Anyone watch "The Cove"

[chiamarie]

Okay, I"m not gonna lie, I haven't read through all of the agurments being made on here. But here's my two cents on "The Cove".

I have not see it. But all I knew about it was that it was getting the word out about drive fisheries happening in Japan.

Then people started posting things on facebook:

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and Part II

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My thoughts are this:

Drive Fisheries are not cool what-so-ever. Poor, poor dolphins. However, its what the Japanese do, its what they've always done. They don't do it to make a profit to sell to amusment parks (as these video's prove).

Ric O'Barry is a flat out liar. He was one of the orginal trainers to Flipper. And thus realized how horrible captivity is (in his mind). And wants it to stop.

If you want to be against Drive Fisheries, thats one thing. I think it's sick what they are doing over there. But realize, that Seaworld (or any other park with dolphins in the US, or even the Western Hemisphere) has nothing to do with the Drive Fishries, and are also probably against it too.

SeaWorld even posted this:
http://www.seaworldparksblog.com/explore/blog/updated-seaworld-discusses-drive-fisheries



So, if you want to be FULLY informed, I strongly suggest you watch these videos, and hopefully they give you something to think about. Like I said. Its one thing to be against the Drive Fisheries. It's another to be against captivity.

 

[finucane]

After doing a little research after watching "The Cove" my understanding is that Ric O'Barry's trouble with Sea World isn't that they use any animals from Taiji, but that they don't use their position as a member of the Alliance of Marine Mammal Parks and Aquariums to pressure other international members, of that organization, to stop purchasing from there.

Now I was saddened and sickened by the practices shown in "The Cove," but I can tell you this, I don't think I would have been nearly as effected by it if I had not had the exposure, education, and experiences, that I have had at Sea World, Shedd Aquarium, and Brookfield Zoo.

I would like to find ANYONE that feels passionate about this that has never actually had the privilege to be around dolphins, or whales, in person. That would have been really hard for a kid growing up in the Midwest if we didn't have access to them locally. I doubt that my wife would have been sobbing out loud during the closing moments of that film if we did not have the encounters we did this past summer at Sea World. Particularly on the behind the scenes tour we took where we got to see them working with an injured dolphin.

Do I believe that dolphins belong free in the ocean, absolutely, but I also can see the benefits that these ocean ambassadors have with the public as well. It would be very hard for us to get as emotional about this topic, if we had not had what experiences we have all had. So if people across the US did not have access to these amazing animals at local aquariums, and places like Sea World, "The Cove" would be falling on deaf ears.

I have not doubt ILoveMyGirls, that if you go through with your trip to Dolphin Cove that the effect that movie will have on you afterwards will only be multiplied one hundred fold. You may also find yourself fighting even harder against places like DC. If that be the case, I just ask that you pause for a moment, and remember where that passion is coming from.

This topic is so totally flame-bait, but I hope this is a level-headed part of the discussion.

 

[LockShockBarrel]

I'll start by saying I have not seen The Cove, nor do I ever intend to. As other people have said, it was made with someone with an agenda, someone who was only out to show the negative position. I'm not trying to say that everyone should go out and catch a dolphin and keep it as a pet, or everyone should eat whale and dolphin, but what I think people are forgetting is that there's 2 sides to a story.

Think of it this way, look how few people there are who are passionate about saving Spiralothelphus, a species of freshwater crab, or Gastrotheca orophylax, a species of frog, Grandidier's Mongoose, or Mariana Fruit Bat. I took all of these off the IUCN red list of animals. They're all threatened but because no one knows what they are, no one cares. We all know dolphins and tigers and polar bears, because we've seen them. We can associate with them. All of these creatures, and the plants and fungi and bacteria that I didn't even list, are just as important as the "superstars" of the animal world.

We've all seen the clips of animals going wild and harming people and trainers, and of course it's a terrible thing. What needs to be remembered though is that because it happens on a fairly rare basis (at least big fatal attacks), the events become sensationalized very quickly. It's like getting a haircut (bear with me here). If you get a good haircut, you might tell 4 or 5 people, if you get a bad haircut, you tell everyone. It's similar to what happens with animal trainers, you only ever really hear about the bad things that happen.

Take the case of California Condors as well. These animals would be extinct had humans not stepped in and helped them. It's the Jurassic Park argument, we caused the events to lead them into danger, we should therefore help them. They, like dolphins and whales, are not dying off due to natural selection. Had the condor not gotten publicity, no one but scientists and bird lovers would have really cared that they'd died out. If we hadn't seen dolphins and whales, and experienced being near them, we probably would have looked at a picture AFTER they were critically endangered or even completely extinct and gone " Oh darn, they're cute, we should have done something...".

