Who is refusing Common Core tests for 3rd-8th graders?

[tvguy]

I love these boards for showing how diverse people's view points are on similar topics across the nation. As I have mentioned, not a big deal in California. And I forget who posted a link to California website opposed to Common Core, but thanks. I did reach out to them several weeks ago by email and voicemail. I gather they aren't every organized because I haven't heard back.

http://edsource.org/2015/in-califor...on-core-relatively-minimal/77180#.VRpem_kYHw0

 

[Happy Snowman]

So, has any child died from taking the common core tests yet?? From the hubbub of the testing, you would almost expect that

 

[nugov2]

I love these boards for showing how diverse people's view points are on similar topics across the nation. As I have mentioned, not a big deal in California. And I forget who posted a link to California website opposed to Common Core, but thanks. I did reach out to them several weeks ago by email and voicemail. I gather they aren't every organized because I haven't heard back.

http://edsource.org/2015/in-califor...on-core-relatively-minimal/77180#.VRpem_kYHw0

That's because the momentum is slowing down now that most areas are down testing.

My dd had no issues with the PARCC and as I've stated nobody I know had any issues with the tests even now that they are done. My dd said one of the tests was a little hard, but overall her opinion was they were easy. I will be curious to see how her scores are. I am actively involved in the schools so I feel like I am pretty in the know as to what is or isn't a big deal and this didn't register. Now there were a lot of upset parents when they switched recess to before lunch instead of after because it is supposed to be better for the kids. Many did not agree and thought there kids would be too hungry to play

 

[undertheradar]

And all this, for what?

From US News & World Report:

http://www.usnews.com/news/articles...ts-unclear-if-common-core-is-helping-students

Reports Show Small Gains After Common Core

Two studies released this week – one from the Brookings Institution's Brown Center on Education Policy and the other from the National Center for Analysis of Longitudinal Data in Education Research – showed small gains on students' scores nationally on the National Assessment of Educational Progress and in Kentucky on the ACT. But it hasn't been determined whether those gains can be attributed to the Common Core standards, which most states only fully implemented within the last one to two years.

The Brookings report compares the fourth grade reading scores on the NAEP exam among states, categorizing them based on how strongly they implemented the standards. The 19 states categorized as "strong implementers," Loveless writes, spent money on more activities and aimed for full implementation by the 2012-13 school year. Another 27 states were "medium implementers," while four states – Alaska, Nebraska, Texas and Virginia – were grouped together since they never adopted Common Core.



Overall, Loveless found a 1.1 point advantage in reading gains among strong implementers over non-adopters, similar to the 1.27 point advantage the center found last year in eighth grade math.

"These differences, although certainly encouraging to [Common Core] supporters, are quite small, amounting to (at most) 0.04 standard deviations on the NAEP scale," Loveless writes. "A threshold ... five times larger ... is often invoked as the minimum size for a test score change to be regarded as noticeable."

Loveless acknowledges the fact that observing outcomes after states have been operating under Common Core "certainly has merit," but says some educational changes "can also produce their biggest 'pop' earlier in implementation rather than later."

"The optimism of [Common Core] supporters is understandable, but a one and a half point NAEP gain might be as good as it gets for [Common Core]," Loveless writes.

The funniest thing about these sources? "Government Think Tanks." Such a thing cannot exist since government has proven again and again that it has no ability to think!

 

[leebee]

Now there were a lot of upset parents when they switched recess to before lunch instead of after because it is supposed to be better for the kids. Many did not agree and thought there kids would be too hungry to play

This makes me laugh. We have an enormous amount of food waste in our cafeteria; many kids eat almost nothing, or don't touch their food at all, at lunch time. The school board is considering putting recess BEFORE lunch, just so the kids will be hungrier and eat more, cutting down on the waste!

 

[jodifla]

Here are the Smarter Balanced results from last year's field tests -- from Smarter Balanced. The failure rates are massive across the board. Much worse for children of color, those in special education, and those who are economically disadvantaged.

http://www.smarterbalanced.org/word.../2014/12/Disaggregated-FieldTestDataFINAL.pdf

 

[nugov2]

This makes me laugh. We have an enormous amount of food waste in our cafeteria; many kids eat almost nothing, or don't touch their food at all, at lunch time. The school board is considering putting recess BEFORE lunch, just so the kids will be hungrier and eat more, cutting down on the waste!

I don't think it is a bad idea to try. Are people against it? Our district doesn't do school lunches other than the every other week hot lunch day(which they order from local restaurants for the kids) and treat day that is optional to participate in.

 

[tvguy]

That's because the momentum is slowing down now that most areas are down testing.

My dd had no issues with the PARCC and as I've stated nobody I know had any issues with the tests even now that they are done. My dd said one of the tests was a little hard, but overall her opinion was they were easy. I will be curious to see how her scores are. I am actively involved in the schools so I feel like I am pretty in the know as to what is or isn't a big deal and this didn't register. Now there were a lot of upset parents when they switched recess to before lunch instead of after because it is supposed to be better for the kids. Many did not agree and thought there kids would be too hungry to play

Well, I am in California too, and I gather Common Core and our educational system are very similar, so no big change here.

