Would you have said anything to the creepy guy?

[Big Cuddly Bear]

......
Anyway, I think the OP's response was appropriate. His urge to get help was because he sensed that although own his kids were safe others might not be not be. Unfortunately, he might be right even though there is/was nothing he can do about it. To me it says Big Cuddly Bear has a good heart and I like that... the world can't have too many of those

Exactly, but I did realize it was not an issue for the police... I hope it never becomes one. If I didn't get a "creepy vibe" I probably would not have thought twice, but I did.

 

[Magpie]

Not all the time- but even if it's just one time I'd be glad I paid attention to my gut.

I absolutely advocate paying attention to your instincts! I think the OP reacted appropriately.

I'm just not in favour of character assassination, on the order of labeling a person a "predator". If I had found the gentleman creepy, I would have kept my kids away AND kept a sharp eye out in the parking lot to make sure he wasn't lurking around waiting for us.

Reminding myself that there's probably no threat and I'm likely worrying about nothing, doesn't mean I put myself in harms way. It just means I'm willing to give the gentleman the benefit of the doubt AT THE SAME TIME as I'm avoiding him.

I hope that makes sense.

OK Magpie, I understand, funny how much influence a word can have, huh?

No, it's not inconceivable at all. If it were easy to spot horrible people no parent or caregiver would ever let them near a kid, so most kids would never have to be subjected to trauma.

I do not think there is a perfect formula for keeping kids safe because if there was we'd all know it. Even if there was the bad guys would be onto it in a heartbeat and simply change their ways to avoid detection. The most anyone can hope for is that caregivers do their best, pay attention, make sure people around our kids know we are paying attention and ensure open dialogue with our kids so they feel safe saying they don't like someone and expressing why. The last time I read about it I think it takes 30 times for a child to be asked if they were being hurt before the kid opened up.... 30 times! How many parents do that?

Anyway, I think the OP's response was appropriate. His urge to get help was because he sensed that although own his kids were safe others might not be not be. Unfortunately, he might be right even though there is/was nothing he can do about it. To me it says Big Cuddly Bear has a good heart and I like that... the world can't have too many of those

I agree with everything you wrote here! Especially about Big Cuddly Bear having a good heart.

(Thirty times, though... where did you read that? I'm definitely curious. Because I think if I asked my kids anything thirty times in a row, they'd eventually say yes it's true. No matter what it was!)

I am glad that the folks on this thread don't get to decide MY fate on anything. I have most likely said sometrhing completely innocent that soemone misinterptreted at some point in my life (as has almost everyone). According to some here that makes me a dangerous psyco who should be locked away. Get real folks, this guy likely meant no harm at all, nad didn't think about how what he was saying would sound. That is infinetly more likely than him having some sort of dark purpose. No one here has any right to defame him to tthe degree that has taken place, and I think that the dergee of venom that has come out of this tread is evidence of the growing paranoia of some groups of parents. EVERYONE is not a treat to our kids. The vasty majority of poeple aren't. I really don't think I could live like some here, thinking there are monsters around every corner and everyone is out to get us.

The thing is, I also agree with this. And as someone who has multiple family members with mental illness, this is what concerns me.

We're far too quick to heap venom on people, just because they're different. It's like the folks we see talking to themselves on the bus. I tell the kids, don't bother them, and don't get sucked into their world, but don't be afraid of them either. Those poor people have enough trouble in their lives already.

 

[Eeyores Butterfly]

What the guy did was creepy (it's the lyrics to the song that seem creepy to me). However, I don't think we can say anything more. Maybe he really is a child predator (a bad one if he is approaching girls in front of their parents) ore maybe he is just a little off in social situations. None of us know him so we can't say.

As for the person whose daughter got pinched- that is on a whole other level! That was actualy physical contact. I teach my students that nobody should touch them in their "bathing suit areas" except for a doctor or a nurse or if mom and dad have to help them with something medical, and even then they have the right to say no if they don't like it. I would have alerted the theatre managers and at the very least gotten his butt kicked out.

I think the OP handled it appropriately -- nothing more that could be done. I agree with whomever said that you have to go w/ your gut -- even if it could have been completely innocent (doubt it), the guy gave off a vibe that the OP wasn't comfortable with.

