Why does it take 4 years to get a college education?

[NY Disney fan]

Why does it take 4 years to get a college education and then another few years to specialize in something? For example, if a high school student wants to be a doctor why can't they go into medical school right after high school (like they do in India)? Why is pre-med necessary? Want to be a lawyer? Why not go to law school after high school? (Abraham Lincoln became a lawyer on the job and did not go to school). Want to be a TV producer...there can be communications schools.

I feel like college is such a scam. People are drowning themselves in debt just becuase they need more and more and more schooling.

Please tell me I'm being ridiculous.

 

[DVCLiz]

Why does it take 4 years to get a college education and then another few years to specialize in something? For example, if a high school student wants to be a doctor why can't they go into medical school right after high school (like they do in India)? Why is pre-med necessary? Want to be a lawyer? Why not go to law school after high school? (Abraham Lincoln became a lawyer on the job and did not go to school). Want to be a TV producer...there can be communications schools.

I feel like college is such a scam. People are drowning themselves in debt just becuase they need more and more and more schooling.

Please tell me I'm being ridiculous.

I think you're being ridiculous, but that's just my opinion. I don't want any professional to go directly to graduate school without first having the basic education provided by a college liberal arts/sciences curriculum. I also don't want a doctor operating on me at age 22 or 23. Again, that's just me.

There are many ways to get an undergraduate education without debt, including working and going part-time, going to summer school as a full-time student, and choosing community college for some or all of the undergraduate coursework.

 

[mhsjax]

Why does it take 4 years to get a college education and then another few years to specialize in something? For example, if a high school student wants to be a doctor why can't they go into medical school right after high school (like they do in India)? Why is pre-med necessary? Want to be a lawyer? Why not go to law school after high school? (Abraham Lincoln became a lawyer on the job and did not go to school). Want to be a TV producer...there can be communications schools.

I feel like college is such a scam. People are drowning themselves in debt just becuase they need more and more and more schooling.

Please tell me I'm being ridiculous.

I agree with you.

Not only that, but jobs these days are requiring college degrees that really shouldn't. I see a lot of customer service jobs that want a 4 year degree. Sorry but I did that job years ago, you don't need a degree for that. I don't know what is going on, before too long, you will need a degree to work at McDonald's.

 

[apirateslifeforme]

I agree with you.

Not only that, but jobs these days are requiring college degrees that really shouldn't. I see a lot of customer service jobs that want a 4 year degree. Sorry but I did that job years ago, you don't need a degree for that. I don't know what is going on, before too long, you will need a degree to work at McDonald's.

Funny you should say that...while laid off and looking for work last year, I saw an online job ad for a manager at a local McDonald's...I remember it because a master's degree was required.

 

[Minnesota!]

I agree with you. 100%.

 

[Tianar]

As someone who is pre-med and starting the application process, what we're told is that college allows medical schools to see how we cope with a high workload. High school work and college work are VERY different in terms of difficulty and what is expected of you. Medical schools are looking for people that can succeed with the high workloads there.

It also gives you more of a chance to see whether or not that career is for you. For instance, if you wanted to go into medicine but then failed out of biology, you would probably reconsider. It opens up more internships and shadowing experiences so that you can get a feel for the medical industry and whether or not you want to become part of that.

 

[johnsontrio]

As someone who is pre-med and starting the application process, what we're told is that college allows medical schools to see how we cope with a high workload. High school work and college work are VERY different in terms of difficulty and what is expected of you. Medical schools are looking for people that can succeed with the high workloads there.

It also gives you more of a chance to see whether or not that career is for you. For instance, if you wanted to go into medicine but then failed out of biology, you would probably reconsider. It opens up more internships and shadowing experiences so that you can get a feel for the medical industry and whether or not you want to become part of that.

I see this is your first post! welcome to the DIS!

 

[NY Disney fan]

It also gives you more of a chance to see whether or not that career is for you. For instance, if you wanted to go into medicine but then failed out of biology, you would probably reconsider. It opens up more internships and shadowing experiences so that you can get a feel for the medical industry and whether or not you want to become part of that.

