Would you pay higher prices for monorail extension?

Would you pay higher prices for monorail extension?

  • Yes, definitely..please add the expansion!

  • No way...are you nuts?

  • Indifferent...doesn't matter either way.


Results are only viewable after voting.

jheigl

Spaceship Earth Junky
Joined
Sep 20, 2006
Messages
833
Ok, everyone please be hypothetical here. We all know that there is pretty much ZERO chance Disney will expand the monorail to include the other parks, but most agree it would be wonderful if they did. I know it is a ridiculous cost to expand it, but for fun, let's see what most people think. Would you pay slightly higher ticket prices and/ or parking fees in order for Disney to raise most or all of the money needed to expand the monorail? Now I know Disney technically doesn't need to raise prices to do this, but of course with the cost being so high, they would want to offset it somehow. With that being said, I want to say that I am the first person in the disgusted visitor line everytime I have to pay $12 to park for the day, but if I could take the monorail all around the world, I think I would put up with a raise in prices. What does everyone think?
 
depends on the rise, 50 cents or 50 bucks makes a big difference
 
Most theme parks already charge anywhere from $15 - $20.00 per day for parking. It's the one thing I always found "cheap" about Disney. So YES I'd pay more if they expanded the monorail (but fortunately I dont' have to since I have an AP ;))
 
Would love more monorail and less busses.
 

Would love more monorail and less busses.

Seems as if nowadays with the "green" movement, the move from polluting busses to a monorail would be great publicity for the company...not as if they need any more publicity!
 
I think Disney shoul look into expanding the monorial to the airport, more people would use that than between the parks, which already have pretty good bus transportation. They could offset the price by charging a small fee for non-disney guests, and having a stop at International Drive and the Lake Buena Vista Crossroads. Of course they could also charge yet another local tax to cover the expense.........
 
I think Disney shoul look into expanding the monorial to the airport, more people would use that than between the parks, which already have pretty good bus transportation. They could offset the price by charging a small fee for non-disney guests, and having a stop at International Drive and the Lake Buena Vista Crossroads. Of course they could also charge yet another local tax to cover the expense.........

Weren't they going to build a high speed rail system from Tampa to Orlando for the Olympics or some other major event?

It wasn't going to be paid for by Disney, but same concept.

I always wondered what the CBA, ROI and NPV would be on a massive infrastructure project like enhancements to the monorail system. Unfortunately there are so many variables and in order to make the best of it, you'd need to connect all the resorts as well...
 
I would love the expansion, but all that extra money will add up eventually. After a couple of trips with a family and having the prices raised... you could probably get an extra vacation out of there if the prices stayed the same. I guess it would be worth it for more monorails- riding the busses does get a little annoying.
 
The other problem nobody has mentioned is monorail capacity. Even where they do run they only carry a small portion of the people traveling between those points. Even if the monorail was expanded buses and other means of transportation would still be required. Because of this the payback for the monorail system would be very small since nothing would actually be eliminated. The monorails are more or less just a novelty or attraction not really a transportation system for the masses.
 
The high cost as a factor kills me. Iger made 13 million last year and at 1 million per mile that's a lot of monorail. Bye bye slug.:laughing:

It's all relative. If they truly cared about guest experience this would be a different conversation but since they only care about the next quarters numbers the point is simply moot until such time as huge profits can be directly quantified from such decision. Look for more "green" busses.

pirate:
 
The other problem nobody has mentioned is monorail capacity. Even where they do run they only carry a small portion of the people traveling between those points. Even if the monorail was expanded buses and other means of transportation would still be required. Because of this the payback for the monorail system would be very small since nothing would actually be eliminated. The monorails are more or less just a novelty or attraction not really a transportation system for the masses.

I guess I can agree that they do not carry as many people as the busses do, however they can hold quite a few and if they expanded the track they could add more monorails. I doubt they use all 12 on any given day, so if they expanded there would be more room for the 12 to be used, and they could even purchase more. While I doubt expanding the monorail is feasible at this point, its just fun to discuss.

Also, I don't think going to the airport would be feasible at all...it is quite a ways from WDW to the OIA (or MCO).
 
I think it would be cool; the monorails are a huge attraction all on their own. It would be great fun, but I think it would all depend on just how much the prices would increase. While the expansion would be neat, I'm not sure how efficient it would be. The lines for the monorails would probably be just as long as those for the buses are now, and while it would spread the crowd out some, it probably wouldn't make that great a difference.

