$110,000 in Debt (college)

[LoveBWVVBR]

Well, I'm not so sure on that one. You know even less about the vaue of an engineering degree than you think you do. Engineers are problem solvers--it's very applicable to many, many career paths.

I'll also tell you that engineers that I know, who have left the field, study their new profession at the graduate level--for example, going to law school. So, it's not like they start from ground zero. They've already proved that they have critical thinking skills.

You might want to consider expanding your circle of friends if you think the English Lit department had all the smart kids.

Well said The part about starting a new profession at the graduate level of study is so true too. Thank you for what you said about engineers being problem solvers, too. Again, that is so true. I'm proud to be an engineer, and I love the critical-thinking and problem-solving skills that my degree has afforded me. I also love how easily I can transition from engineering to another profession without having to go back to school.

FWIW, I do have a graduate degree, paid for in full by my previous employer. I've never used it, though, and I likely won't. The engineering degree is what opens the doors in my experience.

 

[Planogirl]

Well said The part about starting a new profession at the graduate level of study is so true too. Thank you for what you said about engineers being problem solvers, too. Again, that is so true. I'm proud to be an engineer, and I love the critical-thinking and problem-solving skills that my degree has afforded me. I also love how easily I can transition from engineering to another profession without having to go back to school.

FWIW, I do have a graduate degree, paid for in full by my previous employer. I've never used it, though, and I likely won't. The engineering degree is what opens the doors in my experience.

That is true if it's the right kind of engineering. Some disciplines are so flexible.

As for paying back student loans, isn't it better for our government to make an investment in people in this way? I can think of far worse things that the government fritters money away on but I suppose that's getting into politics...

 

[StitchandPooh'sMom]

However, if someone majors in Engineering and decides 10 years down the road that it's not for them, they'll have to go back to school and get a different degree since the one they got can only be applied to one career.

As several PPs have pointed out, this is so wrong. I have an engineering degree and so does my DH - he is a plant manager and I am now a SAHM, but worked in a field other than engineering. I got so many unrelated job offers based on my degree and my critical thinking skills.

We have friends with engineering undergrads who are lawyers, doctors, sales reps, business owners, etc. The engineering degree showed that they could handle heavy workloads, advanced calculations, higher level thinking, and general problem solving. Very few of the engineers that we know design things.

DH has hired tons of people over the years - he knows that a candidate with an engineering degree endured four years of rigorous course work and probably has more common sense than the average person.

 

[FINFAN]

Thank you. Someone had to say it.

Like I said earlier, the student loans are going to be the next Fannie Freddie.

And who will pay it? All the people who tried to make wise choices.

kinda like the housing bubble that burst? maybe educational facilities need to look at the insane rising costs as well as how other countries handle upper education. I do not put the blame soley on the students who wish to obtain an education. While this thread is about not gettting inolved over your head in college debt, it is all relative and a vast majority have some sort of debt that really can't be avoided to obtain even a general undergrad degree, yet America wants our students to be competive with other countries. the article below is just a sample of the situation students face.





http://www.usatoday.com/money/perfi/general/2006-02-22-student-loans-usat_x.htm

 

[crisi]

You mean like when people make blanket statements about English majors and how they have few options for careers, especially making more than a salesperson at the mall?

Except I know what I'm talking about -HAVING BEEN OFFERED A JOB AS AN EDITOR THAT PAID ME LESS THAN I WAS MAKING AT THAT TIME IN A MALL.

That was my own experience I was sharing.

 

[klacey1]

You mean like when people make blanket statements about English majors and how they have few options for careers, especially making more than a salesperson at the mall?

It goes both ways. And even if your experience is one thing, don't expect that to apply to everyone within the same degree field.

Disclaimer: I have a degree, but it's not in English OR Engineering! And, although I borrowed a small amount of money to pay for out-of-state tuition (guess I was spoiled since my parents allowed that), it has been paid off for many, many years now.

Thank you for saying this.

Well said The part about starting a new profession at the graduate level of study is so true too. Thank you for what you said about engineers being problem solvers, too. Again, that is so true. I'm proud to be an engineer, and I love the critical-thinking and problem-solving skills that my degree has afforded me. I also love how easily I can transition from engineering to another profession without having to go back to school.

