Apparently I dislike FP+...alot

[smitch425]

I've forgotten to give one back before.

Are they still doing that? I kind of thought it was possible to track magic bands now. Am I giving magic bands too much credit?

Yes, they still do it.

 

[magicbob]

Actually, legacy FP simply required finding a machine, putting in your ticket, getting the paper that came out and returning within a printed time window. It didn't require rope drop or running.

Regardless, a previous poster seemed happy the candy was taken away from the "savvy" legacy FP users. That's where this "savvy" thing is coming from.

For the truly savvy, legacy was even simpler than that... put in your ticket, get the paper that came out and return any time after your window opens.

ETA: I mention this only in the interest of historical accuracy. And, yes, there was a period of months leading up to FP+ during which return times were enforced. However, this was no longer "legacy" FP, but "transition" FP.

 

[cakebaker]

For the truly savvy, legacy was even simpler than that... put in your ticket, get the paper that came out and return any time after your window opens.

And exactly what I was referring to when I used the word savvy. There were more tricks to be used than that though. I was out of the loop on some of them, but it wasn' hard- IF you knew the tricks and were willing to use them.

With FP+, the field has leveled out- other than an extra 30 days to book for on site guests- which I used to think was huge and have since discovered it's not all that much of an advantage- there are no little hidden tricks or gimmicks. And I suspect it's the source of great frustration to many people- understandably so.

 

[ParkHoppers]

Some people who liked the legacy system said it was because they didn't like to have to plan their vacation. The same people also talked about their strategy for using the legacy system to it fullest.Could someone please tell me how one has a STRATEGY without having a PLAN?

 

[IamGroot]

Some people who liked the legacy system said it was because they didn't like to have to plan their vacation. The same people also talked about their strategy for using the legacy system to it fullest.Could someone please tell me how one has a STRATEGY without having a PLAN?

I think the main difference is that you could have a strategy for each park and just pick a random park each day. With FP+ you have to pick your parks weeks in advance to get the "best" FP options. This is really the only real downfall I see with FP.

Frankly, I think they should just bring back the old system but make it all digital with FP.

And you could even avoid lines by using the tech in magic bands that would know you were at least 100 yards from the ride entrance so you could book the FP with a button push on your phone.

 

[magicbob]

Some people who liked the legacy system said it was because they didn't like to have to plan their vacation. The same people also talked about their strategy for using the legacy system to it fullest.Could someone please tell me how one has a STRATEGY without having a PLAN?

First, you incorrectly assert that the same people held these seemingly contradictory positions, when they may, in fact, be two separate groups.

Second, you neglect to take into account that the positions may not even be contradictory at all because legacy FP allowed many guests to have a loose plan (e.g., arrive early and grab a FP). Not every plan was scheduled down to the minute.

 

[ParkHoppers]

I think the main difference is that you could have a strategy for each park and just pick a random park each day. With FP+ you have to pick your parks weeks in advance to get the "best" FP options. This is really the only real downfall I see with FP. Frankly, I think they should just bring back the old system but make it all digital with FP. And you could even avoid lines by using the tech in magic bands that would know you were at least 100 yards from the ride entrance so you could book the FP with a button push on your phone.

I agree that a new digital version of the legacy system could work. However the only reason some people got a lot of FP under the old system was just the Math of the situation. Disney didn't publicize the old legacy system which in turn led to not that many people using it. Now that Disney is making a huge push to get people to use the new system a lot more people are using it. So now the math of the situation means more people using FP can only mean less for each guest as there are only so many FP in the pool.The cat is out of the bag on FP. What used to be almost a hidden perk for those in the know has become totally mainstream and highly used. You can,t put it back in the box. A lot more people will use FP going forward no matter what the details of the system might look like.

I will also add that I believe that Disney did not publicize the old system because they realized that it would be very bad if twice as many people showed up at RD under the old legacy system. Disney IMO wants people to show up at different times as even as possible throughout the day for crowd control. If you now went back to the old system all the new users of FP would probably realize to get the best use of it you should show up at RD. Having many more people showing up at RD would be a crowd problem that Disney nor its guest would be happy about. The new system spreads out the crowds in that they can show up when they want and still get FPs. Also because of the tiering which includes ALL the rides in DW the crowds while they are in the parks will be more spread out. These two crowd control outcomes are good for Disney and the guest in the parks for a more enjoyable less cramped experience.

