Anyone backing out?

[Chris Timpone]

I think a lot of current members aren't saying it isn't a big deal or we wouldn't be disappointed if the benefits were removed for us all tomorrow. What (I think) at least most of us are saying is that we bought because the terms of the actual contract made sense to us financially. We did not rely on any promise of additional benefits to make our decisions as we knew they could disappear or change at a moments notice. They certainly sweetened the deal but we ran the numbers and made sure the contract (which only stipulates access to a timeshare room) would save us money in the long run before committing. Since they aren't part of the contract we aren't "entitled" to them regardless of where we purchased from. Obviously I hope that Disney continues to offer them to entice new owners but I recognize that they are marketing tools and could disappear in an instant. I truly am sorry for those in the midst of a sale who did not realize those benefits could evaporate overnight. Hopefully this will help those currently looking into purchasing DVC to understand that all any of us truly "own" is access to a room at our home resort. Disney could change anything else.
ETA-everybody was speculating about why DVC sent out new member cards this year with a 5 year expiration date and that it must be to prevent those that sell their DVC contract from continuing to reap DVC discounts-however in light of this recent change it seems like it could be so they can choose who is eligible to receive them again in 5 years.

We all ran the numbers which is why we are in contract. The deal worked for us. But mid deal the terms changed. "being a resale owner" Now there is pre 4/4 and post 4/4 resale owners. We were not given this information up front. And since we are post 4/4 they can continue to add to the member perks list in the future leaving us out of other potential items, due to a timing issue out of our control. Bitter, yes. I would feel better if all resales were treated alike. I am ok with change if i had a choice. I was not given a choice.

Somewhat Quote from a podcast. "You buy a condo in a community. With a pool. And you sell it to a new buyer. But after the buyer puts up cash you tell them they can not use the pool. But they are locked in"

 

[DisDadDVC]

We all ran the numbers which is why we are in contract. The deal worked for us. But mid deal the terms changed. "being a resale owner" Now there is pre 4/4 and post 4/4 resale owners. We were not given this information up front. And since we are post 4/4 they can continue to add to the member perks list in the future leaving us out of other potential items, due to a timing issue out of our control. Bitter, yes. I would feel better if all resales were treated alike. I am ok with change if i had a choice. I was not given a choice.

Somewhat Quote from a podcast. "You buy a condo in a community. With a pool. And you sell it to a new buyer. But after the buyer puts up cash you tell them they can not use the pool. But they are locked in"

Those were the terms you agreed to. You just might not have realized it when you agreed. They did not change the deal terms. The deal terms were "we can take this away at any time". That is still the term.

And your condo comparison is not accurate. The pool is not an "ancillary benefit". Just like DVC pools are not. If they said we couldn't use the pool at our home resort, THAT would be a big deal. If they had a condo-wide BBQ night every Sunday, but resale buyers weren't allowed to come, that would be more accurate.

 

[suebeelin]

I would totally back out if I had the option and no penalty.... If only to save some cash on the expected resale market dip.

I would wait a few months, rent in the meantime, and see how the resale market shakes out.

 

[Dean]

This is like anything in life where everyone has different ideas of what's important to them. It's not for any of us to judge what people add as value into their decision to buy DVC resale or direct. If I were learning this just after I made an offer and these perks were important than I would be mad too, and maybe I would be re-considering my decision. When we went through the Disney sales pitch the perks were definitely highlighted to us, and there wasn't even a mention that they would or could be changed. The initial rep used it to try to entice us to buy because we were getting a huge discount on rooms regularly and so the room discount wasn't the be all end all deal for us. Fortunately I read everything and had some experience with timeshares, so I knew better about the perks. Overall I think that there are those that will feel this decreases the value of a resale, and it may cause a slump in the resale market. With all the changes Disney is making I think more and more people are really unhappy and thinking a little more about going to Disney or buying into DVC. In time everyone will settle down and life will move on. For now there are those of us that don't care and will still go!

