XXI Olympic Winter Olympics Games Thread

[EMom]

I've never been a fan of Pleshenko. Yes, he can jump, but he lacks the grace and style many Russian skaters have. In between those big jumps, he flails his arms about and is anything but smooth. Last night, on several of his landings, he wobbled and barely made it. He counts in those jumps to make up for what he lacks in the other areas and it didn't work last night. As another poster said.....and the same words came out of my mouth as I chatted with DH last night......If this was figure JUMPING instead of figure SKATING, Pleshenko might have won. His spins had all the speed of a camel. Let's face it, it was NOT his best skate by a long shot. Winning a silver is nothing to be ashamed of, but he made an *** of himself by being as ungracious as he could. Maybe he wobbled on those landings because his oversized head threw him off balance.

I do think Johnny Weir should have finished a bit higher and was somewhat disappointed in that, but I'll live.

 

[FINFAN]

While I agree that Weir got a lot lower score then he should have, I have to disagree that Evan's was worthy of gold. I tend to agree with Elvis Stojko in his article.

http://sports.yahoo.com/olympics/va...ws?slug=es-thoughts021810&prov=yhoo&type=lgns

I want to see the guys out there doing the big jumps. I like the big wow factor. But I do also like clean lines. I still dislike that the skaters don't have to do the figures of the old days. You may not have been great at them, but you had to be able to do them with a fair amount of skill. There are so many times you hear about skaters and their sloppy footwork and good footwork comes from hours of working on the figures.

I don't want artsy-fartsy from the guys, leave all the softness to the women. Guys, give me a routine that knocks my socks off. Someone needs to thrust out their chest and give us another D'Artagnan, because that was a knock your socks off routine.

ITA. I'm from Naperville and I have had enough Evan coverage to last a lifetime.I mean, come on, the guy lives in LA...not here. Even the rink he used to train at years ago did not have a lot of confidence in him to win. I did not like Pleshenkos comments at all, did not show sportsmanship at all...but in all honesty, to me Evan won by the lack of performance that his competitors gave, not by the "gold" performance he gave. The guy lacks the "it" factor to me. And he needs to lay off the tanning beds or spray booths...orange is not a good look for him...especially when choosing black costumes...keeps reminding me of Halloween with the orange and black.

 

[EMom]

I don't want artsy-fartsy from the guys, leave all the softness to the women. Guys, give me a routine that knocks my socks off. Someone needs to thrust out their chest and give us another D'Artagnan, because that was a knock your socks off routine.

At some point, I said to DH, "No one will ever touch Philippe Candeloro," meaning no performance will ever top that one. (Obviously, I am a big fan.....I saved his YouTube videos. ) Then I muttered under my breath, "God knows I'd like to have touched him."

ETA: Even does need to run away from the spray tan machine.

 

[Deb in IA]

As a former skater, I feel that the right man won last night. If it were "figure jumping" then Plushenko would have won. It is "figure skating" and the new scoring system takes all the moves in to account when the scoring is done. In the past, under the old system if you out jumped your competition you generally won. Under the new system ( which, by the way is FAR from perfect) the footwork sequences and spins are now looked with more scrutiny.

Plushenko's jumps WERE harder than Evan's, but if you look closely at the landings and the "run out" following each jump, Evan's were done cleaner and with more finesse. Plushenko does a lot of standing around, preening, and blowing kisses to the judges....almost 20 seconds worth if you time it all. In those 20 seconds Evan was SKATING and doing footwork.

If you look at arm movements, Plushenko flaps his arms a lot...which makes you look at his arms and not his feet during footwork sequences. Evan's arms were less distracting which makes his feet look better.

Evan's spins were much more centered than Plushenko's and he seemed to spin faster, all of which is now taken into consideration.


Linda

While I'm no skater, I agree totally!

They showed a lot of Plushenko's jumps in slow motion last night, and Scotty Hamilton was pointing out how tilted and awkward they were, and how they were poorly landed. Yes, he had a quad, but Lysacek's jumps were a lot smoother and cleaner.

Now, what I don't agree with is Jonnny Weir's score. I thought it was too low. He only had one bobble (on a spin, where he caught a ridge in the ice), and otherwise it was a clean performance. He certainly has choreography and personality to spare, and his skating was clean. I though he should have been in at least 3rd or 4th, instead of the 6th he got.

