Would you want to know?

[Hrhpd]

He was not a sperm donor, he did not go to a clinic and donate sperm to a couple, he had a relationship that resulted in a pregnancy .

How in the world do you know that there was a "relationship?" The OP never said that. For all we know, it could have been date rape, a one night stand, a dare from his 16 year old buddies to sleep with an 18 year old or any other number of reasons teens get pregnant.

 

[Coonhound]

Honestly, I would say that you are quite lucky that you've never crossed paths with someone who deserves absolutely nothing more than to be called sperm or egg donors.

I'm not saying there aren't. (Also, you're making assumptions about me). But biological father is an accurate term for a man who gave up a child for adoption.

 

[mummabear]

Sorry, logic and common sense tell me it's highly unlikely a 12 or 13 year old would be going through the family's snail mail. Snobbery? I'm not looking down on his choice of communication, I'm calling it for what I see -- a lazy move that could have easily resulted in a young kid getting a jolt of info. that may well have been above her maturity and coping skills. Parents generally are concerned about those kinds of issues involving their children, including those who profess to care so much all these years later.

How do you know the biological mother has her cake and is eating it too? What if the parents manipulated her into denying her biological connection to the child same as the biological father and it's tearing her up, possibly face to face even? We have zero information to support your speculation. IMO it's more likely the mother did not walk away and cut off all communication except for a facebook message and a desire to "be there for this girl" 20 years later. If the mom has been a loving and non parental figure in this girl's life yet the grandparents did the parenting, why is that wrong? What does that have to do with the father's situation? He made his choices. Perhaps things would have been different if he had told his parents when their help might have afforded him the same privilege. I suppose the girlfriend's parents might have insisted and manipulated him into signing a non disclosure agreement regarding his parents, because I'm certain that's entirely plausible.

So the 13 year old won't open their parents mail but will open their parents private Facebook messages?
How is it lazy to use the form of communication he has. We will have to agree to disagree.

So why weren't his parents told? Why did these other adults decide not to inform this child's parents that he had impreganated someone? Why did they deny him he support he could have used to make better decisions?
Because the Ops husband asked them not to, sorry of someone knocks up my 16 year old their parents will be informed.
Frankly the only reason I can see for them not to have is because they didn't want anyone to fight for the custody.
If you haven't seen how difficult it is for a father to get custody of a child then you have no idea what this boy was up against and it would have been much worse 20 years ago then it is now, but I can tell you it took my brother over 2 years to get custody and they still battles in court for years, to get custody from the grandmother (as the mother was in jail) when he was 20, it caused him to loose his career in the military, it cost him so much money it was only possible because my parents could afford to fight it, he was forced to go through parents courses, anger management courses etc when this grandmother had to do nothing, and he had never signed away his rights.

 

[mi*vida*loca]

I find it very hard to believe, actually totally unbelievable, that his parents didn't know. I can't imagine the pregnant girl's parents, especially her father, NOT contacting them about the pregnancy. It just doesn't ring true.

When I got pregnant at 16 my mother told me my biggest issue wouldn't be raising a baby but the relationship I've created with a teenage boy would be my biggest issue.

I can definitely see them never contacting his parents. I can see them wanting him gone and not around to ruin their daughters life further. Possibly a second pregnancy? Him actually wanting a family and them living in teen parent poverty ? His family talking him out of adoption?

After my experience with my XH and son, If my daughter became pregnant as a teen I would be tempted to never tell the teenage boy. It would be MUCH easier if he just signed over his rights and disappeared. It would honestly be easier for us all if he would just go away and let us live our lives with me helping her BUT it would be unfair to the child.

 

[mummabear]

On this, I can actually see the girl's mother and grandparents (before they adopted her) happily going along with the OP's husband not telling his parents.

I can do but it's a really selfish thing to have done.

How in the world do you know that there was a "relationship?" The OP never said that. For all we know, it could have been date rape, a one night stand, a dare from his 16 year old buddies to sleep with an 18 year old or any other number of reasons teens get pregnant.

They had relations...there is nothing in this story to suggest rape so you are making a giant leap there.
There are any number of reasons for a teen to get pregnant, yet a sperm donor is someone who goes to a clinic, provides his specimen which is then artificially transferred to a recipient, of all the things we know about this situation we know that didn't happen.
He is by definition a biological father.

When I got pregnant at 16 my mother told me my biggest issue wouldn't be raising a baby but the relationship I've created with a teenage boy would be my biggest issue.

