Why I Hate the DDP

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Plus DDP meals order much more that require I "tip out" to other areas of my restaurant. People rarely get just a coke. Because I am having to serve 2-3 times the food to the same amount of guests, I have to tip out my food runners more as well and they don't run my apps or desserts, I do. Say your bill is $100. Of that 100, I receive $18. Of that 18, I tip the bar $1.80, food runners $3-3.60 (mind you the food runners only run the entrees, I do the rest). That leaves me with $12.60 before taxes. I have also found that most guests in a TS restaurant tip 20% or more in general at my location.

I am trying very hard to be politically correct here about the plan. It has some great pros for us and some great cons.

So, another question...

... If a DDP guest tips an additional 10% - 15% on top of the plan (which many here do faithfully) won't you make better money than those who are OOP? I know everyone on DDP will not tip extra, but many will. Also, as far as the tipping out of other employees, this is a part of the equation many do not know about but is very common in large operations where drink stewards and runners are utilized. What happens to the OOP guest who orders something other than a coke or includes appetizers and/or dessert?? We often order this way DDP or OOP. Does this upset our server??? Is this uncommon for people off the DDP to order the "extras" to make a complete dining experience??? Just some questions.

:thumbsup2
 
... for a family of 5 we run between $140 - $170 for a table service meal while at WDW (DDP total or OOP). We like to get different apps and desserts and sample around the table. No, we do not eat every bite of everything.


:thumbsup2
 
keeping quiet - Thank you for speaking up!

Are no-shows a big problem?

Are there that many people making multiply ADR's?

Have the number of ADR's gone up since DDP?
 
You make a very good point, but something needs to be done to discourage multiple bookings for the same time slot by one person or group of people.

Getting stuck on a ride would stink........that is hard (impossible) to plan for. The only option is to buffer your meal ADR with some slow time.

:thumbsup2

This happened years ago and we usually do because I'm hungry by that point. I never late for dinner. ;)

But not many people have experience in the parks to get around and it is very easy to misjudge on those cute little maps how long it takes to get from one place to another add to that the excitement and distractions. It is one of the best places in the world to lose track of time. :hourglass
 

So, another question...

... If a DDP guest tips an additional 10% - 15% on top of the plan (which many here do faithfully) won't you make better money than those who are OOP? I know everyone on DDP will not tip extra, but many will. Also, as far as the tipping out of other employees, this is a part of the equation many do not know about but is very common in large operations where drink stewards and runners are utilized. What happens to the OOP guest who orders something other than a coke or includes appetizers and/or dessert?? We often order this way DDP or OOP. Does this upset our server??? Is this uncommon for people off the DDP to order the "extras" to make a complete dining experience??? Just some questions.

:thumbsup2


RARELY Do DDP guests tip extra! It is far from the norm. However, when they do, it is the highlight of our day! Makes us feel really good knowing that they didn't have to give extra, but obviously thought it was worth it. I will admit that some cast members "expect" extra during the months that the include DDP for free. I am generally just happy that someone showed up! LOL

The difference with DDP and OOP is simply that the bulk of the time, the DDP will maximize their plan (AS THEY SHOULD) and an OOP will get just what they want. That OOP may order 4 apps for 4 people but it is unlikely. OOP tend to get bar drinks vs. non-alcoholic virgin drinks, etc. If your server gets upset because you are DDP or OOP, or because you order extras, get a new server, post their name here and we will go take care of a little explaining in house *wink wink*. I want my guests to get an app or a cocktail or a dessert. It all adds up to higher check and more opportunity for me to shine.

I take great pride in my work and have so much fun doing it. I get frustrated with my fellow cast members who differentiate between guests (the worst is when you hear them griping that the cast member guest didn't leave anything over their included gratuity-most cast members make so little money who are we to expect more!) To me a guest is a guest is a guest. Who cares how you pay, as long as you do because I don't have time to chase after you. Come in with a desire to have fun, eat good food and we will have the best time ever. Come in having a bad time and I will do what I can to try to turn that around.

Bottom line: I make about the same per year but just have to work a lot harder for it. Being a server at Disney used to be like being on a gravy train - easy money and lots of it (I'll admit it). Now, like everywhere else, we have to work a lot harder to maintain the same income. Its life. Do I hate the DDP? Absolutely not. If it weren't for DDP, my income for the entire month of September would be about $500. I do hate some of the BS I have to do or say because of it, i.e., I would be happy to bring you a coffee, but I will have to charge you for it off plan as you are only entitled to one beverage. UGH! Makes me feel like scrooge.