If that's the case then college should be 2 years only.

 

[1stluvispooh]

Maturity

 

[MrsJackSparrow4Life]

Because I want the people who will have my life in their hands to have more than just a basic education. Especially with some of the high school education that people are getting nowadays; they just are not ready for Med school or Law school.

 

[lovemygoofy]

You have to think of college as laying a foundation for the career. Think of it as a house. You need a good solid foundation before you put up the walls and then cap it with a roof.

The college foundation helps you start with the basics and build up. Pre-med takes alot of chemistry and biology classes so you understand what the physician teachers are teaching in med school.

Pre-law teaches basic understanding about law and government and helps you develop your creative thinking process and communication skills.

In addition to all this, I think a person grows and learns alot while in college. Time management, personal management, social skills, situational awareness and a maturity that comes with age. MANY people aren't even ready for law or med school after 4 years of college. I don't think 4 year undergrad is a waste at all and really helps in many ways other than the obvious.

 

[Tianar]

I see this is your first post! welcome to the DIS!

Thank you so much!

The college foundation helps you start with the basics and build up. Pre-med takes alot of chemistry and biology classes so you understand what the physician teachers are teaching in med school.

Oooh, so true! We need 1 year each of bio, gen chem, organic chem, physics, and english. And on top of that we may need (depending on the med school), psych, calc, and biochem. Sometimes it feels like there's barely enough time in the 4 years as it is!

 

[kamik86]

I agree about med schools wanting to see if you can take a high workload.

The validictorian in my high school (who had a higher average then myself and the other 2 validictorians from the years I was in that school) failed out of her first year of college. Why becasue she was one of the people that didn't think much for herself but just studied constantly and memorized things. Give her the type of test where you have to apply what you have learned in new situations (not one JUST like the one you did for homework two days ago) and she would fail. So between this and the increased workload that would make studing everything much harder she couldn't get through.

I also want to point out how many Medical and high level Engineering grad school students are from India... If there system is so much better why do they all want to come here for school?

I agree that some of the core stuff for a BS degree is well BS but it does teach students how to get through the things they don't like as much. (For example if you failed Theatre and an Engineering company sees that on your transcript you might think that wouldn't matter, but they are going to ask you about it in an interview and if you say that you failed it because you weren't interested in that class and gave all your attention to your engineering ones... they are going to wonder what is going to happen to those tasks that every employee gets that are not interesting but just need to get done.

I have started grad school and when I finish will have only needed to borrow a total of $20,000, all of which was for undergrad and before people ask if my parents helped they did but even adding on their help to my loans it still only would have been $40,000. Not so bad for a degree that got me a 60K job in western MA (so not a large city with a ridiculous cost of living).

 

[bettymae1121]

I don't think college in and of itself is a scam, but as other posters have pointed out, there are a lot of jobs now that require 4 year degrees that really don't need to. In short, it's not so much the schools as what employers are now requireing.

I think some professions like doctors, lawyers, etc. should require a four year undergrad before going on to specialize, simply because you learn so much about just being a student. Study habbits that work in high school don't always translate into college life. A bright high school kid that could get away with just paying attention in class and doing their home work and was able to ace the tests and finals without taking notes or extra study, may find they can barley keep up in college. In college you do a lot more in the way of research papers, too.

That said, I think the vast majority of jobs one should be fine with either an assiociates or a bachlors. This trend of needing a Masters before they'll even look at your resume for any job that pays more than $40k a year is getting out of hand. It's almost like a bachlors is treated like an associates, and a Masters is treated like a bachlors. If all you have is an associates or heaven forbid, a HS diploma, you may as well be illiterate. All the while the cost of school keeps going up.

 

[MissFitt]

You want to be told you are being ridiculous -- OK I'll do that!

There is no way I was prepared for the challanges I faced in law school after completion of high school (and I went to one of the top high schools in the nation)

The courseload I had in college was more comparable to that in law school than any of the advanced placement college-level courses I took in high school. Further, you are completely discounting the maturity factor. Those four years of college education adds more than just a degree.

