A Little Advice needed... UPDATE pg 6

[jen0610]

I understand your feelings, but I'm going to play devil's advocate.

Is your SIL uncomfortable for any reason at your mother's house? Or, does SIL have an elderly grandparent where this could be the last Christmas with them? The latter reason is the reason why we always do Christmas with my family and not DH's. (That and it costs a fortune to fly to Wichita, KS)

I really do understand how you feel. And generally I believe in trying to split holiday's between families. However, some people are just more comfortable in certain situations. I think my DH is actually more comfortable at my parent's house than his own. Maybe because we spend more time there, I don't know.

Have you thought of inviting SIL's family to Thanksgiving or Xmas at your parent's house? If you all get along really well, it could be loads of fun!

All that said, I think that someone should broach the topic with your brother. If it's causing this much heartache, it's definitely not something to let fester. I'm sure your brother doesn't mean to upset anyone.

For your bold part, I don't play that card EVER. Anybody, at any time can pass away. Just because your elderly doesn't trump everybody else's live. I could be gone today by an accident. DH's 80 year old parents could pass away, tonight for old age. You don't ever know. And I personnally know of 3 different families - the wives actually - that have pulled that Granny hasn't been well for several years at the holiday that they are to spend at the other families side. I've told 2 of them, they are selfish and I don't want to hear one word outta them about how selfish their kids are, when they are setting the example from which the kids learned this trait. Once someone pointed it out to them, the finally saw the light and changed their ways. The other one, after the 3rd attempt, hubby set her straight, that is Granny needed her sooo badly, that was fine, but he and the kids would be going to meet the needs of their other Granny.

For the OP, talk to your brother. Let him know what your mother is feeling. It will be up to him to heal the damage that he has caused.

 

[jen0610]

I'll bet cash money that next year when it's the wife's turn to spend Christmas with HER parents, they don't catch a 7:00 a.m. Christmas morning flight to your mom's house in Florida. Hide and watch.

In fact, why don't you run that one by your brother and see how it flies? Fair is fair.....

To cut to the chase, your SIL wants to spend Christmas with HER family and she's staying until the early morning hours of Dec. 25 so she meet the "letter of the law" and will be able to say, "We DID spend Christmas with your family dear, just like we promised!" Technically, they did. But anyone with two working brain cells would know this was NOT what was understood. Your parents (rightly) expected the same sort of visit her parents have gotten year after year after year, and they have instead been diddled over. Either your brother's going along with it to keep the peace with his wife or he's clueless as all get out. I'd enlighten him, but I'm like that.

And I wouldn't pussyfoot. I'd say, "Of course, Mom and Dad were expecting you to stay for longer than sunrise on Christmas morning. Have you EVER left your IL's house at that hour on Christmas Day? No. It seems like your family is flying out as early as you can so you can make it to WI in time to spend Christmas Day with your in-laws yet again and no duh, that has Mom in tears. There is no way in *&%^ you'd leave WI at 7:00 a.m. on Christmas Day to get to FL and we both know it. Mom and Dad have dreamed of this visit for an entire year and they have been shortchanged, no two ways about it. Is this the way it's going to be every other year? Mom and Dad get a few days and then you rush off to spend Christmas in WI? Because that really isn't spending every other Christmas with them. If you're not going to spend the holidays with them, just be honest and don't get their hopes up again. This has hurt them too much."

I really like YOU!!!! Tell it like it is.

 

[luvsJack]

Why is everyone fixated on the date?

Christmas can be celebrated on any day and that is what happens when people marry-she wants to see her family too & grandma is spending 10 days alone with her grandchild!

If, for the past year, plans had been being made to spend the 10 prior to Christmas day with his family then all would be fine. That is not the case. The lady's son KNEW that she was planning on spending Christmas with them. Christmas is Dec. 25th; if they wanted to celebrate Christmas another day then they should have made that clear not just assumed everyone would adjust to their plans.

