Why I Hate the DDP

[CinRell]

Making reservations way ahead just gives me something to do to count down to my trip and adds to my excitement!!!

 

[BCVBRUCE]

Perfectly said....prices for out of pocket people have gone up so we can help pay for the DDP (not to mention free dining)...fair no but is it filling the restaurants? yes! People hold their breathe for months to get those ADRs in once they hit 180 days...forget about taking a last minute trip and expecting to eat.
We will never do the DDP and as long as it exists service will be poor and food quality will continue to go down the tubes......I hope you wore you hazmat suit after your post...Good Luck!

My family and I decided to go to WDW on May 19, made reservations using our DVC points for a one-bedroom at SSR, bought WDW tickets, bought airline tickets, bought the DDP and most importantly, on May 20 made 8 ADR's at some very popular spots. We left for WDW on May 24, changed 3 ADR's while at the parks and flew home on May 31. Did we get any character meals? No! Did we try? Yes! Am I mad at the DDP, which by the way, is nothing but a form of payment for meals? No! You had to plan before the DDP, you have to plan now! However, last minute trips and very good meals ARE VERY POSSIBLE. You just have to be open and flexible.

Ones CHOICE to do the DDP has nothing to do with the current exhisting quality of food. Those ON the DDP get the exact same food as those NOT on the DDP. There is one difference,........it is CHEAPER and we get MORE. Again, the DDP is nothing but a form of payment.

 

[MaryKatesMom]

I have to disagree with you. My family every day at Disney (whether we had a dining plan or not) eats a TS breakfast. We usually do CS lunch and every night we eat a TS dinner. I fail to see why this is so completely unbelievable!!!! The snack credits we use for bottled water or a soda.

For your information, none of us are over weight. In fact, my sons are pretty skinny and my oldest wants to GAIN weight. We eat an early TS breakfast-usually between 8-8:30 and a pretty late TS dinner-7:30-8:30 PM. My boys are usually starving for a CS lunch around 1-1:30. Even my 5 year old DD can polish off some lunch. I fail to see how that make us freaks or something. We all eat 3 meals a day at home too Usually around the same times since my kids do sports and have practices/games at night. A lot of nights during football season, I don't even walk in the door until 8:15.

Just because you couldn't or wouldn't want to eat this way, doesn't mean it doesn't work for other families.

To say that is NOT what normal people eat...so I guess those that do are NOT normal??!!

I'm confident there are many NORMAL people who eat that much each day. Just because it may not be what you might eat, or even anyone you know, does NOT make it abnormal. Thank goodness we all have many different degrees of normal.

Obviously you have not vacationed with "normal" teenagers....

Just a reminder, please keep your posts friendly folks - no name calling! Opinions are great and we all have different priorities and styles of dining. No judgements please!

Um...excuse me, but...as a mother of three sons, and having observed all their friends as well, I can say for sure that many "normal" teenage boys eat SIX full meals a day, plus snacks

My mistake for using the more incendiary term normal (hence the flames) instead of average. The federal guidelines for an adult caloric intake is 2000 which would exceed 3 FULL meals and one snack. Now I won't be dragged into a discussion of what people should or shouldn't be doing,..it not my business and I don't care. TMI!

Um.... excuse me, but my point should anyone bother to actually listen to it is the DDP is not for everyone. Thank you all for great examples why.

 

[NEVERENOUGHWDW]

My family and I decided to go to WDW on May 19, made reservations using our DVC points for a one-bedroom at SSR, bought WDW tickets, bought airline tickets, bought the DDP and most importantly, on May 20 made 8 ADR's at some very popular spots. We left for WDW on May 24, changed 3 ADR's while at the parks and flew home on May 31. Did we get any character meals? No! Did we try? Yes! Am I mad at the DDP, which by the way, is nothing but a form of payment for meals? No! You had to plan before the DDP, you have to plan now! However, last minute trips and very good meals ARE VERY POSSIBLE. You just have to be open and flexible.

