Anyone there now that can comment on FP enforcement

[TinkerShy]

My DH and I just returned from our honeymoon at WDW and had a pretty easy time of it with FPs.

We were in AK on 3/7 and can attest to the signs posted on the machines (from what we saw it was on every other or every two machines) and usually a CM standing by to inform guests of the FP restrictions. There was also a note on the FPs themselves stating that there would be no accomaditions for late arrivals.

We ran into a small line at the entrance to KRR where there seemed to be a combined issue of height measurement and FP time checks, but it was only a big deal for one man who tried to skip through it and walked into the standby line entrance only to maneuver back into the FP line. He was promptly and firmly requested to rejoin the FP line proper.

 

[magicbob]

Kind of a related question: have TourGuideMike or touringplans.com changed their advice? Both relied heavily on the "stock up on as many fastpasses as fast as you can" approach to touring.

I would be curious as to how their advice has/is changed.

Hopefully, they will adjust their information about using FPs late in a timely manner (may have already done so, I haven't checked those sites in the last several days). But I think going early and acquiring FPs as quickly as the next one is available will remain an effective touring strategy. It just means you'll be using them more quickly (during the window) instead of holding on to them for later in the day. It's the afternoon/evening part of the touring plan that will be affected the most by this change.

Let me give a different example. Let's say you arrive at Epcot at 8:30am in order to be there for the opening at 9am. In fact, it is clearly printed on the Times Guide that the park OFFICIALLY opens at 9am. However, for whatever reason, on this day the CM's open the turnstiles at 8:45. Well... scandal! This for goodness sake is in VIOLATION of the printed policy! All those who enter early MUST be cheaters! I presume you would wait the extra 15 minutes?? Of course you wouldn't... the OFFICIAL policy that day was to open the park at 8:45... probably because all the CM's were in place and ready to go.

I tried to make a similar point on the closed thread, but was just told that analogies are meaningless and irrelevant. I applaud your effort to present a reasoned, logical explanation, though.

Let me try one more analogy.

EPCOT opens at 9:00 am. That is clearly Disney's policy as evidenced by the hours posted on the website and on the signage outside the park. For years, Disney let guests into the park before 9:00 am. We made our way all the way to the fountain and enjoyed a little show. Then we made our way to Soarin' for FPs and got there ahead of all the people who showed up at 9:00 am. Most guests didn't know they could arrive early because it wasn't published "policy." We clearly enjoyed an unfair advantage by exploiting a loophole. The park hours are clearly posted, so those entering early for RD MUST have been breaking the rules.

Disney recently did away with rope drop at EPCOT. CLEARLY, Disney must have decided to stop the rampant abuse of people just doing what they want and showing up early to the parks despite the fact that Disney's intent that they wait until 9:00 am to enter is obvious.

 

[vacationclub]

Let me clarify - They made an effort to know "all" the rules. Never blamed anyone for not knowing - just saying there was nothing wrong with the ones who did.

Not saying there was anything wrong with those who found out about the lax enforcement either.....I wish I had known. But the reason I didn't know wasn't because I didn't make an effort to know "all" the rules. You can't make an effort to know something that you don't know you're supposed to know. You discover it separate from your normal observance of what Disney (the place that sets the rules) is telling you. For all I know, there are some other secrets that run counter to Disney's official policy. But until I stumble upon them somehow, I don't even know what to ask about....or what effort I'm supposed to make.

 

[origin62]

Hopefully, they will adjust their information about using FPs late in a timely manner (may have already done so, I haven't checked those sites in the last several days). But I think going early and acquiring FPs as quickly as the next one is available will remain an effective touring strategy. It just means you'll be using them more quickly (during the window) instead of holding on to them for later in the day. It's the afternoon/evening part of the touring plan that will be affected the most by this change.





I tried to make this point on the closed thread, but was just told that analogies are meaningless and irrelevent. I applaud your effort to present a reasoned, logical explanation, though.

Not all analogies, just that one.

 

[magicbob]

Not all analogies, just that one.

Sorry, I misspoke. Not ALL analogies are irrelevant. Only analogies that successfully poke holes in the theory that late FP use was abusing the system are irrelevant.

 

[origin62]

Sorry, I misspoke. Not ALL analogies are irrelevant. Only analogies that successfully poke holes in the theory that late FP use was abusing the system are irrelevant.

Right!