On a side note, I have never let my kids sit on Santa's lap (gasp! ), because while I think 50% are grandfatherly types that love kids and/or just really need the money, I think the other 50% are child predators. Who else would deal with the beard tugging/crying/screaming (maybe even peeing on their lap)? I once had someone say to me, "Surely they wouldn't try anything with all of those people around." Um, so it's okay if some perv is getting their jollies off of your child sitting on their lap as long as they don't act on it?

Maybe I watch the news too much -- or maybe it's because my friend worked as a court reporter in too many criminal cases and I've heard the horror stories, but a red flag would have gone off for me, too, in that situation.

Wow, that seems very overboard and a huge leap. I used to work for Disney Entertainment. I worked with a lot of people from all walks of life for whom this is essntially their job. Kids don't necessarily sit on our laps, but we do put our arms around them for pictures, give them hugs, etc. There was not one person I worked with who I would think was in it for the wrong reasons. And yes, I worked with a lot of men.

This is why so few men are willing to teach elementary, even though we have so many boys that need that goo role model. Because people just assume that if a man likes kids, he has some sort of predatory nature. I'm so grateful that I have a male para with all of the little boys I have in my class, but I make sure that he is never alone with the kids and I handle anything to do with the little girls, just so that he doesn't get accused. I think it's sad that men who genuinely want to help kids are afraid to because all we see are predators.

Yes, there are predators out there. But I think that we need to temper that with some good old fashioned common sense.

 

[NHdisneylover]

You'd probably lose that bet. There's no way to tell predatory tendencies based on what song someone sings.

I agree with Magpie. He wasn't trying to get to know your kids, he wasn't leering at them or offering candy, he didn't even strike up a conversation. He was actually being polite by acknowledging the presence of you and your girls, then going back into whatever was going on in his head when you moved into his personal space.

You're reading way too much into it.

I agree. I see nothing creepy at all about the situation as described

Same here! (and I'm from NJ too!)



I think he DID know how it sounded which is why he said 'sorry'. If he was blissfully unaware I'm thinking he would have said something else or questioned her reaction.

My guess is he thought the OP was annoyed by him singing in the store's line. I tend to forget and softly start to sing along once in awhile and that generally gets me a "look" and then I apologize and quit singing.

Tell that to the parents of a toddler who escaped from a child care, she was seen by a man who was too scared to grab her and take her to the police, she ended up drowning. We have got to stop this fear of men for our children's sake, how are we going to have girls having relationships with men if we bring them up to believe all single men are paedophiles?

I can never decide who we are doing more damage to: the little girls who are being raised unable to ever trust a man, or the little boys who are being raised to believe they are pretty much destined to become pedophiles themselves.

 

[bumbershoot]

I absolutely advocate paying attention to your instincts! I think the OP reacted appropriately.

I'm just not in favour of character assassination, on the order of labeling a person a "predator". If I had found the gentleman creepy, I would have kept my kids away AND kept a sharp eye out in the parking lot to make sure he wasn't lurking around waiting for us.

Reminding myself that there's probably no threat and I'm likely worrying about nothing, doesn't mean I put myself in harms way. It just means I'm willing to give the gentleman the benefit of the doubt AT THE SAME TIME as I'm avoiding him.

I hope that makes sense.


(Thirty times, though... where did you read that? I'm definitely curious. Because I think if I asked my kids anything thirty times in a row, they'd eventually say yes it's true. No matter what it was!)

Makes sense to me, too.

And I think that even I would start wondering if I got my story straight if someone asked me the same questions 30 times...




I wasn't there, I don't know if this guy would have creeped me out. I agree that when we get that feeling, we should get ourselves away. I don't agree that we should then label them.

If I'm about to step into an elevator and there's someone in there and he or she has something going on that makes me uncomfortable, I will remember that I've forgotten something and just back out, or get off at the next floor. But I'm not going to then continue to talk about it...because I have NO idea if my instincts were right at that point.

 

[Big Cuddly Bear]

I agree. I see nothing creepy at all about the situation as described

My guess is he thought the OP was annoyed by him singing in the store's line. I tend to forget and softly start to sing along once in awhile and that generally gets me a "look" and then I apologize and quit singing.


I can never decide who we are doing more damage to: the little girls who are being raised unable to ever trust a man, or the little boys who are being raised to believe they are pretty much destined to become pedophiles themselves.

