A Crowded Weekend, FP+, And An Offsite Stay-Reporting Back (Very Long)

[Shaden]

How about they set up a whole bunch of MB readers throughout the park? You put your MB on it and it prints out your FPs for the day on small slips of paper. You would only need to do this once as long as you don't change your FPs. Then you hand the paper to the CM upon entering.

Then you would only be getting a Mickey read once a day instead of 6 (3x2)

How about, they go back to the old system, except instead of putting your card in to tap your MB ???

Maybe allow you to pull FPs from anywhere in the park for a given ride ? (That would take away the "I hate having to run across the park" people's worries).

 

[FlipHipster]

I sadly have to agree, people don't read signs, even giant ones.

Sad but very, very true. Actually they should put the signs on the ground since everyone will be looking down at their smart phones all day. Interactive sidewalks that read your magic band and display your FP info on the ground right in front you.

 

[JimmyV]

Wondering if you had any insight into how this is affecting the single rider lines?

We only used the SR line once, and it was the first time that we ever used it. I have a "thing" about splitting up our family, when the whole idea is to have "family fun". But I think I am over that now! I will give you the excrutiating details of our early morning experience so you can absorb or filter out what you want. I timed everything.

On our DHS day, we arrived at RD and were the 4th-6th people at the entrance turnstile. I consider that pretty good, since many other people who ostensibly arrived at RD were, oh, about 50-75 people deep at their turnstiles. I mention this only to give you an idea of how our early hours went. There is a huge difference between being the 4th person through a turnstile and the 75th. Anyway, the park was scheduled to open at 9:00 but in fact, they started letting people in at 8:45. (Robo has reported on what the "current trends" are for park opening, and he was spot on for this one.) We bee-lined for TSM and were in line by 8:47 and off the ride by 8:57. We then met with a CM with an i-Pad to get our FP+s for the day and were done there at 9:02. Our walk to ToT got us in line at 9:07 and we were off the ride at 9:20. The short walk to Rock-n-Roller Coaster got us there at 9:21 and lo and behold, the SB line was listed as 90 minutes. I figured that the estimate was over-exaggerated and asked the CM what we should expect, and she said that a group of 300 cheeleaders just got in line and that the wait would be every bit of 60 minutes, and that the 90 minute posting was probably accurate. Ouch. So we got in the SR line because our touring plan did not allow for a 90 minute wait at 9:21. Using the SR line, we were off the ride at 9:52, so I think our wait was around 20-25 minutes. And the icing on the cake was, not only did all three of us get on the same limo, we were all in three consecutive cars such that two of us even appeared in the same ride photo at the end of the ride.

Unfortunately, I cannot give you any further insight as I don't want to speculate. I can only tell you that we had a 20+ minute wait at 9:21 on a day when the park opened at 9:00.

Did you go to RD during EMH? Seems like the EMH rope drops (which we don't usually do) might be the way to go and then hop over to another park later in the day.

We did not. When we were there, AK and MK opened at 8:00 on non-EMH days and DHS and Epcot opened at 9:00. That was plenty early for us. It was difficult convincing my wife to be at the boat dock/bus depot by 7:20 on two days. There were sour looks and mean words until the second cup of coffee kicked in. No way was I going to suggest trying to arrive that early (or earlier) on the other days. We generally stay away from EMHs. I planned our own strategy of where to go on which day, and when I consulted both TP and easyWDW, both sites confirmed all of my selections as the best days to go to each park.

 

[ucfknight]

We ran into our first long FP+ line at AK yesterday.Safari had some ropes set up for the Line and they were filled.As we went through the line,it started to spill out in to the common walking areas so I Saw one way firsthand they are trying to shorten this line.They started only have one member of the party scan for fast pass.It did make the line clear up fairly quick.I didn't think of this until later but am wondering if that used up the fast pass for all family members or just the one who scanned.If it was just the one who scanned that could create even more issues if the others go into the app and now adjust that fast pass since they didn't use it yet.

