You must be swift as the coursing river (as long as it's the Lazy River) - comments welcome
- Thread starter WillRunForPizza
- Start date
WillRunForPizza
DIS Veteran
- Joined
- Apr 20, 2022
- Messages
- 1,470
April 21 - 27, 2025
5K training week 5 | 20 days until Hero Dogs 5K9
In which I feel optimistic about my training! Briefly...
With a parkrun since I did threshold hills last week.
Monday
Easy/hill strides: 5.1 miles (10:17), avg. HR 150, max 186, 88% Z1-2
Core
My legs felt quite heavy for the first mile. But after that, it felt like things were trending more towards normal. Not actually normal, mind you, but I did see a lot more 140s HR than I have in a while, and my HR only got to the top of Z2 when I was running easy uphill instead of drifting into Z3. At this point I will take any positive signs.
When I got back, it was time for the Boston Marathon! I love watching that race, even when the coverage leaves something to be desired. Someday I will run it.
Tuesday
Workout: 7 x 3 min @ 5KP/2 min RI + 5 min RI + 1.2 miles @ MP
Total: 10.7 miles, avg. HR 159, max 192
Lower body strength
Considering how my training has been going, I was a little nervous about this workout. It was my first attempt at 5K pace, and I was really tired of being 30-60s slow on everything. Plus, it was warmer than it's been in a while, and I wasn't quite sure how that would go either. (T+D~130, which in a few months will feel pleasantly cool but for now is pretty hot.)
I decided to head for a relatively flat stretch of (paved) trail to give myself the best chance of success. All the 5Ks I'm running are flat, so I thought it made the most sense too. This entailed a longer-than-usual warm-up so I could get to the trail, but I tried to keep it super-easy, other than a few strides. (Pre-workout strides mean I can be ready to go on the first interval instead of taking the first interval for my body to remember how to run fast.)
Once I got to the mostly-flat trail, I took off way too fast (which I'm sure is a huge surprise to everyone). I was supposed to be running 6:29 pace, but the first rep was at 6:12 (6:08 GAP), which is basically 3K pace. Oops!
But I actually managed to dial it in better after that, and ended up running 6:31 pace on average (which might be the only useful thing Strava AI has ever told me).
I had originally written 60s recoveries, but I double-checked my workout guidelines and they said 50-100% rest for 5K pace, so I changed it to 2 minutes. I'm glad I did that because if I hadn't, I probably would have been dead after about 3 reps. The reps still got progressively harder as it was. I almost stopped after 6 because I felt like I was dying, but I convinced myself that #7 would be easier because I had a tailwind that way. (I don't know about easier; I felt like I might puke by the end. But I did it.
) The goal was 6-8, so I was pretty happy with that.
I gave myself the full rep #8 + most of the rest interval to recover before jumping into M pace, which might be kind of cheating but I needed it. And for once, M pace actually felt pretty comfortable. I thought about keeping it up for longer because I still had a couple more miles before I got home, but then I came to a hill and I was like, "Nah."
So that went about as well as I could have hoped. Maybe my running really is starting to get back to normal!
I didn't feel quite ready for squats yet, but I managed to add back single leg deadlifts and Bulgarian split squats (which despite their name are really more like lunges). Progress.
Wednesday
Recovery: 5 miles (10:23), avg. HR 144, max 157, 100% Z1-2
Upper body strength
Actually felt okay. Then in the afternoon I was exhausted. Maybe just leftover tiredness from Tuesday.
Thursday
Medium-long/hill strides: 10.7 miles (9:47), avg. HR 150, max 183, 92% Z1-2*
Pilates
*I am a little skeptical of this HR data. I think the battery on my armband was dying.
It occurred to me that perhaps the road to not-terrible 5K racing did not include a medium-long run the day before, so I switched Thursday and Friday. I actually felt good, so instead of doing 9 miles like I planned, I turned around at 5 miles so I could do 10 total. (I forgot to include running up and down a hill at the end into my running math, which is how I then ended up with 10.7 miles.) I wasn't trying to do a progression one, but it kind of ended up as a baby progression by accident.
I decided to change it up with the strength training too and focus mostly on the lower body. With the resistance band, my hips were crying by the end.
I threw in a few bicep curls and tricep extension too just for fun, because my routine on Wednesday didn't include them.
Friday
Easy/strides: 6.9 miles (9:53), avg. HR 145, max 177, 96 % Z1-2
Core
My legs did feel kind of tired, but I charged my armband, so this HR data should be legit! Hopefully I really am getting closer to normal.
Saturday
Long: 3.8 mile WU + parkrun + 4.3 mile CD
Or not.