The fact is, without zoos and aquariums, without places like SeaWorld and Discovery Cove, people would be far less educated about these animals and not feel a personal draw to them and a inner need to help them.

I'm not condoning the hunting and slaughter, or any animal being mistreated. Maybe we need to think of it in another way, that while yes it sucks that Mr Dolphin was taken out of the ocean, but he's educated thousands of people over the years, and bred more to help replace the natural population, and been a fabulous ambassator for his species encouraging people to get involved with helping his species, and at least he didn't end up in the slaughter. Zoos and aquarium type places have also come leaps and bounds in the way they house and care for animals. No it's not their natural environment but honestly, I'd rather see them in a zoo then not see them at all.

 

[julieannbabe]

We are going on our first Disney Cruise in November. I was planning to swim with the dolphins...but then I saw The Cove! I couldn't sleep for days! You better believe I'm done supporting the dolphin/whale industry! I stopped going to circuses decades ago because of a video I saw of elephants being mistreated! What is hard for me, though, is knowing Sea World does so much good! They educate, rehabilitate and don't use captive animals anymore. (They made a statement that they stopped that over 20 years ago) I haven't been to Sea World since my teens were babies but I was planning on taking them one more time! Oh well, they've survived a childhood without circuses so I guess they can survive not going to Sea World, too! I hope and pray the killings in Japan stop soon!!!

you say that seaworld educate-how do they?
they might educate about 5% of the time but i do feel they 'dress it up' by saying they are educating the customer while all the while having the dolphins/whales perform for us.
also we are not being educated by having the dolphins/whales perform for us - they are doing unnatural behaviour that they wouldn't do in the wild.
this isn't education for me.

 

[julieannbabe]

I am confused. If Sea World stopped using captive animals over 20 years ago and now rescues animals, why would you not go to Sea World?

because whales/dolphins shouldn't be kept in tanks and made to work for their food.
and made to swim with us.

Tily was captured in 1983 sent to sealand in victoria, canada then he was involved in a death of a trainer. In 1992 he was transferred to seaworld, florida.

 

[julieannbabe]

Or maybe Sea World is actually doing a good thing working to save animals. May I ask the last time you visted Sea World? Are you familar with the animals who are working with the disabled? Are you familar with the animals who have been rescued and now live at Sea World as they would not be able to survive in the wild? Do you know the trainers and have you spoken with them? Have you gone along on an animal rescue? Have you seen the manatees that live at Sea World after being injured by humans?

you said "the animals who are working with the disabled.'

WORKING - these animals shouldn't be made to work full stop.

also there is no scientific evidence to suggest that dolphin assisted therapy helps disabled people;

from dolphin care.org:

'We can certainly understand a person going to any length possible to help an ill or disabled loved one. But there is absolutely no scientific evidence to substantiate the claim that spending time in a tank or enclosure with dolphins has healing results for special-needs children.

To the contrary, the only guaranteed result is that the desperate parents of ill or autistic children wind up paying large sums of money for short periods of time in the water with dolphins. Although there may be a momentary increase in the attention level of the child, the effects are fleeting at best. And, in fact, some experts suggest that the inability to provide this kind of stimulus on a consistent basis can actually have a negative effect. However, pet-assisted therapy with dogs, cats and horses is a well-proven technique that enables a child to receive consistent affection and stimulation that can be beneficial in their treatment. Considering the alternatives, why not adopt a pet from a shelter and change two lives for the better?'

 

[julieannbabe]

However, its what the Japanese do, its what they've always done. They don't do it to make a profit to sell to amusment parks (as these video's prove).

no it isn't the 'japanese' doing this - it is 26 fisherman.

Ric O'barry isn't a liar. he freely admits that he feels responsible for the fact that we 'loving dolphins to death' now.

 

[julieannbabe]

If you want to be against Drive Fisheries, thats one thing. I think it's sick what they are doing over there. But realize, that Seaworld (or any other park with dolphins in the US, or even the Western Hemisphere) has nothing to do with the Drive Fishries, and are also probably against it too.

along time ago but seaworld aren't totally innocent:

'SeaWorld's attempt to capture several Orca in Puget Sound in the early 1970s using powerboats, airplanes and explosives to drive the animals resulted in the capture permit being revoked.'

 

[julieannbabe]

I would like to find ANYONE that feels passionate about this that has never actually had the privilege to be around dolphins, or whales, in person. That would have been really hard for a kid growing up in the Midwest if we didn't have access to them locally.

but why should we have access to dolphins? who are we to demand that we should be able to see them?

man has become so arrogant that we think that we are entitled to anything we want.