Ones CHOICE to do the DDP has nothing to do with the current exhisting quality of food. Those ON the DDP get the exact same food as those NOT on the DDP. There is one difference,........it is CHEAPER and we get MORE. Again, the DDP is nothing but a form of payment.

IMO wrong! If you see no difference in menu offerings now compared to prior DDP & free dining I think we must have had different menus than you

 

[kaytieeldr]

My mistake for using the more incendiary term normal (hence the flames) instead of average. The federal guidelines for an adult caloric intake is 2000 which would exceed 3 FULL meals and one snack.

Actually, exceeding 2000 calories per day is what exceeds 2000 calories per day. Three full meals and a snack may or may not exceed the recommendation, depending entirely on what one eats on any given day.

Ignoring for a moment that the Disney Dining Plan does NOT provide three full meals a day - may I ask what your typical meal style is? Not what you eat, I don't care and it's none of my business. But what meals, how many, do you snack?

Back to the DDP - each participant gets one table (e.g. full) service meal; one counter (e.g. lighter, quick) service meal; and one snack. Sounds reasonable to me. Sure, it's less than the recommended three actual meals a day, but...

 

[Katiebell]

IMO wrong! If you see no difference in menu offerings now compared to prior DDP & free dining I think we must have had different menus than you

There is no doubt that there have been changes to WDW menus, and that some of the high-end more expensive dishes and/or ingredients have been discontinued. I don't think anyone is disputing that at all.

But the Disney Dining Plan is not the cause of those changes. Disney didn't decide to offer a dining plan, then offer it for free to certain groups/during certain times of year, then suddenly the marketing geniuses at Disney said, "Oh, goodness, this is costing us a lot of money, we had no idea this would happen! Quick, take the lobster and filet off the menus, before we go bankrupt!!!"

Disney decided to make changes to their Food Service division that were designed to make it more profitable. They offered the Dining Plan, to entice guests to pay up front for their meals, to get a discount but to also eat every day at TS restaurants, and to spend all of their vacation food budget on Disney property. They have scaled back portions. They homogenized the menus somewhat because it's cheaper and easier to buy a lot of the same ingredients in huge volume for many different restaurants. They cut back on some of the more costly "signature dishes" that probably had a very low profit margin -- not all "signature dishes" are costly so they aren't likely to go away anytime soon, for example the Cheddar Cheese Soup at Le Cellier.

I'm honestly sorry to say it, but the Golden Age of Disney Dining is over. I'm genuinely disappointed to have missed it, because Disneyland never had it But even if WDW Dining isn't what it once was, it really isn't dreadful, either. We had excellent service and several very good meals on our visit, much better than could be expected at any other amusement park -- which is natural, because Disney is so much more than an amusement park. I can't see WDW ever going back to a place where the TS restaurants are easy to walk into, half empty, and serving pricey, elegant dishes to the select group of diners who can afford to spend the most. Disney would rather take the menus down a notch or two and have the restaurants packed to the rafters every single day of the year, with eager guests clamoring for ADR's. It just makes good business sense.

 

[CR88]

But the Disney Dining Plan is not the cause of those changes. Disney didn't decide to offer a dining plan, then offer it for free to certain groups/during certain times of year, then suddenly the marketing geniuses at Disney said, "Oh, goodness, this is costing us a lot of money, we had no idea this would happen! Quick, take the lobster and filet off the menus, before we go bankrupt!!!"
QUOTE]

I would have to agree that DDP didn't cause the decline. Many of the frequent Disney travelers that have been going for many years probably notice changes more than I would have since we have been only going yearly the past 2 years, but correlation does not always mean causation. I remember our trip back in 1999 and the food didn’t seem any better. The food was very good then, and it was very good in ‘05 & ‘06. We have no trouble finding a good filet and service seemed to be pretty much the same as it was back in ‘99. But then again, we didn’t go yearly until recently so subtle changes would have probably gone unnoticed. About the only thing I have noticed is that it is more difficult to get a sit down dinner at a popular restaurant, but that’s OK, I can deal with that, I will just make reservations earlier. We have however noticed MANY if not ALL of our favorite chains over the past 10 years or so that have had similar changes to what the DDP critics describe. Many of our favorite dishes are no longer on the menu, and when they are, the portions are so much smaller and IMO lower quality. Service at the chains also seems to be declining in some, not all, as work ethic in ’07 is not the same as it once was. The mom and pop type restaurants seem to be more resilient to the “dumbing down” of the menu, but they aren't immune. With the rising prices of the ingredients it makes it more difficult to keep things on the menu that don't sell quickly, or aren't ingredients for other dishes. But I don’t claim this to be fact, maybe the DDP did cause the decline; I just don't see how it could have similarly affected all of the other non-Disney restaurants too.

