing them my trip next week will be my last to WDW after more then 20 years of visits.

 

[TDC Nala]

It has been confirmed by several Disney sources now that it means EVERYONE no matter how your are paying.

I personally sent them a very unDisney email informing them my trip next week will be my last to WDW after more then 20 years of visits.

Exactly which sources have confirmed? Allears states in their page that they are getting conflicting information from cast members and cannot state one way or the other whether this is limited to DDE or not.

I think that the gun has been jumped because many readers found the DDE email notification to be ambiguous. It will probably be necessary for someone in the DDE office who sent the email to DDE members to clear this up.

 

[Colson39]

I'm sorry, but it would take a lot more than paying a tip to make me stop going to Disney.

 

[CanadianGuy]

It has been confirmed by several Disney sources now that it means EVERYONE no matter how your are paying.

I personally sent them a very unDisney email informing them my trip next week

The information I'm getting from my Food & Beverage contacts at WDW has stressed this is FOR ALL DDE CUSTOMERS AND PARTIES OF 6 OR MORE.

According to my sources -- which may or may not be 100% correct, but I'm betting they are, cuz they usually know this stuff --

This is for DDE customers and parties of six of more... ONLY

And does not affect DDP or credit/cash customers with no discount.

Admittedly, my sources may be wrong.. but since they are in some cases the very servers who read and voted on the employment contract that necessitated this very change ... I doubt very much they got it wrong.

It's all going to be fine. This was an extremely poorly worded press release from Disney that was coupled with poor distribution of the proper information to CM's on the phone.

Knox

 

[Colleen27]

The only thing I can think, and maybe I am wrong here, is that people are routinely tipping a lot less than the standard 15%. If that is the case, then I completely understand why WDW is taking this step. If people regularly tip 5-10%, then yes...18% could add a big chunk to their bill.

I think people on all sides of this are taking it way too personally. Back when the server contracts were in negotiations, we heard from several sources that the 18% auto tip on DDE purchases was a union concession. It very likely has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with actual obsered tipping behaviour, and everything to do with the fact that servers were upset about losing the paid-by-Disney auto tip from the dining plan, and therefore Disney offered the paid-by-the-guest auto tip for DDE'rs as a way to lessen the impact. Typical union/company give and take, not a statement on how many or which guests were most likely to stiff the waitstaff.

Speaking for myself, and still with the disclaimer that I don't think this will apply beyond DDE groups, I don't resent the amount at all. What I do resent is the fact that, when gratuity is automatic, the only way to express displeasure with poor service is to spend *my* time tracking down a manager to complain to. Automatic gratuity takes away the only seamless means a customer has of expressing an opinion on the service, and makes it much, much more likely that poor servers will retain their jobs and make good money, because given the choice between spending a half hour locating and talking to a manager or spending that same half hour on Haunted Mansion, very few guests will take the time to complain.

 

[Beca]

I think people on all sides of this are taking it way too personally. Back when the server contracts were in negotiations, we heard from several sources that the 18% auto tip on DDE purchases was a union concession. It very likely has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with actual obsered tipping behaviour, and everything to do with the fact that servers were upset about losing the paid-by-Disney auto tip from the dining plan, and therefore Disney offered the paid-by-the-guest auto tip for DDE'rs as a way to lessen the impact. Typical union/company give and take, not a statement on how many or which guests were most likely to stiff the waitstaff.

Speaking for myself, and still with the disclaimer that I don't think this will apply beyond DDE groups, I don't resent the amount at all. What I do resent is the fact that, when gratuity is automatic, the only way to express displeasure with poor service is to spend *my* time tracking down a manager to complain to. Automatic gratuity takes away the only seamless means a customer has of expressing an opinion on the service, and makes it much, much more likely that poor servers will retain their jobs and make good money, because given the choice between spending a half hour locating and talking to a manager or spending that same half hour on Haunted Mansion, very few guests will take the time to complain.

While I think you may be right on the union concessions end, I was referring more to posts on this thread stating that if an 18% tip was required, it would put TS dining out of the reach of some customers. The only way I can see that being true is if people are routinely budgeting a lot less for tips.

 

[beattyfamily]

The information I'm getting from my Food & Beverage contacts at WDW has stressed this is FOR ALL DDE CUSTOMERS AND PARTIES OF 6 OR MORE.

What was in the DDE email:

We would also like to inform you that the Walt Disney World® Resort will be implementing an across property policy change regarding gratuity at all food and beverage locations. Effective January 1, 2008, 18% gratuity will be added to all transactions, regardless of party size. Thank you for your continued support.

 

[CanadianGuy]

And that email was directed at DDE customers... and EXTREMELY poorly worded.

Part # 1 of why I'm pretty confident that does NOT affect all non-DDE customer transactions regardless of party size : The 2008 Disney Dining Plan brochure has been out for over a month now indicating that the tip would no longer be included but an 18% gratuity would be automatically added for parties of six or more. I would think that Disney would have printed the correct brochure in the first place since the union contract that caused this change was ratified months ago.

Part # 2 of why I'm pretty confident this is just DDE customer transactions : There's no article about it in today's Orlando Sentinel. If every single restaurant transaction at all Disney World restaurants was locked into the 18 % gratuity, that'd be big news for locals and for the thousands of employees in the parks .. and the Sentinel would have written a story about this groundbreaking decision sure the rock the food service industry across North America.

That aside, I've spoken to MANY CM's who have every reason to know .. and they indicate the correct information is as noted at this link..

http://www.wdwinfo.com/disneydiningexperience.htm

And AllEars while admitting confusion has the correct information posted as well.

One thing is for sure, nobody can clear this up 'for sure' except for Disney and that won't happen till Monday.

Knox