I experienced something similar, but a bit more unique, on the Safari about 2 weeks ago. When we arrived for our return window, the FP+ return line was huge outside of the first scanner. The had a queue that went all the way up the hill and then back down again just to get to the first scanner. Despite the big queue line setup, it still wasn't enough to contain the number of people returning for their FP+. The line spilled out of the queue and into the main walkway.

We reluctantly got into the queue thinking it would take at least 10 minutes to get to the first Mickey, but we kept moving pretty quickly. After only about 2 minutes we reached the 1st Mickey. The cast member was yelling "One scan per party!". I scanned just my band and my whole family walked through after I got the green Mickey. After passing the 1st Mickey, we were able to keep walking without stopping. As we approached the 2nd Mickey, I noticed something strange. The scanners were covered up! So we never got scanned a 2nd time. There was a cast member waving people straight through the covered up 2nd scanners and down to the loading dock. I felt kind of bad for the standby folks. We didn't see any movement in that line at all as we walked past in our steady stream of FP+ returnees.

After we got off the ride, I thought I'd play around to see if I could change the FP+ since only my MagicBand was scanned and it was only scanned once. Despite that, the system would not allow me to modify any Safari FP+ for anyone in my family, even though none of their bands were scanned and my band wasn't scanned a 2nd time.

So was this some alternate FP+ return model they were testing where only one party member gets scanned one time and the system counts all party members as having ridden the ride?

 

[BigGreen73]

I am still not a fan of the whole FP+ system. I will definitely miss the paper FP. Used to be able to ride headliners 3-5 times or more in a day. Not anymore. Not looking forward to using it when we go again. Maybe it will be 100% better and change again by then. Who knows.

One thing is I am glad we always stay onsite. I would hate to have to deal with the Kiosk situation.

Based on the OP, looks like FP+ just shifts the line from SB to the FP+ line. More people are aware of FP+ and using FP+ more than the old system. The FP Q was not built to handle that amount of people at one time so no wonder it impacts the look of the park.

Reading about the huge lines at 9am because of FP+ is just frightening.

 

[JimmyV]

I experienced something similar, but a bit more unique, on the Safari about 2 weeks ago. When we arrived for our return window, the FP+ return line was huge outside of the first scanner. The had a queue that went all the way up the hill and then back down again just to get to the first scanner. Despite the big queue line setup, it still wasn't enough to contain the number of people returning for their FP+. The line spilled out of the queue and into the main walkway.

We reluctantly got into the queue thinking it would take at least 10 minutes to get to the first Mickey, but we kept moving pretty quickly. After only about 2 minutes we reached the 1st Mickey. The cast member was yelling "One scan per party!". I scanned just my band and my whole family walked through after I got the green Mickey. After passing the 1st Mickey, we were able to keep walking without stopping. As we approached the 2nd Mickey, I noticed something strange. The scanners were covered up! So we never got scanned a 2nd time. There was a cast member waving people straight through the covered up 2nd scanners and down to the loading dock. I felt kind of bad for the standby folks. We didn't see any movement in that line at all as we walked past in our steady stream of FP+ returnees.

After we got off the ride, I thought I'd play around to see if I could change the FP+ since only my MagicBand was scanned and it was only scanned once. Despite that, the system would not allow me to modify any Safari FP+ for anyone in my family, even though none of their bands were scanned and my band wasn't scanned a 2nd time.

So was this some alternate FP+ return model they were testing where only one party member gets scanned one time and the system counts all party members as having ridden the ride?

1. Interesting that they were utilizing a coping strategy the week before the President's Day crunch, but not during the busier week that followed.

2. Your comment about there being no movement of the SB line is exactly right. The physical length of many lines would lead you to believe that they would be 20 minutes or so, when in fact it was taking people 70-90 minutes to go through them. Once the FP+ people arrive, they are given immediate access and the SB lines function more like Single Rider lines. They only pull people from the SB lines when the numbers work out.

