2025 Dues

[MerlinandtheMouse]

I’ve just been buying some extra DGCs lately, preemptively starting to pay into my 2025 dues and I just realized we should be getting dues estimates in the next 2-3 weeks, right?

Any wild predictions for this year? Do prices go up a bit more dramatically for resorts about to get a refurbishment because they’ll need to replenish resort coffers, so-to-speak? Or does that not really affect anything? And I’m curious if getting hit head on by a hurricane last week will cause any revaluations.

 

[Genie+]

Good question.

I was just looking at when Copper Creek went on sale dues started $7.33pp and Boulder Ridge was $6.54.

Now they’re $8.68 and $8.09 with BR in the lead, it outpaced CCV by $1.66 over 7 years.

Dues have the power to affect resale prices year to year. Wish I knew how to predict the increases!

 

[MagicDVC]

Any wild predictions for this year? Do prices go up a bit more dramatically for resorts about to get a refurbishment because they’ll need to replenish resort coffers, so-to-speak? Or does that not really affect anything? And I’m curious if getting hit head on by a hurricane last week will cause any revaluations.

Refurbishments are budgeted in the Capital Reserves. The last big jump was increased operational costs for the higher wage for CM. With increased costs for everything from TP to light bulbs, I think we’ll see a moderate increase in dues.

 

[MerlinandtheMouse]

Refurbishments are budgeted in the Capital Reserves. The last big jump was increased operational costs for the higher wage for CM. With increased costs for everything from TP to light bulbs, I think we’ll see a moderate increase in dues.

I see, so it’s just a permanent line item on the budget and stays pretty consistent over the years? Makes sense.

Good question.

I was just looking at when Copper Creek went on sale dues started $7.33pp and Boulder Ridge was $6.54.

Now they’re $8.68 and $8.09 with BR in the lead, it outpaced CCV by $1.66 over 7 years.

Dues have the power to affect resale prices year to year. Wish I knew how to predict the increases!

It’s just surprising we still haven’t really figured out what things have enough of an impact to increase dues the way they do on a yearly basis. I know we can get a very general idea (beach resorts= high dues because water is bad) but you’d think based on X factors, we could be more specific in which resorts will likely have minimal, moderate or significant increase. But perhaps that information is out there and I’m just ignorant to it.

 

[BrianLo]

It’s just surprising we still haven’t really figured out what things have enough of an impact to increase dues the way they do on a yearly basis. I know we can get a very general idea (beach resorts= high dues because water is bad) but you’d think based on X factors, we could be more specific in which resorts will likely have minimal increases, moderate or significant increase. But perhaps that information is out there and I’m just ignorant to it.

Points as a function of square footage will also be one. Basically bad points charts will have better maintenance fees.

Copper creek has the cabins helping it overtake BRV. We’ve also seen Disney consistently over estimate maintenance fees relatively on new resorts, more recently.

No idea what happens this year, but logic suggests maintenance fees should have some tie to inflation.

 

[dvc lover 1970]

How much do they take in administrative fees? I never read the firms closely. I just keep paying. But fees have kept me from adding more points

 

[disneylandtour]

I will say that I'm still confused why OKW is on the high end and SSR is on the low end, as the layout and structure arrangements of those two resorts is similar, right down to the minimal transportation and various bus stops.

 

[atthebeachclub]

I will say that I'm still confused why OKW is on the high end and SSR is on the low end, as the layout and structure arrangements of those two resorts is similar, right down to the minimal transportation and various bus stops.

It could be resort age related?

 

[lilsonicfan]

I found this thread helpful. One thing that @drusba has explained is that OKW has a higher per point cost due to lower points being needed per room, per night. So its operational budget is higher per point than say BLT which requires more points per room per night. Also OKW doesn't have a hotel share so has to cover all front desk costs, and other costs, on its own. @tjkraz explained that SSR having the preferred category and the GV/treehouses makes it overall cost more points per room per night than SSR, which has the effect of spreading out the operational budget. SSR also has more guests, say 67% more guests, while only needing 35% more buses.

 

[disneylandtour]

I found this thread helpful. One thing that @drusba has explained is that OKW has a higher per point cost due to lower points being needed per room, per night. So its operational budget is higher per point than say BLT which requires more points per room per night. Also OKW doesn't have a hotel share so has to cover all front desk costs, and other costs, on its own. @tjkraz explained that SSR having the preferred category and the GV/treehouses makes it overall cost more points per room per night than SSR, which has the effect of spreading out the operational budget. SSR also has more guests, say 67% more guests, while only needing 35% more buses.