Now, looking at it for simply adding more to the Guests' experience at the World, ignoring efficiency and money, I say go for it! :goodvibes
 
I think it would be great. I also think they should put "donation stations" throughout the parks and resorts. If I had extra change in my pockets I'd be inclined to toss it in. Raise the money through donations.
 
I think it would be great. I also think they should put "donation stations" throughout the parks and resorts. If I had extra change in my pockets I'd be inclined to toss it in. Raise the money through donations.

Or maybe sell some type of "lasting memory" thing, such as like they did for the "Walk Around the World" bricks and the "Leave a Legacy".
 
A Disney area columnist ponders "What's Next for Disney World?"
by Dave Parker

This week we switch tracks a bit (pun definitely intended there) to focus on the twelve train-strong Walt Disney World Monorail System. While this Highway in the Sky is extremely popular with Guests, as well as a critical element of the WDW transportation system, why hasnt it ever expanded?
Ill admit it: Im a Monorail junkie.



I mean, sure, I didnt initially think I would like having plant shelves in our house, but boy are they a convenient place to show off my Monorail toy, err.. *ahem* Monorail model collection... ...and lets not get into the fact that I was disappointed to find out that the Contemporary addition only supports one Monorail beam going through it (until you coax it into supporting two, that is).

So when John asked me his question last week about why theres no Monorail service to the Disney-MGM Studios or Disneys Animal Kingdom, well, I felt his pain. I mean, the Monorail here at Walt Disney World, as well as the one in California, is just as much a part of Disney as Space Mountain and Pirates of the Caribbean. Just take a look at Disney.com and tell me what pulls into the screen at the top, doubling as a web link bar?

Oh how I wish the Walt Disney World Resort would have kept up the Monorail System to add stops at other destinations around the property, especially the other two Theme Parks.

Of course, this didnt happen, and may never happen thanks to a little, or rather as it always is, a BIG thing called price.

While the Monorail has many things going for it, it is a little pricey to built and maintain. In fact, just the track alone costs well over one million dollars...per mile!

Just for a reference, the path from the Ticket and Transportation Center to Epcot is roughly seven miles, and those parks are very close together.

Of course, you do get a lot when you invest in such a Monorail. First off and most dramatic, the addition doesnt need that much space, since the only things you need are place for the track pillars to go. Compared to another mass transit system, the footprint of the Monorail is negligible.

Another benefit is the fact that it is completely pollution free; free from chemical pollution AND noise pollution. If youre like me, they just look cool anyway, which makes me want to ride and watch them go by.

...but back to the story of the Monorails cost. Of course, most of the thought of a system expansion was around the time of the then-new Disney-MGM Studios, which would have been the first major destination on property without Monorail access.

Given the cost required to do a sizable expansion to the system, which would have most likely required a new central hub to the west of the Epcot area, the idea was put on hold where it stands today.

Instead, the Monorail was supplemented by motor coaches, otherwise known as busses.

Although not as glamorous or futuristic as the Monorail, the fleet of busses served two very important requirements of the WDW management: cheaper and flexible. You see, transportation around the Walt Disney World Resort isnt as steady as one might think. In fact, if youve ever tried to leave the Magic Kingdom within one hour of the park closing, versus at ten in the morning, youll understand what I mean completely.

There are established times for when the WDW Transportation system will need to carry more Guests than at other times, as well as be able to provide a larger capacity between certain routes at certain times. One example of this might be from Animal Kingdom to the Magic Kingdom around 5:00 PM, as Guests are leaving a closing Animal Kingdom to spend the rest of the night in the Park that stays open the longest on that night. That route will not have the same requirements as one going from the Caribbean Beach Resort to Downtown Disney, for example.

That flexibility is what really helps out when it comes to the busses in operation around the WDW property. When a certain time or certain routes need more or less capacity, additional busses can be brought into service to accommodate the demand. Of course, the fact that they are relatively cheap (as compared to other mass transit) also helps with that scenario.

Which, given the fact that the busses fit so well nowadays with their flexibility, as well as the numerous stops on property now, the fact of a Monorail expansion is highly unlikely; probably more than ever.

I say that because you have to think about what a Monorail is really good for, and what its not. A Walt Disney World Mark VI Monorail (the model currently in use) can hold over 300 people per train. However, consider how many different stops you would have to build to connect each resort and destination on property, and you end up with a lot of trains holding only handfuls of people on most of the routes.

In its current use, its perfect. Its a high capacity shuttle of sorts, especially at peak time such as the opening and closing of the Magic Kingdom. Thats where the 300+ capacity will be filled up minute after minute, dropping one group off and going around for another load.

