Bean Counters and shortsightedness

[bryaalre]

So they DO manage ride capacity and always have? It's not too much of a leap of logic to conclude that capacity management is used to maximize Genie revenue. After all, as New Mouse pointed out, if wait times are low, Genie revenue is zero.

I was just at WDW this past weekend and the only park that had any big wait times was HS. I don't think they care about the Genie+ revenue all that much to manipulate ride capacity. I think people will just buy genie+ just to skip lines no matter if they are 60 minutes or 10 minutes.

 

[Aluminum Falcon]

Not at all. Genie was just another way to take advantage of the high demand and wring more money out of guests who have already plunked down thousands on tickets and rooms. Otherwise they think they won't be able to ride any attractions.

It's like owning the soft drink concession at a ball stadium where there are no water fountains.

Once again you are making assertions with nothing to back them up, just personal conjecture

 

[Jrb1979]

That softness this summer is not exclusive to Disney. Cedar Fair, Six Flags, Universal, Sea World, etc. have all experienced a softening of crowds.

I have a theory on why that is for a lot of parks. IMO right after COVID there seem to be a lot for first time visitors to parks everywhere as they were places that were the first to fully open. Now we starting to see parks go back to their normal levels.

 

[wabbott]

Once again you are making assertions with nothing to back them up, just personal conjecture

It's called "logic."

 

[ChipnDale79]

Your comment is selfish

 

[ChipnDale79]

Vacation is supposed to be fun. When I'm not having fun, I decide to do something else.

Full disclosure: I haven't been to WDW since March '22. We were in Orlando in March '23, but spent the week at Universal. March '24 is New Orleans. I don't have any plans to go, though the DVC resorts not named OKW and SSR are part of a (much larger) Interval ongoing search. If they hit, we'll think about it, but I'm not sure we won't throw it back and wait for something else.

I enjoyed the March trip, but I am definitely not in a hurry to go back. That's partly because it wasn't as much fun. Familiarity breeds contempt? Partly. But maybe not entirely.

Of course, there are families lined up to take my place, and Disney will miss me less than I miss Disney--no matter how little I miss it.

its hard to let go. but we're starting too.

we just got back from NYC. One of my kids has asked to go there instead of Disney next year, like planned.

Disney has become exhausting, because of that, we've open up our vacation possiblities. we are starting to other places.

 

[BrianL]

You know, it totally makes sense for Disney to adjust ride capacity based on crowds and not necessarily run full-capacity during slow times. However, it's also not good for them to always try to run at the bare minimum that they can get away with - they should build-in some extra overhead so that lines don't become so intolerable. That's just part of offering a premium experience. I am sure there is some algortihm built from metrics that dictates how they do it, but I can agree that they are not getting it quite right.

 

[ChipnDale79]

You know, it totally makes sense for Disney to adjust ride capacity based on crowds and not necessarily run full-capacity during slow times. However, it's also not good for them to always try to run at the bare minimum that they can get away with - they should build-in some extra overhead so that lines don't become so intolerable. That's just part of offering a premium experience. I am sure there is some algortihm built from metrics that dictates how they do it, but I can agree that they are not getting it quite right.

this.

there's always a happy medium. Understanding that maintenance needs to take place, but they should run rides at a decent rate, even with lower crowds. Makes no sense for people to be standing in long lines, when disney can shorten them.

but thats selfish of me.

 

[BrianL]

this.

there's always a happy medium. Understanding that maintenance needs to take place, but they should run rides at a decent rate, even with lower crowds. Makes no sense for people to be standing in long lines, when disney can shorten them.

but thats selfish of me.

Right. That's not to say they should run full-capacity all the time - that's not realistic. I just think that considering what they charge, they should be offering a higher than service level than "the minimum" which it seems like they do sometimes. I am sure somewhere on paper it doesn't appear that way, but they should take that data and then hedge even further just to be sure.

 

[Tigger's ally]

I have a theory on why that is for a lot of parks. IMO right after COVID there seem to be a lot for first time visitors to parks everywhere as they were places that were the first to fully open. Now we starting to see parks go back to their normal levels.

Not to mention they were getting free vacation checks in the mail from their Uncle Sam.

 

[Aluminum Falcon]

Right. That's not to say they should run full-capacity all the time - that's not realistic. I just think that considering what they charge, they should be offering a higher than service level than "the minimum" which it seems like they do sometimes. I am sure somewhere on paper it doesn't appear that way, but they should take that data and then hedge even further just to be sure.

