Who has only purchased direct and why?

[Dean]

We're direct buyers - we bought our 2 larger contracts (and neither is very large) when the incentives were fantastic and the point buy-in much lower than today. We just added on at $115/pt with $500 total discount.

I was one of those who didn't know about re-sale and my comfort level still is low for re-sale. I realize that not many people get taken but sending a large amount of cash and not getting any points for month or more just doesn't cut it for me. I don't like the uncertainty, the bartering or the need to constantly pled for my product from the broker and then from DVC. I just want to walk up and buy. For that ease of purchase I am willing to pay more altho I will try for any incentives available to reduce the price.

We wanted a small contract at BCV (55pts) and small contracts are 1: hard to find and 2: command a highter re-sale price. So we went direct, have our UY, the exact number of pts we were looking and an immediate availabllity. We put down 20% and financed the rest and we well pay it off early - just like our others - so we didn't have to deplete our savings even briefly. To us it is worth the 'extra' cost.

The problem with this line of thinking is simply that for certain options (exclude very small contracts, VGF & VGC) the price for that comfort level is dramatic. It'd be exactly like paying twice as much for a used car at the actual dealer vs a resale lot but without the risk variables of a used car.

I'd venture to guess that I was the very first resale buyer that was non family when I bought in 1994, I think I saved about $12 a point which was around 20% off retail at the time.

Well, you can, but it's very difficult. There are times of year when you can't get any discount of any kind. And you really can't count on getting a discount at any time. You can never tell perfectly when they'll offer discounts and by how much. Even when they offer discounts, they don't necessarily offer them for every room every night.

And you can't get discounts very early; they always wait until they see what the demand is for a period before releasing discounts. If they just need to sell a few extra rooms, they might send out PIN-protected mailings to specific lists. They might offer discounts to specific groups that you might not be a member of (AP holders, Florida residents, military, specific clubs and organizations).

Disney is pretty unusual in the travel industry in that they get actual rack rate for a pretty significant number of rooms. Not by any means all of them, but way more than other companies. The hotel business is notorious for publishing rack rates that bear no real relationship to what they actually charge. But Disney really does sell rooms at rack rate. A lot of rooms.

If you are plugged in to the discount info, subscribe to the MouseSavers newsletter, and will mostly be going during off-peak times, you can often save 20-30% off rack rates, though not necessarily all the time. If you will mostly be going during school holidays or during special events like Food & Wine, or you feel better locking in rooms early, you may not be able to get any discount, or might have to settle for 10% or less, though occasionally you'll get more.

Even if you think you will almost always be able to snag 20-30% discounts, if you plan to stay in Studios DVC will still be a big financial win. In 1-bedrooms and other villas, it's still a win, just not as big.

I think it's unusual not to have some type discount, at least a 10% discount available all year for something or the other, esp AAA o AARP. I personally think a discount of 20% is the best round number for those that insist on using rack rates as a reference. Personally I don't think rack rate has any bearing on savings (money) but may have bearing on value and enjoyment except for someone who was doing suites consistently anyway.

 

[lah3hh]

I have 15 contracts I have purchased direct from DVC. I use my points for basically all my travel needs. Over the 15 years of being a member I have taken 20 cruises, stayed at DL (both VGC & PP), WDW DVC Resorts, II exchanges ( now a days that would be equivalent to RCI) and some nightly Concierge options. If I had bought resale all of those trips on points would not have happened.

Did I know about resale before I bought...you betcha! Do I regret buying direct...no way! Will I keep buying direct...count on it!

Everyone makes decisions for various reasons and I just wanted to add on a few reasons I have not seen posted by others already that played into my thought process.

 

[Missyrose]

I have 15 contracts I have purchased direct from DVC. I use my points for basically all my travel needs. Over the 15 years of being a member I have taken 20 cruises, stayed at DL (both VGC & PP), WDW DVC Resorts, II exchanges ( now a days that would be equivalent to RCI) and some nightly Concierge options. If I had bought resale all of those trips on points would not have happened.

Did I know about resale before I bought...you betcha! Do I regret buying direct...no way! Will I keep buying direct...count on it!

Everyone makes decisions for various reasons and I just wanted to add on a few reasons I have not seen posted by others already that played into my thought process.