I can definitely see them never contacting his parents. I can see them wanting him gone and not around to ruin their daughters life further. Possibly a second pregnancy? Him actually wanting a family and them living in teen parent poverty ? His family talking him out of adoption?

After my experience with my XH and son, If my daughter became pregnant as a teen I would be tempted to never tell the teenage boy. It would be MUCH easier if he just signed over his rights and disappeared. It would honestly be easier for us all if he would just go away and let us live our lives with me helping her BUT it would be unfair to the child.

And doing so is not o my incredibly selfish and unfair to the baby but to the teenage boy who is its father.

 

[Magpie]

When I got pregnant at 16 my mother told me my biggest issue wouldn't be raising a baby but the relationship I've created with a teenage boy would be my biggest issue.

I can definitely see them never contacting his parents. I can see them wanting him gone and not around to ruin their daughters life further. Possibly a second pregnancy? Him actually wanting a family and them living in teen parent poverty ? His family talking him out of adoption?

After my experience with my XH and son, If my daughter became pregnant as a teen I would be tempted to never tell the teenage boy. It would be MUCH easier if he just signed over his rights and disappeared. It would honestly be easier for us all if he would just go away and let us live our lives with me helping her BUT it would be unfair to the child.

It would be unfair to your hypothetical teenage boy, as well.

It takes two to have sex. It takes two to "ruin a life" (or lives). The boy is not necessarily the villain of the story, and the girl is not always the victim.

If my daughter had got herself knocked up at sixteen, I'd still have felt the boy deserved a chance. Especially since my daughter generally has good taste in friends, so I'd assume she must have seen something worthwhile in the lad or she wouldn't have slept with him.

And if it'd been my son who'd got someone else's daughter pregnant, I'd very much hope her family would behave decently toward him. (And that he'd trust us enough to talk to us!)

 

[mi*vida*loca]

It would be unfair to your hypothetical teenage boy, as well.

It takes two to have sex. It takes two to "ruin a life" (or lives). The boy is not necessarily the villain of the story, and the girl is not always the victim.

If my daughter had got herself knocked up at sixteen, I'd still have felt the boy deserved a chance. Especially since my daughter generally has good taste in friends, so I'd assume she must have seen something worthwhile in the lad or she wouldn't have slept with him.

And if it'd been my son who'd got someone else's daughter pregnant, I'd very much hope her family would behave decently toward him. (And that he'd trust us enough to talk to us!)

I agree. I was pregnant at 16 and I was the devil to my ex mil (we married at 20). I had ruined her precious sons life and she was going to send him away so I couldn't ruin his life further. She made my life a living hell for a while. It would have been easier had they disappeared.

I was just showing how her parents may have been thinking. Teen pregnancy and parenthood isn't pretty in most cases.

 

[Coonhound]

When I got pregnant at 16 my mother told me my biggest issue wouldn't be raising a baby but the relationship I've created with a teenage boy would be my biggest issue.

I can definitely see them never contacting his parents. I can see them wanting him gone and not around to ruin their daughters life further. Possibly a second pregnancy? Him actually wanting a family and them living in teen parent poverty ? His family talking him out of adoption?

After my experience with my XH and son, If my daughter became pregnant as a teen I would be tempted to never tell the teenage boy. It would be MUCH easier if he just signed over his rights and disappeared. It would honestly be easier for us all if he would just go away and let us live our lives with me helping her BUT it would be unfair to the child.

I'm glad you said you'd be tempted rather than saying you'd actually do it. It wouldn't just affect the child but also the boy who would be intentionally kept away from his own child. I'll be honest here. When my grandchild's mother found out she was pregnant, we were told she had already decided to have an abortion. My wife and I talked and about it and decided that if she had an abortion we didn't see any reason to tell our son that there had ever been a pregnancy. (Looking back that wouldn't have worked because it would have come up in the trial) But anyway we quickly realized that wasn't right- it would be a terrible thing to conceal someone's child like that. A man or boy deserves to know if he has fathered a child, he deserves the chance to be involved (and the child deserves the support of both parents- even if only financial).

 

[Hrhpd]

So the 13 year old won't open their parents mail but will open their parents private Facebook messages?
How is it lazy to use the form of communication he has. We will have to agree to disagree.

