AP Sales Paused

[RoseGold]

We are getting EVERYTHING promised in our contract, and usually a little more than what is in our contract

All we bought was a room at our home resort right? Not those discounts on products that aren’t even been sold, obviously.

 

[murphy7573]

f anything I think they have showed remarkable restraint with pricing. I think they are realizing they completely blew it with the new annual passes at Disneyland. The top tier $1,400 annual passes sold out within 2 months. They way underpriced those.

Agreed they blew it with Disneyland, but the way they blew it was allowing Cali residents to be able to make monthly payments on those passes. With a built in park going capacity of millions of potential locals (AKA SoCal) within driving distance and not needing aa many "resort guests" needing park reservations (3 properties). But this is also why DLR and WDW are not good comparisons.

 

[princesscinderella]

We just got home yesterday from WDW and it was crazy crowded, it was busier than when we were there in 2019 for the same weekend. There were times where the walkways were so crowded between the lines spilling out of the normal queues and the amount of people that you could barely navigate your way through. There’s definitely no social distancing happening so if anyone feels even remotely uncomfortable due to covid fears Disney parks are definitely not the place to be.
For those like us who refuse to buy LL and genie plus the best touring strategy is still get there super early. There’s definitely a noticeable drop off in lines close to 2pm when hopping is allowed. And then at the end of the night, so save the headliners for those times. We are so thankful that we had already purchased our APs for this trip. At this point I wouldn’t want to be in the parks if it was a sold out day because it doesn’t feel like they are limiting max capacity, but more like they have reached max capacity.

 

[MillauFr]

Agreed they blew it with Disneyland, but the way they blew it was allowing Cali residents to be able to make monthly payments on those passes. With a built in park going capacity of millions of potential locals (AKA SoCal) within driving distance and not needing aa many "resort guests" needing park reservations (3 properties). But this is also why DLR and WDW are not good comparisons.

Aren't there more Florida locals within a 60 minute drive of Disneyworld than Orange County residents within a 60 minute drive to Disneyland? Sure a few residents living in southern Los Angeles County can get to Disneyland in that amount of time. But if you live in northern Los Angeles County that drive takes longer than Miami to Disneyworld

 

[Sandisw]

Aren't there more Florida locals within a 60 minute drive of Disneyworld than Orange County residents within a 60 minute drive to Disneyland? Sure a few residents living in southern Los Angeles County can get to Disneyland in that amount of time. But if you live in northern Los Angeles County that drive takes longer than Miami to Disneyworld

True but DL has always been a more locals park because it doesn’t have the number of parks and things as WDW.

What I have read over the years is that WDW pulls a higher share of non FL residents than DL ever will. So even if you do have a lot of FL residents like CA residents at DL, the gap between those people and those from out of town is a lot more at WDW.

There are lot of cash guests who buy APs and travel to WDW as much as DVC…which I mentioned

I would bet it would be a difficult decision to explain to let some buy new and not others. Probably just easier especially for CMs to have it all or no one.

 

[DsneyDude1]

I will gently point out that several of the folks posting here most firmly that folks should have expected this, people shouldn’t be upset, are folks who have their APs already. Everyone entitled to their perspective but…

I got mine last week but did post that I don't like the way they are doing business. So even if you are not hurt in the short term by the pause, I think some of the management decision making trends are alarming. As you can see, some others do not. My wife and I have always said DVC is the best money we ever spent. And we still feel that way. But giving the current management a free pass is not in my wheelhouse.

 

[MillauFr]

True but DL has always been a more locals park because it doesn’t have the number of parks and things as WDW.

The parks in California have pack the same number of rides in two parks that Florida spreads out over 4. Plus due California has superior rides to its Florida counterpart. I just don't understand why Disney doesn't put its best rides at its flagship property.