On another note, I am so excited to be using the plan this September myself! Every now and then they offer the plan to cast members (for a fee of course) and I can't wait to see how the hotel spiels it, how other restaurants handle it, etc. For the record, I have worked in 6 different full-service restuarants on property and 4 of them were after the plan began.
 
keeping quiet - Thank you for speaking up!

Are no-shows a big problem?

Are there that many people making multiply ADR's?

Have the number of ADR's gone up since DDP?

We have gone from having very few no-shows (we are a "must do" restaurant) to having 10-20% daily this year. Disney is well aware of the multiple reservation issue. It makes staffing a nightmare. Thankfully, our front desk staff are great about taking walk-ins and feeling the flow of the restaurant. With many guests having multiple phone numbers (cell, home, work, spouse cell and work, etc.), there isn't much to be done. I don't see Disney requiring deposits for reservations, but they have surprised me in the past.
 
It comes in our paycheck a week later. DISNEY NEVER HOLDS TIPS! (making sure I am clear here as I know they often read the various boards) I pay taxes on every penny that I receive DDP, credit card or cash (we live in an age where you cannot "hide" tips as everything is run through the computer), however, with the large jump in the amount "in the check" we are all feeling a stronger bite in the tax department. None of us can quite figure it out as tax percentage is still just that... a percentage. Plus DDP meals order much more that require I "tip out" to other areas of my restaurant. People rarely get just a coke. Because I am having to serve 2-3 times the food to the same amount of guests, I have to tip out my food runners more as well and they don't run my apps or desserts, I do. Say your bill is $100. Of that 100, I receive $18. Of that 18, I tip the bar $1.80, food runners $3-3.60 (mind you the food runners only run the entrees, I do the rest). That leaves me with $12.60 before taxes. I have also found that most guests in a TS restaurant tip 20% or more in general at my location.

I am trying very hard to be politically correct here about the plan. It has some great pros for us and some great cons.

Thanks so much for this explanation, we knew there was always a reason why our servers seemed suddenly relieved/cheerful/more attentive when we were asked if we were on DDP and replied No. We do use the DDE, and always tip between 20 - 25%, so the discount is basically the tip :)
Michelle in NY
 
/
I too have been turned away without an ADR. If they held a few tables it would not matter since there is a constant stream of people trying to get in. You would only please a couple of people. My suggestion is if you're staying on site just visit the guest services desk first thing before you head out to see whats available that day. I have gotten many good reservations like that. For the record I hate making reservation so far out and having to plan my parks according to that. But there's no other choice if you want a certain resturant during dinner time. Each place can only service so many people per hour.
 
RARELY Do DDP guests tip extra! It is far from the norm. However, when they do, it is the highlight of our day! Makes us feel really good knowing that they didn't have to give extra, but obviously thought it was worth it. I will admit that some cast members "expect" extra during the months that the include DDP for free. I am generally just happy that someone showed up! LOL

The difference with DDP and OOP is simply that the bulk of the time, the DDP will maximize their plan (AS THEY SHOULD) and an OOP will get just what they want. That OOP may order 4 apps for 4 people but it is unlikely. OOP tend to get bar drinks vs. non-alcoholic virgin drinks, etc. If your server gets upset because you are DDP or OOP, or because you order extras, get a new server, post their name here and we will go take care of a little explaining in house *wink wink*. I want my guests to get an app or a cocktail or a dessert. It all adds up to higher check and more opportunity for me to shine.

I take great pride in my work and have so much fun doing it. I get frustrated with my fellow cast members who differentiate between guests (the worst is when you hear them griping that the cast member guest didn't leave anything over their included gratuity-most cast members make so little money who are we to expect more!) To me a guest is a guest is a guest. Who cares how you pay, as long as you do because I don't have time to chase after you. Come in with a desire to have fun, eat good food and we will have the best time ever. Come in having a bad time and I will do what I can to try to turn that around.

Bottom line: I make about the same per year but just have to work a lot harder for it. Being a server at Disney used to be like being on a gravy train - easy money and lots of it (I'll admit it). Now, like everywhere else, we have to work a lot harder to maintain the same income. Its life. Do I hate the DDP? Absolutely not. If it weren't for DDP, my income for the entire month of September would be about $500. I do hate some of the BS I have to do or say because of it, i.e., I would be happy to bring you a coffee, but I will have to charge you for it off plan as you are only entitled to one beverage. UGH! Makes me feel like scrooge.

On another note, I am so excited to be using the plan this September myself! Every now and then they offer the plan to cast members (for a fee of course) and I can't wait to see how the hotel spiels it, how other restaurants handle it, etc. For the record, I have worked in 6 different full-service restuarants on property and 4 of them were after the plan began.