Compromise is what happens when people marry (or at least it should). The compromise was made last year to spend Christmas with her family, this year should be with his--NOT split between the two. And spending the holidays with his family should not mean grandma is babysitting while trying to get ready for Christmas.

 

[sbell111]

If this thread was about how the two sets of inlaws were pressuring a poster to rearrange thier vacation time around their desires, the majority of replies would be advising the poster to spend their vacation however they want and not allow others to guilt them into anything. However, since this thread is about a poster who wishes to bend the vacation of relatives to her whim, the advise is the complete opposite.

Disboard people are funny.

 

[cats mom]

If this thread was about how the two sets of inlaws were pressuring a poster to rearrange thier vacation time around their desires, the majority of replies would be advising the poster to spend their vacation however they want and not allow others to guilt them into anything. However, since this thread is about a poster who wishes to bend the vacation of relatives to her whim, the advise is the complete opposite.

Disboard people are funny.

Yes, if that's what this thread was about, you're probably right. But that's not what this thread is about.

This thread is about the OP's brother and SIL agreeing to split holiday's... one year in WI, the next in FL. They seem to be able to handle the WI part of the deal just fine. But the first year for spending the holiday in FL, they fly out at 7am Christmas morning so they can be in WI in time for Christmas dinner.

Why is everyone fixated on the date?

Christmas can be celebrated on any day and that is what happens when people marry-she wants to see her family too & grandma is spending 10 days alone with her grandchild!

Everyone is fixated on the date because the agreement was to split the holidays; one year in WI, the next in FL. The actual travel plans are more about throwing a bone to the OP's family while spending the holidays in WI, just like every other year.


From the OP:

BACKGROUND: DBrother and SIL have been together for 6 yrs now. Ever since they stated dating they would fly to Wisconsin to see her family for Christmas and New Years. No big deal. After DNephew was born my mom asked if Holidays could now be split (one year WI and one year FL) so that they could have time to see DN for the holidays. DB and SIL agreed. DN's first christmas and new years was spent in WI and this year DB was supposedly flying down to FL.

 

[sbell111]

Yes, if that's what this thread was about, you're probably right. But that's not what this thread is about.

This thread is about the OP's brother and SIL agreeing to split holiday's... one year in WI, the next in FL. They seem to be able to handle the WI part of the deal just fine. But the first year for spending the holiday in FL, they fly out at 7am Christmas morning so they can be in WI in time for Christmas dinner.

Still, they will have a nice visit during the Christmas holiday season.

It is their vacation to do with as they wish.

 

[luvsJack]

Still, they will have a nice visit during the Christmas holiday season.

It is their vacation to do with as they wish.

But he should not have let his Mom continue planning on being with them for Christmas (as in Christmas Day) and not said a word about different plans. Not being there Christmas Day would be ok if they had made that clear from the start.

He needs to at least know that he has hurt his Mother. He really may not realize that it is a big deal. He may really think that this is easier because he is doing what his wife wants and its not that big a deal to his family.

 

[sbell111]

But he should not have let his Mom continue planning on being with them for Christmas (as in Christmas Day) and not said a word about different plans. Not being there Christmas Day would be ok if they had made that clear from the start. ...

Something tells me that neither side properly communicated their plans.

 

[Mouse House Mama]

I'll bet cash money that next year when it's the wife's turn to spend Christmas with HER parents, they don't catch a 7:00 a.m. Christmas morning flight to your mom's house in Florida. Hide and watch.

In fact, why don't you run that one by your brother and see how it flies? Fair is fair.....

To cut to the chase, your SIL wants to spend Christmas with HER family and she's staying until the early morning hours of Dec. 25 so she meet the "letter of the law" and will be able to say, "We DID spend Christmas with your family dear, just like we promised!" Technically, they did. But anyone with two working brain cells would know this was NOT what was understood. Your parents (rightly) expected the same sort of visit her parents have gotten year after year after year, and they have instead been diddled over. Either your brother's going along with it to keep the peace with his wife or he's clueless as all get out. I'd enlighten him, but I'm like that.