 

[magicbob]

Sorry, I misspoke. Not ALL analogies are irrelevant. Only analogies that successfully poke holes in the theory that late FP use was abusing the system are irrelevant.

Right!

I give you credit for your honesty.

 

[kirasaurus]

just got back last night, and there is a message posted on the fastpass machine and the fastpass itself that says something like "please use your fastpass within the designated time." (i can't remember the exact phrasing)
i didn't see anyone turned away, but we only used fps for soarin because the fp times didn't fit into our schedule.

this has probably been posted numerous times but I just wanted to add another confirmed report.

 

[bigbluenation]

Sounds like things are going pretty smooth.

 

[LaurenT]

Not all analogies, just that one.

So, if you had gone to WDW back in October and went to a FP distribution machine and waited for a mi ute - discussing with your wife whether or not you'd be able to get back by the return window....trying to decide if you should get the FP or skip it and try to find one with a more convenient return time....
And a CM was standing there and overheard you - and said "don't worry about it! You can actually come back anytime after the start time...right up u til the park closes", you'd argue with him? Report him for trying to get guests to cheat? Smile and just ignore his advice?....what?

 

[Grenadyr]

We just got back and our last day in the parks was the 7th. On the 7th, we used 5 passes about 1/2 hour after the window closed on the Safari at AK. The new signs were on the machines but the CM's didn't say anything to us. Strangely enough we did get turned down earlier in the week for being two minutes early at the Buzz Lightyear ride at MK. This was my first time using the fastpasses and we loved the convenience of them.

 

[origin62]

So, if you had gone to WDW back in October and went to a FP distribution machine and waited for a mi ute - discussing with your wife whether or not you'd be able to get back by the return window....trying to decide if you should get the FP or skip it and try to find one with a more convenient return time....
And a CM was standing there and overheard you - and said "don't worry about it! You can actually come back anytime after the start time...right up u til the park closes", you'd argue with him? Report him for trying to get guests to cheat? Smile and just ignore his advice?....what?

Of course I would disregard the CMs comments and report him immediately. To follow his advice would mean riding outside of my FP window, and that's wrong.

No, silly. I would (1) be surprised since every guest communication medium from WDW indicates that I should use the FP during the time shown. (2) Be delighted by the CMs instructions and gleefully enjoy the attraction later that day.

 

[LaurenT]

Of course I would disregard the CMs comments and report him immediately. To follow his advice would mean riding outside of my FP window, and that's wrong.

No, silly. I would (1) be surprised since every guest communication medium from WDW indicates that I should use the FP during the
time shown. (2) Be delighted by the CMs instructions and gleefully enjoy the attraction later that day.

Ok, that is what I would do, and what I have sone since I have been specifically told that by CMs numerous times over the years. This is why us former late FP users get our dander up when posters say that we are cheaters or are abusing the system.

 

[origin62]

Ok, that is what I would do, and what I have sone since I have been specifically told that by CMs numerous times over the years. This is why us former late FP users get our dander up when posters say that we are cheaters or are abusing the system.

I hear you. My personal opinion is that late users do negatively impact the attractions and other guests. But, of course, Disney has allowed it, so I agree with you that guests who choose to use FPs late are not "cheaters."

The reason for my original post was that I don't think the early-theme-park-opening is a valid comparison to late FP use. It's an apples-to-oranges analogy. Again, this is just my personal opinion.

As many have pointed out, it's all moot now since Disney's practice has changed.

 

[CandleontheWater]

I still don't understand how it was such a secret. All you had to do was ask any CM what would happen if you were late to your FP time, and they would have told you that FP are good until the end of the day.

I just don't understand how you could not be curious? If you had been to WDW multiple times, why wouldn't you have asked that question? It seems like a pretty logical question to ask.

 

[origin62]

I still don't understand how it was such a secret. All you had to do was ask any CM what would happen if you were late to your FP time, and they would have told you that FP are good until the end of the day.

I just don't understand how you could not be curious? If you had been to WDW multiple times, why wouldn't you have asked that question? It seems like a pretty logical question to ask.

I don't know who you're asking, but yes, I can see how some people might be curious and ask. But, if your're a casual visitor, and every Disney communication to guests describes how to use FP, and it says right on the FP what time to return, and an overhead sign indicates the return time before you even get a FP, I can also see how people would just accept that and go along. They may never have a reason to ask.