 

[tiana1989]

I can definitely sympathize with the people who planned on getting APs out of their holiday trips. I was in the same boat this past year because I had 4 trips planned and wanted to get an AP but didn’t know when they would resume sales. As it turned out, I had to pay for day tickets for two of those trips and only got to bridge on the third, which was definitely frustrating and expensive and we considered canceling or modifying the later trips if they weren’t back in time because it was just too much.

With that being said, the reports from those at the parks this week have been pretty awful. There’s still just too much closed right now to absorb these crowds. We go for Christmas every year, so we’ve been there during the holidays pre-Covid. Yes, it’s crowded, but there are things you can do to beat the crowds early and outlast them at night. It’s just not the same this year. Even the park hours are still reduced. DHS was 9-9 last Christmas when capacity was 35%, and it’s still 9-9 this Thanksgiving week. That’s absurd! And I’ve seen multiple people say that Genie+ at the smaller parks only got them two reservations the entire day, plus Disney’s IT woes have unsurprisingly surfaced again, so that’s not really working right now.

So is it possible that Disney will use this pause to jack up AP prices? Definitely. But I also think that with the sold out day tickets too, at least part of this is Disney acknowledging that the parks can’t absorb the crowds right now. And those who planned to bridge their tickets over the holidays are obviously going to be in the parks over the holidays, so the silver lining for them and everyone else with upcoming trips is that at least Disney seems to be trying to limit the chaos during the time you’re there. Cash grabs and crowd control don’t have to be mutually exclusive.

 

[TiggerBouncy]

All we bought was a room at our home resort right? Not those discounts on products that aren’t even been sold, obviously.

We bought a room. We pay fees for management of the hotels including staffing and maintenance. A portion of our fees does go toward events. Those are things like the community centers as well as the activities that are put on including fireside and other activities. DVC uses some of those funds to negotiate with other business units for benefits.

A lot of other benefits are negotiated on a mutually benefited trade. I.E. DVC gets a discount, and in turn DVC members are more likely to purchase something - everyone wins.

Disney gives us nothing that isn't either in the contract, or negotiated with other business units based on DVC offering some tangible or intangible benefit back to the business unit. Every benefit we have ever gotten was negotiated on that basis, and DVC continues to try to find benefits; but BU's are less likely to trade when DVC doesn't have anything to offer and they (the BU's) don't have a need. I.E. There is no benefit to the BU right now to offer up free Genie+ and DVC can't offer then anything worthwhile, so why would they?

That will change. It always does. But it will take time given that in this extreme climate, the BU's are all stretched to their limits and what they need more than anything else - increased capacity - is not something DVC can offer.

True but DL has always been a more locals park because it doesn’t have the number of parks and things as WDW.

What I have read over the years is that WDW pulls a higher share of non FL residents than DL ever will. So even if you do have a lot of FL residents like CA residents at DL, the gap between those people and those from out of town is a lot more at WDW.

I have a lot of friends in CA that would have lunch in DL during a work day. Like they would literally have time to get over there, have lunch IN THE PARK, and get back to work. I have friends in Orlando, but for the most part, if they have lunch at Disney, it's in a resort or at Springs. Not sure why that is... but it is.

 

[DisneyOutsider]

Obviously anyone running a business where their main problem is too much demand for their product isn’t stupid

Let's not act like the current management deserves any credit for the current demand of the Disney product. That's a bit silly. They could have handed the reigns to anyone posting in this thread and we wouldn't have been able to put a dent in the demand for Disney Parks and Resorts. Current management was handed the keys to a vintage one-of-a-kind Porsche (built many decades ago) and told "Don't screw it up". There's plenty of room for valid criticism of the current management style, a style which places a heavy emphasis on short term market appreciation at the behest of long term vision and sustainable growth.