 

[BCVBRUCE]

IMO wrong! If you see no difference in menu offerings now compared to prior DDP & free dining I think we must have had different menus than you

I do not think you understand what I am saying. WDW food has become crappier and crappier over the years. This decline started well before the DDP. Remember the "Food and Fun" plan. We used it in 1996 and the food was excellent then. So the correllation between crappy WDW food and the DDP, Food and Fun or whatever the plan du jour, is a non-issue.

Right now at this very moment WDW food is relatively crappy compared to a few years ago. Your "CHOICE" is a)Eat crappy WDW food on-site, save time and enjoy the various themes/food offerings -OR- b)Eat off site? That's it. Those are your choices.

So, if you choose option a), now you have another choice. That is, do I pay more for this crappy food out of pocket or do I try to save a buck and have the relative peace of mind that I paid a fixed price for the same crappy food that everyone else is getting.

The choice of doing the DDP or not has absolutely no bearing on the quality of food you are getting. That is purely WDW cutting corners and trying to make a buck.

 

[gokenin]

I do not think you understand what I am saying. WDW food has become crappier and crappier over the years. This decline started well before the DDP. Remember the "Food and Fun" plan. We used it in 1996 and the food was excellent then. So the correllation between crappy WDW food and the DDP, Food and Fun or whatever the plan du jour, is a non-issue.

Right now at this very moment WDW food is relatively crappy compared to a few years ago. Your "CHOICE" is a)Eat crappy WDW food on-site, save time and enjoy the various themes/food offerings -OR- b)Eat off site? That's it. Those are your choices.

So, if you choose option a), now you have another choice. That is, do I pay more for this crappy food out of pocket or do I try to save a buck and have the relative peace of mind that I paid a fixed price for the same crappy food that everyone else is getting.

The choice of doing the DDP or not has absolutely no bearing on the quality of food you are getting. That is purely WDW cutting corners and trying to make a buck.

so I was wondering does everyone that hates the DDP and thinks that the disney food is crap still eat there? or do you all eat offsite for every meal? just wondering how much you really hate disney food since you come here and say how awful it is.

 

[CR Resort Fan 4 Life]

so I was wondering does everyone that hates the DDP and thinks that the disney food is crap still eat there? or do you all eat offsite for every meal? just wondering how much you really hate disney food since you come here and say how awful it is.

My family and I don't think Disney food is crap, however that is not the reason we have a lot of meals offsite. Since we don't purchase the DDP we are not forced to make ADR's for every single day of our vacation and sometimes we may not even make any ADR's for our whole time at WDW.

 

[sportears]

Disney use to offer a Fall Fantacy Package, which was an off season discounted package, that included free breakfast at any on property restaurant during your stay. It was great becuase we always booked the latest breakfast possible, considered it Brunch, and only paid for one meal, dinner each day. (the latest time for breakfast use to be 10:50) The DDP included packages, which are primarily the off season discounted packages. If Disney considers the Daily DDP value per person to be $100, then what is the easiest way for the company to save money? Continue to charge and book the value at $100 per day, though cut the cost of the food.

Someone posted that DDP and non-DDP people eat the same food, WELL OF COURSE THEY DO, but the quality for everyone goes down. We have never used the DDP, but I can tell you this, at Kona Cafe during Easter, we had a 8 PM Res., we got to the restaurant at 6 PM, hoping to eat early, they seated us immediately. The restaruant was crowded, and I noticed that there were several people standing by the podium looking as if they were waiting to be seated.