My daughters actually didn't even know what I said. I'm also sure they had no idea what the guy was singing.( Nor would they have understood my concerns just from hearing it ) Like I said, I got a bad vibe from this guy. I believe that every single person in this thread - IF THEY GOT A CREEPY VIBE FROM THIS GUY - would have done something if they had my experience, even if all they did was switch to another line. Nobody would want their children around people who give you the creeps... at least not normal people.

I think it is quite a stretch to think that boys are being raised to think they are destined to become pedophiles. But normal parents will make sure that boys understand the boundaries. And normal parents will tell any child to take precautions. If they don't, then they aren't doing their jobs very well.

 

[Liberty Belle]

Last night I had my daughters with me in a store. We were in line to pay. California Girls ( Beach Boys ) was playing over the speakers. There was a guy in front of us waiting to pay when we got in line.

He turned around and saw my daughters and said "Hello little girls." And then he turned away after my kids said hello.

So he starts singing "I wish they all could be real little girls" instead of California girls. So I walked up to him and gave him an evil eye, and just said "Dude."

And then he said "Sorry", and paid and walked away.

What would you have done or said? Part of me wanted to call the cops, but he didn't actually do anything illegal. But he was really creepy.

He was probably mentally ill or disabled. I don't know why someone who wasn't (or on drugs or drunk) would do that, especially right in front of their father.

I would have ignored him, probably.

 

[Liberty Belle]

A couple of months ago my DD 14 went to the the newest Harry Potter movie with a couple of friends and one of the friend's mother on opening day. The theater was very crowded as the movie let out and the lobby was packed with more people waiting to get in.

DD said a man her dad's age pinched her rear end twice when they were walking out of the theater and into the lobby! At first she thought it was an accident from someone who bumped into her because everyone was walking close together like a herd of cattle. But then it happened again, this time harder and more deliberate. She turned around and saw this creeper late 40's-ish to early 50's aged man right behind her looking at her right as she turned around to see who pinched her.

DD had gotten a little separated from her group in the crowd, but when they got out into the lobby she told her friends and her friend's mom what happened. They all thought it was funny and laughed. DD laughed with them to not show she was freaked out, but right after she was dropped off at home, she broke into tears and was so hysterical she couldn't even tell me what happened until she calmed down. It really scared her. Now had it been a teenager that pinched her she'd have laughed it off, but this was a man her dad's age!

I was a bit upset that the other mother took it so lightly, but she probably didn't know DD was freaked out. Had I been there with the girls, the mama bear would have come out in me. I would have found the creep, chewed him out and then followed him to his car and wrote down his driver's license number and reported him to the police for committing a lewd act on a minor. He would have denied it, I'm sure, but maybe the guy had a record which would have at least alerted the police to keep a closer eye on him.

The mom laughed?! I would have gone to the manager with a description at the least. That's crazy. Your poor daughter.

 

[mhsjax]

Sorry, but any man singing I wish they all were little girls to the tune of Wish they all could be California girls is just sick, and yep wacko and yep probably a pervert. There is no other explanation for it, and frankly I don't see how anyone can even start to claim anything else. This has nothing to do with being nice or talking to or even smiling at kids, that is appropriate behavior. But that song isn't appropriate especially when you change the words to little girls. Those beach boys are talking about wanting to play dolls, they are loving the way California girls look. CREEPY.

I wouldn't have called the cops, but I would have suggested that he not try and get his jollies off of little girls.

 

[DMRick]

Maybe he didn't know the words. Maybe he thought he was being cute.
I would not have thought anything of it. Maybe he said sorry, because he thought you thought he couldn't carry a note. It never would have occured to me, that he was a sexual preditor.

Last night I had my daughters with me in a store. We were in line to pay. California Girls ( Beach Boys ) was playing over the speakers. There was a guy in front of us waiting to pay when we got in line.

He turned around and saw my daughters and said "Hello little girls." And then he turned away after my kids said hello.

So he starts singing "I wish they all could be real little girls" instead of California girls. So I walked up to him and gave him an evil eye, and just said "Dude."

And then he said "Sorry", and paid and walked away.

What would you have done or said? Part of me wanted to call the cops, but he didn't actually do anything illegal. But he was really creepy.