 

[magicbob]

The reason for my original post was that I don't think the early-theme-park-opening is a valid comparison to late FP use. It's an apples-to-oranges analogy. Again, this is just my personal opinion.

Not trying to derail this thread, honestly... I'm not.

I think the park entry analogy is valid in comparing that using a FP late was not "abusing the system" because Disney offered this option to us even though the "published policy" was different, just as they allow you to enter earlier than the published park opening time. That's the comparison I was attempting to draw. Just trying to show that not every action that is counter to "published policy" is neccessarily "wrong" to do. The reason for I made this anaolgy in the first place is that the linchpin of some people's arguments was essentially to state that it was not the official policy as published on the website, etc. and not known by the masses, therefore it must be wrong to do.

If someone else reads my analogy and thinks I'm trying to apply it as evidence of something other than that, then I can see how the logic of the analogy COULD fall apart, thus making it invalid in that case. It IS apples to oranges if you're applying it to a different argument than the case being presented.

In conclusion, the analogy in question is both valid and invalid simultaneously (refer to Schroedinger's Cat experiment discussed in the "Large Mystery Box" thread).

I don't know who you're asking, but yes, I can see how some people might be curious and ask. But, if your're a casual visitor, and every Disney communication to guests describes how to use FP, and it says right on the FP what time to return, and an overhead sign indicates the return time before you even get a FP, I can also see how people would just accept that and go along. They may never have a reason to ask.

I agree. The casual visitor did NOT know they could use them late. Heck... many of them still don't realize FP is FREE.

Some people see this as an issue of "fairness." Late FP users MUST have been doing something wrong because others didn't know better and "followed the rules." Was late FP use an "insider secret?" That's debatable. Does that make it wrong? No.

To expand on the Schroedinger's Cat reference, many people here maintain that only a select few "in the know" people took advantage of late FP use. Yet, at the same time, it was SO rampant that it greatly affected their wait in the standby line and this rampant abuse is the sole reason Disney started enforcing the time window. The cat is both alive AND dead.

Now, back to our regularly scheduled programming...

 

[vacationclub]

I still don't understand how it was such a secret. All you had to do was ask any CM what would happen if you were late to your FP time, and they would have told you that FP are good until the end of the day.

I just don't understand how you could not be curious? If you had been to WDW multiple times, why wouldn't you have asked that question? It seems like a pretty logical question to ask.

Why is a logical question to ask? The rules were clearly posted, it leaves no questions. Only if you had a situation where you really needed to be a little late would you even bring yourself to ask a CM about how lenient they are. Then, and only then, would you discover that they tell you that you can actually come as late as you want.

I've never had a reason to suspect that the FP return sign, and the ticket, and the web site, and the TV channel were actually wrong and that I should ask what the "real" rules were.

But then again, I've never had any reason to believe I should ask about other things that may not be enforced as they are published. Should I ask the front desk if check out is really at 6pm and not what's posted on the reservation and the back of the door? Should I ask what the real price is of stuff marked with a price tag? I suppose anything is possible, but what reason would most people have to ask about any of those things?

 

[mesaboy2]

Why is a logical question to ask? The rules were clearly posted, it leaves no questions. Only if you had a situation where you really needed to be a little late would you even bring yourself to ask a CM about how lenient they are. Then, and only then, would you discover that they tell you that you can actually come as late as you want.

You seem to be under the impression this doesn't happen that often. I bet it happens dozens, if not hundreds of times each and every day across WDW. And in each case, I don't think it's unreasonable to assume that the ensuing conversation between late guest and caring and trained CM included (note the past tense ) this little nugget of info.

 

[BNM]

I find it just crazy that someone with hundreds and hundreds of posts on the Dis would NOT have known about the ability to use FP late. Especially if they frequent this board. I found out about it after a couple of days. Almost any thread talking about maximizing your time in the parks mentioned it. And almost every week there has been a thread dedicated to whether or not they had started enforcing the window. So I guess if you diligently avoided all threads mentioning fastpass or touring plans, it's possible you wouldn't have known. But then I think it's safe to say that such a person wasn't as interested in using FP efficiently as they were in other aspects of their vacation. so why would that person care at all?

I didn't know that the shops stayed open after closing until I read about it on the Dis. Too bad, I guess I missed out on those trips. But then, I wasn't interested enough in maximizing shopping time to find out.