Air Canada cutting 2,000 jobs, trimming capacity

[declansdad]

I think one reason for the higher fares on Air Canada is because their main competition is WestJet, plus the fact that they fly to more locations. Let's not forget unlike in the United States there are more Airlines like United, American, Delta, US Airways, Southwest and JetBlue, so Americans would have more options in terms of who they want to fly with.

I agree, a large part of the high fares is the lack of competition.

 

[nflder]

You make some very good points but the sad truth for AC is that the average fare is higher than most Canadians can afford. I think they are in for more trouble before things get any better.

Is it AC's airfare or is it the fees, taxes and surcharges? We just booked two aeroplan tickets to Orlando for next April. In my mind, these are "free" tickets. With the taxes, surcharges and fees our "free" ticket ended up costing us $174 each. Most of the fees, from what I could see were government based i.e. airport security fee and 9/11 fee. Now there were also fuel surcharges and airport improvement fees as well as about 10 other ones that I can't remember!!!

 

[SAGE]

Is it AC's airfare or is it the fees, taxes and surcharges? We just booked two aeroplan tickets to Orlando for next April. In my mind, these are "free" tickets. With the taxes, surcharges and fees our "free" ticket ended up costing us $174 each. Most of the fees, from what I could see were government based i.e. airport security fee and 9/11 fee. Now there were also fuel surcharges and airport improvement fees as well as about 10 other ones that I can't remember!!!

It's the fees, taxes etc that has me using BUF airport.
I've flown AC & West jet and would happily do so again - however the extra fees/costs have to be lowered.

 

[cey]

MY DH and I stopped flying AC several years ago after a number of experiences of poor customer service which were inexcusable. We have a choice and take advantage of flying out of SYR yearly. The AC customers that have my sympathy are the ones that don't have an airline choice. They live in smaller communities which only AC/Jazz service! No Westjet service! Last year I had my parents travel by train to TO, and they flew direct from Toronto to Kelowna on WestJet and raved at how they found that airline more efficient, economical, excellent customer service etc. Even though they are in their 80's they are willing to go this route rather than deal with multiple (4+) flights with AC to fly from their home town. Last AC flight had them almost stranded in Vancouver overnight due to AC incompetence.
Air Canada has proven time and time again that their focus is not on providing good customer service and I haven't even vented about their prices!

 

[declansdad]

Is it AC's airfare or is it the fees, taxes and surcharges? We just booked two aeroplan tickets to Orlando for next April. In my mind, these are "free" tickets. With the taxes, surcharges and fees our "free" ticket ended up costing us $174 each. Most of the fees, from what I could see were government based i.e. airport security fee and 9/11 fee. Now there were also fuel surcharges and airport improvement fees as well as about 10 other ones that I can't remember!!!

I just did a quick check on a flight from St John's to Orlando for next April and the total cost would be about $1000. The fees are annoying but the fares are still pretty high.

 

[nflder]

I just did a quick check on a flight from St John's to Orlando for next April and the total cost would be about $1000. The fees are annoying but the fares are still pretty high.

It would cost the same amount of money to fly on WJ as well. The cheapest we could fly to Florida is on a seatsale but even then our tickets are still $600 each. That's why we book 11 months in advance with aeroplan every other year!!!

 

[wee-haggis]

Its the taxes and fees for sure. If our fees were the same as flying out of US, then AC and WJ would be close to being on an equal playing field.
Then again (fuel hedging aside),how does SWA still manage to do cross country flights at relatively low rates (Compared to YYZ to Vancouver for example) and still be the highest profit making company in North America?

 

[bavaria]

Lower cost staff, short gate turnaround time, lack of union involvement, no hub/spoke route system, release schedule short term, light frequent flyer system, no international routes, no elite lounges, etc

SW has a lot of fans here, but on many routes their fares are actually about equal to the legacy carriers

 

[minnie56]

Its the taxes and fees for sure. If our fees were the same as flying out of US, then AC and WJ would be close to being on an equal playing field.
Then again (fuel hedging aside),how does SWA still manage to do cross country flights at relatively low rates (Compared to YYZ to Vancouver for example) and still be the highest profit making company in North America?

Must still be the taxes don't you think? We have them---they really don't..or very little!

 

[F4disneyfan]

Well I guess customers of AC can expect even higher fares and even less customer service if that is at all possible.