So why weren't his parents told? Why did these other adults decide not to inform this child's parents that he had impreganated someone? Why did they deny him he support he could have used to make better decisions?
Because the Ops husband asked them not to, sorry of someone knocks up my 16 year old their parents will be informed.
Frankly the only reason I can see for them not to have is because they didn't want anyone to fight for the custody.
If you haven't seen how difficult it is for a father to get custody of a child then you have no idea what this boy was up against and it would have been much worse 20 years ago then it is now, but I can tell you it took my brother over 2 years to get custody and they still battles in court for years, to get custody from the grandmother (as the mother was in jail) when he was 20, it caused him to loose his career in the military, it cost him so much money it was only possible because my parents could afford to fight it, he was forced to go through parents courses, anger management courses etc when this grandmother had to do nothing, and he had never signed away his rights.

Aren't you in a different country? Down under I believe. While there may be some similarities, your brother's experiences in your country's courts are hardly a benchmark for what might have happened in US courts. The father had legal rights for 2 years, rights he chose not to exercise.

 

[mi*vida*loca]

I'm glad you said you'd be tempted rather than saying you'd actually do it. It wouldn't just affect the child but also the boy who would be intentionally kept away from his own child. I'll be honest here. When my grandchild's mother found out she was pregnant, we were told she had already decided to have an abortion. My wife and I talked and about it and decided that if she had an abortion we didn't see any reason to tell our son that there had ever been a pregnancy. (Looking back that wouldn't have worked because it would have come up in the trial) But anyway we quickly realized that wasn't right- it would be a terrible thing to conceal someone's child like that. A man or boy deserves to know if he has fathered a child, he deserves the chance to be involved (and the child deserves the support of both parents- even if only financial).

No I wouldn't do it. Every child deserves a father and I have a conscience. I couldn't knowingly live a lie abd sleep at night. I couldn't do that to someone's kid and live with Myself.

My son is now 16 so if he got a girl pregnant I would want to know if she was keeping the child. If she already decided on abortion I would be fine never knowing and ok if her and her parents chose to never tell my son.

If my daughter got pregnant and chose abortion I would feel no reason to tell his parents or even him.

 

[CarolAnn856]

I feel like you may be directing this at my posts, and I understand it sounds very harsh, but my posts are generally directed at the OPs situation, and those that are like OPs situation.

No, not at all. There have been quite a few posters who come to mind. I realize that even the general posts are likely directed to the OP's husband, and I'm probably reading too much into the others.

 

[Miskey]

I'm not saying there aren't. (Also, you're making assumptions about me). But biological father is an accurate term for a man who gave up a child for adoption.

and sperm donor is an accurate term for a man who happily signed away his rights in order to avoid responsibility

Neither one of us knows which term would most accurately describe this man. I would love to know what contact he tried to make, or what support he tried to provide for the first two years of the child's life.

 

[LisaR]

I find it very hard to believe, actually totally unbelievable, that his parents didn't know. I can't imagine the pregnant girl's parents, especially her father, NOT contacting them about the pregnancy. It just doesn't ring true.

My brother got a girl pregnant in high school. My parents didn't have a clue. They went out a few time, had sex, and she ended up pregnant. It wasn't like she was coming over to our house and hanging out. My parents never met her or even knew she existed. My brother was a loser back in the day...a lot of drugs, skipping school, wrong crowd. The girl did tell him but told him that he wasn't going to be involved because he could never handle a baby at that point in his life. He didn't argue at all.
Over the years he got his act together little by little. The mom and my nephew lived in another state and my brother would go visit once a year or so. None of us had even a remote clue that this child existed. Fast forward twenty years. My older brother was shopping one day and kept looking at the cashier and wondering why he looked so familiar. My brother paid with a credit card and when the *cashier* saw his last name, he asked my brother if he was related to our younger brother. "Yes, he's my brother. How do you know him?" "He's my dad!" No DNA test needed. He is a spitting image of his dad. He was living just a few miles from all of us while going to college. Such a shame none of us knew we had a nephew/grandchild for twenty years, but I can't blame his mom in the slightest. My brother was not in any position to be around a child back then. To this day none of us know what arrangement they had. I don't know if my brother signed away his rights or if he ever gave them any money. He didn't become a sober person until he was thirty so I doubt he ever gave them anything.

 

[NHdisneylover]

So the 13 year old won't open their parents mail but will open their parents private Facebook messages?
How is it lazy to use the form of communication he has. We will have to agree to disagree.
.

Oh for goodness sakes--don't they have registered letters or osmething similar in New Zealand?