Unfortunately, thats not the sort of transportation system the Resort as a whole needs, as it is actually too rigid and massive for most of the assumed stops. Even if we had most of the Resorts on a single Monorail line, there would have to be many trains on each line so that each station has an arrival in a decent amount of time (keep in mind about the distances were talking about); again, the cost for such a plan would be prohibitive, but this time for the trains involved.

However, just because the Monorail isnt the best choice for the job, it doesnt leave the Resort high and dry without an alternative. In fact, there is one very promising alternative that Disney has allegedly looked into in the past.

Imagine you are standing at the front of your resort, Coronado Springs, and you enter the PRT station (Ill explain in a second; just go with me here). You see a lot of small bubble-like vehicles the size of a small compact car, many lined up on a track and all of them moving.

However, there is a large group in the middle that is moving together but very slowly. There are others approaching the station very fast, and then slow down to enter the pack in the middle moving slowly. The ones at the front of the pack take off fast one by one, heading out of the station. Youve seen this before: namely on the Tomorrowland Transit Authority in Tomorrowland at the Magic Kingdom. Although there are numerous cars leaving the station there are enough on the system to have some waiting at the station at all times.

You get on a moving platform, and then step into one of the cabs as the door shuts behind you. A voice comes over the speakers and greets you with Welcome to the Walt Disney World Personal Rapid Transit System. Please choose a destination from the console in front of you.

Upon looking down, you see a console that contains buttons for every destination on Walt Disney World property, and upon picking Downtown Disney: Westside, the same voice comes over the speakers again and states This cab will be traveling to Downtown Disney Westside. If you should need to change your destination, please select a new destination from the console at any time.

The cab then proceeds to speed and lift up onto an elevated track traveling automatically to your specific destination. No stops in between. No vehicle changes.

Thats the type of flexibility, individualized flexibility, that the Walt Disney World Resort needs; the ability for a traveling party to get into a cab, pick their destination, and let the system automatically get them there. Once exited, that cab then becomes available for use for another Guest or group. Since the cabs are constantly cycled in and out of stations, they never stay in one place and therefore allow every station with enough empty cabs to meet demand. During peak times, the system can divert empty cabs to known high-traffic stations automatically.

To give you some idea of what Im talking about, there are some great concept photos of proposed PRT systems from an upstart company called Taxi 2000. You can check them out and learn more about their PRT system from their web site here.

While I wish I could say this was my idea, it in fact started with Walt Disney himself. He saw a need for both a high capacity shuttle (i.e. the Monorail) and a more individualized People Mover to co-exist. While the system he envisioned and the one I described above are a little different, they are modeled after the same idea.

Speaking of models, next time youre on the TTA in the Magic Kingdom, take a look at the Epcot model above Stitchs Great Escape, and youll see the Monorail right next to the People Mover, co-existing since they were designed for separate roles. Of course, Im referring to the real EPCOT; the city, not the theme park.

Remember I said that Disney had researched this concept before? Well, West Virginia University has a system sort of like this in place for over 30 years called the WVU PRT, which can be seen below:



In fact, they have a pretty nifty video of the system and how it works located here if youd like to take a look.

Now Im not saying that this will happen at the Walt Disney World Resort. I have to wonder, however, how long can the Resort afford to use (which will have to be) an ever-increasing fleet of busses indefinitely?

Thanks for stopping on by, and Ill see you next week!
 
That too me seems more expensive and illogical than expanding the monorail.... one argument against this article is that I wasn't saying the monorail needs to go to any more resorts at all....just the parks. It would only be an extra two stops. Therefore not much change of timing, especially since they would be on their own loops. Great read though!
 
"1 million per mile" is an urban legend.

See http://www.yesterland.com/monoraillegends.html

As Horace's link accurately points out, a 4.4 mile monorail in Las Vegas cost over $600 million dollars.. but there are a LOT of costs there which Disney wouldn't face.

Regardless, it's much more than $1,000,000 per mile.

Add to that, the route is limited in part by land that is a conversation status and means no development can take place on it - period - and some other land (often adjacent to that) on which development is "not ideal". (This according to the RCID planning documents available online)

What does all that mean? That Disney has to plan the expansion of the monorail around protected wetlands and conservation area ... AND along that route that avoids the protected areas, be sure that the posts that hold up the monorail are seated on bedrock ... no good putting them in mushy swampland ... altho that would be an E-Ticket attraction for sure.. ;)

Getting to bedrock in Florida can be an expensive proposition..

It all adds up.

Knox
 


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