By the way, did you see him GLARE at the ice after his bobble? HILARIOUS, like, "how DARE you trip me up?"

 

[Deb in IA]

Oh, yeah, and Plushenko is such a sore loser. Stalking off after the final scores, and glowering though the medal ceremony.

Makes me glad he didn't win.

 

[suejai]

Okay, so I'm not a big hockey fan, despite being a Canadian hockey mom, so could someone explain how the groupings work for the Olympics. I guess what I'm asking is when Canada and the US play on Sunday is the loser out of contention for a medal, are they just knocked out completely....? Thanks.

 

[declansdad]

Okay, so I'm not a big hockey fan, despite being a Canadian hockey mom, so could someone explain how the groupings work for the Olympics. I guess what I'm asking is when Canada and the US play on Sunday is the loser out of contention for a medal, are they just knocked out completely....? Thanks.

The winner will get a bye to the quarter-final game while the loser will need to play another game to get in.

After preliminary play, the top 4 teams get the bye while the other 8 will play for the last four spots.

 

[zachnsamsmommy]

As a former skater, I feel that the right man won last night. If it were "figure jumping" then Plushenko would have won. It is "figure skating" and the new scoring system takes all the moves in to account when the scoring is done. In the past, under the old system if you out jumped your competition you generally won. Under the new system ( which, by the way is FAR from perfect) the footwork sequences and spins are now looked with more scrutiny.

Plushenko's jumps WERE harder than Evan's, but if you look closely at the landings and the "run out" following each jump, Evan's were done cleaner and with more finesse. Plushenko does a lot of standing around, preening, and blowing kisses to the judges....almost 20 seconds worth if you time it all. In those 20 seconds Evan was SKATING and doing footwork.

If you look at arm movements, Plushenko flaps his arms a lot...which makes you look at his arms and not his feet during footwork sequences. Evan's arms were less distracting which makes his feet look better.

Evan's spins were much more centered than Plushenko's and he seemed to spin faster, all of which is now taken into consideration.

Although figures are no longer done in competition, the skaters who are moving up in the ranks now do something called "moves in the field" which combine footwork elements and pieces of the former figures. These were implemented to get up and coming skaters to focus more on footwork. Many of the footwork sequences used by the skaters incorporate these moves.

Now, the new scoring system is flawed in that it DOES put too much emphasis on packing a program full of stuff to get points. In a way the system designed to bring more artistry that can be measured and scored has taken it away. But, a well choreographed and constructed program like the ones we saw last night, that put emphasis on both the high scoring jumps the beautiful footwork and spins is beautiful to watch.

There has been much criticism of Evan not attempting a quad. A well done triple-triple combination scores more points than a poorly attempted and possibly not landed quad. If there is gold on the line, I just might play it on the safer side and go for what I know I can do well rather than risk not getting any points at all.

All in all, it was an amazing competition. Now on to Ice Dancing!!!

Linda

ITA...even though I am no expert, and have no actual 'skating experience'. From my very amateurist view, and I watched both men skate...I definately thought Pleshenko had more 'technical' jumps (ie the quad), but that his landings were not graceful. I also thought his footwork to be just so-so. Now I did not think Evan's was as technical (ie no quad) as Pleshenko's, but the landings were much more graceful and the footwork much better.

I wanted Evan to win, but I wasn't sure how it would be scored out. I didn't know if quad+slight bobble was better than triple+good footwork. I honestly thought it could go either way. Now that I know more about the scoring, I do think Evan should have one the gold.

Now Weir...I did think his performance was better than 6th, but then again, he wasn't as graceful and his footwork not near as complicated as the skaters who finished above him. Tough call...IMO.

Sorry to bring this up late...but I was gone all morning...

 

[LJC1861]

Johnny Weir's program was not as technical as some of the other skaters for many reasons.

Footwork. Good footwork involves many quick steps with many changes of edge and direction. Johnny's was more flowing with more time between turns. The judges are also looking for things done on both feet and turning in both directions. Most of us, and most skaters jump and turn better in one direction. For a skater to turn equally well in both directions takes practice. Also most of us have a dominant foot. Skaters are more comfortable on that dominant foot and the judges are looking to see that they are using both feet equally well.