 

[badblackpug]

Honestly, I think we are going way overboard as a society. We see a predator in every checkout line, lurking around every tree, in every man that is kind to a little girl. It is ridiculous to jump to the conclusion that this man is some sort of pedophile because he said hello and changed the words of California Girl. Maybe he was just trying to be silly and amuse your kids. Maybe he is a dad or a grandpa with a little daughter/granddaughter whom he adores. Maybe he is disabled, or mentally ill, or just has poor social skills. But a man who says hello to 2 kids then turns around and sings a little song, no longer engaging the children at all is hardly stalking prey. Would I have thought him a little strange? Maybe. A pedophile? Definitely not. As others have said this paranoia has unfairly stereotyped men. ...and honestly if your kids didn't hear him or understand him, why was it necessary to say anything?

 

[IDoDis]

This is why so few men are willing to teach elementary, even though we have so many boys that need that goo role model. Because people just assume that if a man likes kids, he has some sort of predatory nature. I'm so grateful that I have a male para with all of the little boys I have in my class, but I make sure that he is never alone with the kids and I handle anything to do with the little girls, just so that he doesn't get accused. I think it's sad that men who genuinely want to help kids are afraid to because all we see are predators.

Yes, there are predators out there. But I think that we need to temper that with some good old fashioned common sense.

My DH is an elementary school teacher (so am I). What you say is so true. He has to be real careful not to be alone with kids. The school counselor has a mentoring program at the school and teachers volunteer to eat lunch with a child they mentor once a week in their classroom while the other kids are at recess. DH always has to say "no" that he cannot do that. They really want him to because there are so few male teachers in elementary and the kids really love him. He's like a rock star at the school with girls wanting to hold his hand when he's walking outside. The parents all love him too, but all it would take is one child or irate parent to accuse him of something and that would be it for his reputation and maybe career.

 

[JJsmama]

I actually think the OP's instincts were probably right. What the OP felt was a sudden, instinctual desire to protect his children against something that felt dangerous. Research has shown that when humans feel these sudden instincts, we are usually correct. The Fight or FLight instinct is very strong. I can say it certainly got me out of some dangerous situations as a young woman. As for him 'dwelling on it', I feel for him. When a parents has what is perceived as a 'close call' with our children, it is hard NOT to dwell on it.

36 years ago I was a very sleepy two year old. My mother felt strongly that something was not right. My father told her to leave me alone and let me sleep. My mother took me to the hospital where doctors told her that I had meningitis and clearly stated that I would not live through the night. Well, I did, but it was a close call and my father has never gotten over feeling that he failed to react strongly enough to protect his child more quickly.

 

[NHdisneylover]

My daughters actually didn't even know what I said. I'm also sure they had no idea what the guy was singing.( Nor would they have understood my concerns just from hearing it ) Like I said, I got a bad vibe from this guy. I believe that every single person in this thread - IF THEY GOT A CREEPY VIBE FROM THIS GUY - would have done something if they had my experience, even if all they did was switch to another line. Nobody would want their children around people who give you the creeps... at least not normal people.

I think it is quite a stretch to think that boys are being raised to think they are destined to become pedophiles. But normal parents will make sure that boys understand the boundaries. And normal parents will tell any child to take precautions. If they don't, then they aren't doing their jobs very well.

I don't have an issue with trusting your instincts--in fact I think that is really important. I do have an issue with jumping to being willing to bet someone has predatory tendencies just because they say hello to your kids and then sing about little girls.

As far as raising boys to believe they are destined to grow up to be predators--have you seen posts on the DIS (your included)? Over and over I see parents who by actions and words, teach their children to avoid men and that men are dangerous. Whether that is by jumping to the conclusion that the man in the checkout who talk to you and sings is likely a predator, or by refusing to let a child spend the night a at a home with a father (or sometimes even a brother) present in the home, to telling kids if they get lost they must go to a women--the message that men are bad and will hurt you is everywhere. I find that horribly sad and horribly unfair to men and boys. Yes, the odds are that someone who hurts a child will be male, but the odds are that the vast majority of males will never hurt a child. And, at the same time that we are teaching our children that men are so dangerous, crimes by women against children are skyrocketing--so in the end they are still not protected.
I think it is much better for all to teach children that most people are good. That there are a few bad ones and what those bad ones might try and how to handle it if someone tries something with them. What to do and how do act to stay safe--oh and to trust their instincts (which also means if they need help and their instinct is that that man with his 2 kids is safe and that woman is not to go to the man).

