Why defend Disney

whiporee

DIS Veteran
Joined
Aug 16, 2012
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This idea came up on a thread that's now locked, but I thought it might make interesting conversation.

A couple of people wondered why someone (I suppose me, but others) defend Disney rather vehemently in certain threads. Some even suggested there are plants here; WDW defending its positions on message boards. While I doubt that is true (and if it were, I'd hope they do a better job than I do), it did raise a question in my mind, so I thought I'd answer.

I defend Disney on things I agree with because I don't want the opposite narrative to become fact. People make assumptions about Disney here that sometimes are made in frustration, and sometimes made as easiest answer. I was just in a dust up about June hours, but the same thing could be said about EMM or FP+ or DAH or Wishes parties, that WDW is just working from a maximizing profit standpoint. And while that may be true, it may not be. Any --of not all -- could be considered to be beneficial to some customers. But if you let the narrative go unchallenged, if you don't show another side --and you don't swing back as hard -- then then the narrative that is most vocal becomes fact.

For example, I've seen many times here that rides are working at reduced capacity -- making lines are longer -- as a direct result of staffing cuts. Repeating it as fact has become commonplace. And here's something else I found interesting: I couldn't find anything about it at the Orlando Sentinel about layoffs. I saw stuff on Kenny the Pirate and other blogs, but even they quoted "inside sources" for their information. But The Sentinel or Orlando Business Journal ought to be all over those things. Disney employs 62,000 people in Orlando; if there were big reductions in tat workforce it would be big news. It's not. The last major layoff was 1400 out of 62,000 employees seven years ago. Disney is a publicly traded company; i'm pretty sure stuff like that is promoted and published because reducing costs invariably helps stock prices. But I couldn't find anything beyond the IT layoffs after FP+ and MDE after were rolled out. So i don't know whether the story is true or not; all i know is that it gets repeated around here a lot. And now it's stated as fact when it might not be. The same thing with rides not running at capacity, the same thing with Shanghai overruns being passed down. I know it's said a lot, I just don't know whether it's true.

And it shouldn't matter, because most of the long-time posters here have already formed their opinions on things and they are unlikely to change. But there are other people -- people who find the site when they are looking for Disney ideas, or they are planning a trip. And if all they hear is how badly WDW sucks, how it's crowded all the time, how FP+ makes it impossible to have a good time, how WDW is just about taking as much money as they can however they can, those folks might reconsider what might turn out to be a great vacation. Or, if they are going to reconsider, they ought to know there are two sides to whatever story might be circulating.

I think that's only fair because none of us -- NONE --knows the real stories behind Disney's decisions. If there are less damning possibilities for why things happen -- or if there are potential benefits to things that some consider detrimental -- then they ought to be pointed out, too.
 
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You're forgetting that there are Disney employees on this board that do know. As well as others who have extensive knowledge of Disney, including inside knowledge. So sure, there's opinion on here - but yeah, there's fact too. And at some point common sense has to enter in too, no matter how much you want to be an optimist and give the benefit of the doubt.
 
I defend Disney because I love it, and well, why not?
I believe that Disney gives the absolute best customer service on the planet... Yes, there are frustrations and annoyances, but at the end of the day I'M ON VACATION! it's a privileged world problem. I like how Disney treats me, and I continue to vacation there because of how I feel there.
So, unless, Disney does something absolutely horrific to its employees, or to me the consumer, I will continue to defend them.
 

There are a lot of Disney "apologists" on this board that would prefer to attack people people in order to defend a corporation instead of seeing things for what they are. I would be willing to bet they interact with people like this in general and it is not just a Disney thing. However, there are a lot of members on this board that are realists and though they love all things Disney they do not like the choices the executives are making. Since this is a Disney forum, there are going to be those that think the company can do no wrong until it affects them personally. You just have to take both sides in the comments and put the people on ignore that rub you the wrong way. :)
 
You're forgetting that there are Disney employees on this board that do know. As well as others who have extensive knowledge of Disney, including inside knowledge. So sure, there's opinion on here - but yeah, there's fact too. And at some point common sense has to enter in too, no matter how much you want to be an optimist and give the benefit of the doubt.

Except we don't know that for fact, and we don't know who is who. And we don't know whether there's a grudge or a misunderstanding.