Spins. Johnny's spins were beautiful, but did not have as many changes in position as the others. Also, many of the skaters are now spinning in both directions....something that takes lots of practice to do effortlessly and Johnny does not.

Jumps. Johnny skated the performance of his life last night, but the overall technical quality of his jumps was not as high as the skaters who came in 4th and 5th. The judges are also looking for jumps added after the halfway mark for the "bonus points" and Johnny basically front loaded his jumps in the first half.

Lastly, Johnny has done a lot over the years to disrespect the judges and basically the USFSA and ISU (the governing bodies of skating) As much as that shouldn't play into any decision made on the Olympic ice, word does get around that he is 'controversial' and 'different'. Even with the new scoring system there is still room for some subjectivity in the second part of the score ( I can't remember what exactly they are calling it now). They can wiggle a bit if they don't like the costume, or the music or in Johnny's case the attitude and presentation of the skater. They can also award points if they feel the opposite. This was MUCH More prevalent under the old scoring system, but does still exist with the new system. In a sport that often comes down to fractions of a point between first and second, it only takes a tiny bit of subjective judging to affect a skater's overall score. I truly believe that this is what happened in Johnny's case. He was marked down a bit for his past performances and antics.

I admire him for being himself, despite what everyone wants him to do. I think he is one of the most interesting skaters that has come along in years!

Linda

 

[suejai]

The winner will get a bye to the quarter-final game while the loser will need to play another game to get in.

After preliminary play, the top 4 teams get the bye while the other 8 will play for the last four spots.

Got it. Thanks declansdad

 

[dturner]

and then you see stories like these and all I can do is :

What a sore sport!!!

Plushenko: Lysacek not a champion without quad

http://www.nbcolympics.com/news-features/news/newsid=430590.html?__source=msnhomepage&GT1=39003

 

[declansdad]

and then you see stories like these and all I can do is :

What a sore sport!!!

Plushenko: Lysacek not a champion without quad

http://www.nbcolympics.com/news-features/news/newsid=430590.html?__source=msnhomepage&GT1=39003

He has always been a cry-baby.

 

[OK!]

For anybody who may care, the goalie in net for Belarus today, Andrei Mezin, was also the Belarusian goalie in 2002 when they upset Sweden in Salt Lake City. The outcry in Sweden was HUGE. Tommy Salo, the Swedish goalie, received death threats after the Games ended, and there was a full-page feature in one of the newspapers there that had the Olympic photos of all of the Swedish players beneath the headline "Wanted for Crimes Against the State."

But back to Mezin, I had no idea he was still playing. Good for him!

Sweden's up 1-0 with 13 minutes remaining in the 1st.

 

[Deb in IA]

Johnny Weir's program was not as technical as some of the other skaters for many reasons.

Footwork. Good footwork involves many quick steps with many changes of edge and direction. Johnny's was more flowing with more time between turns. The judges are also looking for things done on both feet and turning in both directions. Most of us, and most skaters jump and turn better in one direction. For a skater to turn equally well in both directions takes practice. Also most of us have a dominant foot. Skaters are more comfortable on that dominant foot and the judges are looking to see that they are using both feet equally well.

Spins. Johnny's spins were beautiful, but did not have as many changes in position as the others. Also, many of the skaters are now spinning in both directions....something that takes lots of practice to do effortlessly and Johnny does not.

Jumps. Johnny skated the performance of his life last night, but the overall technical quality of his jumps was not as high as the skaters who came in 4th and 5th. The judges are also looking for jumps added after the halfway mark for the "bonus points" and Johnny basically front loaded his jumps in the first half.

Lastly, Johnny has done a lot over the years to disrespect the judges and basically the USFSA and ISU (the governing bodies of skating) As much as that shouldn't play into any decision made on the Olympic ice, word does get around that he is 'controversial' and 'different'. Even with the new scoring system there is still room for some subjectivity in the second part of the score ( I can't remember what exactly they are calling it now). They can wiggle a bit if they don't like the costume, or the music or in Johnny's case the attitude and presentation of the skater. They can also award points if they feel the opposite. This was MUCH More prevalent under the old scoring system, but does still exist with the new system. In a sport that often comes down to fractions of a point between first and second, it only takes a tiny bit of subjective judging to affect a skater's overall score. I truly believe that this is what happened in Johnny's case. He was marked down a bit for his past performances and antics.