3. I guess that since bands and cards are linked, use of one can apply to all. But what happens if 4 people have a FP+ for, say, 1:00-2:00 and two people use it at 1:05 while the other two are meeting a Princess, and the two who were meeting the Princess want to use the FP at 1:40? Would the use by two people at 1:05 lock out the other two who haven't yet ridden?

 

[ArwenMarie]

How about, they go back to the old system, except instead of putting your card in to tap your MB ???

Maybe allow you to pull FPs from anywhere in the park for a given ride ? (That would take away the "I hate having to run across the park" people's worries).

I was kind of kidding, but as I started to write it, I thought why not. Could it be worse than this

 

[ucfknight]

I guess that since bands and cards are linked, use of one can apply to all. But what happens if 4 people have a FP+ for, say, 1:00-2:00 and two people use it at 1:05 while the other two are meeting a Princess, and the two who were meeting the Princess want to use the FP at 1:40? Would the use by two people at 1:05 lock out the other two who haven't yet ridden?

I had that same thought.

Doing only one scan per party would be great for speed, but it really wouldn't be able to take into account split-up parties or other special circumstances.

 

[ArwenMarie]

1. Interesting that they were utilizing a coping strategy the week before the President's Day crunch, but not during the busier week that followed.

2. Your comment about there being no movement of the SB line is exactly right. The physical length of many lines would lead you to believe that they would be 20 minutes or so, when in fact it was taking people 70-90 minutes to go through them. Once the FP+ people arrive, they are given immediate access and the SB lines function more like Single Rider lines. They only pull people from the SB lines when the numbers work out.

3. I guess that since bands and cards are linked, use of one can apply to all. But what happens if 4 people have a FP+ for, say, 1:00-2:00 and two people use it at 1:05 while the other two are meeting a Princess, and the two who were meeting the Princess want to use the FP at 1:40? Would the use by two people at 1:05 lock out the other two who haven't yet ridden?

Wow to point 2. Its truly a standby line then.

 

[FlipHipster]

Wow to point 2. Its truly a standby line then.

yes, pretty soon riding standby for headliners will be like getting a walk up table at Ohana on a busy night.

 

[mom2rtk]

yes, pretty soon riding standby for headliners will be like getting a walk up table at Ohana on a busy night.

Great analogy! I've seen that line.

 

[clsteve]

I don't have much faith that signs would help. I have a feeling that most of those who cause the lines to back up will still have the same issues.

Looks like they have several issues that are all colliding at once:

Technology

• The MB's and the scanner's - caused by signal strength, DB/network lag time, ergonomics or a combo of all: but, they have to and want to collect the data
  
• Kiosks- not efficient
  
• Wifi
  
• They over-estimated how tech-savvy guests are to use Kiosks, the app, smart phones, MDE, etc., to manage their FP's in real-time

Process

• (maybe) over-allocating FP's
  
• Language barriers
  
• Lines- too long and long enough people think they need to get in them- Kiosks and the FP lines. They didn't plan for that part at all, so where do they put them in the short term
  
• FP availability and return times- you don't know what's available when you get in line at the kiosk, nor when you should get in line at the ride to redeem the ones you have

All of the above are multiplying the effect on each other. They may have to throw huge amounts of manpower at this until they can find the one with the quickest fix that helps all the others. I hope they have everything on the table- no matter how painful since Spring Break's just a couple of weeks away.