You've gotten great use out of your points. But I will point out that for the first 90 percent of your ownership tenure, you could do everything you just listed using resale points. It's only resale points bought in the past two years that would have been restricted.

But again, the thing that multiple people keep coming back to is that the "why" of a decision to buy direct isn't interesting, it's the "when" that is far more telling. I'm sure if most people had bought in the late-90s/early 2000s, when prices were in the $60-$90 range and the difference between a resale contract and a direct one were a few dollars per point, it would have been a no-brainer to buy direct. And there weren't direct wait lists in those days either. But the landscape and the numbers are drastically different now.

 

[luv2sleep]

I have 15 contracts I have purchased direct from DVC. I use my points for basically all my travel needs. Over the 15 years of being a member I have taken 20 cruises, stayed at DL (both VGC & PP), WDW DVC Resorts, II exchanges ( now a days that would be equivalent to RCI) and some nightly Concierge options. If I had bought resale all of those trips on points would not have happened.

Did I know about resale before I bought...you betcha! Do I regret buying direct...no way! Will I keep buying direct...count on it!

Everyone makes decisions for various reasons and I just wanted to add on a few reasons I have not seen posted by others already that played into my thought process.

What great trips!!!!

 

[bakerworld]

Made our 3rd direct purchase last night - our WL'd BCV 55pt Dec UY came thru. We have 2012 pts with no MF and $172 closing costs vs. the $195 charged by Fidelity or other closing costs (title ins/broker fees). Our dues for 2013 will be prorated for 6 months of ownership. Points already available for use altho we're planning to bank them as we've a cash reservation at the Dolphin for October.

I had been looking at the re-sale market without success - much to my husbands relief. I will keep looking for BWV pts - unless that WL comes thru also which will include the $500 incentive as well as the 2012 pts with no MF for 2012 and prorated 2013 dues.

 

[JimMIA]

Made our 3rd direct purchase last night - our WL'd BCV 55pt Dec UY came thru. We have 2012 pts with no MF

Right, the 2012 MFs would have been paid by the previous owner in 2012. You are not getting anything for nothing -- you are purchasing in the 2012 UY and you are getting the points you are paying for.

OTOH, if that is the contract you are looking for, it's probably very unlikely you would find something that small on the resale market.

(Incidentally, only Fidelity charges that $195 administrative fee. None of the other brokers charge the buyer anything.)

 

[DougEMG]

But again, the thing that multiple people keep coming back to is that the "why" of a decision to buy direct isn't interesting, it's the "when" that is far more telling. I'm sure if most people had bought in the late-90s/early 2000s, when prices were in the $60-$90 range and the difference between a resale contract and a direct one were a few dollars per point, it would have been a no-brainer to buy direct. And there weren't direct wait lists in those days either. But the landscape and the numbers are drastically different now.

This is a very good point and here are some examples using the current direct and resale markets to show why buying direct today is an expensive option.

The following numbers are the direct prices for WDW resorts (AKV has incentives that can lower the price depending on how many points you buy) compared to what the average asking resale price is for that resort, followed by the difference in direct vrs resale price per point.

BLT Direct=165 Resale=110 Savings=55
VGF Direct=150 - No resale available, so no option to buy other than direct
AKV Direct = 150 Resale = 83 Savings=67
BCV Direct=130 Resale=81 Savings=49
BWV Direct=130 Resale=88 Savings=42
OKW Direct=130 Resale=71 Savings=59
SSR Direct=130 Resale = 80 Savings=50
VWL Direct=130 Resale=81 Savings=49

Average savings buying resale is $53/point or roughly a savings of 38% off direct prices. Or $5,300 for every 100 points you buy.

Note that closing costs, MFs and how many points come with the contracts all effect the final savings.

Average asking prices was based on the current listing among the 4 major online brokers. I would expect actual selling prices to be lower than those asking prices, probably by at least $5-$10, which would move the average savings from $53/point to $58-$68/point. The other way to look at this is that when you buy direct as soon as you walk out the door you have lost $58-$68/point on whatever you purchased.

Note that these are very broad averages and your results will vary, but the general point is that there are huge savings to be had buying resale if you can find the contract you want.