 

[julieannbabe]

I'd rather see them in a zoo then not see them at all.

isn't that being selfish though? just as long you get to see them it makes it okay?

 

[iwrbnd]

you say that seaworld educate-how do they?
they might educate about 5% of the time but i do feel they 'dress it up' by saying they are educating the customer while all the while having the dolphins/whales perform for us.
also we are not being educated by having the dolphins/whales perform for us - they are doing unnatural behaviour that they wouldn't do in the wild.
this isn't education for me.

You make a valid point and it is definately something we all have to ask ourselves now! I've only been to Sea World once and although I enjoyed it I have to say seeing them swim freely in the ocean on our Hawaii trip was way better! (Actually it was Humpback Whales we saw but seeing dolphins would have been just as exciting!)

 

[livndisney]

because whales/dolphins shouldn't be kept in tanks and made to work for their food.
and made to swim with us.

Tily was captured in 1983 sent to sealand in victoria, canada then he was involved in a death of a trainer. In 1992 he was transferred to seaworld, florida.

On this post you state whales should not be made to work for your food and then in another post you complain Tilly is left alone in a tank. Which is your true concern? It is very easy to repeat what one reads on the internet, but the simple fact it this film was made by someone with a agenda. And still has nothing to do with Sea World.

 

[livndisney]

you said "the animals who are working with the disabled.'

WORKING - these animals shouldn't be made to work full stop.

also there is no scientific evidence to suggest that dolphin assisted therapy helps disabled people;

from dolphin care.org:

'We can certainly understand a person going to any length possible to help an ill or disabled loved one. But there is absolutely no scientific evidence to substantiate the claim that spending time in a tank or enclosure with dolphins has healing results for special-needs children.

To the contrary, the only guaranteed result is that the desperate parents of ill or autistic children wind up paying large sums of money for short periods of time in the water with dolphins. Although there may be a momentary increase in the attention level of the child, the effects are fleeting at best. And, in fact, some experts suggest that the inability to provide this kind of stimulus on a consistent basis can actually have a negative effect. However, pet-assisted therapy with dogs, cats and horses is a well-proven technique that enables a child to receive consistent affection and stimulation that can be beneficial in their treatment. Considering the alternatives, why not adopt a pet from a shelter and change two lives for the better?'

I think the correct statement should be "there is no evidence on The Cove website to support the claim Dolphins are helping special needs children".

In fact there is considerable evidence that these amazing animals are making a huge difference with these special children.

http://www.idw.org/html/dolphin_therapy.html

"Before we went I thought, It’s not a miracle cure’ - I never expected that. But Emily loved it and she was a different child when we came back home. It lasted a couple of months, then we started to raise money again and went back a year later.
Before the Dolphin Therapy, Emily was trapped in a world of her own and cried a lot, but since we’ve returned, she has been noticeably brighter, more aware and she’s making more eye contact.”

“It is undeniable that dolphin healing has a powerful effect on the human psyche, “says Dr. Horace Dobbs, Founder of IDW."


"Dolphin therapy is relaxing and therefore enhances learning in those with Down Syndrome:
Dolphin Therapy removes the cares and concerns of the world.

Being in the water with dolphins, or on a ship out at sea watching and following dolphins, is what dolphin therapy is for a someone with Down Syndrome.

The dolphin therapy helps to focus the person's attention on to their interaction with the dolphins and away from their normal day to day concerns - thereby the dolphin therapy reduces stress and anxiety, thus making people with Down Syndrome or other disabilities more open to learning new behaviour, interactions and thinking patterns."

 

[julieannbabe]

On this post you state whales should not be made to work for your food and then in another post you complain Tilly is left alone in a tank. Which is your true concern? It is very easy to repeat what one reads on the internet, but the simple fact it this film was made by someone with a agenda. And still has nothing to do with Sea World.

my one and only true concern is that whales/dolphins should not be in capitivity whether it be in america or japan or anywhere in the world. full stop.

 

[julieannbabe]

I think the correct statement should be "there is no evidence on The Cove website to support the claim Dolphins are helping special needs children".

In fact there is considerable evidence that these amazing animals are making a huge difference with these special children.

http://www.idw.org/html/dolphin_therapy.html

"Before we went I thought, It’s not a miracle cure’ - I never expected that. But Emily loved it and she was a different child when we came back home. It lasted a couple of months, then we started to raise money again and went back a year later.
Before the Dolphin Therapy, Emily was trapped in a world of her own and cried a lot, but since we’ve returned, she has been noticeably brighter, more aware and she’s making more eye contact.”

“It is undeniable that dolphin healing has a powerful effect on the human psyche, “says Dr. Horace Dobbs, Founder of IDW."