We all ran the numbers which is why we are in contract. The deal worked for us. But mid deal the terms changed. "being a resale owner" Now there is pre 4/4 and post 4/4 resale owners. We were not given this information up front. And since we are post 4/4 they can continue to add to the member perks list in the future leaving us out of other potential items, due to a timing issue out of our control. Bitter, yes. I would feel better if all resales were treated alike. I am ok with change if i had a choice. I was not given a choice.

Somewhat Quote from a podcast. "You buy a condo in a community. With a pool. And you sell it to a new buyer. But after the buyer puts up cash you tell them they can not use the pool. But they are locked in"

I'll say again, anyone buying resale either knew or should have known changes could happen and that they had happened before. I think that is absolute and transcends personal preferences. So the terms didn't really change in a sense and the risks certainly didn't. This isn't loss of a pool but in the condo example, being denied a discount to the onsite restaurant.

 

[Chris Timpone]

Those were the terms you agreed to. You just might not have realized it when you agreed. They did not change the deal terms. The deal terms were "we can take this away at any time". That is still the term.

And your condo comparison is not accurate. The pool is not an "ancillary benefit". Just like DVC pools are not. If they said we couldn't use the pool at our home resort, THAT would be a big deal. If they had a condo-wide BBQ night every Sunday, but resale buyers weren't allowed to come, that would be more accurate.

Don't get me wrong. I am buying for the points. Just if i was 2 weeks earlier I would be pre 4/4. I do not need the perks they are taking away. But I am sure that list will change for us post'ers only going forward.

 

[gharter]

Don't get me wrong. I am buying for the points. Just if i was 2 weeks earlier I would be pre 4/4. I do not need the perks they are taking away. But I am sure that list will change for us post'ers only going forward.

I'm still new to this. But my understanding is each time they "change the rules", everyone before that date is grandfathered in. So if you buy today, under the new rules, you should not be affected by the next changes (at least that appears to be true historically). With what we signed, Disney could potentially take away any perks they wish in the future.

 

[LAMickey14]

Where do people have the idea that resale prior to 4/6 is grandfathered in? It does not exactly read that way in this document at all that i see.

Have to agree this document does not say resales are grandfathered in. And I also called and was told the same thing. Do not know who the letter is from that others are talking about grandfathered in.

 

[DisDadDVC]

Have to agree this document does not say resales are grandfathered in. And I also called and was told the same thing. Do not know who the letter is from that others are talking about grandfathered in.

http://www.themainstreetmouse.com/2...s-major-perks-change-for-those-buying-resale/

Please know that as a current Disney Vacation Club Member (regardless of when or where you bought your membership), your access to Disney Differences and these additional Membership Extras will not be affected by this policy change

 

[gharter]

Have to agree this document does not say resales are grandfathered in. And I also called and was told the same thing. Do not know who the letter is from that others are talking about grandfathered in.

Per the announcement that is posted on the DVC members site:


Now, effective April 4, 2016, Members who do not

purchase their ownership interest directly from Disney Vacation Club will not have access to other

Membership Extras, such as exclusive Member experiences and discounts. Please know that as a


current Disney Vacation Club Member (regardless of when or where you bought your membership),

your access to Disney Differences and these additional Membership Extras will not be affected by this

policy change.

The bolding is Disney, not mine.
This seems very clear, that if you are a member before April 4, 2016, you do not lose any of the perks mentioned. The gray area is where they draw the line. Submitted or ROFR, passed ROFR, closed, recorded, etc? From many posts, this line still seems cloudy.

 

[LAMickey14]

http://www.themainstreetmouse.com/2...s-major-perks-change-for-those-buying-resale/

Please know that as a current Disney Vacation Club Member (regardless of when or where you bought your membership), your access to Disney Differences and these additional Membership Extras will not be affected by this policy change

Then they need to update their document to say that because it does not.

