................

[CJMickeyMouse]

Originally posted by The Mystery Machine
When you have a difficult child this does not work.

I struggle with the "difficult child" concept. Aren't all children difficult in one way or another?

I guess I just don't understand why, in the past, "difficult" children were taught to behave just like all of the others.

But now "difficult" children are labeled, medicated, counseled, etc.

I really think it's sad for the kids.

Flame proof suit in place.

 

[chrissyk]

Originally posted by The Mystery Machine
When you have a difficult child this does not work. Just thought I would let you know. I wish it would, however....

What do you do with a difficult child then? I'm interested in this already, since my husband's sister was a nightmare child (and is now a nightmare adult). I'm not sure if there was anything that my in-laws could have tried/done differently. She was ADHD/ODD (I think)...they tried medication and counceling. Nothing worked Now she's an adult with a personality disorder and a drug problem. I really don't blame my in-laws, since they raised one completely normal child in the same household. I think that some kids are so far beyond normal means of discipline that parents don't know what to do. I honesly don't know what kind of discipline I would employ with a child like SIL. How do people handle it? Or, is it more a matter of "surviving" the child until they are out of the house (as my in-laws did)

 

[holycow]

I am feeling your pain too! I have a 5 yr. old who just started K and has had a mouth on her lately....grrrr! just making me think about it...but she really is such a sweet girl most of the time!


I also think another thing is......(putting flame suit on here)
is the cartoons they watch! Have you seen them lately and what they say to each other?....Lilo and Stich was horrible ...the one I watched had them calling each other stupid and idiot....Jimmy Neutron, and the Fairly Odd Parents....when I sit and watch these I think no wonder she is talking that way to me...so I've curbed the TV and she has really improved a bit. (plus having a 16 yr. old brother doesn't help either!) Lots of factors involved here.


Holycow

 

[Robinrs]

I'm really shocked by this thread. I can't imagine a child speaking to an adult in that way. I can STILL feel my Mom's look if I even think of disrespecting an adult.

Difficult or not, a child who does not have a true perspective on authority figures will be a difficult person for everyone in their lives. All children push boundaries and know who to do what to. Mind you, there are "difficult" children in my family who are NEVER "difficult" to me or my Mom, but manage to make life miserable for their parents. They know exactly what buttons to push. Don't wear those buttons.

I raised my two nephews, my niece and now my son, all ages 11 to 34. To this day they know what they can say and react to me out of respect. Be consistent and careful on who you are and what will be tolerated.

BTW, I agree with you holycow on the shows that are presented to children and how "disrespect" is considered the norm. I complained about Lillo and Stitch and got flamed! My son can watch these things and shake his head... "did you see what that child said to his Mom???" he'd say. We can see this stuff and not be influenced if it is instilled in their souls early enough.

This reminds me of a Eddie Murphy bit where he visits a friend's home and witnesses him cussing at his parents. He goes home and tries it on his parents.... and, to put it lightly, it DIDN'T WORK!

God bless,

Robinrs

 

[The Mystery Machine]

Originally posted by CJMickeyMouse
I struggle with the "difficult child" concept. Aren't all children difficult in one way or another?

I guess I just don't understand why, in the past, "difficult" children were taught to behave just like all of the others.

But now "difficult" children are labeled, medicated, counseled, etc.

I really think it's sad for the kids.

Flame proof suit in place.

No suit needed...
I know that it is hard to understand. A difficult child is implusive, quick to anger, does not care about a "punishment". In fact they "welcome" them. They like to push you to the edge and beyond just to see how much you can take.
You have to be consistent EVERYTIME otherwise you are back to square one.
Here is the part where I think failure of a difficult child is significant...the parents have to be totally on the same page and cannot show "weakness" in front of the child. Hard to do when they are young and you are new parents.

Also they are very, very sensitive kids and you have to keep that in mind. I started "HUG THERAPY" with dd at about age 9ish. I just started doing it one day. I had run out of ideas and thought I would "turn the tables" on her. It worked!

She is 13 now, things are good. But we really, really worked at it.

 

[PrincessDadx2]

Don't know much about modern methods, but my Dad always applied the hand of discipline to the seat of correction when I mouthed off. It solved the problem YMMV

Disrespect to parents is not tolerated in our house. It is met with swift and certain discipline. This is not negotiable, neither do we allow any TV shows or movies that depict this.

 

[buddy&wooz]

I can only speak from my personal experience. My kids know there are consequences for back talk and rude behavior. I've been very consistant, and so has my husband. They're not perfect, but they're respectful. The teen knows to go to his room and cool off if he gets really angry, then come back and speak rationally to me. I simply won't listen to him when he's yelling. Ignoring them till they're calm is the worst punishment I can hand out to them I think! Even my youngest (age 6) would never tell me off or ignore me when I tell him to do something!

When I look at my friends and aquaintances, this is what I see. The ones who have respectful, polite kids follow through with discipline and have consistant household rules. The ones who constantly complain about their kids throw up their hands and rarely or never follow through. It starts when they're toddlers with "but he hates the car seat and just screams the whole time, so I don't buckle him in just so we have some peace" (worth risking his life?) and moves to "I know he shouldn't eat all that junk food, but when I tell him to stop he just ignores me" (why do you have it in the house then?) etc etc.

