Be careful of Disneys Terms and conditions

[anricat]

I don't understand why everyone is defending Disney. First, because they don't need your help. And second, because what's legal and what's right aren't always the same thing. Yes, Disney is legally allowed to do what they did. But from a custom service perspective, what they did is awful. We should expect better of them.

"Awful"? Really? What they did was put language in their cruise contract to cover just this type of eventuality because stuff like this happens all the time that is completely beyond their control.

Was I upset when my cruise missed Isafjurdor? Yep. Super bummed. Did I think Disney was awful for it? No. The dock wasn't done. It was out of their control. It's a vacation, not life and death.

 

[Kwami]

How is what they did awful? New Caledonia is politically unstable currently. It is at Level 3: Reconsider Travel from the US State Department. Is Avoid non-essential travel by Canada. Australia is reconsider your need to travel. DCL would have been reckless to continue the planned stop there. Eden and Hobart will be pleasantly warm and for a 6 night cruise there was not many other options. The only other possible one would have been Vanuatu which still might not have been manageable. Bass Strait should also be a non-issue because you do not need to enter the Strait to get to Hobart from Sydney. The Tasman can be rough but it is summer so shouldn't be too bad.

Rerouting the cruise to avoid political trouble isn't awful. Refusing to let a very disappointed customer get a refund after such a massive change is.

 

[Royal Consort]

I haven't been through Bass Strait and know nothing about Eden and Hobart except that they're in New South Wales

Hobart is the capital of the state of Tasmania, quite some way from New South Wales. Natural, beautiful, and chilly.

 

[Lesverts]

Rerouting the cruise to avoid political trouble isn't awful. Refusing to let a very disappointed customer get a refund after such a massive change is.

What is Disney suppose to do? Just cancel everything? There is a reason the contracts are the way they are. Disney modified the cruise for the safety of passengers and cast members and are not passing on the additional port fees and taxes onto the guest. None of the lines offered substantial discounts/cancellations/refunds when St Petersburg was taken off of every lines cruises a couple years ago. Nor did they for removing Tel Aviv and Ashdod from Eastern Mediterranean trips over the last few years. Only the cruises that went through the Red Sea got anything and most of the time that was because the cruise lines just cancelled the Suez transits and sailed the ships empty during repositioning.

I will only fault Disney on taking so long to make this decision. The political situation in New Caledonia has been pretty bad for over a year. This was foreseeable and the changes should have been made months ago.

 

[Kwami]

What is Disney suppose to do?

Allow the passenger to get a refund. This isn't complicated.

 

[Lesverts]

Allow the passenger to get a refund. This isn't complicated.

So what is the point of having terms and conditions?

 

[Kwami]

So what is the point of having terms and conditions?

Disney should have better terms and conditions. We should expect better of them.

 

[SleepyDeb]

We had Isafjordur cancelled from our ports on our Norway/Iceland/France last year. I was pretty devastated at the time, not going to lie. It was a very expensive cruise that already had way way more sea days that I really wanted. We didn't receive any compensation and they didn't replace the port with anything else. I know they don't have to do any of that but other cruises with cancelled ports have often gotten something. I actually cried. I was really upset.

We went on the cruise and had an amazing trip.

We were on this cruise too. It was quite disappointing to lose that port, but it was a great cruise!

 

[kiford]

Rerouting the cruise to avoid political trouble isn't awful. Refusing to let a very disappointed customer get a refund after such a massive change is.

A contract is a document that establishes a relationship between two parties, outlining what each party values and how they will behave if things don't go as planned. It lets you know in advance what the terms are and to avoid disagreements later on when things that could be foreseen potentially happening do happen. It gives you a chance to decide on what to do before you agree. Once you agree to it, you have said that you are okay with it. Expecting the other party to say, "Oh, that's fine - to keep you and dozens if not hundreds of other people happy, we'll completely override what we said we'd do if this happened, and we'll eat the losses" isn't a company being awful, it's sound business practice and standard contract management. This isn't an exceptional circumstance - this happens all the time which is why there is a clause outlining this.

Disney should have better terms and conditions. We should expect better of them.

But you know the terms and conditions going in. You know exactly what to expect. If you want better terms and conditions and they don't offer them, you don't agree to those terms and then expect something different.

 

[Kwami]

A contract is a document that establishes a relationship between two parties, outlining what each party values and how they will behave if things don't go as planned. It lets you know in advance what the terms are and to avoid disagreements later on when things that could be foreseen potentially happening do happen. It gives you a chance to decide on what to do before you agree. Once you agree to it, you have said that you are okay with it. Expecting the other party to say, "Oh, that's fine - to keep you and dozens if not hundreds of other people happy, we'll completely override what we said we'd do if this happened, and we'll eat the losses" isn't a company being awful, it's sound business practice and standard contract management. This isn't an exceptional circumstance - this happens all the time which is why there is a clause outlining this.


