AP Lending?

[Martin22]

A friend just returned from WDW and used his brothers AP at the parks! When it didn't work with his "Biometrics?" he mentioned that he had a problem last time he was at WDW. He went to guest services and had it re-done. He was not asked for ID and was told that this "Biometrics" problem is quite common. Is this possible?

 

[Shells9]

Might be possible but you won't catch me trying it, and the AP holder who had it was not real bright, either. That's a lot of money to risk on something they tell you NOT to do.

 

[zurgswife]

WOW!! pretty lucky if you ask me...

 

[KristaTX]

Originally posted by Shells9
That's a lot of money to risk on something they tell you NOT to do.

Yep. And also totally unethical .

 

[dpuck1998]

I find that a little hard to swallow. True the biometrics don't work very well, in fact didn't work for me more than it did. However, every single time it didn't work they asked for ID and let me in. When I complained about it they reset it for me right at the gate, not by going to Guest Services...and they asked for ID before they reset it.

 

[DVC~OKW~96]

Yep, have to agree. I'm at the park (EPCOT in particular) so often that I know the security guards, the CMs at the gates and the CMs in the ticket booth, and when I forget my annual pass, or when I've washed my AP (they don't take too kindly to the laundry) I always have to show I.D. to get a new one. Once, they asked me for my birthdate when I had forgotten my annual pass and my license.

I'm not saying it couldn't happen, but it sure sounds really odd. Not something that I'd ever want other folks to think they could do with any ease.

Has precious little to do with protecting the coffers of WDW, rather more importantly, protecting the standing of the guest. Imagine how embarrassing it would be to have your AP confiscated.

 

[bunnyfoo]

Your friend is pretty lucky ... I've had problems with the finger scans and I've always been asked for photo ID by the CM.

 

[cheerdaddy]

you know, there are lots of debates about different things people do or don't do, should or shouldn't do on the DIS....for the most part they are lots of fun, and I like to get in on them. I don't usually feel super strong about it either way, but, this pi**es me off!!! Not only is it unethical, but, downright illegal!!! your friend is lucky not to be in jail and his brother should not only have his pass confiscated, but should be barred from the parks for life for even trying something so stupid and dishonest. Im all for finding and using each and every legitimate discount you can to make a wdw trip less expensive, but, that is just WRONG!

 

[jaysue]

Yes it is possible, but the CM that reset the biometrics ot whatever they did broke procedure but not insisting on verification of the ticket name versus ID etc....



thanks
jaysue

 

[RescueRanger]

Originally posted by dpuck1998
I find that a little hard to swallow. True the biometrics don't work very well, in fact didn't work for me more than it did. However, every single time it didn't work they asked for ID and let me in. When I complained about it they reset it for me right at the gate, not by going to Guest Services...and they asked for ID before they reset it.

I have to agree. My wife had a problem once with her biometrics scan. The CM asked to see her ID then reset the biometrics scan right there at the turnstile. We did not have to go to guest services.

 

[Sammie]

I find this hard to believe and if it did happen the CM that did it could and would lose their job if found out.

I would take it with a grain of salt that not everything we are told is the absolute truth.

Some people get enjoyment by telling others how they got away with something.

 

[mickeem]

I had a problem with My AP a few time this past December. It was "rush hour" at the entrance, and I was just let in, never asked for ID.
I thought hmm, thats not right, but it was sooooo busy.
Maybe it depends on the time of day, the mood of the CM, who knows, But I would never have tried to use someone elses AP!

 

[GoldenOldie]

The biometric scan is set at the turnstile, not at Guest Relations. It is encoded onto the pass itself and is not kept in the ATS computer system. When it doesn't work, the gate CM resets it right there.

The only way Guest Relations gets involved is if the magnetic strip on the AP itself gets corrupted. The standard procedure is for the GR CM to ask for a photo ID before issuing a new one.

Could what the OP described have happened? Sure. You can never say never when Disney policy and CMs are involved.

 

[Martin22]

Thanks for the info. I would never try this and I find it hard to swallow that someone I know would knowingly break the law (Theft).

MP

 

[kadaten]

Originally posted by dpuck1998
I find that a little hard to swallow. True the biometrics don't work very well, in fact didn't work for me more than it did. However, every single time it didn't work they asked for ID and let me in. When I complained about it they reset it for me right at the gate, not by going to Guest Services...and they asked for ID before they reset it.