 

[sportears]

DDP has never worked for us. We primarily only eat at table service restaurants, and we always like to eat at the Flying Fish and Cal Grill at least once each trip, and those take too many credits. I do believe that are more apt to work you in, if you don't have a res., or change a res. at the last minute, if you were NOT on the DDP. Even though the food quality has dropped overall, we still eat on property for conveniance only. Basically, if you stay on property, they've got you.

A few years ago, I wrote a letter addressing it to ever Disney top executive, outlining a list if things I thought needed to be changed. I had a list of about 5 things which included food quality. When we went back this year, everything I had complained about had been corrected, with the exception of the food. When the next annual report comes out, I plan to write again complaining about the food. I think someone needs to post all of the Exec. names and addresses again, and we all need to write letters complaining about the food.

 

[DonaldTDuck]

I love the food, love the DDP especially in September and wouldn't want to go off site to eat most meals. Even when we've stayed off site, most meals are at Disney. My favorites are still the same, with most fo my favorite dishes. With DDP, I've tried new restaurants and have new favorites. Now I'm a meat and taters type, don't want that fancy stuff. A good steak, pot roast, or some good German food will make me happy. If you think the food is crfap, please feel free to eat elsewhere. If you thin\k the DDP is just wrong, no one is making you use it. Disney used to have an under 50% table use. This will shut anyone down. Now they run over 90%. Why in heck would they consider 86'ing it?

 

[NEVERENOUGHWDW]

There is no doubt that there have been changes to WDW menus, and that some of the high-end more expensive dishes and/or ingredients have been discontinued. I don't think anyone is disputing that at all.

But the Disney Dining Plan is not the cause of those changes. Disney didn't decide to offer a dining plan, then offer it for free to certain groups/during certain times of year, then suddenly the marketing geniuses at Disney said, "Oh, goodness, this is costing us a lot of money, we had no idea this would happen! Quick, take the lobster and filet off the menus, before we go bankrupt!!!"

Disney decided to make changes to their Food Service division that were designed to make it more profitable. They offered the Dining Plan, to entice guests to pay up front for their meals, to get a discount but to also eat every day at TS restaurants, and to spend all of their vacation food budget on Disney property. They have scaled back portions. They homogenized the menus somewhat because it's cheaper and easier to buy a lot of the same ingredients in huge volume for many different restaurants. They cut back on some of the more costly "signature dishes" that probably had a very low profit margin -- not all "signature dishes" are costly so they aren't likely to go away anytime soon, for example the Cheddar Cheese Soup at Le Cellier.

I'm honestly sorry to say it, but the Golden Age of Disney Dining is over. I'm genuinely disappointed to have missed it, because Disneyland never had it But even if WDW Dining isn't what it once was, it really isn't dreadful, either. We had excellent service and several very good meals on our visit, much better than could be expected at any other amusement park -- which is natural, because Disney is so much more than an amusement park. I can't see WDW ever going back to a place where the TS restaurants are easy to walk into, half empty, and serving pricey, elegant dishes to the select group of diners who can afford to spend the most. Disney would rather take the menus down a notch or two and have the restaurants packed to the rafters every single day of the year, with eager guests clamoring for ADR's. It just makes good business sense.

No doubt we have opposite opinions of what "very good" is.

Of course they took top items of menus with the DDP......if they didn't most that participate would order the $$$$ items on the menu which has been proven here time & time again with threads from DDp participants. Not sure what words were hysterical to you....

 

[MaryKatesMom]

But the Disney Dining Plan is not the cause of those changes. Disney didn't decide to offer a dining plan, then offer it for free to certain groups/during certain times of year, then suddenly the marketing geniuses at Disney said, "Oh, goodness, this is costing us a lot of money, we had no idea this would happen! Quick, take the lobster and filet off the menus, before we go bankrupt!!!"

What is your source for that statement? Please link it.