Now seperate put related is just how expensive financing can make your purchase. Assuming financing over 3 years at 10% and comparing that over paying cash for resale and your savings become

BLT Direct=165 Financing=191 Resale=110 Savings=81
AKV Direct=150 Financing=174 Resale=67 Savings=91
BCV Direct=130 Financing=151 Resale=81 Savings=70
BWV Direct=130 Financing=151 Resale=88 Savings=63
OKW Direct=130 Financing=151 Resale=71 Savings=80
SSR Direct=130 Financing=151 Resale=80 Savings=71
VWL Direct=130 Financing=151 Resale=81 Savings=70

What is interesting to note is that when buying AKV resale you have the biggest saving over direct and conversely when you buy AKV direct you will lose the most amount of money on your contract as soon as you walk out the door. This is especially important to note because AKV has one of the larger number of resale contracts available so it should be quiet easy to find a resale AKV contract.

 

[BTSD]

But regardless of your decision and your circumstances, if you can live with your decsision personally and financially speaking, AND your enjoyment of said purchase outweighs the cost of ownership, then you made a good purchase.

Very good point. I've read through these blogs for quite a while (please don't critique me on my join date which was quite a bit AFTER I had been on here), and it always amazes me when someone is so excited they joined directly and then people have to come along and burst their bubble telling them they can always back out and buy resale instead. Obviously they know about resale since they're on the boards. How about just a "Congrats!"???

I know this thread is about who purchased resale, but it goes along the same trend that people tend to criticize those that buy direct.

 

[luv2sleep]

Very good point. I've read through these blogs for quite a while (please don't critique me on my join date which was quite a bit AFTER I had been on here), and it always amazes me when someone is so excited they joined directly and then people have to come along and burst their bubble telling them they can always back out and buy resale instead. Obviously they know about resale since they're on the boards. How about just a "Congrats!"???

I guess I'm just the kind of person that is happy for others when they are - and yes, I've bought both direct (knowing about resale) and resale contracts, and couldn't be happier.

Thank you. Could not agree more.

 

[ELMC]

This is a very good point and here are some examples using the current direct and resale markets to show why buying direct today is an expensive option.

The following numbers are the direct prices for WDW resorts (AKV has incentives that can lower the price depending on how many points you buy) compared to what the average asking resale price is for that resort, followed by the difference in direct vrs resale price per point.

BLT Direct=165 Resale=110 Savings=55
VGF Direct=150 - No resale available, so no option to buy other than direct
AKV Direct = 150 Resale = 83 Savings=67
BCV Direct=130 Resale=81 Savings=49
BWV Direct=130 Resale=88 Savings=42
OKW Direct=130 Resale=71 Savings=59
SSR Direct=130 Resale = 80 Savings=50
VWL Direct=130 Resale=81 Savings=49

Average savings buying resale is $53/point or roughly a savings of 38% off direct prices. Or $5,300 for every 100 points you buy.

Note that closing costs, MFs and how many points come with the contracts all effect the final savings.

Average asking prices was based on the current listing among the 4 major online brokers. I would expect actual selling prices to be lower than those asking prices, probably by at least $5-$10, which would move the average savings from $53/point to $58-$68/point. The other way to look at this is that when you buy direct as soon as you walk out the door you have lost $58-$68/point on whatever you purchased.

Note that these are very broad averages and your results will vary, but the general point is that there are huge savings to be had buying resale if you can find the contract you want.

Now seperate put related is just how expensive financing can make your purchase. Assuming financing over 3 years at 10% and comparing that over paying cash for resale and your savings become

BLT Direct=165 Financing=191 Resale=110 Savings=81
AKV Direct=150 Financing=174 Resale=67 Savings=91
BCV Direct=130 Financing=151 Resale=81 Savings=70
BWV Direct=130 Financing=151 Resale=88 Savings=63
OKW Direct=130 Financing=151 Resale=71 Savings=80
SSR Direct=130 Financing=151 Resale=80 Savings=71
VWL Direct=130 Financing=151 Resale=81 Savings=70

What is interesting to note is that when buying AKV resale you have the biggest saving over direct and conversely when you buy AKV direct you will lose the most amount of money on your contract as soon as you walk out the door. This is especially important to note because AKV has one of the larger number of resale contracts available so it should be quiet easy to find a resale AKV contract.