 

[JimmyV]

Looks like they have several issues that are all colliding at once:

• They over-estimated how tech-savvy guests are to use Kiosks, the app, smart phones, MDE, etc., to manage their FP's in real-time

• Language barriers
  

A couple of thoughts on these. The over-estimation of the tech-savvy guests is really hard to comprehend unless this whole system was designed by 24 year olds. Several years ago, Arby's installed self-serve screens at some of their restaurants so that customers could place their own orders. They removed most (all?) of them in short order. People couldn't use them, didn't want to use them, and were insulted by the notion that they could not be served by a real person. At WDW, people couldn't understand or complete the simple process of running their KTTK cards through the turnstile machines while placing their finger on a scanner. Now, WDW wants customers to link cards/bands, choose which rides to FP, pick a selected option that worst fits their actual desired times, and then individually change each of those selections to fit more closely with their desired times? (By the way, when we worked with CMs to get our FP times, this is exactly what they did. If I said that I wanted Everest around 1:00, Kali around 2:00 and Safari around 4:00, they booked early morning times and changed each one individually. So the workaround that people recommend here is actually the process used by the CMs themselves). It might seem like a simple process to someone who is 24 and just graduated from Cal Tech. But to the 68 year old long-time Disney guest, this is way too much.

As for the language barrier, we made an observation during our recent trip that, while not scientific, and perhaps not even accurate, was intriguing to us. Spanish is used as the second language for all Disney announcements, whether they be in the Monorails, (Por favor manténganse alejado de las puertas) or on rides. But is Spanish even the most prominent second language at WDW any more? It certainly didn't seem that way to us. While I cannot necessarily identify a second language that was far and away the most used, (Brazilian Portugese perhaps?), there were a multitude of languages that appeared to be equally prevalent, including Spanish. In other words, we heard as much Portugese, German, Italian, Japanese, French and Russian/Eastern European as we did Spanish. There may have been a time when second languages at WDW trended at 80% Spanish and 20% "other" making the announcements in Spanish a sound idea. But there are so many languages spoken at WDW that are not accounted for in signage or announcements that this presents a real issue. And yes, we encountered several people who were getting blue Mickeys at the tapstiles who spoke something other than Spanish or English, so I do think that this cannot be overlooked.

 

[mom2mickeyfan]

yes, pretty soon riding standby for headliners will be like getting a walk up table at Ohana on a busy night.

And yet with the limits and tiers you have no other choice no matter what you do.

 

[ultraviolet]

Thanks to the OP for this detailed report. My daughter and a friend from school will be going to WDW during the second week of March, parks will be at a 9. They only have two days to spend between the 4 parks so we bought park hoppers.

They're staying offsite and I've informed her that she will be unable to schedule her FP+ until she is actually at the park. I've told her how vital it is to get to the first park of the day at RD. What recommendations can you offer to make their limited time between the parks most efficient?

For example, let's say she gets to DHS at RD and spends a few hours doing the attractions she wants on standby rather than use her allotted 3FP+. She then makes her way over to Epcot after lunch. Is there any realistic chance that she would be able to get a FP+ for TT or Soarin' when arriving at the park so late?

Does it make sense to schedule FP+ for their first park of the day as soon as they get there instead? How likely would it be that they could schedule all morning times at DHS (ie ToT & RnR) and go on their rides, then head over to Epcot that afternoon and still be able to get on TT or Soarin' without a 3 hour wait in SB?

The last time we were there, we stayed at YC and used FP- efficiently during President's Weekend, and did not have extremely long waits for anything. I fear that even though she understands that she won't be able to enjoy the parks as she's accustomed to, she will be terribly disappointed because she won't get to do very much at all.

Any touring plans / suggestions would be greatly welcomed.

 

[ucfknight]

For example, let's say she gets to DHS at RD and spends a few hours doing the attractions she wants on standby rather than use her allotted 3FP+. She then makes her way over to Epcot after lunch. Is there any realistic chance that she would be able to get a FP+ for TT or Soarin' when arriving at the park so late?

The likelihood of FP+ for Soarin' or Test Track still being available in the afternoon on a 9 crowd day is slim to none.

 

[Shaden]

The likelihood of FP+ for Soarin' or Test Track still being available in the afternoon on a 9 crowd day is slim to none.

That is true, but can you book FPs FOR Epcot FROM MK for instance via the Kiosk ???

If so they could RD one park and book FPs for another from there ???