Sorry, I have a friend who's kids are completely out of control, and she always asks for my advice, so this stuff is what I tell her. Sadly, she always ignores me.

I know there are issues beyond the control of even the best of parents, but I'm talking about healthy kids with no underlying issues. Parenting is a full time job and there are no shortcuts to raising good kids.

 

[Teejay32]

OMG can I relate to this. The trouble with my 7-year-old (Little Miss Sunshine until this year) is that she's tougher than I am. She's a good kid who has been through many a medical nightmare in her time, and me making scary Mom noises just doesn't have the same effect it has on my older DD or other kids. No matter what I threaten, what she loses - the madder she gets, the more she digs in. [It's not just a discipline thing, it's a good kid turning combative or hostile, for whatever reason.]

The idea that some kids act out toward those they love because it's "safe" makes a lot of sense. I had a brother who was exactly like this when he was little, and I keep reminding myself that he's a great guy, he survived childhood, and that ridiculous force of will is something we all respect today. So...I've been setting some simple ground rules, easy to follow - no disrespect, no fighting with sister, etc - and backing off of other things, like battling over what she wears to school or what time she does homework. I also want to redirect some of that will somewhere else and I'm rethinking her taking figure skating - that's one day a week at a rink, and it's not like she can practice at home. I'm standoffish during her moody times - an hour later she's all sunshine again and sometimes we'll cuddle up and read a book or something, just to reinforce those good times and to maybe gain an opportunity to talk it out.

This is a work in progress though, so this isn't advice. Just sympathy.

 

[WDSearcher]

You mentioned losing priviledges, but do you actually take them away? Has he been punished at all for his behavior? If not, then obviously it's going to continue. If you're punishing him and he's still acting up, then change the punishment and, as many have said here, keep it consistent and don't back down.

The best tactic with us kids was the "you're smarter than that" tactic. When one of us would mouth off or talk back or yell, her response was, "I know you're smart enough to figure out a way to get what you want without behaving the way you're behaving. Come back to me with another option and we'll talk about it. If you choose not to figure out a plan, then the answer is no." That dumped it right back on us, and we usually came back with a compromise she was willing to accept.

My sister, who tried to circumvent the problem by simply doing what she wanted to without asking, was grounded first, and then found herself under 24/7 guard. My mom would sit in her room while she did homework or was on the phone, went to her school to check that she was in class, didn't allow her to leave the house, and literally sat next to her or in the same room with her all day -- I know it had to have tired my mom out to a great extent, but she wanted to make it clear to my sister that if she wanted her freedom back, she had to earn it. And my sister did. She is now, as my dad would say, "a thriving and contributing member of society."

It all boils down to remembering that YOU are the grown-up here -- you're in charge. Your son has no power in any situation unless he earns it by behaving himself.

 

[skiwee1]

I could have written your post! I have a 5 y/o girl who seems to think it funny to backtalk lately. This is the age that they start this though and having gone through it was two other kids I should have expected it. If I tell DD she will get a time out she will tell me right back that I am getting a time out. They do grow out of this stage. Just keep being persistent and following through. This is just the age where they push to see how far they get. It is a normal part of growing up.

 

[nuke]

Originally posted by skiwee1
This is just the age where they push to see how far they get. It is a normal part of growing up.

I agree with you 100%. They have freedom from us at school all day and are testing the waters at home.

I also agree that every action has to have a consequence. Good behavior gets rewarded, bad behavior gets un-rewarded.

 

[Kimnicki]

Originally posted by nuke
I also agree that every action has to have a consequence. Good behavior gets rewarded, bad behavior gets un-rewarded.

My DH always tells our kids "If you're good, you get good things, if your bad, you get nothing."

DD9 gets it fully. DS6 doesn't quite grasp this concept yet. I think you're all right when you say it's a normal part of growing up. DS is not "bad", he just needs to learn what will be tolerated and what will not. He'll get it eventually. We do follow through on our punishments and sooner or later, it'll sink in. Hopefully it'll be sooner than later!


Kim

 

[Tigger&Belle]

Sounds like life with my son, who will be 5yo in December. Problem is he's been this way since he was 13 months old, but he was the most angelic baby. Little did I know what was in store for me! lol

I have 3 other children who were never this bad (two are teens now, though, so I do go through stuff with them now). Thankfully my 11yo is quite well behaved and when he starts mouthing off he will stop when it is pointed out to him.

I know that my youngest has some big shoes to fill having 3 older siblings and that it must be hard for him sometimes. Still, does everything need to be so difficult???

He's not always this way and is fine at preschool, so I know that this, too, shall pass. But when???