 

[castleview]

This makes me laugh. We have an enormous amount of food waste in our cafeteria; many kids eat almost nothing, or don't touch their food at all, at lunch time. The school board is considering putting recess BEFORE lunch, just so the kids will be hungrier and eat more, cutting down on the waste!

We did it at our school. Guess what? It worked. Kids are not taking two bites so they can run outside and play and they actually sit a little bit more - a little bit.

 

[jodifla]

Well, I am in California too, and I gather Common Core and our educational system are very similar, so no big change here.

It sounds as if California has little stakes tied to the testing. The lower the stakes, the less outcry. It also looks like they put money into training and education.

The problem is, to get the waivers from NCLB, you eventually have to tie the testing results to teacher evaluations. And, the testing results aren't in. So people might feel differently once those things start happening.


http://edsource.org/2015/in-califor...on-core-relatively-minimal/77180#.VRsCbeEiOPU

 

[undertheradar]

It sounds as if California has little stakes tied to the testing. The lower the stakes, the less outcry. It also looks like they put money into training and education.

The problem is, to get the waivers from NCLB, you eventually have to tie the testing results to teacher evaluations. And, the testing results aren't in. So people might feel differently once those things start happening.


http://edsource.org/2015/in-california-opposition-to-common-core-relatively-minimal/77180#.VRsCbeEiOPU

So what is your solution? You post long links, grass roots newsletters, random numbers that are small samples. What is your solution?

 

[Colleen27]

This makes me laugh. We have an enormous amount of food waste in our cafeteria; many kids eat almost nothing, or don't touch their food at all, at lunch time. The school board is considering putting recess BEFORE lunch, just so the kids will be hungrier and eat more, cutting down on the waste!

That's actually worked for our school. It isn't that the kids are hungrier because they've been out playing, it is that they aren't rushing through the lunch part of lunchtime in a hurry to get to the recess part. And it has been a measurable difference not only in the amount of food waste but also in afternoon behaviour according to the lower elem teachers.

 

[Happy Snowman]

That's actually worked for our school. It isn't that the kids are hungrier because they've been out playing, it is that they aren't rushing through the lunch part of lunchtime in a hurry to get to the recess part. And it has been a measurable difference not only in the amount of food waste but also in afternoon behaviour according to the lower elem teachers.

Our kids elementary school did that too and saw the same results. It's a very good idea.

 

[baylorberas]

Really hard to answer this one without violating the political enjoinder (although I find the criticism of common core crosses both sides of the aisle). Anyway, I’m very opposed to the testing craze and I’m also very opposed to common core. JMO.

 

[jodifla]

So what is your solution? You post long links, grass roots newsletters, random numbers that are small samples. What is your solution?

My solution would have been to pilot the standards first to see if they actually worked! I would have fewer standards, made sure they were in English instead of vague academic-speak. At least half of the standard writers for each grade should have been classroom teachers from that grade. Special Education teachers should have had a say -- and the standards should have included children of color, impoverished children and disabled children in a meaningful way. The standards shouldn't have been copyrighted -- it makes them too hard to tweak. There should have been a lot more dialogue when these were developed with parents.There should be a Common Core office -- someone in charge of shepherding these standards instead of dumping them on the states and running.

Today, I'm not sure what can be done. I'm just trying to protect my child from all the damage and fallout.

 

[undertheradar]

The challenge I see is they are damned if they do or damned if they don't. How in the world could you possibly please every parent and educator out there. Even on this thread are conflicting educators and parents. There is no possible way to develop a standard curriculum while including every change that is suggested. Some of the grass roots backlash is completely unfounded and appears to be sour grapes from other educational co-ops. As for opting out, I see no reasonable purpose in doing so. The experience of taking tests is paramount in development for future lifetime experiences. As with anything else new and different, there will be a group opposing it just because they are afraid of the change. Will there need to be changes made? Of course, nothing is perfect out of the gate.

 

[nugov2]

My solution would have been to pilot the standards first to see if they actually worked! I would have fewer standards, made sure they were in English instead of vague academic-speak. At least half of the standard writers for each grade should have been classroom teachers from that grade. Special Education teachers should have had a say -- and the standards should have included children of color, impoverished children and disabled children in a meaningful way. The standards shouldn't have been copyrighted -- it makes them too hard to tweak. There should have been a lot more dialogue when these were developed with parents.There should be a Common Core office -- someone in charge of shepherding these standards instead of dumping them on the states and running.

Today, I'm not sure what can be done. I'm just trying to protect my child from all the damage and fallout.