FWIW, I do have a graduate degree, paid for in full by my previous employer. I've never used it, though, and I likely won't. The engineering degree is what opens the doors in my experience.

Well, I'm not so sure on that one. You know even less about the vaue of an engineering degree than you think you do. Engineers are problem solvers--it's very applicable to many, many career paths.

I'll also tell you that engineers that I know, who have left the field, study their new profession at the graduate level--for example, going to law school. So, it's not like they start from ground zero. They've already proved that they have critical thinking skills.

You might want to consider expanding your circle of friends if you think the English Lit department had all the smart kids.

For what it's worth, you all clearly took my Engineering comment out of context. I didn't think before I typed Engineering-- I really meant any career-specific degree. Apparently, engineering is not as career-specific as I believed it to be. I apologize for that. Thank you all for enlightening me. I especially thank you for being so kind and respectful while doing so.
I never said "the English Lit department had all the smart kids." It just so happens that the people in my life that I consider to be the smartest (except for my DBF, who has a degree in History and is one of those people) have degrees in English.
Unlike those of who attacked me, I said everything I said with respect. I never insulted those with a degree in Engineering or said they were unintelligent or they were stupid for picking that major. Again, thank you for telling me about the wealth of opportunities available to Engineering majors.

 

[Muushka]

That is true if it's the right kind of engineering. Some disciplines are so flexible.

As for paying back student loans, isn't it better for our government to make an investment in people in this way? I can think of far worse things that the government fritters money away on but I suppose that's getting into politics...

News flash....the US has NO MONEY. Not even for investing in education.
Do you know how many people with degrees are out of work right now?

kinda like the housing bubble that burst? maybe educational facilities need to look at the insane rising costs as well as how other countries handle upper education. I do not put the blame soley on the students who wish to obtain an education. While this thread is about not gettting inoved your head in college debt, it is all relative and a vast majority have some sort of debt that really can't be avoided to obtain even a general undergrad degree, yet America wants our students to be competive with other countries. the article below is just a sample of the situation students face.





http://www.usatoday.com/money/perfi/general/2006-02-22-student-loans-usat_x.htm

Exactly like the housing bubble that was precipitated by Fannie Freddie giving out loans that they had no business giving out.
And the same thing is happening with education.

I agree 100% that the cost of education is out of control. But nobody ever focuses on that. Look at the scam they run with books. Forcing students to buy new books each semester because the prof decided that the one that came out last year is outdated. While that may be true for some subjects, it sure isn't true for a lot of them. At one point, people will say enough is enough.

 

[mdrob214]

Except I know what I'm talking about -HAVING BEEN OFFERED A JOB AS AN EDITOR THAT PAID ME LESS THAN I WAS MAKING AT THAT TIME IN A MALL.

That was my own experience I was sharing.

Yes, you're correct, although I don't think yelling is necessary. But another editor posted that she had a great paying job, so we have two opposite experiences. Blanket statements like that (and not just yours, but others as well--I'm not singling you out to start an argument) aren't accurate. That's all I was pointing out.

I was enjoying this thread until it turned into a fight over who has the better degree, or whether working moms or SAHM moms are better, etc. I have a daughter who will graduate in 2012. We're dealing with all of this now--how to choose a good school, good career field, etc. I liked some of the information I was reading and wish it would get back on topic.


ETA--that's graduating HS, not college.

 

[LoveBWVVBR]

Look at the scam they run with books. Forcing students to buy new books each semester because the prof decided that the one that came out last year is outdated.

More likely, the prof. wrote or co-wrote the book and gets revenue from the purchases...that was often the case when I was in school At least now students have access to things like half.com, renting textbooks online, etc. Still, though, I agree...the textbook thing is a total scam.

 

[mdrob214]

More likely, the prof. wrote or co-wrote the book and gets revenue from the purchases...that was often the case when I was in school At least now students have access to things like half.com, renting textbooks online, etc. Still, though, I agree...the textbook thing is a total scam.

Textbooks are crazy expensive! Do the book companies give incentives for professors to choose new books more frequently? I have heard that rumor, but not sure how much truth there is to it.

 

[Muushka]

More likely, the prof. wrote or co-wrote the book and gets revenue from the purchases...that was often the case when I was in school At least now students have access to things like half.com, renting textbooks online, etc. Still, though, I agree...the textbook thing is a total scam.