I admire him for being himself, despite what everyone wants him to do. I think he is one of the most interesting skaters that has come along in years!

Linda

Ah, thanks for explaining this. I can totally see now how Johnny got his scores. Personally, I like his nonconformity too. It seems that he is taking his skating more seriously now, and working and practicing harder than he ever did. Too bad he can't get points for that.

 

[LJC1861]

Deb,

He IS taking his skating much more seriously now, and I think his new coaches Galina Smevskya and Viktor Petrenko do have a lot to do with it. He is amazingly talented and when he finishes competing he is really going to light up whichever tour he lands on. Personally I would love to see him do Stars On Ice as I think they encourage creativity and being different more so than the Tom Collins Champions on Ice tour does.

Linda

 

[DVC~OKW~96]

Johnny Weir's program was not as technical as some of the other skaters for many reasons.

Footwork. Good footwork involves many quick steps with many changes of edge and direction. Johnny's was more flowing with more time between turns. The judges are also looking for things done on both feet and turning in both directions. Most of us, and most skaters jump and turn better in one direction. For a skater to turn equally well in both directions takes practice. Also most of us have a dominant foot. Skaters are more comfortable on that dominant foot and the judges are looking to see that they are using both feet equally well.

Spins. Johnny's spins were beautiful, but did not have as many changes in position as the others. Also, many of the skaters are now spinning in both directions....something that takes lots of practice to do effortlessly and Johnny does not.

Jumps. Johnny skated the performance of his life last night, but the overall technical quality of his jumps was not as high as the skaters who came in 4th and 5th. The judges are also looking for jumps added after the halfway mark for the "bonus points" and Johnny basically front loaded his jumps in the first half.

Lastly, Johnny has done a lot over the years to disrespect the judges and basically the USFSA and ISU (the governing bodies of skating) As much as that shouldn't play into any decision made on the Olympic ice, word does get around that he is 'controversial' and 'different'. Even with the new scoring system there is still room for some subjectivity in the second part of the score ( I can't remember what exactly they are calling it now). They can wiggle a bit if they don't like the costume, or the music or in Johnny's case the attitude and presentation of the skater. They can also award points if they feel the opposite. This was MUCH More prevalent under the old scoring system, but does still exist with the new system. In a sport that often comes down to fractions of a point between first and second, it only takes a tiny bit of subjective judging to affect a skater's overall score. I truly believe that this is what happened in Johnny's case. He was marked down a bit for his past performances and antics.

I admire him for being himself, despite what everyone wants him to do. I think he is one of the most interesting skaters that has come along in years!

Linda

Thank you for sharing your knowledge and experience with us. It's nice to read information that is so cleanly presented.

I too like Johnny Weir. I think irreverence is a wonderful thing, but it doesn't seem to serve one well in a seemingly tradition laden sport like figure skating.

Do you remember the Duchneys? The Canadian Brother Sister team, who then went on to skate for France? They were irreverent too, for their time. We LOVED them, but the judges didn't.

It was good that the message of being an excellent skater was sent intstead of being a jumper. Horses jump. Skaters skate, eh?

Take care now and again, thanks for your great info.

 

[Kirby]

I haven't read through all the posts but doesn anyone know if there is somewhere online that I can go and watch the skating online from last night? For some reason I thought it was going to be on tonight and missed it all!

 

[OK!]

Make it 3-0 Sweden!

 

[JamieW]

I haven't read through all the posts but doesn anyone know if there is somewhere online that I can go and watch the skating online from last night? For some reason I thought it was going to be on tonight and missed it all!

nbcolympics.com

 

[wdwgirl03]

and then you see stories like these and all I can do is :

What a sore sport!!!

Plushenko: Lysacek not a champion without quad

http://www.nbcolympics.com/news-features/news/newsid=430590.html?__source=msnhomepage&GT1=39003

Ugh, that just really annoys me! I saw the comment he made after the short program about how you shouldn't be the champion if you don't do that quad or whatever the heck it is. But then watching last night he just seemed so arrogant to me with all his blowing kisses and whatnot. And then all the OTHER comments he's making now!

I totally agree about Plushenko's jumps...it seemed like on so many of them his landings were not that great. I can remember one that he landed cleanly. I guess I am just biased though since I wanted Evan to win.