 

[LAMickey14]

Per the announcement that is posted on the DVC members site:


Now, effective April 4, 2016, Members who do not

purchase their ownership interest directly from Disney Vacation Club will not have access to other

Membership Extras, such as exclusive Member experiences and discounts. Please know that as a


current Disney Vacation Club Member (regardless of when or where you bought your membership),

your access to Disney Differences and these additional Membership Extras will not be affected by this

policy change.

The bolding is Disney, not mine.
This seems very clear, that if you are a member before April 4, 2016, you do not lose any of the perks mentioned. The gray area is where they draw the line. Submitted or ROFR, passed ROFR, closed, recorded, etc? From many posts, this line still seems cloudy.

They need to update their doucment, because it does not say that.

 

[hopeful4fl]

Ladies and Gentlemen,
Calm down. Let's do the math. An average contract buyer may go in for 160 points (which I think a family of 4 may want to buy in as). With current rates today for resorts like SSR, AKV, that is a saving of about $9,000.

Assuming you plan to go as a family of 4, you would lose about $400 annually in Annual pass discounts.
Assuming you buy RACK RATE made in China junk that is super over inflated in Disney stores (as opposed to buying the same from a Disney outlet before you go to Disney), and spend $400, you lose about $40 in savings.
It would take you over 20 years to come close to making up the diff in buying resale, without even considering any compounding on the original saving.

PLEASE note I am not saying this does not dilute the value proposition for resale after 4/6. The point is, it is STILL a huge saving from buying direct. I do not know why Disney is thinking this will deter resale. Unless....... people impulse buy a lot. Surely they do not

 

[gr8tdame]

I wonder how much my fellow resale owners would pay per point to "turn them into retail"? DVD will never do it, but it would be pure profit to them beyond the cost of the "Membership Magic" stuff. $25 per point? I like to say I wouldn't care at all, but I know for sure I would do it for $5, but not for $50.

I would have bought direct from Disney but they did not have the inventory for the home resorts I was interested in purchasing. (BCV, BWV or AKL) It would have saved the ROFR wait .

 

[linzjane88]

You clearly have this perception that perks and benefits shouldn't be a factor at all and that we should all just be happy with what we bought. The rules changed the other day for people that were in the middle of a transaction, so they aren't getting what they thought they bought. Now maybe they should still proceed and that is the right decision for them, but that is their decision alone to make. So to make comments like you did in this thread is not fair in my opinion. A DVC AP could save a family $800 a year in ticket costs.....that isn't insignificant. Could it disappear next year as a perk to everyone, sure.....but prior to this change it was part of the equation.

You have your points to book a room and as an honorary Half Member, Disney doesn't punch you in the face at every resort check in . What more could you possibly want from your thirty thousand dollar purchase?

(said in jest from a fellow Half Member who closes 4/14)

 

[freediverdude]

That letter could be taken a different way, depending on how DVC defines the term "member". But I agree, it probably means everyone who owned before 4/4.

 

[Dean]

I'm still new to this. But my understanding is each time they "change the rules", everyone before that date is grandfathered in. So if you buy today, under the new rules, you should not be affected by the next changes (at least that appears to be true historically). With what we signed, Disney could potentially take away any perks they wish in the future.

So far they have but there's no legal requirement that they would need to going forward.

They need to update their doucment, because it does not say that.

It wouldn't matter, they could change it at any time. This is not part of the POS or contract.

 

[boxer11]

A few thoughts I have:

1). The primary purpose of DVC is to have access to deluxe level accommodations in multiple sizes at a discounted rate over the rack rate.

2). Disney clearly advertises that all perks are never guaranteed and the only thing you are "entitled" to are the actual real estate holding/points.

3). Disney could yank these benefits from everyone at anytime if they so choose... As a result if you purchase DVC for the perks alone, then you shouldn't have purchased. Yes it is nice to have but you need to remember it is a business which wil do what it must.

4). I'm currently involved in my resale purchase and my broker has reached out the the higher ups at DVC. They have explained that any contract that was received by 4/3 at their offices will be grandfathered to the old policy and entitled to all of these benefits.