I mean wait times have been pretty tolerable lately, but they also can only control crowd movement so much. they may schedule a day for lower crowds when a giant swath of guests shows up at MK and EPCOT is empty in comparison. I think it's a lot more complex than we think.

 

[Aluminum Falcon]

cut me some slack, i did say for lack of a better term

 

[BrianL]

I mean wait times have been pretty tolerable lately, but they also can only control crowd movement so much. they may schedule a day for lower crowds when a giant swath of guests shows up at MK and EPCOT is empty in comparison. I think it's a lot more complex than we think.

And don't get me wrong, I don't think it's some conspiracy to sell more G+ etc. I think they are just being over-reliant on some data-driven metrics that tell them how to maximize efficiency and nobody really cares to massage that a bit to make it better. That just results in times where itr really misses the mark and wait times are very high due to the lower capacity. It's not nefarious - more like laziness.

 

[Aluminum Falcon]

And don't get me wrong, I don't think it's some conspiracy to sell more G+ etc. I think they are just being over-reliant on some data-driven metrics that tell them how to maximize efficiency and nobody really cares to massage that a bit to make it better. That just results in times where ir really misses the mark and wait times are very high due to the lower capacity. It's not nefarious - more like laziness.

potentially, i mean look at how well the rest of their tech works haha.

 

[Brian Noble]

That just results in times where ir really misses the mark and wait times are very high due to the lower capacity.

Capacity is almost always staffing. You can put more logs on splash*, but unless you open the third load bay, it doesn't matter---and you can't open that bay unless you have the Cast scheduled to work it.

That's probably true in other places where it isn't as obvious. Thunder, for example, probably needs more people checking restraints when they have all five trains on or they can't make the shorter intervals.

So there is probably a limit as to how responsive they can be when they get it wrong, and I am sure there is a limit to how willing they are to schedule "just in case" staff.

-----
Well, you can't anymore, but you get what I mean.

 

[fatmanatee]

You know, it totally makes sense for Disney to adjust ride capacity based on crowds and not necessarily run full-capacity during slow times. However, it's also not good for them to always try to run at the bare minimum that they can get away with - they should build-in some extra overhead so that lines don't become so intolerable. That's just part of offering a premium experience. I am sure there is some algortihm built from metrics that dictates how they do it, but I can agree that they are not getting it quite right.

They caught a lot of flak for running Guardians on only one side for the first Epcot After Hours, resulting in long lines for people who in many cases bought tickets to the event because they advertise shorter waits for attractions and they specifically mention Guardians in this advertising.

They've been running it on both sides since then.

 

[HokieRaven5]

The discussion of Disney operating attractions at reduced capacity is not a new thing exclusive to the G+ era either. On these boards a couple of threads discussing it as a possibility in 2018 and 2019:

Thread 'Jan 2018 wait times longer than Summer 2017: Disney reduced ride capacity'
https://www.disboards.com/threads/j...er-2017-disney-reduced-ride-capacity.3668838/

Thread 'Reduced Ride Capacity'
https://www.disboards.com/threads/reduced-ride-capacity.3763497/

 

[Aluminum Falcon]

The discussion of Disney operating attractions at reduced capacity is not a new thing exclusive to the G+ era either. On these boards a couple of threads discussing it as a possibility in 2018 and 2019:

Thread 'Jan 2018 wait times longer than Summer 2017: Disney reduced ride capacity'
https://www.disboards.com/threads/j...er-2017-disney-reduced-ride-capacity.3668838/

Thread 'Reduced Ride Capacity'
https://www.disboards.com/threads/reduced-ride-capacity.3763497/

Yeah, ride capacity is a thing a most amusement parks. People just don't like that it happens at Disney

 

[Smugpugmug]

The discussion of Disney operating attractions at reduced capacity is not a new thing exclusive to the G+ era either. On these boards a couple of threads discussing it as a possibility in 2018 and 2019:

Thread 'Jan 2018 wait times longer than Summer 2017: Disney reduced ride capacity'
https://www.disboards.com/threads/j...er-2017-disney-reduced-ride-capacity.3668838/

Thread 'Reduced Ride Capacity'
https://www.disboards.com/threads/reduced-ride-capacity.3763497/

And 2017-19 was during the era that had some of the highest crowds I had ever seen at Disney....like 2 1/2 hour wait for Toy Story Mania level. Oof.

 

[HokieRaven5]

And 2017-19 was during the era that had some of the highest crowds I had ever seen at Disney....like 2 1/2 hour wait for Toy Story Mania level. Oof.

Not to mention every E-ticket was basically gone at 60 days to resort guests where at least today all guests have somewhat of a fighter’s chance, just happens to cost $.