And there is no easier place to lie -- or exaggerate -- than an internet message board.

So you may be right, and there may be a lot of inside information being passed along. Or there might not be. We don't know. But just because someone say they are inside doesn't mean they are, and just because someone says they are inside and say something bad, it doesn't give it any more validity.
 
I defend it where I see fit because I enjoy going and I would like to see it continue to exist (in it's ever changing forms) for me now and my children in the future.

I often defend where the position taken is that Disney has done something with the idea that it will personally screw one person over. That is just ridiculous. When they made Fountain View into a Starbucks I was a little sad because hey, that's where my now-DH got a giant ice cream sandwich on our first vacation together and I mashed it in his face in front of the fountain. But my good memories are not something that Disney gave two seconds thought about because that's just not what a multinational billion dollar entity does. So when someone gets all indignant that something was done to them personally, I will usually defend because it is patently untrue.

The June hours thread is an example. People keep saying "the hours aren't available!" Sure, they are. 9am to 10pm are the standard operating hours. They've been that way forever. What people are actually saying is that the hours they WANT don't exist. Those two statements aren't the same thing and that is what I was defending.

I am fine with someone having an opinion, we all have one. What's interesting is when the line between opinion and fact becomes soft.
 
People defend Disney (or anything else they love) when it's attacked because it calls into question their own personal taste. For example, my ex was a total jerk who everybody in my family hated (rightfully so in retrospect) but the more they bagged on him to me even on justifiable grounds, the more I staunchly defended him...because if they were right, what does it say about me and MY ability to make smart choices?? Attacking him was attacking my choices.

THAT'S why people defend what they love, whether rightfully so or otherwise.

Disney is GREAT but isn't perfect. I love it to death. BUT I'm not blind to their imperfections, or willing to ignore them anymore when they do things that affect me in a negative way.
 
It's not an article of faith that to enjoy WDW you have to defend it on all issues. Disney's not perfect, nor are those who are making decisions about it. It's not all right or all wrong. It's worth discussing where they're succeeding and where they're falling short, and IMHO we shouldn't take it so personally if someone disagrees with us on a particular issue.
 
I defend Disney when I think they are doing the logical thing. I come from a business background and understand the need to actually make a profit, which will drive decisions that affect our theme park experience. Having said that, there are lots of things that Disney is doing now that I disagree with and on those I also offer my opinion on the boards, and with my wallet.

I'm an equal opportunity offender.
 
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I personally love opposing viewpoints but when those individuals get so bent out of shape about what someone says then it gets to be too much. Disney doesn't need us to defend them when their activities speak for themselves. We can go by logic or we can wear blinders and see what we wish to. What we shouldn't do IMO is jump on others for stating a simple opinion.

I also know of a few insiders who I have a fair amount of trust for. It's fine if you don't but we are all here to discuss planning and knowing as much as possible helps with that. They might end up wrong but at least I've worked the possibilities into my plans and I'm not blindsided by some change that I decided to ignore because it was "negative".

One more thing - I don't give Disney a pass because they're a business. There are plenty of businesses I could give money to and many I don't because of what they are. Disney hasn't reached that point yet but I will judge them based on the needs and wants of my family and not on what is good for Disney. I will celebrate if they do well but I won't defend at all costs due to some need to help them.
 
This thread will probably end up locked too, but for what it's worth, it's a valuable mindset to be able to both defend and criticize. Pixie dusters tend to put Disney on a pedestal and that's fine, they don't need to explain themselves just the same as you shouldn't have to defend your POV.
 
Thank you for your post. Some great points.
Agree completely.


Apparently I'm on that "list" too whiporee.

Here's my take-
I started coming to this board just before my September trip, and got a TON of great advice!!

A few months later I decided to start planning a cruise, came back here-

Again, great advice!

Then about 6-7 weeks ago I started being on here a lot. I decided to do a Land/Sea conbo and booked my resort in March. Again- received a lot of great advice and read a lot of great tips!

But then somehow I stumbled on threads that were full of SO MUCH negativity.. It shocked me, and I know I didn't experience the same on my trip. I started reading "rumors" that became "facts" (in the eyes of some), and such a downright "attack Disney" tone in many threads.