 

[DonMacGregor]

Aren't there more Florida locals within a 60 minute drive of Disneyworld than Orange County residents within a 60 minute drive to Disneyland? Sure a few residents living in southern Los Angeles County can get to Disneyland in that amount of time. But if you live in northern Los Angeles County that drive takes longer than Miami to Disneyworld

I'm not sure 60 minutes is the right threshold. If you are talking about a 60 minute drive in So Cal on a weekday, at rush hour, then maybe that's a 30 mile radius (and that still gets you much of the most heavily/densely populated areas of central, southern and eastern LA County depending on direction of traffic), but that same 60 minutes outside of rush hour expands the radius out to 45 or 50 miles. Now you're well into Riverside and even San Bernardino Counties. 60 minutes on the weekend is a 65-70 mile radius, and that gets you about 75% of LA County (including the Valley), all of Orange County, and about a 1/3 of San Diego County and all of the most heavily populated cities in Riverside and San Bernardino Counties (pretty much everything but the desert). That's going to give access to about 15 or 16 million of the 24 million people living in Southern California, versus the 22 million living in the entire state of Florida.

Fortunately, I live 15 minutes from Disneyland...LOL

 

[Prince John Robin Hood]

I know many feel that DVC is strictly promising a stay at a room at a resort in Florida but last time I checked all the marketing material focuses heavily on the parks. When I login right now and click on 'What Perks Await with Membership Magic?' it highlights Epcot Fesitval of Holidays, Annual Pass programs (No I'm not making this up. They just have a sick sense of humour maybe?) and Scenic Selfies which are all related to the parks.
DVC Moonlight Magic wasn't held at resorts but in the parks. People looking at buying VGF2 will be told about the new walkway to MK when they go on a tour. It's unlikely they'll be told how difficult it may be to purchase a discounted annual pass or that there is no guarantee they can purchase tickets/passes to visit the parks when they visit. It's just very disingenuous to claim that we're getting exactly what we've been sold because we are all sold more than a hotel room.

 

[chicagodisneyguy]

I know many feel that DVC is strictly promising a stay at a room at a resort in Florida but last time I checked all the marketing material focuses heavily on the parks. When I login right now and click on 'What Perks Await with Membership Magic?' it highlights Epcot Fesitval of Holidays, Annual Pass programs (No I'm not making this up. They just have a sick sense of humour maybe?) and Scenic Selfies which are all related to the parks.
DVC Moonlight Magic wasn't held at resorts but in the parks. People looking at buying VGF2 will be told about the new walkway to MK when they go on a tour. It's unlikely they'll be told how difficult it may be to purchase a discounted annual pass or that there is no guarantee they can purchase tickets/passes to visit the parks when they visit. It's just very disingenuous to claim that we're getting exactly what we've been sold because we are all sold more than a hotel room.

And most of the time, DVC has been able to deliver on the perks and benefits of being near the parks. I've bought discounted APs many times since joining in 2009. I've been able to partake in Moonlight Magic, used the Epcot lounge, gotten the chance to preview new lands early, discounts on food/shopping TIW etc. I think Disney has been very good to DVC members in my personal opinion. I think DVC will continue use the parks and perks when marketing DVC. I also think DVC will continue to offer ample perks/benefits that will fulfill that marketing.

I feel bad for the people who waited and didn't buy their APs. But at the end of the day, AP sales were available for sale for several weeks/months. Whatever Disney's reasons are for stopping sales are really besides the point. After seeing them stop Disneyland's sales, i think it made the chance of it happening at WDW much more likely.

 

[eandt]

I know many feel that DVC is strictly promising a stay at a room at a resort in Florida but last time I checked all the marketing material focuses heavily on the parks. When I login right now and click on 'What Perks Await with Membership Magic?' it highlights Epcot Fesitval of Holidays, Annual Pass programs (No I'm not making this up. They just have a sick sense of humour maybe?) and Scenic Selfies which are all related to the parks.
DVC Moonlight Magic wasn't held at resorts but in the parks. People looking at buying VGF2 will be told about the new walkway to MK when they go on a tour. It's unlikely they'll be told how difficult it may be to purchase a discounted annual pass or that there is no guarantee they can purchase tickets/passes to visit the parks when they visit. It's just very disingenuous to claim that we're getting exactly what we've been sold because we are all sold more than a hotel room.