 

[Disney Doll]

Well, OP, if the situation gave you the creeps then it's good that you trusted your instinct and handled it.

It's a bit of a leap from singing a song to sexual predator, but I wasn't there so maybe the creepy feeling was that strong.

In any event, you handled it. Bravo!

 

[Mermaid02]

BTW Op, you handled the situation well!

 

[Liberty Belle]

Sorry, but any man singing I wish they all were little girls to the tune of Wish they all could be California girls is just sick, and yep wacko and yep probably a pervert. There is no other explanation for it, and frankly I don't see how anyone can even start to claim anything else. This has nothing to do with being nice or talking to or even smiling at kids, that is appropriate behavior. But that song isn't appropriate especially when you change the words to little girls. Those beach boys are talking about wanting to play dolls, they are loving the way California girls look. CREEPY.

I wouldn't have called the cops, but I would have suggested that he not try and get his jollies off of little girls.

Really? Because it seems like something a few of the adults I know with high functioning autism would do. I still say he was probably disabled in some way. What predator would do that? It doesn't make sense at all.

 

[Carly_Roach]

The problem with giving people a pass for trusting their instincts is that some people's instincts are so whacked that they can't be trusted. Look at the parents who don't let their children out of their sight - they're trusting their instincts. Look at the men who get accused of being potential child molesters when all they did was take a strange child's hand to cross the street or take a job as a mall Santa Clause. They're accused by people who seem to get a pass from society because they invoked the, "I'm a parent who's trusting my instinct" clause.

Funny how the woman who drowns her children doesn't get a pass when her instincts tell her the end of the world is near and she wants to save her children from the horrible death her instincts have told her is sure to happen. Better that they die her way rather than being burned alive or run through with spears. She has an instinct, too. She likely saw herself as making the ultimate sacrifice for the love of her children, yet we call her crazy (or worse) and throw her in jail.

I'm all for following your instincts. Following our instincts has kept us out of trouble and away from harm since the beginning of man. By all means, trust your instincts that tell you to remove yourself, and your children, from the situation. However, I stop relying on other people's instincts when someone makes a serious charge against another human being based soley on personal opinion, which can be skewed and/or biased.

60 years ago that line of reasoning got many black men hung in the South and fed McCarthyism in the Senate when people were accused of having Communist tendencies simply because they acted or spoke differently. You'd think we'd have learned by now that witch hunts are bad.

 

[mhsjax]

Really? Because it seems like something a few of the adults I know with high functioning autism would do. I still say he was probably disabled in some way. What predator would do that? It doesn't make sense at all.

I know one person that is a high functioning autistic, this is NOT something he would do. I know autism exists, but I won't give everything a pass just because it does. Sorry.

 

[mhsjax]

The problem with giving people a pass for trusting their instincts is that some people's instincts are so whacked that they can't be trusted. Look at the parents who don't let their children out of their sight - they're trusting their instincts. Look at the men who get accused of being potential child molesters when all they did was take a strange child's hand to cross the street or take a job as a mall Santa Clause. They're accused by people who seem to get a pass from society because they invoked the, "I'm a parent who's trusting my instinct" clause.

Funny how the woman who drowns her children doesn't get a pass when her instincts tell her the end of the world is near and she wants to save her children from the horrible death her instincts have told her is sure to happen. Better that they die her way rather than being burned alive or run through with spears. She has an instinct, too. She likely saw herself as making the ultimate sacrifice for the love of her children, yet we call her crazy (or worse) and throw her in jail.

I'm all for following your instincts. Following our instincts has kept us out of trouble and away from harm since the beginning of man. By all means, trust your instincts that tell you to remove yourself, and your children, from the situation. However, I stop relying on other people's instincts when someone makes a serious charge against another human being based soley on personal opinion, which can be skewed and/or biased.

60 years ago that line of reasoning got many black men hung in the South and fed McCarthyism in the Senate when people were accused of having Communist tendencies simply because they acted or spoke differently. You'd think we'd have learned by now that witch hunts are bad.

I think your last paragraph is to the extreme. Somehow a man singing I wish they all could be little girls and thinking he is probably some kind of creep, isn't the same as hanging a black man or thinking everyone is a communist.