And I wouldn't pussyfoot. I'd say, "Of course, Mom and Dad were expecting you to stay for longer than sunrise on Christmas morning. Have you EVER left your IL's house at that hour on Christmas Day? No. It seems like your family is flying out as early as you can so you can make it to WI in time to spend Christmas Day with your in-laws yet again and no duh, that has Mom in tears. There is no way in *&%^ you'd leave WI at 7:00 a.m. on Christmas Day to get to FL and we both know it. Mom and Dad have dreamed of this visit for an entire year and they have been shortchanged, no two ways about it. Is this the way it's going to be every other year? Mom and Dad get a few days and then you rush off to spend Christmas in WI? Because that really isn't spending every other Christmas with them. If you're not going to spend the holidays with them, just be honest and don't get their hopes up again. This has hurt them too much."

Amen!
This is exactly what I would do. Then again, my sister and I rarely keep our feelings to ourselves when it comes to each other. I think your brother is being terribly rude and is completely wrong. Even if he doesn't want to see your parents for the holiday he should buck up and say so. Playing this game is cruel and mean.

 

[Nom]

Maybe a little OT, but does anyone think it is strange that the DB and SIL are dumping the child with grandparents that it sounds like he doesn't even really know for 10 days? My daughter would be scared and sad to be with people who are relatively strangers for that long.

That being said, I agree, OP should call DB ASAP and explain her feelings calmly. My ex-husband is like the OP's DB: prefers email to phone. However, I still call him to talk live about issues that have the potential of being volatile, because things tend to escalate in emails very quickly.

OP, I hope you call, and if so, let us know how it goes!!

 

[KandD]

Typically I think that holidays should be spent whereever you feel comfortable despite everyone else's feelings and that holidays don't have to be celebrated ON the actual holiday. But in this situation I feel that the DB and DSIL are being unfair. OP and her family have thought for the past year that they would be spending the actual holidays with the DB and his family. If they had known before now maybe they would have invited the SIL's family or the OP could have switched her schedule or at the very least, not have had such high expectations.
OP I do think that you need to speak to your brother about this. If it were me I would want to do it right away but the logical part of me is telling me that nothing is going to change so maybe talk to him after the holidays and tell him how hurt your mom was and how disapointed you were. Is this your mom's first grandchild? If so I am sure that only makes it worse for her.

 

[kafitty]

Really?
Most young people make plans with friends for New Years.

true, but it's still considered part of the holidays! Just 'cause i party with my friends on July 4th, doesn't make THAT any less of a holiday, right?
And, considering DB & SIL have spent Christmas and New Years with her family in WI, then i would think that is what they consider "the holidays."

As I posted before-its OP's extremely busy schedule that is causing the family not to get together-the blame should not be put on the brother.

Unfortunately, yes the OP has an extremely demanding schedule. However - Mom was told one thing, and now brother is saying something completely different. UM, HECK YES, he deserves the blame.

The cheaper flights excuse would fly with me, if they were flying home, but they're not, they're flying to WI to be with SIL's family. (OP states they've flown every year to see SIL's parents, which means they don't live close by.)

What gets me about this is that there are so many threads on here about parenting and how children are out of control. Well it's no wonder! If we can't ever tell someone they've done something wrong because they might feel guilty . DB has done wrong, he should feel guilty. If he didn't plan on alternating holidays he shouldn't have said he would, period. They aren't flying out to go home and save money on flights, they are flying out to see her family and then they'll fly from there home.

Did it ever occur to anyone that the only reason he'd feel guilty, is if he is "guilty"? My DM is a master manipulator and tries to pull guilt trips all the time, but I've never felt guilty for something that I knew was right. If your DB feels he is right in doing this, he won't feel guilty. If he knows he's been a deceitful little ****** he'll feel guilty.