 

[normjen]

With legacy FP, we sometimes would go to the bus stop and get on whatever bus came first (to a park). Those days are long gone. From there you would have a strategy which turned into a plan. But thats what was good with legacy FP , The plan was easily flexable. you knew TSM was going to run out of passes by 11 to 1 oclock, so if you wanted to do TSM ,more than twice you could skip RNC or TOT FP and get another for TSM, (let me see you ride TSM 3 times today without waiting over an hour in a line at least one of the times)

For example at HS:

FP TSM
Rope drop TSM
Ride RNC or ToT, if RNC line is too long
Use FP or by then window would open for new FP. FP which ever TOT or RNC you did not ride.

IF HS seemed tooo crowded you could easily hop to another park and know you could score enough worthy FP to make it worth your time.

Today, if you find a park seems crowded, what do you do, Suffer because your FP are probably not over till at least 12 to 1 oclock.

 

[ParkHoppers]

With legacy FP, we sometimes would go to the bus stop and get on whatever bus came first (to a park). Those days are long gone. From there you would have a strategy which turned into a plan. But thats what was good with legacy FP , The plan was easily flexable. you knew TSM was going to run out of passes by 11 to 1 oclock, so if you wanted to do TSM ,more than twice you could skip RNC or TOT FP and get another for TSM, (let me see you ride TSM 3 times today without waiting over an hour in a line at least one of the times) For example at HS: FP TSM Rope drop TSM Ride RNC or ToT, if RNC line is too long Use FP or by then window would open for new FP. FP which ever TOT or RNC you did not ride. IF HS seemed tooo crowded you could easily hop to another park and know you could score enough worthy FP to make it worth your time. Today, if you find a park seems crowded, what do you do, Suffer because your FP are probably not over till at least 12 to 1 oclock.

I find the new system to also be very flexible as I can and have changed my FP and plans on the fly while in the parks. Also look at the second part about crowds that I added above. Spreading people out in the parks which IMO is a good thing is something most people overlook about the new system. One bad thing about the new system IMO is that if you are not tech savvy this can hurt you with the new system.

 

[itchin2go]

And exactly what I was referring to when I used the word savvy. There were more tricks to be used than that though. I was out of the loop on some of them, but it wasn' hard- IF you knew the tricks and were willing to use them.

With FP+, the field has leveled out- other than an extra 30 days to book for on site guests- which I used to think was huge and have since discovered it's not all that much of an advantage- there are no little hidden tricks or gimmicks. And I suspect it's the source of great frustration to many people- understandably so.

2 things, respectfully:

(1) I never used the "tricks" as you referred to them. I pulled a paper fastpass and returned within the time window. It worked great under those circumstances, for me, and probably others. As far as I know, there were only two "tricks" (in quotes because I don't think that's an accurate characterization, but I'll play along): using them after the end of the stated return time (which was shut down before the advent of FP+), and there were *some* instances where you could pull FPs for two different attractions even though the first time window had not expired.

(2) OF COURSE there are "tricks" (again, don't agree with the word, but for argument's sake ...) for the new system! And it's not been around long enough for all of them to be fully exploited. Your least favorite, I think, is the old magic bands under a different MDE for extra same day FPs. I know you're also not a fan of throwaway rooms. You can also use swapping MBs to your advantage (ask me how if you want to know more - I have 4 FPs for our MK days for the "riders" in my family ). Another thing that has been discussed, but I haven't seen confirmation of lately, is that you can potentially make 3 advance FPs in Epcot (for instance), cancel 2 (anything but Soarin or Test Track), and then immediately book your 4th FP after you ride Test Track or Soarin. I'm sure there are more.

No offense (truly), but it's ironic to me that you state there are no "tricks" with FP+, but you have actually been a very vocal opponent of some of those "tricks", or as I like to call them, "strategies".

I think there are pros and cons for legacy FP and for FP+. I don't think either is perfect or irreparably flawed. But I wholeheartedly disagree with the idea that the playing field has now been levelled. I think it's more lopsided than before, personally.

I also whole heartedly disagree that being "savvy" (I would use the word "knowledgeable") no longer yields an advantage. I'm using several of the strategies I mentioned above, and I absolutely feel I have an advantage over (at least some of) those who don't use them.