 

[Sandy V.]

You want to be told you are being ridiculous -- OK I'll do that!

There is no way I was prepared for the challanges I faced in law school after completion of high school (and I went to one of the top high schools in the nation)

The courseload I had in college was more comparable to that in law school than any of the advanced placement college-level courses I took in high school. Further, you are completely discounting the maturity factor. Those four years of college education adds more than just a degree.

I absolutely agree with you.

I am one of those people who went straight from kindergarten through law school, and I can tell you that it's not just the education that you need to be a good attorney, it's life experience. I did fine in law school, but the folks that did the best were the ones who'd been out in the "real world" for at least 2 years before they attended law school. The MATURITY factor is huge and cannot be ignored.

ETA - You don't usually know at 18 years of age what you're going to be when you "grow up". At least I didn't, nor did most of the people I knew that were my age. And neither do my kids NOW at ages 22 and 20. A college education with core requirements in many disciplines helps to give you a foundation and point you in the eventual direction you'll turn to.

 

[The Mystery Machine]

Well for starters you CAN get a BS degree in less than 4yrs. However you have to put in the effort.

I would say that it takes 4yrs+ because most people are not advanced in school, did not plan it out, or need extra time to explore a major or school for that matter.

I know several people that graduated in 3yrs. They took a TON of classes per semester, got A's and went to summer school. They made it a mission, a focus of their life. They knew what they wanted to do right out of HS.

I also know people that did internships that took 6yrs to graduate. It combined work with school. They got paid to go to school, school was paid for, they worked for some semesters, job was guaranteed upon graduation, etc...

 

[MrsPete]

College made me a better version of myself: I'm more well-rounded, more able to gather information and form an opinion for myself, better able to communicate that opinion to others, and well-versed in my field. It also qualified me for my job.

I didn't go into debt to get my education (though I sure did work long hours at some pretty awful jobs while I was in school), and I've had back every dollar I spent many times over. My degree has allowed me to work at a secure job that I like.

College was in no way a scam for me.

At the same time, I do see lots of kids heading to universities even though they have absolutely no business being there. I'm talking about the kids who made it through high school with Cs, who skipped school, who rarely read on their own, who don't really have career motivation, and who don't like learning. Those kids would be so much better off starting a vocational track in high school and working towards a trade (don't most high schools offer classes in electrical work, auto tech, carpentry, cosmetology, etc.?). Those classes give the right kid a good jump start on a career. But instead we pretend that "everyone" should go to college, so these kids lounge about in the college track -- never progressing far, holding others back -- because it's what they "should do".

Those kids end up going to college for 1-2 semesters, then dropping out (perhaps with debt). For them, college IS a scam. Or maybe just a bad choice. Scam implies that someone forced them to go, and that isn't really true.

 

[Lauralee]

You've also got to consider that most high school graduates don't have a good idea of what they want to do with their lives at that age. I'd venture a guess that the majority of freshman/sophomore undergrads change their minds several times before they commit to a degree program their junior year. Even after getting their BA, they may yet again choose a different path.

My son is a good example. His freshman year of college was spent focusing on pre-engineering. In his sophomore year he took some art classes and found he had a talent for that. At his junior year he transferred to a well-known art school and got his BA in illustration. After illustrating children's books for a couple of years, he couldn't get this love of science out of his mind. While continuing with illustration, he enrolled in another university and took more advanced math, science, biology, biochem, etc. After all that bouncing around, he finally chose his profession. He took the MCAT, got into a great med school and just finished up his first year.

My daughter changed her mind midway through college what she wanted to do, and I expect my youngest son, who is transferring into a university this fall after two years at community college, will do the same.

So in my kids' cases, choosing a degree program right out of high school didn't work for them. They needed time to mature and explore different options before they choose their career paths.

 

[dumboiu]

Please tell me I'm being ridiculous.

You are being ridiculous.