But you know the terms and conditions going in. You know exactly what to expect. If you want better terms and conditions and they don't offer them, you don't agree to those terms and then expect something different.

I'm sorry, but I think that you're really missing the point here. You keep defending the bad terms and conditions and making excuses for why Disney should keep doing what they're doing. I'm not an idiot. I know what a contract is and I know that the original poster has no legal recourse to get a refund if Disney doesn't allow it.

But Disney should allow it because it's the right thing to do. And Disney should modify their terms and conditions to be more reasonable. It's not reasonable to completely change a cruise just a few weeks in advance, after everyone's already paid in full, and then say that the customer has to just accept the new cruise. We shouldn't be OK with that.

 

[scroogie]

Disney should have better terms and conditions. We should expect better of them.

And where do you draw the line if Disney decided to refund this particular passenger? All the cruises these days have social media pages, if OP runs to the one for their cruise and says they were refunded due to the change and every other passenger contacts Disney over the same thing, what would you think is reasonable action on Disney's part?

I was on the Wonder a few weeks ago, and due to the ship needing hull cleaning prior to heading to New Zealand we had an itinerary change and a port cancelled which we were only informed of at embarkation. We were actually compensated quite well (a future cruise discount plus OBC), but once word got out on social media, those embarking on the next cruise very quickly started saying "well, if the ship is delayed for us we WILL be demanding the same compensation that these people got".

I understand your point, but it's also a tricky precedent to set. If Disney has to be prepared to refund one party, then they need to be prepared to potentially refund every party. But that will end up with ships sailing around empty, and a withdrawal from the market. There needs to be a balance.

 

[greeneyedchick]

And where do you draw the line if Disney decided to refund this particular passenger? All the cruises these days have social media pages, if OP runs to the one for their cruise and says they were refunded due to the change and every other passenger contacts Disney over the same thing, what would you think is reasonable action on Disney's part?

I was on the Wonder a few weeks ago, and due to the ship needing hull cleaning prior to heading to New Zealand we had an itinerary change and a port cancelled which we were only informed of at embarkation. We were actually compensated quite well (a future cruise discount plus OBC), but once word got out on social media, those embarking on the next cruise very quickly started saying "well, if the ship is delayed for us we WILL be demanding the same compensation that these people got".

I understand your point, but it's also a tricky precedent to set. If Disney has to be prepared to refund one party, then they need to be prepared to potentially refund every party. But that will end up with ships sailing around empty, and a withdrawal from the market. There needs to be a balance.

I think it would be more reasonable for Disney allow guests to switch to a different cruise or receive credit for a future cruise if they prefer. I don't think everyone would request a change because a lot of people have already taken off work and will lose their vacation time if they switch.

 

[kiford]

We shouldn't be OK with that.

Then don't accept the terms. If you accept the terms, you've said it's okay. If you think the terms are bad, don't sail with them.

 

[Kwami]

Then don't accept the terms. If you accept the terms, you've said it's okay. If you think the terms are bad, don't sail with them.

You're right. We should all just accept whatever terrible terms the big corporations come up with and we should never ask them to be better. Obviously.

 

[CM Dad]

This is a good general rule, though of course there are exceptions.

I'd add that compensation is more likely if something changes once passengers are onboard or potentially en route to the ship than if changes happen in advance. Again, there are exceptions, but port changes more than a month in advance rarely result in compensation, especially if (as in the case of the OP's cruise from Sydney) ports are added when a port is removed. The thinking may be that people can still plan excursions or make other plans for the new ports or added sea days if they know the change in advance.

That said, I understand that it's disappointing when the port that's dropped is an unusual one that was a big part of the reason someone booked the cruise. People who feel that strongly about not wanting to cruise on the new itinerary can cancel or rebook, but they will pay a penalty based on how far in advance the decision was made.

We were one of the exceptions. We booked a 8/2016 Mediterranean cruise round trip from Barcelona and included Greece and Turkey when we booked. I think it was around January 2016 when DCL decided to skip Greece and Turkey due to current unrest at that time. We were given the option to cancel with full refund, or stay on the modified cruise and receive a $1,000 stateroom credit. At least that is the amount I remember. My wife and I had been looking forward to the cancelled ports, but decided that we had never been to the Mediterranean, so would keep the booking. I was surprised at how generous the offer was.

 

[anricat]

You're right. We should all just accept whatever terrible terms the big corporations come up with and we should never ask them to be better. Obviously.

Well, you can vote with your wallet.