I would love to have you as my server!!! :flower3: You seem to be a true professional........Thanks for making someone's day at WDW special!!!


:thumbsup2
 
Hmm… a ‘must-do’ restaurant with a typical $40 check and which does take walk-ins… eliminates Le Cellier… eliminates the Signature locations… eliminates the buffets and pre-plated meals… :scratchin
 
However, the point of the thread isn't what your family does or my family does it is but what impact does the use of the DDP have on Disney Dining

The title of the thread is "Why I Hate the DDP" -- sort of a broad topic. And the OP said she hated it because people were rudely making multiple overlapping ADR's (there doesn't seem to be any dispute there, it's definitely happening), she felt the OOP price of food has gone up (no proof at all that there is a connection in anyway to the DDP), service has suffered for people paying OOP (interestingly, many people paying OOP have stated they felt the server treated them better when they found out they weren't on the DDP), and the CS lines are horrendous because people new to the plan don't know how to use it. I don't believe there was anything in her original post about a decline in food quality -- although that was mentioned later on by others who "Hate the DDP".

What some folks just don't seem to be understanding is that the DDP did not cause the unfavorable changes to Disney Dining. Disney decided to make some changes to increase their profits, and one of those changes was to offer the Dining Plan.

Maybe if you look at it this way: if I shop for maternity clothes, and friends give me their babies' outgrown clothes, and I buy a crib, and I paint my spare room yellow with little ducky wallpaper -- does that make me pregnant? :rotfl2: No. You can see by the things I did that I had a "plan of action" to have a baby, but none of those steps caused me to get pregnant.

Disney had a plan of action to make more money. They saw that the resorts had empty rooms, particularly during certain seasons, and that the TS restaurants were often operating at considerably below capacity. So they:
* offered the free ME -- costs money to operate, but keeps the guests on the property without a rental car, spending all of their money at Disney (even for grossly inflated sundries and bottled water, as previously mentioned).
* offered the DDP -- Disney takes a bit of a loss on those who utilize the plan fully and use all of their credits wisely, but people pre-pay for their meals and stay on Disney property to get the value. And Disney recoups much of that loss with guests who don't pre plan meals and don't use all of their non-refundable credits, or who spend credits on cheaper meals, and end up paying OOP for more expensive meals if they run out of credits.
* offered the DDP for free during certain seasons/to certain groups -- Disney takes a much larger loss by offering dining for free, but this is offset in having the resorts full during hurricane season, the majority of the guests getting free dining paying standard rack rate for their rooms. No more "slow season".
* scaled back menus -- Disney restaurants have cut some of their signature dishes or substituted less expensive ingredients for some of their menu offerings, and have standardized/homogenized menus across the board to some degree, and have evidently also decreased some portion sizes. This was not caused by the DDP. Disney did this as part of their overall plan to increase profitability, and it's part of an industry-wide trend.

There have been some negative impacts as a result -- restaurants are operating at full capacity (a plus in Disney's eyes), but now are overcrowded and hard to get in to (bad). Because restaurants are in such high demand, people must book meals months in advance, taking away from the spontaneity of their vacations (a plus for people who love to plan in advance). Because the restaurants are packed to the rafters, servers are stressed and working their tails off (bad) but are also making steady money year round with guaranteed tips on high ticket meals (good). It has also been mentioned that CS lines are now long due to clueless guests/CM's who don't understand how the plan works. I had delays behind guests at 3 CS restaurants -- Tusker House, Columbia Harbor House, and the Cantina, where an incredibly rude woman was asking for detailed descriptions of each menu item at the window, and kept asking why they didn't serve certain things -- repeatedly -- 20 minutes before Illuminations when there were a million people in line behind her. I thought the crowd was going to throw her in the lagoon. I would have gladly grabbed her feet :laughing: NONE of those slow guests were on the DDP.

The Dining Plan is part of the overall changes Disney has implemented to make more money. There have been some unfavorable changes to Disney Dining, but they were not caused by the Dining Plan, that's only one piece of the total picture. Just like putting ducky wallpaper up in my spare room will not make me pregnant :teeth:
 
... from everything I have observed on the DIS it seems many of us (DIS members) tip in that 10% - 15% above while on DDP. Sorry that the general WDW patron does not. Many of us think the service is worth the extra!!!

:thumbsup2
 
I would love to have you as my server!!! :flower3: You seem to be a true professional........Thanks for making someone's day at WDW special!!!