Look, I was not thinking I would be running at 6:31 pace for this 5K, even though I averaged that pace through ~5.5K of intervals on Tuesday. But going into the parkrun, I thought somewhere in the 6:45-6:55 was plausible. I would have been satisfied with a 21:30 under the conditions, which were similar to Tuesday's. (Of course the warmest, most humid days of the week were the ones when I wanted to run fast.)
As I was jogging to Fletcher's Cove where the parkrun takes place, my legs felt pretty tired again. That's not so unusual for a warm-up, though, so I didn't worry too much about it.
It was also rather muddy, having rained overnight and drizzled on and off throughout the morning, so that was fun. At least the crushed gravel on the towpath tends not to get too slippery. Because of the mud, rather than my Metaspeed Edge Paris, I had decided to wear my older Novablasts that have 400 miles on them. Not the best choice for speed, but I didn't want to get my $250 shoes all messy.
Anyway, I had read about a pre-race strategy called priming a while back, and I wanted to give it a try. Once you're warmed up, you run for 4-6 minutes at race pace to get your legs ready to run at that pace. To give yourself time to recover, you want to do this well before the race starts. So on the way to the start line around 8:15, I did 3 minutes (4 seemed like a lot) at an average 6:47 pace. It felt kind of hard, but I thought maybe it was supposed to? Kind of like the first rep is sometimes a shock to the system and then the rest are okay.
I got to Fletcher's Cove around 8:30, which was way too early. There really wasn't anything to do except wait around. The volunteers with the banners and things finally showed up around 8:50, and the briefing didn't even start until after 9. I really just wanted to get on with it, but parkruns are free so I can't complain too much.
I lined up near the front to try to avoid some of the chaos at the beginning, and we were sent off by a couple of kids with cowbells, which was not a bad way to start a race. After the first rush, I settled in right around 7 min/mile, which seemed okay. I was slowed a bit trying to dodge the worst of the puddles, at which I was only moderately successful. I was briefly the first female, but another woman passed me early on. I could still see her not too far ahead of me, though. The first mile came it at 6:59, and I was not excited about the pace but not too unhappy. There was still plenty of time left, and I still felt reasonably good.
That did not last long.
By the time we hit the turnaround, I was hurting. At that point, the woman in first was maybe 20 meters ahead of me, but she started to slip away as I faded. Mile 2 came in at 7:06. I just did not have enough left in the tank. By the middle of mile 3 I was struggling running 7:30-8 min/mile. I ended up running mile 3 in 7:36 before picking it up a tiny bit in the last 0.1 miles (7:22). I ended up running a 22:33, at least a minute slower than I'd thought I could.
So that was a disappointment, to say the least. You would think I would be able to run what is supposed to be my 60-minute race pace for 21-ish minutes, even training through it. But instead I averaged 8 seconds/mile slower than HM pace, which...sucks. Maybe you can attribute some of that to the puddles, the heat/humidity, the less-than-speedy surface, the worn-out daily trainers...but not that much. I just didn't have it. That was my worst performance in quite a while.
In hindsight, sure, I obviously went out too fast - you don't plan for your third mile to be >30 seconds slower than your first mile. But I really don't think I would have done it differently knowing what I knew at the start. Why would I have thought I would run slower in a 5K than in a half marathon? So I don't even know that I really learned anything from the experience other than that my running is a mess right now. I thought that this week showed signs of improvement, but I guess not so much.
I don't think there's really anything else to say about it. I slogged home and felt sad. The end.
Sunday
Yoga
I was mostly over my pity party by morning. And when I was doing yoga, I could actually go all the way down into a full squat, which I haven't been able to do in weeks, so that was something.
Totals
Running: 8h 5m, 49.7 miles
Strength/mobility: 2h 21m
Total: 10h 26m
I did do significantly more this week than previous weeks, so maybe I am getting better but then my body got tripped up a bit by the higher workload. Who knows.
NSAID protocol update
You might remember that last week, I decided to try taking ibuprofen for a week to see if it would help my knee/ankle. I think it actually worked? My ankle is not quite 100% but definitely better, and my knee seems to have pretty much recovered. So I guess if you have persistent - or acute - minor issues, it's worth a try.
Coming up
Probably. We'll see how it all feels.
5K training week 5 | 20 days until Hero Dogs 5K9
In which I feel optimistic about my training! Briefly...
With a parkrun since I did threshold hills last week.
Monday
Easy/hill strides: 5.1 miles (10:17), avg. HR 150, max 186, 88% Z1-2
Core
My legs felt quite heavy for the first mile. But after that, it felt like things were trending more towards normal. Not actually normal, mind you, but I did see a lot more 140s HR than I have in a while, and my HR only got to the top of Z2 when I was running easy uphill instead of drifting into Z3. At this point I will take any positive signs.
When I got back, it was time for the Boston Marathon! I love watching that race, even when the coverage leaves something to be desired. Someday I will run it.