5) DVC needs a new lawyer to review their policy statements since their statement, policy, and letter all seem to have contradictory terms....

Again, I didn't purchase this because I can get a small discount on a pass or dining... I wanted access to a discounted room going forward while Disney is constantly raising prices... If I get some extras then great... If
Your that worried, do a resale and but a 25 point add on... Problem solved....

We all ran the numbers which is why we are in contract. The deal worked for us. But mid deal the terms changed. "being a resale owner" Now there is pre 4/4 and post 4/4 resale owners. We were not given this information up front. And since we are post 4/4 they can continue to add to the member perks list in the future leaving us out of other potential items, due to a timing issue out of our control. Bitter, yes. I would feel better if all resales were treated alike. I am ok with change if i had a choice. I was not given a choice.

Somewhat Quote from a podcast. "You buy a condo in a community. With a pool. And you sell it to a new buyer. But after the buyer puts up cash you tell them they can not use the pool. But they are locked in"

I'm in the same boat as you and agree. When the resale brokers asked Disney to clarify "Anytime" they originally stated "Contracts under our review (ROFR)" then changed it the next day. I did all the research and ran all the numbers and it made since and still makes since to buy a resale contract. I notice a few of the same people on these boards keep posting the same message. They will inform you "perks are perks and can go away at anytime", "Your contract says perks can be taken away at anytime", and "You are just purchasing a room discount". Yes, we did our research and understand. The way I see it Disney will take all perks away from DVC members and make them an add-on cost in about 3 years or less. I see Disney selling a Member Perk Card to current members in this time and giving it as a "perk" to new direct buyers. Disney has just set the stage for this move. Sorry, back to the topic of this thread Anyone Backing Out?

 

[lovin'fl]

Ladies and Gentlemen,
Calm down. Let's do the math. An average contract buyer may go in for 160 points (which I think a family of 4 may want to buy in as). With current rates today for resorts like SSR, AKV, that is a saving of about $9,000.

Assuming you plan to go as a family of 4, you would lose about $400 annually in Annual pass discounts.
Assuming you buy RACK RATE made in China junk that is super over inflated in Disney stores (as opposed to buying the same from a Disney outlet before you go to Disney), and spend $400, you lose about $40 in savings.
It would take you over 20 years to come close to making up the diff in buying resale, without even considering any compounding on the original saving.

PLEASE note I am not saying this does not dilute the value proposition for resale after 4/6. The point is, it is STILL a huge saving from buying direct. I do not know why Disney is thinking this will deter resale. Unless....... people impulse buy a lot. Surely they do not

The non-DVC/FL resident AP is the Platinum at $750pp. The cheapest DVC is the Gold at $550pp...that's $200 difference per person and I am a family of 5 Disney adults...so for us it's a $1000/year difference. Then we'd get TIW card to save 20% and we do 1-2 TS per day on our trips...with an AP we do about 12-16 days in that year...so, say, 14 TS meals for 5 Disney adults at 20% off ( good $400-500 in savings at least)...that's big. Luckily we are grandfathered...but if I were just waiting for my first contract via resale and this happened to me I would be beyond TICKED off.

 

[dvcdream4fld]

For a large frugal DVC resale buyer, an annual pass discount does matter. Resale allows me to take my whole family at a discounted rate and hotel. DVC says buy our timeshare it gives large families space and now it is less affordable for those same families. I'll say it again, although DVD has ROFR to inflate resale, the economics of devaluing resale also devalues retail.

 

[lovin'fl]

Have to agree this document does not say resales are grandfathered in. And I also called and was told the same thing. Do not know who the letter is from that others are talking about grandfathered in.

Well I am now glad that we added on 55 BWV direct to our June membership and then 25 BWV direct to our Aug membership. I was really regretting that (that we didn't just wait on WL for that other 25 for June) but now it looks like it may have helped us...if resales prior to 4/4/16 are NOT grandfathered (because both my June and Aug had all resales prior to adding the BWV direct).