 

[Angel Ariel]

Some people who liked the legacy system said it was because they didn't like to have to plan their vacation. The same people also talked about their strategy for using the legacy system to it fullest.Could someone please tell me how one has a STRATEGY without having a PLAN?

I'm one who liked legacy because I don't like having to plan *ahead* as much as I have to with FP+. Key word being "ahead."

We always had a strategy of "we'll head to this park" beforehand, but we didn't decide which direction we were going to head in a park until we were there, in the park, and we saw the weather/crowd conditions/etc. We toured by land..so we'd head to tomorrowland, pull FPs for space, and do the other things in tomorrowland we wanted to do while we waited for our FP to come up.

When we visited, crowds were never peak, so we were generally able to pull FPs within 30 mins-1 hr of when it would be used (I'm referring to MK mostly here). We'd use 6-8 FPs in a day. It wasn't "maximizing" the system completely..I know others who routinely got more than the 6-8 FPs, but it worked very well for our touring style and required very very little preplanning. As I said, the only pre-planning we did was which park/which day and any ADRs we wanted. We didn't follow touring plans of any kind, or RideMax...just arrived at a park and then decided where we wanted to head first.

Not a whole lot of planning involved in that, and we were still able to use FP well.

 

[Angel Ariel]

There are absolutely tips/tricks one needs to know for FP+. Some I can think of quickly off the top of my head:

1. For the hottest attractions, trying to book them for the end of your trip increases the likelihood of availability.

2. If you can't get a group of FP+ for the same time window, try booking individual FP+ with overlapping windows (something I personally had to do for both Spaceship Earth and Buzz at one point, so this isn't just limited to the hottest attractions).

3. If you're looking for FP+ after you've booked your original 3 (but still before your trip), booking a full "new" day of FP+ will show you the full availability for the day. If you just click change experience, it will only give you experiences that are available during the time window of the experience you're changing - not the full day.

4.) So along with that, if one is using the "modify FP" option, sometimes one may have to change the experience from something popular to something less popular, then change the time to the time frame they're looking for, then go back and look to see if the attraction they really wanted is available at the time they were wanting. (#3 is a heck of a lot easier than #4).

I'm not saying these are bad things, or saying they are negatives about the system. I just think it's a bit disingenuous to say that there are no tricks or no special knowledge needed to best make use of FP+.

 

[ParkHoppers]

I will agree that the new FP system means planning ahead and understand how some would not like this. I still think the fact that some people get less FP than they used to is still the biggest reason they don,t like FP+ This is understandable as it is never feels good to get less. But now that FP is mainstream and many,many more people are aware of it I can,t see a possible solution of how to go back to the days of people getting close to what they used to. Again it is just the math of the current situation. I hope someone will read what I wrote above about the current FP exposure and its use of spreading out the crowds and tell me how we could go back to the good old days when not as many people knew about or used the FP system. Any FP system. I would actually love to hear some solutions for how people could get what they used to with the current usage of FP and the crowd control issues that go with it.

 

[clsteve]

I will agree that the new FP system means planning ahead and understand how some would not like this. I still think the fact that some people get less FP than they used to is still the biggest reason they don,t like FP+ This is understandable as it is never feels good to get less. But now that FP is mainstream and many,many more people are aware of it I can,t see a possible solution of how to go back to the days of people getting close to what they used to. Again it is just the math of the current situation. I hope someone will read what I wrote above about the current FP exposure and its use of spreading out the crowds and tell me how we could go back to the good old days when not as many people knew about or used the FP system. Any FP system. I would actually love to hear some solutions for how people could get what they used to with the current usage of FP and the crowd control issues that go with it.

BMR
...
...
...

(build more rides)

 

[cakebaker]

I just think it's a bit disingenuous to say that there are no tricks or no special knowledge needed to best make use of FP+.

If I had said that, you might have a point. I said no hidden tricks or gimmicks. So perhaps what you said is what's really disingenuous.

Most everything you listed you'd find out with a phone call to WDW. Some of it's just plain common sense. Some of them you find out just playing around in MDE. They're not hidden tricks or gimmicks or just flat out cheating the system.

 

[ParkHoppers]

BMR ... ... ... (build more rides)

Yes more rides would be a good start but they would have to build a heck of a lot of new rides to have a noticeable positive effect on getting more from the FP system IMO. Seems like lately they close one ride and replace it with another which doesn't change the numbers of more FP at all. Thanks for the response as it is a step in the right direction on the things I have discussed.