:thumbsup2

You wouldn't say that when I got done with you! :) I am a task master, inflexible, and if you don't do what I say, I will punish you. I may even drive you to drink, but you would have had fun doing it. But if you are my favorite of the group, you can do no wrong. You can guess my location I am sure. I would say that 75% of us in my location are fun, professional and efficient. The other 25% don't seem to get what we do or why... and they wonder why they don't make any money. :thumbsup2 Thank you for the compliment.
 
Service has suffered. I really think that the service we received was consistently less that stellar - even in the pricier places. If you have servers making consistent money because they are guaranteed a certain amount off of every DP patron - they really couldn't give a hoot about a table of "out of pockets" - they have already made their money. (Believe me I know....I was a server for a long time....take away the incentive for good service and I would be cranky too!!)

Thanks so much for this explanation, we knew there was always a reason why our servers seemed suddenly relieved/cheerful/more attentive when we were asked if we were on DDP and replied No. We do use the DDE, and always tip between 20 - 25%, so the discount is basically the tip :)
Michelle in NY

This is a perfect example -- one poster says they are treated badly by servers because they are paying OOP. The other poster says their server treats them better because they are paying OOP. It's totally a matter of perception: whether or not you have a good server, whether or not they are having a good night (everyone has an off night, as they say), and maybe the way the guest treats the server might have something to do with it? Maybe also whether the guest thinks the DDP is a good thing or not may also have to do with their perception as to the service they received. And sometimes it's just what a guest considers to be "good service". Some people think if they have to ask for a drink refill one time that they received poor service. Others might be a little more forgiving, particularly if the restaurant is a madhouse and the server is running their tail off in fifty million different directions.
 
Thank Katiebell is one smart cookie!

Not so smart...I just figured out that the ducky wallpaper didn't cause it, and I ended up with three kids :rotfl2:

I did want to say, that I really have appreciated reading your perspective, and you have confirmed what I've believed all along: Disney servers are a special group of folks. You guys deal with huge crowds of diverse, often demanding people, and you work hard, stay cheerful and pleasant and make our Disney vacation more wonderful. We didn't get a chance to dine at your restaurant (my husband was ill -- not due to food -- during the last couple of days of our vacation, and that unfortunately canceled some of our plans), but all of the servers and CM's who took care of us at WDW were fantastic, just like the great experiences we've had every year at Disneyland :goodvibes
 
I guess we aren't regular DDP people then. We always add money to the tip to make it 20% and we always order alcohol-even at lunch. We add $ to the auto 18% tip to our drinks as well.

I have never noticed a difference in our service whether we used the DDP or paid cash. :confused3 I'm so surprised people say that. We used the plan in Oct 2006, but paid OOP for breakfasts-Norway, Donalds, Crystal Palace, 'Ohana, Spoodles, Cape May Cafe. We paid OOP for lunches at Brown Derby, Sci-Fi, and ESPN. We paid OOP for dinner at Mama Melrose.

We USED the plan for dinners at Rose and Crown, Le Celliar, Flying Fish, 'Ohana, Kona Cafe, Wolfgang Puck, Cape May Cafe. Of course, we also used it for CS lunches. There was no difference in our service whether used the plan or payed cash.

Dec 2005 we went without the DDP and only used the DDE card. We noticed no difference in service between that trip and our trip 10 months later WITH the DDP. I have such a hard time believeing that people are being treated better/worse based solely on the DDP. Oh course, maybe servers like us either way because we are generally pleasant and order alcohol. :rotfl:
 
I guess we aren't regular DDP people then. We always add money to the tip to make it 20% and we always order alcohol-even at lunch. We add $ to the auto 18% tip to our drinks as well.

I have never noticed a difference in our service whether we used the DDP or paid cash. :confused3 I'm so surprised people say that. We used the plan in Oct 2006, but paid OOP for breakfasts-Norway, Donalds, Crystal Palace, 'Ohana, Spoodles, Cape May Cafe. We paid OOP for lunches at Brown Derby, Sci-Fi, and ESPN. We paid OOP for dinner at Mama Melrose.

We USED the plan for dinners at Rose and Crown, Le Celliar, Flying Fish, 'Ohana, Kona Cafe, Wolfgang Puck, Cape May Cafe. Of course, we also used it for CS lunches. There was no difference in our service whether used the plan or payed cash.

Dec 2005 we went without the DDP and only used the DDE card. We noticed no difference in service between that trip and our trip 10 months later WITH the DDP. I have such a hard time believeing that people are being treated better/worse based solely on the DDP. Oh course, maybe servers like us either way because we are generally pleasant and order alcohol. :rotfl:



I agree.......we have the same level of service with or without DDP.


:thumbsup2
 
Bravo Katiebell! :flower3: I think you summed that up perfectly and I loved your analogy!

PS: I'd blame the ducks myself :thumbsup2
 
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