Here you can pay to have it so a letter is only delivered to one person, signature required, handed over in person.

If the OP's husband refused to go through an agency, and wait for the young woman to contact him and and when she ever did---IF he inssites on trying to contact the parents himself (even knowing they surely knew how to find him if they wanted to) then he should have written a carefully worded letter, addressed to them, sent registered mail, with his name on the return address clearly visible from outside so they'd see it and know if they did not want to open the letter if she happened to go with them to sign for it.

If it is not worth the hassle and cost of a certified letter, and the forethought to do so---it is really not that important to him at all. (though they'd have every right to get that and not repond either---BUT it would have been the mature, adult way of attempting contact)

 

[roseaster]

So the 13 year old won't open their parents mail but will open their parents private Facebook messages?
How is it lazy to use the form of communication he has. We will have to agree to disagree.

So why weren't his parents told? Why did these other adults decide not to inform this child's parents that he had impreganated someone? Why did they deny him he support he could have used to make better decisions?
Because the Ops husband asked them not to, sorry of someone knocks up my 16 year old their parents will be informed.
Frankly the only reason I can see for them not to have is because they didn't want anyone to fight for the custody.
If you haven't seen how difficult it is for a father to get custody of a child then you have no idea what this boy was up against and it would have been much worse 20 years ago then it is now, but I can tell you it took my brother over 2 years to get custody and they still battles in court for years, to get custody from the grandmother (as the mother was in jail) when he was 20, it caused him to loose his career in the military, it cost him so much money it was only possible because my parents could afford to fight it, he was forced to go through parents courses, anger management courses etc when this grandmother had to do nothing, and he had never signed away his rights.

In the States this is not the case. Even 20 years ago it wasn't the case. Here, precedence is always given to the biological parent over any other relatives. Unless, of course, there is a question of that parent being unfit.

So, in the OP's case, if the child's mother did not want custody of her, the bio father would have been given custody before the grandparents regardless of his age.

If both parents wanted the child they would, probably, be given joint custody.

As I said upthread, when I was a teen, and I am older than Big Al, I know guy who got his GF pregnant and she wanted to place the child for adoption and he did not and he did end up with custody of the child.

The place where this situation loses it's merit is where Big Al hides his child for 2 years and then signs over parental rights.

He had 2 years to figure out a way to tell his parents, to get a job and help support his child, to bond with his child and act like a parent if that is what he wanted to be.

The OP is muddying the water with all the personal emotion and drama. At it's base this is a story about an 18 year old man who gave his 2 year old daughter up for adoption. Like any other adoptee/birth parent in this situation it is the child's prerogative to make contact.

 

[Hrhpd]

They had relations...there is nothing in this story to suggest rape so you are making a giant leap there..

I did not suggest rape at all, I gave a list of possibilities.

You keep comparing this to your brother, but there is no comparison. Your brother wanted his child and fought tooth and nail for him.

Big Al waited for two years and as soon as he was legally able, signed away his rights to his daughter to her grandparents.

By using your brother's experience, you are lending support to the idea that a young man can make a decision about whether he wants to be a father or not.

Your brother wanted to be a father to his child and went to great lengths to mske it happen. Big Al, for whatever reason, chose to give up his child for adoption after having 2 years to think about it.

The thing is, adoption is permanent. Once you give that child to her adoptive parents, that is it. It should be like you never had a child.

Adoption is not temporary childcare where you give up your child and then 20 years later say "I've got it together now, so I want to be a father." No. Al gave up that right a long time ago. He could have given her up for very loving reasons. But he only gets a second chance if the young lady wants to give him one. He does not get to make that decision.

 

[NHdisneylover]

So why weren't his parents told? Why did these other adults decide not to inform this child's parents that he had impreganated someone? Why did they deny him he support he could have used to make better decisions?
Because the Ops husband asked them not to, sorry of someone knocks up my 16 year old their parents will be informed.
Frankly the only reason I can see for them not to have is because they didn't want anyone to fight for the custody.
If you haven't seen how difficult it is for a father to get custody of a child then you have no idea what this boy was up against and it would have been much worse 20 years ago then it is now, but I can tell you it took my brother over 2 years to get custody and they still battles in court for years, to get custody from the grandmother (as the mother was in jail) when he was 20, it caused him to loose his career in the military, it cost him so much money it was only possible because my parents could afford to fight it, he was forced to go through parents courses, anger management courses etc when this grandmother had to do nothing, and he had never signed away his rights.