 

[disnut1149]

I'm one who liked legacy because I don't like having to plan *ahead* as much as I have to with FP+. Key word being "ahead."

We always had a strategy of "we'll head to this park" beforehand, but we didn't decide which direction we were going to head in a park until we were there, in the park, and we saw the weather/crowd conditions/etc. We toured by land..so we'd head to tomorrowland, pull FPs for space, and do the other things in tomorrowland we wanted to do while we waited for our FP to come up.

When we visited, crowds were never peak, so we were generally able to pull FPs within 30 mins-1 hr of when it would be used (I'm referring to MK mostly here). We'd use 6-8 FPs in a day. It wasn't "maximizing" the system completely..I know others who routinely got more than the 6-8 FPs, but it worked very well for our touring style and required very very little preplanning. As I said, the only pre-planning we did was which park/which day and any ADRs we wanted. We didn't follow touring plans of any kind, or RideMax...just arrived at a park and then decided where we wanted to head first.

Not a whole lot of planning involved in that, and we were still able to use FP well.

This is how we tour. Legacy FP was fun! We never ran across the park to get FPs. Toured one land and then went onto the next. Now I have to go find a FP kiosk and stand in line to get a 4th, 5th FP and hope good rides are still available. It's not fun for me. Also too much planning down to the minute 60 days in advance. I have stress now that I never had before.

 

[normjen]

Ever since FP+ has begun, I have seen posted by some that its the 1st time they been able to ride TSM, as FP have always been gone by the time they get to the parks. So some (agree not all) already knew legacy FP existed but were not willing (or able) to make the journey to the parks early enough to get them. Going back to legacy would probably not change those habits. (which Disney would never go back IMO) I do not feel too bad for those who did not know about legacy fast pass or how to use it, if I am plopping down $1000's of dollars on something I definitely do my homework whether its a vacation to Disney or new tool for my business or car. etc...... Lack of such (again IMO) means an incredible disregard for their spending dollars or a (wish we could all be this way, Maybe) total carefree attitude even beyond what makes sense. to me.
Maybe I am more uptight than I think I am, but even a day trip somewhere new takes a little research.

 

[surferdave]

I will agree that the new FP system means planning ahead and understand how some would not like this. I still think the fact that some people get less FP than they used to is still the biggest reason they don,t like FP+ This is understandable as it is never feels good to get less. But now that FP is mainstream and many,many more people are aware of it I can,t see a possible solution of how to go back to the days of people getting close to what they used to. Again it is just the math of the current situation. I hope someone will read what I wrote above about the current FP exposure and its use of spreading out the crowds and tell me how we could go back to the good old days when not as many people knew about or used the FP system. Any FP system. I would actually love to hear some solutions for how people could get what they used to with the current usage of FP and the crowd control issues that go with it.

Perhaps for sake of discussion with those of us here, you could suspend disbelief of hidden motives and go along with our stated reasons for not liking the new system?

 

[Angel Ariel]

If I had said that, you might have a point. I said no hidden tricks or gimmicks. So perhaps what you said is what's really disingenuous.

Most everything you listed you'd find out with a phone call to WDW. Some of it's just plain common sense. Some of them you find out just playing around in MDE. They're not hidden tricks or gimmicks or just flat out cheating the system.

Or maybe we just have a different opinion of what is considered hidden.

I don't consider hidden as meaning gimmicks or cheating the system. When I read hidden, hidden = hard to find.

While you might consider what I listed above to be common sense and easy to find, I would say that I disagree. With the number of threads I see every day with people asking questions that the things I listed relate to (or are answers for) - or how many times those questions are asked (and answered) in mesaboy's thread, I don't see them as easily known/found.

Many of them people would never think to do differently (like the changing experience/time stuff) - or even think that they *needed* to ask. I know that when I first used the system, I assumed I was seeing full availability when I was modifying the FP+ I got. Once I was working with it for a few minutes, I remembered the threads here and realized I wasn't and needed to do things differently...but if I hadn't read threads here, I wouldn't have had any reason to think I was doing something wrong or could do something different to even think to call WDW to ask for help in the first place.

If by using the term hidden, you were speaking strictly of things that were really cheating the system, then we're talking about different things entirely, and I apologize for using "disingenuous".