Yes the "perks", including discounted AP's were definitely highlighted on every one of our sales visits/tours. We were presented a "Buy into the Magic" spiel not a "buy into a room" pitch .....that would not be magical at all.

 

[Brian Noble]

Aren't there more Florida locals within a 60 minute drive of Disneyworld than Orange County residents within a 60 minute drive to Disneyland?

I sure don't think so.

Orange County, FL: 1.4M
Orange County, CA: 3.2M

Lake, Polk, and Osceola together are only another 1.8M, so just equal to CA-Orange.

LA County is another 10M.

if you live in northern Los Angeles County that drive takes longer than Miami to Disneyworld

WDW to Miami: 3.5 hours w/o traffic (per google maps).

Six Flags Magic Mountain (north of LA) to Disneyland: 1.5-2.5 hours in morning mid-week rush hour traffic for a 9AM arrival. 1-1.5 hours for a 9AM arrival on a weekend. (Both also per google maps) How much of LA county's 10M population is that closer or closer? Probably most of it.

 

[DonMacGregor]

I sure don't think so.

Orange County, FL: 1.4M
Orange County, CA: 3.2M

Lake, Polk, and Osceola together are only another 1.8M, so just equal to CA-Orange.

LA County is another 10M.


WDW to Miami: 3.5 hours w/o traffic (per google maps).

Six Flags Magic Mountain (north of LA) to Disneyland: 1.5-2.5 hours in morning mid-week rush hour traffic for a 9AM arrival. 1-1.5 hours for a 9AM arrival on a weekend. (Both also per google maps) How much of LA county's 10M population is that closer or closer? Probably most of it.

See my reply above. Depending on the day of the week and time of day, a HUGE percentage of So Cal's 24 million residents live within 90 minutes of DL. I'd put all or most of Orange, LA, Riverside, San Bernardino, and a big chunk of northern San Diego County in that group.

The desert areas of Riverside, San Bernardino, and the northern and western ends of LA County (Thousand oaks, Simi Valley, etc.) as well as the southern and eastern reaches of San Diego County and all of Imperial County would be out, but those are all mostly lightly populated desert regions or agricultural land.

Having lived my entire 57 years on this planet in So Cal and having driven about every mile of freeway here, I can attest to that with some personal experience.

ETA: You might be pushing getting from Valencia (Six Flags) to DL in 2.5 hours during rush hour as you're driving through the gut of downtown LA, but it is an excellent representation of the most extreme traffic commute, and Valencia/Santa Clarita/Newhall really does represent the northernmost boundary of LA's population base. Plus, I'd estimate that a good 80-90% of LA's population lives much closer to DL than that.

 

[Brian Noble]

It’s almost like the folks at SRI knew what they were doing—not easy for this Cal grad to admit.

https://www.sri.com/hoi/disneyland/

 

[CBMom01]

If it makes folks feel better, I heard from someone this morning that they were unable to buy a multi-day ticket for the week after Christmas because of limited park availability. I obviously can't verify what that person experienced or was told, but if true it would put non-ap visitors on more or less the same footing as those seeking to buy AP right now.

 

[DonMacGregor]

It’s almost like the folks at SRI knew what they were doing—not easy for this Cal grad to admit.

https://www.sri.com/hoi/disneyland/

It's OK you can let it go.

(Signed, this UCLA grad '86).

 

[CBMom01]

Yes the "perks", including discounted AP's were definitely highlighted on every one of our sales visits/tours. We were presented a "Buy into the Magic" spiel not a "buy into a room" pitch .....that would not be magical at all.

Not to be insensitive - truly - but Florida has had to pass special consumer protection laws for timeshare sales because there's so much pressure and puffery in timeshare sales pitches. To me, that's a huge tipoff that anything not expressly promised in the contract should not be relied upon when deciding whether to buy.