Perhaps you remember a few years ago Red Lobster had an all you can eat crab promotion. Guess what? They took a bath on it and an executive lost his job. Mistakes happen.

How much experience in the restaurant industry did the marketing guy have?

Didn't they change the way credits were pooled because of abuses using the children's credits for adult meals? That leads me to believe that they DO monitor what is being ordered and change their menu/ plan to reduce losses. Maybe they don't need to take the lobster and filet off ALL of the menu's but isn't that a great way to get people over to Cap'n Jack's and out of Le Cellier? Out of MK and over to DD?

http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=1469601

 

[Andrea from PA]

We did DDP on our 1st family trip Dec 2005 -- It was wonderful for our family of 5!

We will be doing it again Dec 2007, but from all the posts I realize I need to lower my expectations -- Appears sevice has suffered & definitely from skimming the menus choices have decreased dramatically (esp for the kids).

I am using DDP because it is good financial sense for us, but seems like we ALL (DDP & OOP) are losing some magic

 

[drakethib]

I have to wonder, where are you guys eating at WDW.

I honestly cannot remember having a very bad meal there and many are saying the food just keeps getting worse.

Maybe I have not made as many trips as you all (probably 12 - 15 or so in the last 7 - 8 years) but Boatwrights and Cindys castle still fill the void in my belly each time we visit.

Maybe I don't have enough culture to know what "true" good food is, but I grew up in South Louisiana and we cajuns are known for our good cooking. JMHO

 

[gina2000]

Making changes in purchasing, reducing portions and eliminating high cost items made the DDP possible. The DDP may not have caused these things to happen but the powers that be were definitely looking for a way to fill the restaurants without sacrificing the bottom line. So the changes go hand in hand with the DDP as far as I'm concerned.

As far as WDW food being a higher caliber than other theme parks, I'll agree to some degree. The big problem, however, is that visitors to WDW tend to stay far longer than they do at Great Adventure or a ball game. A day or two of expensive, rip-me-off prices is fine. When you multiply it by 5 or 7 days, it gets ridiculous. And I think that's what has turned us off of WDW dining. If you don't do the DDP, you've got in-your-face prices for decent, not great food. Sure WDW does a great job with food for the amount of people it serves. But at what cost? Day after day, it gets ridiculous. The DDP at least brings the price into perspective for our family. I don't expect great food at that price. At an OOP price, though, I do. And I don't care how many people they're feeding. So we headed offsite, paid one third the cost and were satisfied with the food.

I don't expect Ruth Chris steak at a one table service WDW restaurant. I expect Outback steak. But if I'm going OOP, I don't want to pay Ruth Chris' prices either. And that's where my protest lies. If I go to a signature restaurant, I'll be happy to pay Ruth Chris' prices for a reasonably sized and great tasting steak. But beef shrinkage has become a glaringly apparent observation at WDW restaurants and the price ain't comin' down, baybay.

JMHO

 

[bytheblood]

DDP

 

[BCVBRUCE]

so I was wondering does everyone that hates the DDP and thinks that the disney food is crap still eat there? or do you all eat offsite for every meal? just wondering how much you really hate disney food since you come here and say how awful it is.

I am rather baffled by your question! It is quite simple.

I believe, in my opinion, in my wife's opinion and many others here believe that WDW food has gone down hill over the past few years.

I do not believe that the cause of said decline in food quality is due to the DDP. It is merely WDW trying to make a buck. Why was the food better than it is today during the heyday of the Food and Fun plan??????????????????? It is, after all, the same relative plan as the DDP???????????

If faced with paying full price for WDW food out of pocket or paying roughly 75% of the cost by using the DDP, I Choose the DDP.

I choose to eat WDW food because while it is RELATIVELY crappy compared to a few years ago, it still beats wasting valuable park/vacation time, traveling off-site and eating even crappier Golden Corral, Applebees and etc.

Everytime I have gone to WDW, I have used the DDP or the Food and Fun plan(when it exhisted). I will continue to use the DDP.

Just for clarification, WDW food is NOT awful and I do NOT hate WDW food. It has gone down hill.