The standards do work when done properly as have been shown in the many districts across the nation having success. You just choose to ignore that. The problem is you can't go back and fix the problems in low income schools with the wave a magic wand, but you cannot just sit back and watch them suffer either. Should those children not get the same education that the other districts are? The only way they can is if the standards are the same. These schools need more time though to do so and in that I think needs to be changed. I firmly believe that with a higher bar set the younger generations who only know these higher standards will perform better with the right foundation in place from the time they enter school. So where does that leave the older students? This is the biggest issue facing everyone and where I think the rollout needs to be implemented better. It cannot be shoved down the throats of students in an implementation bomb. Districts floundering made huge mistakes both academically and financially and that is going to be a big hole to dig out of, but no matter what now things have to be fixed. I think it can be fixed with CC in place and that the problem came from bad decisions by school districts vs the standards being poor, but isn't this the same argument anit CC and those who are ok with CC have over and over. It is kinda like what came first the chicken or the egg. I think CC is just fine, it is the administrators and teachers who have mucked it up. You think CC needs to have the teachers involved, but do you not think the districts implementing these standards also need to have classroom teachers involved? When that happens so does success and that is how every school district should begin their roll out.

How do you mean the standards need to include impoverished children? Those kids will go to the same colleges or trades and will enter the same workforce as the rest of the country, should they not have the same standards so that they can compete academically or is the answer to allow the gap to widen b/c low income schools should have lower standards than the school in the town over with a higher level of income. Isn't that a huge disservice? It is like the philosophy that all students should pass even when they are failing. Who does that help? Would these kids not be better off to be introduced to higher academic achievement from the time they enter school so that if they better prepared no matter if they are college bound or trade bound giving them the same opportunities? If school districts across the country could work together and open their eyes to successful districts could they not learn from each other? Isn't this a huge advantage to all districts when they all have the same standards. This means low income districts having success(because they are always out there) can successfully share their strategies b/c now all standards are the same. In the past this wasn't an option. This could be a real opportunity.

To me it is a huge red flag that many think the test and the standards are on average two full grades ahead of what was when some areas are saying they are on par or even easier. Why should student be learning at that much lower of a level, when clearly students of the same age across the country are doing more. Honestly, you should be protecting your child from having to go back to that and fighting to show your district what can be done with a proper rollout. I have said it before, but this issue has shown me how solid our district was since we didn't miss a step with the implementation, but I think that reason is 1. we had high standards in place and 2. our district did recognize that a school is only successful when it reaches our to both its teachers and parents to collaborate on what is best for the students. Is CC perfect, no. The testing has some flaws and will probably need to be tweaked. CC deadlines need to be reset and reevaluated too, allowing everyone not having success to reevaluate what needs to be done and even collaborate with districts having success. People can blame CC, but I will say it again I have never come across a lesson that was bad b/c of the standard. They are bad b/c the lesson written for that standard was bad and implemented in a way that makes no sense and that has nothing to do with CC.

 

[Ceila]

...made sure they were in English instead of vague academic-speak...

I agree wholeheartedly with what Nugov2 posted in response to your post, but I do want to address the above. Why should standards NOT be written using the language of the academic world? They are professional standards that professional educators are meant to use in order to effectively perform their jobs. Would you argue, say, that guidelines for how a doctor prescribes a certain drug be written in non-medical language? Of course not! Why is education any different?

 

[nugov2]

Saw an article today with the following teacher quotes, while I know it is a proCC site they still give actual experiences similar to what we are experiencing in our school districts and how the teachers I know feel:

"Student discussions and critical analysis have improved schoolwide. Why? We teach the Common Core State Standards at Iota Middle which is not a prescribed curriculum. They are a set of standards allowing those of us closest to the students to make the best decisions about curriculum, instruction, resources and assessment to measure mastery.

"Whether I am meeting with parents from New Orleans and Baton Rouge or pre-service teachers at the University of Louisiana at Lafayette, we all have the same desire to raise student academic standards in the state of Louisiana. Parents want the education improved for their children and future and current educators want to challenge the students.

"We need to continue to communicate and support both parents and educators with professional development on the Common Core State Standards. To paraphrase the words of Albert Einstein, we have to change to get different, higher, results in education in Louisiana."

From a school in NH

Through Common Core, the first-grade literacy curriculum has introduced more nonfiction, and the teachers all agreed the students have 'adjusted beautifully.' They have learned to identify and use text features to locate information and use those text features to learn how a nonfiction book is organized.

"In math, the third-graders have shifted to focus on providing evidence of their thinking to a greater extent. They are required to show their thinking process and often share it during group work.

"Mullaney said she believes that when children work together and see different methods to arrive at the same answers, it may teach them to 'respect diversity of opinion.'"

"Board member Ann Walker agreed and pointed out how much students truly enjoying sharing different ways of arriving at the same answer.

"'There's this common misconception that kids are being taught there's only one way to do things' board member Patrick Ellis said. 'I'm glad to see that you've shown kids use many different methods.'"

 

[jcc0621]

I agree wholeheartedly with what Nugov2 posted in response to your post, but I do want to address the above. Why should standards NOT be written using the language of the academic world? They are professional standards that professional educators are meant to use in order to effectively perform their jobs. Would you argue, say, that guidelines for how a doctor prescribes a certain drug be written in non-medical language? Of course not! Why is education any different?

Because it is kids taking the tests, not teachers.