Tuesday
Workout: 7 x 3 min @ 5KP/2 min RI + 5 min RI + 1.2 miles @ MP
Total: 10.7 miles, avg. HR 159, max 192
Lower body strength
Considering how my training has been going, I was a little nervous about this workout. It was my first attempt at 5K pace, and I was really tired of being 30-60s slow on everything. Plus, it was warmer than it's been in a while, and I wasn't quite sure how that would go either. (T+D~130, which in a few months will feel pleasantly cool but for now is pretty hot.)
I decided to head for a relatively flat stretch of (paved) trail to give myself the best chance of success. All the 5Ks I'm running are flat, so I thought it made the most sense too. This entailed a longer-than-usual warm-up so I could get to the trail, but I tried to keep it super-easy, other than a few strides. (Pre-workout strides mean I can be ready to go on the first interval instead of taking the first interval for my body to remember how to run fast.)
Once I got to the mostly-flat trail, I took off way too fast (which I'm sure is a huge surprise to everyone). I was supposed to be running 6:29 pace, but the first rep was at 6:12 (6:08 GAP), which is basically 3K pace. Oops!
But I actually managed to dial it in better after that, and ended up running 6:31 pace on average (which might be the only useful thing Strava AI has ever told me).I had originally written 60s recoveries, but I double-checked my workout guidelines and they said 50-100% rest for 5K pace, so I changed it to 2 minutes. I'm glad I did that because if I hadn't, I probably would have been dead after about 3 reps. The reps still got progressively harder as it was. I almost stopped after 6 because I felt like I was dying, but I convinced myself that #7 would be easier because I had a tailwind that way. (I don't know about easier; I felt like I might puke by the end. But I did it.
) The goal was 6-8, so I was pretty happy with that.I gave myself the full rep #8 + most of the rest interval to recover before jumping into M pace, which might be kind of cheating but I needed it. And for once, M pace actually felt pretty comfortable. I thought about keeping it up for longer because I still had a couple more miles before I got home, but then I came to a hill and I was like, "Nah."
So that went about as well as I could have hoped. Maybe my running really is starting to get back to normal!
I didn't feel quite ready for squats yet, but I managed to add back single leg deadlifts and Bulgarian split squats (which despite their name are really more like lunges). Progress.
Wednesday
Recovery: 5 miles (10:23), avg. HR 144, max 157, 100% Z1-2
Upper body strength
Actually felt okay. Then in the afternoon I was exhausted. Maybe just leftover tiredness from Tuesday.
Thursday
Medium-long/hill strides: 10.7 miles (9:47), avg. HR 150, max 183, 92% Z1-2*
Pilates
*I am a little skeptical of this HR data. I think the battery on my armband was dying.
It occurred to me that perhaps the road to not-terrible 5K racing did not include a medium-long run the day before, so I switched Thursday and Friday. I actually felt good, so instead of doing 9 miles like I planned, I turned around at 5 miles so I could do 10 total. (I forgot to include running up and down a hill at the end into my running math, which is how I then ended up with 10.7 miles.) I wasn't trying to do a progression one, but it kind of ended up as a baby progression by accident.
I decided to change it up with the strength training too and focus mostly on the lower body. With the resistance band, my hips were crying by the end.
I threw in a few bicep curls and tricep extension too just for fun, because my routine on Wednesday didn't include them.Friday
Easy/strides: 6.9 miles (9:53), avg. HR 145, max 177, 96 % Z1-2
Core
My legs did feel kind of tired, but I charged my armband, so this HR data should be legit! Hopefully I really am getting closer to normal.
Saturday
Long: 3.8 mile WU + parkrun + 4.3 mile CD
Or not.
Look, I was not thinking I would be running at 6:31 pace for this 5K, even though I averaged that pace through ~5.5K of intervals on Tuesday. But going into the parkrun, I thought somewhere in the 6:45-6:55 was plausible. I would have been satisfied with a 21:30 under the conditions, which were similar to Tuesday's. (Of course the warmest, most humid days of the week were the ones when I wanted to run fast.)
As I was jogging to Fletcher's Cove where the parkrun takes place, my legs felt pretty tired again. That's not so unusual for a warm-up, though, so I didn't worry too much about it.
It was also rather muddy, having rained overnight and drizzled on and off throughout the morning, so that was fun. At least the crushed gravel on the towpath tends not to get too slippery. Because of the mud, rather than my Metaspeed Edge Paris, I had decided to wear my older Novablasts that have 400 miles on them. Not the best choice for speed, but I didn't want to get my $250 shoes all messy.