Yep. Me too. Never been able to get in if there was a problem with the fingers without showing ID.

 

[MarkC]

Originally posted by cheerdaddy
Not only is it unethical, but, downright illegal!!! your friend is lucky not to be in jail and his brother should not only have his pass confiscated, but should be barred from the parks for life

lol, i'm sorry, but when I read that, I couldn't help but burst out laughing! Illegal, and jail? What country do you live in where the laws are so inane? haha, because the United States certainly doesn't have any laws where using somebody elses Disney pass will get them to jail!

The truth of the matter is, it's NOT illegal. Any police officer or judge would laugh at you if you even tried to take somebody to court and arrest them over it. Using some one else's pass is simply against Disney's rules. They do have the option to invalidate the pass if abuse is found, however that is an extreme option that is almost never used. Disney is really concerned with the issue though. It happens very little, and on top of that, they hand out and comp. so many free tickets, that they aren't concerned with a few people who slip through the cracks. At the end of the day, these people are still going to end up spending money in the parks, and that's all they are concerened about.

And Sammie, the CM would NOT lose their job. There are times when the CM's are encouraged by their area managers not to ask for ID simply as a matter of convienence for the guests (especially if the lines are long). And as for the validity of the story, I believe it 100%. There have been SO many times when the biometrics haven't worked with my pass and the CM has simply either let me through the turnstile or reset the biometrics without asking for my ID.

I'm not advocating this unethical use of the pass, as I feel if I'm paying for the pass, so should others. However, it's not as huge of a deal as some of you are making it out to be.

 

[McCall]

Fraud is certainly illegal in this country and can in deed land you in jail. That ticket is a contract and a legal document.
It clearly states the terms and that it is for the person it is issued to.

 

[cheerdaddy]

DISclaimer: This post is not intended to be arguementative or sarcastic in any way.

MarkC: I was just wondering which part of it is not considered illegal? the fraud part or the theft of services part?

 

[MarkC]

Originally posted by cheerdaddy
MarkC: I was just wondering which part of it is not considered illegal? the fraud part or the theft of services part?

Well, fraud is only punishable if the amount of damages is above $75 in most cases (sometimes even higher, depending on the type of fraud we're dealing with). The price of admission is only $50, and on top of that, if it were ever taken to court, they'd figure out that the cost to Disney in letting in another person free of charge would probably be no more than $30. But in this instance, it's unlikely utilizing a pass for a day would even be considered fraud. I don't know of any cases where someone borrowing a pass for a day (whether it be a health club, a theme park pass, or a country club) has been accused of fraud, and I have studied the subject when I attended law school about 5 years ago (which is why I thought I'd chime in on this subject).

As for theft of services, that would not occur in this instance. If a CM lets you through the turnstile, in the eyes of the law, it's an affirmation BY Disney that the pass is valid for the person entering. If a CM had stopped a person prior to entering, then again, there would be no case of theft of services (as they were stopped before they entered) and all that would occur is the pass would be confiscated for a violation of the terms of service, and that would be the end of it. I don't know of any court who would pursue a case like this, nor do I know of any police department who would even think of arresting someone in this instance if Disney or any type of club were to suggest pressing charges. The only way "theft of service" could occur is if somebody were to bypass the gates and sneak in. That really wouldn't even fall under "theft of services" though because the monetary value is too low for it considered punishable or illegal; instead the property owner would probably choose to pursue that violation as a trespassing charge.

What it all comes down to, is the only rules that AP sharing violates are those of Disney. Law aren't applicable when the value of "services" or the pass are minor.

 

[MarkC]

Originally posted by McCall
Fraud is certainly illegal in this country and can in deed land you in jail. That ticket is a contract and a legal document.
It clearly states the terms and that it is for the person it is issued to.

That ticket is NOT a legal document. It IS an agreement, however, between the issuer and the user (and even then, it's purpose is nothing more than disclaimer for Disney to explain what their rights are in conducting business). The problem with considering a ticket as a legal document is that it's way too ambiguous. It still can be used in a court as guidelines in determining possible legal violations, but it doesn't hold the air-tight value that a true legal document would possess.