 

[nflder]

The wierd thing about AC service, it varies. Last year when we were flying out of St. John's all of the flights for the day were cancelled due to fog (what a surprise!) The agent we had in St. John's initally told us the earliest we could get to Orlando was Sunday, our flight was cancelled on Wednesday! Needless to say we weren't happy campers but didn't get angry. We asked her to try to find another solution for us. She worked on it for about 45 minutes and was finally able to book us on a flight out of Deer Lake for Thursday. Deer Lake is about a 6 hour drive from St. John's - the agent was very helpful and friendly. We took the flight out of Deer Lake because we didn't want to lose four days of our vacation. To make a long story short, on Thursday we ended up missing our connector flight out of Toronto to Orlando and the agent there was able to book us on the last flight out of Toronto for Orlando (we took the last three seats). Instead of one day to get to Orlando - it took us almost 3 days. We arrived in Orlando 3:00 am Friday morning. Everyone we encountered on our trip down went out of their way to help us out. And we were very appreciative.

On the flip side of this, on our way back we found the agents we dealt with a bit rude when we asked simple questions. So overall - big problems they were great, little issues they weren't the best.

 

[minnie56]

The wierd thing about AC service, it varies. Last year when we were flying out of St. John's all of the flights for the day were cancelled due to fog (what a surprise!) The agent we had in St. John's initally told us the earliest we could get to Orlando was Sunday, our flight was cancelled on Wednesday! Needless to say we weren't happy campers but didn't get angry. We asked her to try to find another solution for us. She worked on it for about 45 minutes and was finally able to book us on a flight out of Deer Lake for Thursday. Deer Lake is about a 6 hour drive from St. John's - the agent was very helpful and friendly. We took the flight out of Deer Lake because we didn't want to lose four days of our vacation. To make a long story short, on Thursday we ended up missing our connector flight out of Toronto to Orlando and the agent there was able to book us on the last flight out of Toronto for Orlando (we took the last three seats). Instead of one day to get to Orlando - it took us almost 3 days. We arrived in Orlando 3:00 am Friday morning. Everyone we encountered on our trip down went out of their way to help us out. And we were very appreciative.

On the flip side of this, on our way back we found the agents we dealt with a bit rude when we asked simple questions. So overall - big problems they were great, little issues they weren't the best.

It does indeed vary greatly flight to flight and of course, customer service should be standard throughout. We flew to Aberdeen, Scotland last November and had an exemplary flight both ways. We were upgraded to Executive Class on the outbound flight which was heaven but both ways, the service and flight was flawless. Doesn't happen all the time I realize!

 

[digskat]

Between taxes, additional fuel costs and AC's near monopoly on Canadian flights.....it isn't surprising that AC is so much more expensive. It is the same with liquor, the LCBO has the monopoly in Ontario, and that with the ridiculous taxes on it, has the cost more than double the cost in Michigan, on the same bottle of rye. Brewers Retail has a near monopoly on beer sales, so a 12 Blue is $10-12 in Michigan............$18-20 here.

 

[minnie56]

Guess they get us coming and going!

 

[drag n' fly]

I am sticking with drag n' fly's conspiracy theory it appears WJ may have hedged their fuel. Their is so many Oil and Gas investors in the airline that it may have made an arrangement for private fuel costs which of course is passed partially onto the customer when they have one of their token "seat sales" That's what they are calling it these days AC on the other hand is seen as a top heavy, bloated, eastern run conglomerate out here...no deals there sir

 

[minnie56]

I am sticking with drag n' fly's conspiracy theory it appears WJ may have hedged their fuel. Their is so many Oil and Gas investors in the airline that it may have made an arrangement for private fuel costs which of course is passed partially onto the customer when they have one of their token "seat sales" That's what they are calling it these days AC on the other hand is seen as a top heavy, bloated, eastern run conglomerate out here...no deals there sir

AC hedge their fuel as well...

 

[drag n' fly]

What I am curious though is it at the same price as WJ?

 

[minnie56]

What I am curious though is it at the same price as WJ?

I could have told you 3 days ago the exact amount per barrel that they locked in at last time ..but with the fast-fading memory, I have forgotten!

 

[drag n' fly]

It would be interesting to know that. SW has definitely gotten the advantage on fuel hedging it would be interesting see what the Canadian airlines did Conspiracies don't always include hard cold facts!

 

[minnie56]

We were with our friends Sat nite for dinner--he of 'Air Canada' so I got some goods, but remembering them, WHOLE other story!

He said what they last paid per barrel...gone-poof
He had just flown back from LHR-YVR then home to here. Landing fees at Vancouver I 'think' he said $8,000 ..fuel used to get there approx $84,000 ..he told me the amount..gone-poof....and 284 passengers onboard. I figured an average of $1,000 per pax..likely half of which is taxes. Then there's the fuel--landing fees--crew payroll-ground staff-maintenance and on and on and on..

Didn't seem such a mega-profit at the end of the day..