 

[JimmyV]

For example, let's say she gets to DHS at RD and spends a few hours doing the attractions she wants on standby rather than use her allotted 3FP+. She then makes her way over to Epcot after lunch. Is there any realistic chance that she would be able to get a FP+ for TT or Soarin' when arriving at the park so late?

Does it make sense to schedule FP+ for their first park of the day as soon as they get there instead? How likely would it be that they could schedule all morning times at DHS (ie ToT & RnR) and go on their rides, then head over to Epcot that afternoon and still be able to get on TT or Soarin' without a 3 hour wait in SB?

Any touring plans / suggestions would be greatly welcomed.

Let me preface this by saying that we did not hop. I did not see any real workaround for trying to hop as an offsite guest. People who can pre-book FP+ can arrange for their FPs ahead of time at their second park. Offsite guests cannot. So if one were to plan to use their FP+s at the second park of the day, they can count on two things (during a busy time):

• A frustratingly long line to use a kiosk or see a CM with an i-Pad once they arrive at their second park, and
• A limited number of options once they get to the front of that line.

By process of elimination, this pretty much means using her FP+s at the first park and planning to wait in long SB lines at the second parks. I haven't thought this through entirely, but I am guessing that if it were me, I would use my FP+s at the first park, and use the second park to have a relaxing day seeing shows and "lesser attractions", and then on the next day, reverse the process. In other words, on Day 1, go to Epcot at RD and do Soarin' SB, get FPs for Test Track, Mission Space and Spaceship Earth at around 10:00, 11:00 and 12:00, try to squeeze in Sum of All Thrills before my first FP expired, then hit the FP rides in order, have lunch, do perhaps one or two other things like Maelstrom and .....whatever, and then hop over to DHS. Once at DHS, I would spend the afternoon seeing Beauty and the Beast, Indy, Muppets, Little Mermaid, One Man's Dream, and any other "walk on" attraction. I wouldn't even attempt the "big three". On Day 2, I would go to DHS in the morning and do TSM, get FPs for ToT and RnR and finish up anything that I didn't do on Day 1. Then I would hop to Epcot and have lunch and spend the afternoon in World Showcase and clean up whatever other walk on attractions there are at Future World like Energy, JIA, etc. I wouldn't even attempt Soarin' or TT.

To sum it up, I think offsite guests who hop have to be commandos at Park #1 at RD, using their FP+s before 1:00 p.m., and use Park #2 as a leisurely afternoon to see shows and do things that require little waiting.

 

[JimmyV]

That is true, but can you book FPs FOR Epcot FROM MK for instance via the Kiosk ???

If so they could RD one park and book FPs for another from there ???

As of right now, you cannot. We were behind a guy at the International Gateway kiosk who tried to get FPs for a park other than Epcot and he was told that he could not.

 

[ultraviolet]

In other words, on Day 1, go to Epcot at RD and do Soarin' SB, get FPs for Test Track, Mission Space and Spaceship Earth at around 10:00, 11:00 and 12:00, try to squeeze in Sum of All Thrills before my first FP expired, then hit the FP rides in order, have lunch, do perhaps one or two other things like Maelstrom and .....whatever, and then hop over to DHS. Once at DHS, I would spend the afternoon seeing Beauty and the Beast, Indy, Muppets, Little Mermaid, One Man's Dream, and any other "walk on" attraction. I wouldn't even attempt the "big three".

To sum it up, I think offsite guests who hop have to be commandos at Park #1 at RD, using their FP+s before 1:00 p.m., and use Park #2 as a leisurely afternoon to see shows and do things that require little waiting.

Do you think it is possible to get FP+ at Epcot (or any of the parks) for 10:00, 11:00 & 12:00 on a 9 day? I was under the impression that doing so would be difficult, that they'd have to be more spread out later into the day.

I'm going to impress upon her how they really must prioritize attractions and parks. She would be devastated if she couldn't ride ToT.

Thanks for your insight