But I like the plan of people can just do whatever they want and no one should ever say anything about it because then the person might feel guilty. I think we should all just forget how our actions affect others and only think about ourselves. Judging by this thread the people that we hurt can just deal with it and no one will ever call us on it and we won't have to deal with any of that nasty guilt stuff

seriously...awww people have to man up when they've screwed someone else over, poor them!

 

[Kika]

I haven't read all the replies, but I can see why you and your mom would be hurt over this. I think I would be, too. I would call your brother. Do they have a non-refundable flight? It will most likely cost them some $ to change it. If it were my brother, I would be honest w/him and tell him how you feel (and how sad your mom was about it).

 

[luvsJack]

]Maybe a little OT, but does anyone think it is strange that the DB and SIL are dumping the child with grandparents that it sounds like he doesn't even really know for 10 days? My daughter would be scared and sad to be with people who are relatively strangers for that long.
[/B]
That being said, I agree, OP should call DB ASAP and explain her feelings calmly. My ex-husband is like the OP's DB: prefers email to phone. However, I still call him to talk live about issues that have the potential of being volatile, because things tend to escalate in emails very quickly.

OP, I hope you call, and if so, let us know how it goes!!

I thought that same thing. It would be very hard on the child being with someone he doesn't know and it may be hard on the OP's mom because she doesn't know her grandson. It helps when caring for a child to know their likes and dislikes, what makes them cry, etc. I wouldn't have just left my child like that, I would have wanted to be with him while he got to know his grandma.

 

[chicagoshannon]

I'd call your brother and tell him I'm sorry he isn't able to spend this years Christmas and New Years with your family but that you're really looking forward to spending next year with them since they said they'd be alternating.

 

[scottishduffy]

So I spoke with DB.

I first called Mom to let her know that I intended to speak with Bro and ran my little speech by her. She did not want to be the evil MIL to give him and SIL the talk, but approved of my doing so.

I took a long time to think of what to say. I told him that we had all been under the impression he would be spending Christmas here in FL. I told him how excited Mom had been, how she had been planning Christmas dinner for months, and other plans she had. I let him know that both her and I felt upset as we felt as if he did not wish to spend holidays with us. We told him we didn't just want to see the baby, we wanted to spend time with all of them because we love them. He basically "Uh-huh"ed and "OK"ed me through the whole conversation. I let him know that we all felt hurt, but most especially mom. Pretty much no impact there.


On the upside his flight reservation now has him flying out at 2:00 pm on Christmas Day as opposed to 8:00 am. He says it was a computer glitch . I will not get to see DB or SIL at all. But at least Mom will get to have a Christmas Morning and Christmas breakfast before they leave. It is slightly better. I am glad that at least Mom and Dad can have a little of christmas day before taking them to the airport.

I will make a special trip to come home early from the wedding on 13th to spend an evening with Nephew. Since DB and SIL will be on vacation I wont get to see them at all. Oh well, I will have to make it out to their home state again some time next year.

Everyone is still pretty hurt that the original promise of spending the holidays here was broken. But we will all make the best of the few days we have with DB and SIL. Mom will change her big dinner to Christmas Eve and Gramma will come by earlier as well. No family photo, but what can we do? Mom will have the photographer come early to take a photo of the people there as we want to get a nice photo of my grandmother with her 1st great-grandchild.

 

[ReneeA]

I guess based on this thread I am a rotton daughter...we NEVER spend Christmas with my family anymore. We used to split it up - one Christmas with DH's family and then the next with mine since my family lives 300 miles away. Then I had the kids. I believe that it's best to be in our home for the holiday - Santa visits, there's too much stuff to haul back and forth, and there's way too much chaos without also throwing in "sleeping in another bed not their own". So, my DH's family gets to spend every holiday with us since they live near us.

My family knows that we will try and get there shortly after Christmas, we'll stay for 5+ days and we'll celebrate with them at that time. I've gotten a few snide comments here and there, but it's been 7 years now and I guess they've gotten used to it.

I don't think it's right that they are going back on their word, but I don't think it should be all about THAT day...10+ days is a long time to spend and celebrating can be done while they're there.