I was being kind, but I think you are right.

Textbooks are crazy expensive! Do the book companies give incentives for professors to choose new books more frequently? I have heard that rumor, but not sure how much truth there is to it.

I heard the same thing. But for some reason, nobody questions it. Poor kids just hand over the $$$.

 

[tasha99]

And who pays back the rest of it? Us taxpayers who had no choice or say?

It's just one more entitlement program. DH and I both worked and lived at home to pay our way through school. We made the decision we would pay for our boys' schooling which we did. So, on top of that we're paying for others to go to school.

I think the idea behind lots of those loan forgiveness programs is recruitment (certainly for the special ed programs). The Income Based Repayment Program, on the other hand, is more about making payments affordable for regular people. Since it stretches payments out 25 years for people not working in public service, it's not likely that people who are actually working wouldn't be able to pay at least a large amount off during that time. I think it sounds like a great way for people to be able to afford their loan payments when they have jobs that may start out small, but build up to a bigger salary.

As for the special ed loan forgiveness, I think it may actually save taxpayers money. Yes payment for these programs is on the taxpayers' back, but the result is that there are more qualified people in service jobs that are needed for our society to function. Think about it--if a school can't get enough, or even any therapists (and I'm planning on moving to Alaska, where almost every school district seems to have one, if not multiple openings for slps), how should the taxpayers educate their children with special needs? Pay for private practice therapists to come in at an hourly wage? Have unqualified people provide the services?

One way to deal with a lack of therapists and special ed teachers would be to raise salaries, but they would have to raise them pretty high to compete with private practice or hospitals. That would cost a lot of taxpayer money as well. I think loan forgiveness is one way to provide a perk that costs the taxpayer less money than increasing salaries, but provides incentives for service jobs.

I also had my tuition waved during grad school because I got a federal grant based on my promise to work with children in an educational setting. There are lots of programs out there if you take the time to access them. And no, it's not "entitlement"--all of those programs are public information, and you apply and make your plans accordingly. I saw this as an opportunity to go back to school now that my kids are older, AND get out to do a job I love. If they were to take these programs away, I would still be okay, but with a loan payment as high as a mortgage, you can bet I'd be in a medical setting at least for the next 10-15 years.

 

[Mrs.Reese]

People with high student loans should choose the income-based repayment plan. This is for Stafford Loans (not private loans--avoid those at all costs!)

Basically, payment is set at a percentage of your income. For most jobs, anything not paid off in 25 years is forgiven. For public sector jobs and non profits (including Americorps and the Peace Corps), anything not paid is forgiven after 10 years.

I had to take out sizeable loans for grad school, so this loan repayment program is one of many factors that has made me decide to pursue a career as a speech language pathologist in public schools rather than in a hospital. I have almost $100,000 in student loans, but between that and other special ed/rural school forgiveness programs, I am estimating I'll only have to pay about a third of it back.

I read the article posted a while ago, but if I remember correctly, the writer took private loans. That's something I think almost everyone should avoid.

I agree private loans = bad. I took out $20,000 to get my master's in special education. After five years of teaching special ed, whatever I have left on my loans will be paid off. These kinds of programs are great but they do have strict requirements on them. I would advise any person that's considering any of repayment program to research the requirements very carefully. For my repayment it's FIVE continuous years of teaching special education. That's a pretty tall order considering it's somewhere around 50% of all teachers leave by year 5.

 

[Planogirl]

News flash....the US has NO MONEY. Not even for investing in education.
Do you know how many people with degrees are out of work right now?

Here's another newsflash. I know. I was speaking in general terms.

Besides what is the actual default rate. In my line of work, I see people who had student loans and paid them back more often than I see defaults.