"Dolphin therapy is relaxing and therefore enhances learning in those with Down Syndrome:
Dolphin Therapy removes the cares and concerns of the world.

Being in the water with dolphins, or on a ship out at sea watching and following dolphins, is what dolphin therapy is for a someone with Down Syndrome.

The dolphin therapy helps to focus the person's attention on to their interaction with the dolphins and away from their normal day to day concerns - thereby the dolphin therapy reduces stress and anxiety, thus making people with Down Syndrome or other disabilities more open to learning new behaviour, interactions and thinking patterns."

why can't people with down syndrome pet a cat or a dog instead and taught how to look after it?

do the dolphins have a say whether they want to be petted or not or take part in the 'therapy'? not really - if they don't co-operate then they don't get fed their treats.
if a dolphin was in the ocean do you think it would be thinking how great it would be to interact with humans in a tiny enclosed space?

i am shocked that people don't seem to grasp that these are not 'pets' that we should be entitled to pet and stroke and have them to tricks for us.

everything is about us, humans, want - nothing else matters.
if people get their dolphin swim thats great - thats all they care about - they got their memory and the photo with the dolphin.

who cares how the dolphin is feeling? it always looks happy so it must be okay to do it.

people can't seem to see that all this is wrong - keeping these animals locked up then us getting into the water with them and invading even more of the tiny space that they have.

it great if your daughter feels better - but all these dolphin swims are just wrong.

 

[livndisney]

why can't people with down syndrome pet a cat or a dog instead and taught how to look after it?

do the dolphins have a say whether they want to be petted or not or take part in the 'therapy'? not really - if they don't co-operate then they don't get fed their treats.
if a dolphin was in the ocean do you think it would be thinking how great it would be to interact with humans in a tiny enclosed space?

i am shocked that people don't seem to grasp that these are not 'pets' that we should be entitled to pet and stroke and have them to tricks for us.

everything is about us, humans, want - nothing else matters.
if people get their dolphin swim thats great - thats all they care about - they got their memory and the photo with the dolphin.


who cares how the dolphin is feeling? it always looks happy so it must be okay to do it.

people can't seem to see that all this is wrong - keeping these animals locked up then us getting into the water with them and invading even more of the tiny space that they have.

it great if your daughter feels better - but all these dolphin swims are just wrong.

If we are going to simplify the arguement as such-have you asked the dolphin how they feel about the therapy?

May I see your evidence to support " if they don't co-operate then they don't get fed their treats."?

I am also still waiting for your success stories on releasing captive whales into the wild.

It is shocking to me how one sided this arguement is "this is what I want, this is all I see"


And this statement just further proves who have not read "the other side", and in fact you are not even reading what is posted here. Where did I mention a daughter?
"it great if your daughter feels better - but all these dolphin swims are just wrong"

The truth of the matter is this is how you feel based on one narrow view.

 

[BLTLDZ]

At any rate, I would just like to say that I have cancelled the discovery cove prtion of our trip, and am feeling good about my decision.

 

[livndisney]

At any rate, I would just like to say that I have cancelled the discovery cove prtion of our trip, and am feeling good about my decision.

I am glad you are happy with your choice. I do hope you have a wonderful trip.

But I do wonder if you also be avoiding Animal Kingdom, Animal Kingdom Lodge and Epcot?

 

[irisheyes123]

why can't people with down syndrome pet a cat or a dog instead and taught how to look after it?

do the dolphins have a say whether they want to be petted or not or take part in the 'therapy'? not really - if they don't co-operate then they don't get fed their treats.
if a dolphin was in the ocean do you think it would be thinking how great it would be to interact with humans in a tiny enclosed space?

i am shocked that people don't seem to grasp that these are not 'pets' that we should be entitled to pet and stroke and have them to tricks for us.

everything is about us, humans, want - nothing else matters.
if people get their dolphin swim thats great - thats all they care about - they got their memory and the photo with the dolphin.

who cares how the dolphin is feeling? it always looks happy so it must be okay to do it.

people can't seem to see that all this is wrong - keeping these animals locked up then us getting into the water with them and invading even more of the tiny space that they have.

it great if your daughter feels better - but all these dolphin swims are just wrong.

I do not believe for one moment that they do not get treats if they don't co-operate

Also who is to say they are not happy with what they are doing do they talk to you If they don't what to come over to people for the swim part they don't they are not made to do it also if they don't want to do the shows they don't

Im sure dogs and cats were not born to be pets at first either

I think what seaword do is great you can tell that they love and treat them very well

 

[julieannbabe]

At any rate, I would just like to say that I have cancelled the discovery cove prtion of our trip, and am feeling good about my decision.

wow. i am pleased you made that decision.

every bit helps x