 

[diznygirl]

I guess based on this thread I am a rotton daughter...we NEVER spend Christmas with my family anymore. We used to split it up - one Christmas with DH's family and then the next with mine since my family lives 300 miles away. Then I had the kids. I believe that it's best to be in our home for the holiday - Santa visits, there's too much stuff to haul back and forth, and there's way too much chaos without also throwing in "sleeping in another bed not their own". So, my DH's family gets to spend every holiday with us since they live near us.

My family knows that we will try and get there shortly after Christmas, we'll stay for 5+ days and we'll celebrate with them at that time. I've gotten a few snide comments here and there, but it's been 7 years now and I guess they've gotten used to it.

I don't think it's right that they are going back on their word, but I don't think it should be all about THAT day...10+ days is a long time to spend and celebrating can be done while they're there.

I don't think you read the whole post. The nephew will be there the whole 10 days being babysat by Grandma while the B and SIL are out hiking. They will be there three days.

I agree it doesn't have to be all about the day, but saying you are coming for Christmas is different than coming for Christmas and heading for the airport at noon. At least in my book.

 

[ReneeA]

I don't think you read the whole post. The nephew will be there the whole 10 days being babysat by Grandma while the B and SIL are out hiking. They will be there three days.

I agree it doesn't have to be all about the day, but saying you are coming for Christmas is different than coming for Christmas and heading for the airport at noon. At least in my book.

I did read the whole post. If grandma doesn't want to babysit (and that does not seem to be the case at all) then she shouldn't babysit. 3 days together as a family is lots of time in my book to celebrate the holidays. Pick a day, have a dinner, play the music, open the gifts. It doesn't need to be done on Dec 24th or 25th IMO.

The family was under the impression that they would be there ON Christmas, and now feelings are hurt. I get that. I also think that it was rotton if it was done on purpose. It could also be just a misunderstanding. DB and his wife could have been thinking that Grandma getting to spend quality time with DGS alone and then some family time together to celebrate would be great.

 

[robinb]

So I spoke with DB.

I first called Mom to let her know that I intended to speak with Bro and ran my little speech by her. She did not want to be the evil MIL to give him and SIL the talk, but approved of my doing so.

I took a long time to think of what to say. I told him that we had all been under the impression he would be spending Christmas here in FL. I told him how excited Mom had been, how she had been planning Christmas dinner for months, and other plans she had. I let him know that both her and I felt upset as we felt as if he did not wish to spend holidays with us. We told him we didn't just want to see the baby, we wanted to spend time with all of them because we love them. He basically "Uh-huh"ed and "OK"ed me through the whole conversation. I let him know that we all felt hurt, but most especially mom. Pretty much no impact there.


On the upside his flight reservation now has him flying out at 2:00 pm on Christmas Day as opposed to 8:00 am. He says it was a computer glitch . I will not get to see DB or SIL at all. But at least Mom will get to have a Christmas Morning and Christmas breakfast before they leave. It is slightly better. I am glad that at least Mom and Dad can have a little of christmas day before taking them to the airport.

I will make a special trip to come home early from the wedding on 13th to spend an evening with Nephew. Since DB and SIL will be on vacation I wont get to see them at all. Oh well, I will have to make it out to their home state again some time next year.

Everyone is still pretty hurt that the original promise of spending the holidays here was broken. But we will all make the best of the few days we have with DB and SIL. Mom will change her big dinner to Christmas Eve and Gramma will come by earlier as well. No family photo, but what can we do? Mom will have the photographer come early to take a photo of the people there as we want to get a nice photo of my grandmother with her 1st great-grandchild.

I wouldn't be so sure there was "no impact" as you said before he doesn't like to talk on the phone. Maybe this will make an impression with him and he will make a better effort the year after next when it's your mom's "turn" again. In any case, I'm glad you said something to him so he knows that he's not pulling the wool over anyone's eyes and I'm also glad that your mom is moving forward with other plans.