Thanks for this. This was helpful

 

[Genie+]

I will say that I'm still confused why OKW is on the high end and SSR is on the low end, as the layout and structure arrangements of those two resorts is similar, right down to the minimal transportation and various bus stops.

The average number of points needed per room size plays a part. My dues per point is much higher at BWV than VGF when you take out the property taxes. It’s something like $5pp VGF and $7pp BWV.

Take a studio. There’s other factors but let’s just look at maintenance to upkeep the physical room. Even if the daily average breakdown of VGF is 10% higher than that of BWV, if the average point cost to book VGF studio over BWV is 25%, that cost of room maintenance will be considerably cheaper for VGF dues $pp each year.

The math for room upkeep could look like this (made up numbers):

VGF daily avg studio upkeep cost $33 divided by 20pt avg cost per night = $1.65 of dues per point

BWV daily avg studio upkeep cost $30 divided by 16pt avg cost per night = $1.88

The same thing happens with wage increases. If it takes a housekeeper 3 hours a week on average per 2BR at a cost $90 (wage, benefits, etc), that cost will be diluted at a resort with a higher average point cost per night. Take something like a 35pt/nt OKW 2BR to 55pt/nt RIV 2BR, OKW will need to spend more money per point. Even if RIV’s need 10% more housekeeping hours per unit, it ends up being a smaller cost dues/point when the rooms require 25 to 40% more points per night.

Sorry if this made things more confusing. It’s meant to show how higher point charts can help lower yearly dues per point.

 

[marmentrout85]

View attachment 904008

The average number of points needed per room size plays a part. My dues per point is much higher at BWV than VGF when you take out the property taxes. It’s something like $5pp VGF and $7pp BWV.

Take a studio. There’s other factors but let’s just look at maintenance to upkeep the physical room. Even if the daily average breakdown of VGF is 10% higher than that of BWV, if the average point cost to book VGF studio over BWV is 25%, that cost of room maintenance will be considerably cheaper for VGF dues $pp each year.

The math for room upkeep could look like this (made up numbers):

VGF daily avg studio upkeep cost $33 divided by 20pt avg cost per night = $1.65 of dues per point

BWV daily avg studio upkeep cost $30 divided by 16pt avg cost per night = $1.88

The same thing happens with wage increases. If it takes a housekeeper 3 hours a week on average per 2BR at a cost $90 (wage, benefits, etc), that cost will be diluted at a resort with a higher average point cost per night. Take something like a 35pt/nt OKW 2BR to 55pt/nt RIV 2BR, OKW will need to spend more money per point. Even if RIV’s need 10% more housekeeping hours per unit, it ends up being a smaller cost dues/point when the rooms require 25 to 40% more points per night.

Sorry if this made things more confusing. It’s meant to show how higher point charts can help lower yearly dues per point.

Makes sense. I'm proud of myself for actually understanding this lol. Also helps paint the picture why the dues are so high at CFW.

 

[Sandisw]

How much do they take in administrative fees? I never read the firms closely. I just keep paying. But fees have kept me from adding more points

DVC takes a straight 12% fee for management of operating costs. Some administrative costs on the dues statement have to do with hotel administration.

 

[Genie+]

Makes sense. I'm proud of myself for actually understanding this lol. Also helps paint the picture why the dues are so high at CFW.

Great. I think you’re right about CFW!

Maybe if Reflections is added and has some very high point categories like Bungalows, CCV Cabins or Penthouses it could eventually help settle the dues down. DVC probably knows something about the future that turns CFW more attractive. The demand to buy would improve If dues don’t increase at the rate of others and amenities get built up.

 

[CastAStone]

DVC takes a straight 12% fee for management of operating costs. Some administrative costs on the dues statement have to do with hotel administration.

I believe it’s less than 12% of dues because the tax portion is considered separately from the 12% fee calculation.

 

[Sandisw]

I believe it’s less than 12% of dues because the tax portion is considered separately from the 12% fee calculation.

That’s why I said the operating costs. Taxes and capital reserves are done separately in the dues breakdown.

 

[nightwing12]

https://dvcnews.com/dvc-program-men...-for-most-walt-disney-world-based-dvc-resorts

 

[disneylandtour]

https://dvcnews.com/dvc-program-men...-for-most-walt-disney-world-based-dvc-resorts

This was posted a few days ago on the thread. I'm pretty sure this means that we'll see $1 to $1.50 increases at a few resorts in MF. There's the underage assessment for 2024, plus a similar or higher raise for 2025, plus the usual.

 

[VGCgroupie]

Dues were announced Nov 6 of last year right? When do we think we will see them released this year?

 

[CastAStone]

Dues were announced Nov 6 of last year right? When do we think we will see them released this year?

Certainly in the next 7-10 days, maybe tomorrow even.