I can't answer why the other fmaily did not tell the parents---but it might well be they felt that was his place and not theirs---I probably would.

Regardless, as someone upthread has already mentioned, things must be quite different in NZ. A biological father would automatically have custody over any othter relative (other than the biological mother--with whome sutody would be split if both parties wanted it) and it is almost unheard of that grandparents could possible have custody granted to them if either parent wants custody (abuse or neglect would pretty much have to be involved and termination of rights for that reason and THEN the grandparents would have perogitive over strangers in most cases).

This has been the case for well over 30 years in the US.

 

[Nancyg56]

That's a little dramatic don't you think?

Not really. I am pretty uncomfortable with this term being thrown around, even if the people doing so are referring to the man in this case. WHile I am not giving him a pass, not one of us have any clue what transpired 20 years ago.

Honestly, I would say that you are quite lucky that you've never crossed paths with someone who deserves absolutely nothing more than to be called sperm or egg donors.

I agree. There is a difference between someone who can support a child and refuses and o who makes the difficult decision to gift their pecios child to another who can provide a stable life fo that baby. Whether the baby is 2 days or 2 years old makes no difference, it cannot be an easy choice and I wish that people would stop using those derogatory terms.

 

[kamik86]

So the 13 year old won't open their parents mail but will open their parents private Facebook messages?
How is it lazy to use the form of communication he has. We will have to agree to disagree.

To be honest its alot easier to see facebook messages. i have seen my husbands often. All it takes is for him to remain logged in and just close then window then I go to facebook and am logged in as him. Messages often pop up in the corner.

I saw my parents emails and facebook a ton as a teen because they tended to leave everything open all the time and were autologged into everything because they couldn't type well and didn't want to bother. Due to this I actually also knew all my parents passwords because of this. I'm pretty sure I could go log into my mothers bank account right now if I tried.

To open her mail I would have had to do it on purpose and if I did do it on purpose she would at least know it was opened and read.

 

[cabanafrau]

So the 13 year old won't open their parents mail but will open their parents private Facebook messages?
How is it lazy to use the form of communication he has. We will have to agree to disagree.

So why weren't his parents told? Why did these other adults decide not to inform this child's parents that he had impreganated someone? Why did they deny him he support he could have used to make better decisions?
Because the Ops husband asked them not to, sorry of someone knocks up my 16 year old their parents will be informed.
Frankly the only reason I can see for them not to have is because they didn't want anyone to fight for the custody.
If you haven't seen how difficult it is for a father to get custody of a child then you have no idea what this boy was up against and it would have been much worse 20 years ago then it is now, but I can tell you it took my brother over 2 years to get custody and they still battles in court for years, to get custody from the grandmother (as the mother was in jail) when he was 20, it caused him to loose his career in the military, it cost him so much money it was only possible because my parents could afford to fight it, he was forced to go through parents courses, anger management courses etc when this grandmother had to do nothing, and he had never signed away his rights.

First, it's best to resist the temptation to extrapolate a personal experience as the typical experience and assume it tells much more about the topic than it does.

Second, remember OP's husband didn't want his own parents to know. We have no idea how well the mother or her family knew this kid. What if they chose not to tell because he insisted his parents would throw him out on the streets and they were convinced? Combine that with the possibility there were no indications coming from this boy that he was at all interested or motivated to step up for the baby in any way. Should they have looked at the situation in front of them with the best information they had, or should they have followed your absolute mandate and risked blowing a 16 year old's life apart -- a 16 year old they likely had no real interest in stepping up and providing for themselves if things went wrong?

I know exactly what it looks like when parental rights are relinquished -- and when they are terminated against a parent's will in an abuse and neglect action. Precisely how that process works and the laws surrounding it inform my opinions about this situation. The severing of parental rights is an unusual area of the law. It is one of the few times that a court will review a situation not solely fenced in by admissible evidence, but instead review the totality of circumstances surrounding the child and the parents. This is because the bond and the rights of parents and their children is considered sacrosanct, as it absolutely should.

As far as the facebook vs. snail mail, what if a computer in the house was sitting with the parent's facebook open, a message arrived and only the kid is in the room to hear the notification and they end up seeing it? I still say that's much more likely than the kid opening snail mail. I've been at friend's and family's homes where a computer is sitting open to facebook on the kitchen counter or a table in the family room several times. Not much of a stretch IMO.