Anyway, I had read about a pre-race strategy called priming a while back, and I wanted to give it a try. Once you're warmed up, you run for 4-6 minutes at race pace to get your legs ready to run at that pace. To give yourself time to recover, you want to do this well before the race starts. So on the way to the start line around 8:15, I did 3 minutes (4 seemed like a lot) at an average 6:47 pace. It felt kind of hard, but I thought maybe it was supposed to? Kind of like the first rep is sometimes a shock to the system and then the rest are okay.
I got to Fletcher's Cove around 8:30, which was way too early. There really wasn't anything to do except wait around. The volunteers with the banners and things finally showed up around 8:50, and the briefing didn't even start until after 9. I really just wanted to get on with it, but parkruns are free so I can't complain too much.
I lined up near the front to try to avoid some of the chaos at the beginning, and we were sent off by a couple of kids with cowbells, which was not a bad way to start a race. After the first rush, I settled in right around 7 min/mile, which seemed okay. I was slowed a bit trying to dodge the worst of the puddles, at which I was only moderately successful. I was briefly the first female, but another woman passed me early on. I could still see her not too far ahead of me, though. The first mile came it at 6:59, and I was not excited about the pace but not too unhappy. There was still plenty of time left, and I still felt reasonably good.
That did not last long.
By the time we hit the turnaround, I was hurting. At that point, the woman in first was maybe 20 meters ahead of me, but she started to slip away as I faded. Mile 2 came in at 7:06. I just did not have enough left in the tank. By the middle of mile 3 I was struggling running 7:30-8 min/mile. I ended up running mile 3 in 7:36 before picking it up a tiny bit in the last 0.1 miles (7:22). I ended up running a 22:33, at least a minute slower than I'd thought I could.
So that was a disappointment, to say the least. You would think I would be able to run what is supposed to be my 60-minute race pace for 21-ish minutes, even training through it. But instead I averaged 8 seconds/mile slower than HM pace, which...sucks. Maybe you can attribute some of that to the puddles, the heat/humidity, the less-than-speedy surface, the worn-out daily trainers...but not that much. I just didn't have it. That was my worst performance in quite a while.
In hindsight, sure, I obviously went out too fast - you don't plan for your third mile to be >30 seconds slower than your first mile. But I really don't think I would have done it differently knowing what I knew at the start. Why would I have thought I would run slower in a 5K than in a half marathon? So I don't even know that I really learned anything from the experience other than that my running is a mess right now. I thought that this week showed signs of improvement, but I guess not so much.
I don't think there's really anything else to say about it. I slogged home and felt sad. The end.
Sunday
Yoga
I was mostly over my pity party by morning. And when I was doing yoga, I could actually go all the way down into a full squat, which I haven't been able to do in weeks, so that was something.
Totals
Running: 8h 5m, 49.7 miles
Strength/mobility: 2h 21m
Total: 10h 26m
I did do significantly more this week than previous weeks, so maybe I am getting better but then my body got tripped up a bit by the higher workload. Who knows.
NSAID protocol update
You might remember that last week, I decided to try taking ibuprofen for a week to see if it would help my knee/ankle. I think it actually worked? My ankle is not quite 100% but definitely better, and my knee seems to have pretty much recovered. So I guess if you have persistent - or acute - minor issues, it's worth a try.
Coming up
Probably. We'll see how it all feels.
Attachments
avondale
DIS Veteran
- Joined
- Oct 24, 2017
- Messages
- 1,978
Someday soon!
Or the time over the week just healed it with the help of a dose of placebo effect? Count me skeptical with an experiment of one.
Sorry to hear about your 5k. Seems like a bad day following a not-so-great week.
Are you thinking about another try? Although you would probably do it soon. I'm thinking of doing a local 5k the weekend of Aug 2/3. Haven't picked a race yet. This is a lot of time to train for it, but I'm going to do a bit of base-building and then I have some vacation in the middle there. It's mostly something to keep me moving this summer when I can't handle the T+D for much more, plus I really should work on some speed.
GollyGadget
DIS Veteran
- Joined
- Feb 15, 2017
- Messages
- 2,126
Bad runs are the worst. At least you've got plenty of room for improvement for the "real" thing!
WillRunForPizza
DIS Veteran
- Joined
- Apr 20, 2022
- Messages
- 1,470
Also possible. However, both issues had been lingering for quite some time, and both improved significantly with the ibuprofen, so I think it's plausible there's something there.
I'm doing a road 5K in the middle of May (Hero Dogs 5K9) and a track 5K at the end of May (Tracksmith Twilight 5000). Hoping I will be better at those.
Doing a local race in early August sounds...rough. 
RuntheMouse
DIS Veteran
- Joined
- Apr 11, 2022
- Messages
- 1,327
Sorry your park run didn’t go as you hoped 
but happy to read your running overall is heading towards normal for you!
I have no doubt you’ll run Boston someday!
but happy to read your running overall is heading towards normal for you!I have no doubt you’ll run Boston someday!
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