T&B

 

[helenk]

I would say get a hand on it now while you can. I did not have this problem but my sister did and now my neice is 11 and what a mess! She bosses my sister around, she does not listen and does not respect her at all. For years my sister has let her get her way, if she does not want to finish her homework, my sister finishes for her, she refuses to read a book, so my sister will either read aloud to her or buy a book on a tape and play it for her. Essentially my sister just felt it was better to let her get her way rather than going through the "aggravation" of punishing her.
This is her first year in middle school and she hates it, because she has more work to do etc, the other day she did not want to go because they were having a test, she and my sister had a screaming match and my niece SPIT in my sister's face!!!!!
Now I realize that this is the extreme, but trust me you do not want to have this behavior later in life

 

[laurie31]

May I recommend the book, "The Strong Willed Child," by James Dobson. Even if you are not Christian, I think you would gain insight from it. I had never thought of younger dd as "difficult" I'd thought she was "high-spirited" and that it was good that she was stubborn and strong-willed as when used for "good" these traits can carry you far in life . However, used for "evil" they can make life very nasty. My dd2 started this backtalk thing too

I got the book. It was written about her! It doesn't make me see her as "difficult" just "different." Older dd responds so much differently to stimuli and to punishments. She would never DARE backtalk! Younger dd dares to see how far she can go. She doesn't care if she gets punished. The trick to dealing with her is to be totally impassive (which is HARD sometimes!) when I tell her she has done something she knows is unacceptable, so she has chosen to lose her TV priviledges for the day (week, whatever is appropriate). She wants that reaction of anger and she doens't care what consequenses she has to suffer to get it. So...no reaction = no reinforcement from the behavior. Of course, we still do "consequenses" but it's really made a difference to stay calm and almost bored sounding when we tell her she's done wrong. For some reason, strong-willed children fell powerful when they can make adults excited or angry.

I'm another one who can't STAND those cartoons where they talk so rudely. Angelica off the Rugrats...I can't even watch. It makes me nauseous. DD2 does not approach ANYTHING like that. My head would explode, book or no book!

Good luck with your DS. Positive reinforcement works better that any of the negative things, btw. Make a chart and for every day he isn't rude or disrespectful he gets a star. Agree in advance on what reward he will get for 5 stars, 10 stars, 50 stars, etc. Don't make the reward too far off or he will get discouraged. If he loses a star for the day, calmly remind him that he chose that behavior, now he won't get a star. This puts the responsibility on HIM to act the way he knows he should, instead of making it a power struggle between the two of you. In a power-struggle, both of you will always lose, every time

(as as a bright point, my strong-willed dd is my child who will come up and hug me and say "I love you" out of the blue, and can be soooo sweet. Everyone at school thinks she's quiet and reserved. They have no clue she's like Jeckle and Hyde!)

Laurie

 

[Disney1fan2002]

Probably not a popular remedy, but let's go back to the old days when kids were respectful....they knew what soap tasted like. My kids never had to taste the soap, but I have come close, and now all I have to do is mention getting soap...and they shape up.

I tell my kids, nasty mouths need washing.

 

[Lachesis00]

I have a duel battery charger from SunPak and keep loosing the darn clips that come with it (they just slip off) and so I emailed he company (I actually have 2 of these chargers b/c I lost the clips to #1). Here is the email I received today. I emailed them on Saturday.
I'd say this was excellent customer service!



Dear Rachel,

Please provide your name and address and we will send the clips to you at no charge.

Thank you,

John Long
Service Manager
ToCAD America


-----Original Message-----
From: Info [mailto:info@tocad.com]
Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2004 11:44 AM
To: jlong@tocad.com
Subject: FW: Looking for a part to the sunpak duel battery charger
-----------------------------------------------------
From: Rachel in AZ
Sent: Saturday, October 09, 2004 10:02 PM
To: info@tocad.com
Subject: Looking for a part to the sunpak duel battery charger


I have your sunpak duel battery charger (works for a sony FM-50 battery) and I need to buy/get new clips (the little gray clip) that hold the battery in.

Could you please tell me how I can about obtaining this product.

Thank you

Rachel

 

[disykat]

I always figure you know you're doing your job when your kids are respectful to other adults, but occasionally mouthy to you! I think all kids need a safe place to test the waters - they just need to know it's not going to fly when they do! Just keep being consistant with the consequences and she'll come around.

What I worry about more is the kids whose smart mouths aren't squelched by their parents and they take it out on the general population!

 

[mom2boys]

I told him his time out would be over when urge to hit him left my body

I will definitely be using this one on my mouthy, mouthy 9 yr old. BTW he can be such a sweetie when he wants to be.

 

[hrh_disney_queen]

Originally posted by mom2rb
I've got two six year olds so I feel your pain. A few weeks ago one of them was so mouthy to me I told him to go to his room for a long time out. When he asked me how long it would be I told him his time out would be over when urge to hit him left my body. He has been pretty polite since then.

Good one!! I'll have to use that one on my own DS6. He is a very sweet boy some of the time, but I never know what is going to set him off. He is very dramatic, and whenever he gets into trouble, he tries to turn it around on me..."Mommy, why don't you like me?" Also resorts to saying, "I hate you!" a lot, which he got from FINDING NEMO-thank you Disney!!! Except, he heard it wrong, so he says, "I HAPE you!" That doesn't hurt as much!!

At times he is so sweet and cuddly, then other times I too just don't want to be around him...Hoping he outgrows this someday....

At least he is a good boy at school and respectful to his classmates and teacher..It's like another person sometimes.