Again, this isn't life or death. It's vacation. If this were an issue with safety or legitimate underhandedness or unethical behavior that's one thing. We're talking about a port change. Literally one day on vacation of your entire life. Are you allowed to be bummed about it? Absolutely. I get that. But at the end of the day, Disney is running a business with a contract that everyone is entitled to read before continuing with booking. They can absolutely choose another cruise line (though, spoiler alert, all the other lines have the exact same verbiage in their contracts). Take a different vacation if these risks aren't for you.

We know going into a cruise that this is the chance we take. We might not be able to dock at CC because of weather. We might have to be re-routed because of a tropical storm or hurricane. We might have a mechanical breakdown and the ship might limp back to PC getting back late. We might have a medical emergency that causes late boarding for the next round of passengers. My cruise might be entirely cancelled before it even sets sail. 13 cruises under my belt and these are just a sampling of possible issues. (Personally we've had an cruise completely cancelled, a port missed and not replaced prior to sail date, a late departure due to medical emergency, a late debarkation due to a medical emergency, and we've missed a port due to weather on the day of the port).

Heck, I'm booked on a Greek Isles cruise next year that currently has a port stop in Turkey on it. I think it's very likely it will be changed. Will I be disappointed? Yep. Will I still have a great vacation? Yep. Will I be mad at a publicly traded company for participating in late-stage capitalism with a clearly defined contract? Nope. I'm fully aware of what's happening here and if I don't like it, I can take my money and my vacations elsewhere. Disney isn't perfect and I was definitely irritated with them for the way they handled our missing port last year. Clearly not irritated enough to not book any further cruises though (2 on the books for 2025 with the intention to book another the following year).

This business is the way it is and it's not likely to change. The good news is that there are loads of other fantastic vacation opportunities out there that potentially have less risk. We can all choose what works best for us. And as my step mom used to say, "that's what makes horse racing."

 

[Babsy]

OP, I am sorry that this happened to you. I have had a few similar situations when cruising, loss of ports, itinerary changes, lost days, etc. I have had almost no compensation most of the time. Once, the change was late and I wasn't able to cruise with the changes the way they were. No compensation. I was bummed for sure. I still feel upset when I dwell on the money lost.......so I feel your pain.

That said, I did know the rules going in and accepted the changes as part of life lessons. These terms and conditions mean what they say, unfortunately. When they offer compensation they are going above and beyond. When they just inform you of your new vacation reality, they are within their rights. Cruise lines have to reserve this right and use discretion when awarding compensation. I have lost a few ports that I really wanted to stop at, once the port lost was the reason for choosing that cruise, but frankly I understood the reason for the loss. I never even considered asking for compensation and it was not offered.

I hate to say it, but we have been spoiled by many travel companies and places like WDW going out of. their way to sometimes make a situation more palatable by offering some compensation. It has begun to feel like the company owes everyone something when things go wrong. The truth is - often they don't. The terms and conditions state unequivocally what you can expect. It is a sad reality for the traveler that they have those rules to protect themselves in situations like this.

Hopefully, you will still enjoy your cruise. Try to find other ways to make the new itinerary exciting. Allow yourself some on board treats that you wouldn't normally splurge on, perhaps. It won't matter to Disney either way, but a positive attitude can make all the difference in your vacation for you. I hope that you have a wonderful time despite your current disappointment.

 

[RivShore]

We were one of the exceptions. We booked a 8/2016 Mediterranean cruise round trip from Barcelona and included Greece and Turkey when we booked. I think it was around January 2016 when DCL decided to skip Greece and Turkey due to current unrest at that time. We were given the option to cancel with full refund, or stay on the modified cruise and receive a $1,000 stateroom credit. At least that is the amount I remember. My wife and I had been looking forward to the cancelled ports, but decided that we had never been to the Mediterranean, so would keep the booking. I was surprised at how generous the offer was.

This is a reasonable response to a big (advance) change. But the OP had what seems to be a more drastic change, something like changing that Mediterranean cruise to a cruise around the UK. The UK might be a great cruise but it is so very different than a Med cruise in all ways. With that big a product change, why would they not do what they have done in the past, like this Med example?

 

[tvguy]

Allow the passenger to get a refund. This isn't complicated.

I suspect travel insurance wouldn't kick in because those policies usually have it in THEIR terms and conditions that they don't cover incidents brought on by political turmoil and war. Kind of the way of the world.

 

[lanejudy]

We booked a 8/2016 Mediterranean cruise round trip from Barcelona and included Greece and Turkey when we booked. I think it was around January 2016 when DCL decided to skip Greece and Turkey due to current unrest at that time.

Sorry, but I question your memory on that timeline. DCL would have zero reason for offering anything 8 months in advance of an itinerary change. Only concierge would have been unable to cancel without penalty anyway, and even concierge could change dates that far out.

ETA: I stand corrected. That was a very generous (and unusual) offer!
https://disneycruiselineblog.com/20...ugust-1-2016-12-night-disney-magic-itinerary/