 

[FINFAN]

In our family. we look at college as hiring a business. Our hard earned cash pays for their services of educating and training. We select the school, hire them , pay the bill and hopefully find meaningful employment in the field that was just invested in. Too many students go in thinking they are still in the high school phase and the school is the boss not the other way around. Research is huge, and one on one conversations and discussions to make sure your "hire" the best place are vital to your education/ end result. Seek out Alumni and prior teachers, scour the internet for reviews, contact companies you would like to work for and get thier opinion of the value of an education from schools...look up all the courses you will be required to take and ask yourself if that course is worth the $$$ you will be paying. This frame of mind has helped us to focus on the best bang for the buck, best investment..just like any other major/huge purchase in life. Of course flexibilty, realistic goals/requirements and compromise come into play, just like anything in life. Our high school, counselors, meeting..yadda yadda, none of them ever presented this point of view at any meeeting I was present at and I wish they would. I think students who view themselves as more in control from the get go feel a bit more empowered in the rest of their decisions both financial and educational. Maybe then things like overpriced textbooks, supplies, housing for that matter will be held more accountable if students feel like they have a little bit more equal footing on the reason they are there in the first place...not just because college is something you do after high school.

 

[maggiew]

I agree 100% that the cost of education is out of control. But nobody ever focuses on that. Look at the scam they run with books. Forcing students to buy new books each semester because the prof decided that the one that came out last year is outdated. While that may be true for some subjects, it sure isn't true for a lot of them. At one point, people will say enough is enough.

Let me just say, as a college professor, that we do not force students to purchase new books because the one from last year is outdated!!! It is the publishers who come out with new textbooks each year! Then, they do not allow you to use an older version once the new one is out.

Believe me, I pay close attention to the price of textbooks that I require my students to purchase. I quit using one particular book because the author kept coming out with new versions each year (after not changing much). So I switched to a book that has pledged to only update every three years - which allows the used book market to go on for at least 3 years. I also choose a soft cover book instead of the hard cover book for cost reasons (even though they are usually slightly different). For some courses, I don't require a book at all because either 1) all books are too expensive IMHO for non-majors taking a course for one quarter or 2) good information can be found freely elsewhere.


In addition, I get no "kickbacks" for choosing any particular book. I have never heard of such a thing.

Maggie

 

[FINFAN]

Let me just say, as a college professor, that we do not force students to purchase new books because the one from last year is outdated!!! It is the publishers who come out with new textbooks each year! Then, they do not allow you to use an older version once the new one is out.

Believe me, I pay close attention to the price of textbooks that I require my students to purchase. I quit using one particular book because the author kept coming out with new versions each year (after not changing much). So I switched to a book that has pledged to only update every three years - which allows the used book market to go on for at least 3 years. I also choose a soft cover book instead of the hard cover book for cost reasons (even though they are usually slightly different). For some courses, I don't require a book at all because either 1) all books are too expensive IMHO for non-majors taking a course for one quarter or 2) good information can be found freely elsewhere.

Maggie

see? Speaking with teachers/professors is always a source of valuable info. Here's hoping Maggies methods are widespread.

 

[BuzznBelle'smom]

For what it's worth, you all clearly took my Engineering comment out of context. I didn't think before I typed Engineering-- I really meant any career-specific degree. Apparently, engineering is not as career-specific as I believed it to be. I apologize for that. Thank you all for enlightening me. I especially thank you for being so kind and respectful while doing so.
I never said "the English Lit department had all the smart kids." It just so happens that the people in my life that I consider to be the smartest (except for my DBF, who has a degree in History and is one of those people) have degrees in English.
Unlike those of who attacked me, I said everything I said with respect. I never insulted those with a degree in Engineering or said they were unintelligent or they were stupid for picking that major. Again, thank you for telling me about the wealth of opportunities available to Engineering majors.

You know, since several posters "took you out of context", it might be worth your while to go back and see what you typed, versus what you might have meant. You said that the English Lit people were the smartest people you know. That may be true--I'm just suggesting you widen your circle, because every field has smart people (and blinding idiots--no one group has cornered THAT market, either!). As it happens, my sister majored in English Lit and works at a call center. My degree's in engineering, and I'm a SAHM. We're both happy with our choices.

I don't think anyone has attacked you--just pointed out that you don't know what you're talking about. You may have pulled engineering out of thin air--just a building you walked by when you crossed campus--and I get that. But, you don't know what you don't know. Go pick on the architects! (Kidding!)

And I shout-out to the other engineers-turned-SAHMs on this thread.

 

[LoveBWVVBR]

And I shout-out to the other engineers-turned-SAHMs on this thread.

Hey

 

[StitchandPooh'sMom]

And I shout-out to the other engineers-turned-SAHMs on this thread.