I'm glad I didn't read all of those in August, it wouldn't have changed my trip, but it would have made me wonder how much had changed in the 4.5 years since I hadn't been there. And who knows, maybe it would have caused me to look at it differently.

I think the old saying "misery loves company" is true. Negative things seem to be more attractive and more "true" to people than their outnumbered positive things and experiences.

Bottom line- I hope people actively planning a trip do not get discouraged, do not spend their trip looking for problems, and do not come back with complaints. I hope they go in with the excitement of what Disney is, and realize that a trip is what YOU make it.
 
You're forgetting that there are Disney employees on this board that do know. As well as others who have extensive knowledge of Disney, including inside knowledge. So sure, there's opinion on here - but yeah, there's fact too. And at some point common sense has to enter in too, no matter how much you want to be an optimist and give the benefit of the doubt.


All true, and this works both ways, to those that are fast to condemn Disney on heresay, rumors and guess work, as the OP pointed out quite well.

Sadly there are some that are just mad at Disney because of changes, real and imagined and that the prices have gone up. To these folks Disney is always wrong, no matter what.

AKK
 
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All true, and this works both ways, to those that a fast to condemn Disney on here say, rumors and guess work, as the OP point out quite well.

Sadly there are some that are just mad at Disney because of changes, real and imagined and that the prices have gone up. To these folks Disney is always wrong, no matter what.

AKK
I think you and I are on some of the same cruise threads. When summer '17 pricing was released I was shocked!! (On the 11 night cruises), as were many others. Being shocked at price is fine. I know I chose another line for a Northern Europe, as many others did as well. But I've yet to see anyone in the DCL section go on a post trip report etc..and tell them that they are wrong for going on said cruise, or that DCL is absolutely horrible and money grabbing.
Maybe my November cruise on DCL will be my first and last. But I don't see a reason to continually bash them just because I don't see the value in certain itinerary pricing.

For me it's simple - if I don't see the value in something then I don't pay it.
 
You make some valid points. What I find sad is that an exchange of opinions escalates so quickly into arguments and personal attacks. What is meant to be funny is taken wrong. And some comments are made just to start these disagreements. An exchange of differing personal opinions shouldn't cause problems, but sadly they almost always do. And not just on this forum, it happens on every forum I've ever taken part in. The written word cannot readily convey emotional context or intent and so it's easy to misinterpret comments. The internet also distances people. One can say things on a forum where you cannot see the other person that you would never say to someone in a face to face discussion. Wouldn't it be nice if we could just agree to disagree sometimes? :)
 
There are a lot of Disney "apologists" on this board that would prefer to attack people people in order to defend a corporation instead of seeing things for what they are. I would be willing to bet they interact with people like this in general and it is not just a Disney thing. However, there are a lot of members on this board that are realists and though they love all things Disney they do not like the choices the executives are making. Since this is a Disney forum, there are going to be those that think the company can do no wrong until it affects them personally. You just have to take both sides in the comments and put the people on ignore that rub you the wrong way. :)
You define two groups of people as "apologists" or "realists", with yourself, of course, in the realist category. Just because someone does not see things the same way in which you do does not make them wrong or an "apologist". Everyone is entitled to their own opinion and everyone's opinion has the same value. Feel free to agree or disagree with other posters, but labeling people based on whether their opinion reflects your own is misguided and creates argumentative discussions.
 
You define two groups of people as "apologists" or "realists", with yourself, of course, in the realist category. Just because someone does not see things the same way in which you do does not make them wrong or an "apologist". Everyone is entitled to their own opinion and everyone's opinion has the same value. Feel free to agree or disagree with other posters, but labeling people based on whether their opinion reflects your own is misguided and creates argumentative discussions.


And yet you respond defensively and argumentative. :oops: :confused3

Saying somebody is an apologist is not name calling or an insult. I also did not say anybody was wrong.

a·pol·o·gist
əˈpäləjəst/
noun
noun: apologist; plural noun: apologists
a person who offers an argument in defense of something controversial.
"an enthusiastic apologist for fascism in the 1920s"
synonyms: defender, supporter, upholder, advocate, proponent, exponent, propagandist, champion, campaigner;
informalcheerleader
 
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