I agree with everything here and would like to add one thought. At some point in time, buying DVC becomes not worth it. When we looked into DVC in November of 2011, BLT prices were around $140 with incentives. When I compared that price to the cost of renting points, financially it didn't make sense. Now, there are intangibles such as controlling your reservation, being able to check availability, cancel as needed, etc. that renting doesn't afford you. But those benefits did not close the gap in my mind. So from a strict numbers standpoint, I couldn't justify the cost. That's why we ended up buying BLT resale at $80 a point.

That being said, there is more to this than money. VGF is a prime example of this. Yes, it's super expensive. But it's also DVC at VGF. It's super cool. That's what I think people should hang their hat on instead of trying to do financial gymnastics to make the numbers say something that they really shouldn't.

 

[ELMC]

Very good point. I've read through these blogs for quite a while (please don't critique me on my join date which was quite a bit AFTER I had been on here), and it always amazes me when someone is so excited they joined directly and then people have to come along and burst their bubble telling them they can always back out and buy resale instead. Obviously they know about resale since they're on the boards. How about just a "Congrats!"???

I know this thread is about who purchased resale, but it goes along the same trend that people tend to criticize those that buy direct.

I think it's a mistake to assume that people know about resale just because they're on the DIS. Most people who come on here to ask advice about their direct purchase spend time on other DIS boards, where the topic of resale isn't discussed.

I also think your characterization of bubble bursting is a bit undeserved. Nobody is looking to ruin anybody's day. All we want to do is present all the alternatives (including the ones your "guide" won't tell you about) so that you can make an informed choice. Personally speaking, my critiques of direct buyers only happen when they fudge the numbers to make them say something they don't, or misrepresent information. There are plenty of direct buyers that I've congratulated because after considering resale, they determined that it was the best way to go for them. I can respect that.

You think that you are doing people a service by saying "Congrats", and maybe you are. I think that I'm doing them a service by presenting all the information so that they can make an informed choice, and maybe I am. The two don't have to be mutually exclusive. The intent is the same...to help. The methodology is just a bit different. I would hope that you I would not accuse you of simply being a just as I would hope that you would not accuse me of being a .

 

[Deb & Bill]

Very good point. I've read through these blogs for quite a while (please don't critique me on my join date which was quite a bit AFTER I had been on here), and it always amazes me when someone is so excited they joined directly and then people have to come along and burst their bubble telling them they can always back out and buy resale instead. Obviously they know about resale since they're on the boards. How about just a "Congrats!"???

I know this thread is about who purchased resale, but it goes along the same trend that people tend to criticize those that buy direct.

I used to be one to say congratulations back in my early days (like early 2000's). But since about 2006, I'm not one to tell new purchasers that any more.

And when I see someone come on saying they bought directly from Disney (and not a new resort), I bite my tongue, unless they are still within their rescission period. I'm not about to tell them they made a stupid purchase, that is just plain rude and everyone has their reasons. I don't think many of the first time purchasers direct from Disney know about resale purchases. Besides, if they want to purchase GFV, the only way to get that is direct. I bought direct, pre-opening, twice with VWL and BCV. But those were my last purchases period.

I agree with ELMC that most of the long time members or more savvy members do want to provide more information to the new or potential purchasers.

 

[luv2sleep]

If there were no restrictions on resale contracts I'd have no problems with resale. Everyone has different value systems and I value the perks that are now restricted no matter what I've read here about how unimportant they are.

 

[Deb & Bill]

If there were no restrictions on resale contracts I'd have no problems with resale. Everyone has different value systems and I value the perks that are now restricted no matter what I've read here about how unimportant they are.

But they could be gone tomorrow.

 

[luv2sleep]

But they could be gone tomorrow.

True but they are here now. Again, it's something I value. People should respect that. I definitely understand if others don't and respect their feelings about it.

 

[Msmithmd]

When I purchased, I bought resale after spending months reading threads like this and seeing the advice posted by Dean, Doug, ELMC, Missy, and others. Because of their guidance I saved $18,000 in upfront cost.

If that isn't providing a service on a discussion board, then I don't know what is! So by all means, seeing past the pixie dust is an essential part of these forums.

And as an adult, if a buyer says, "yeah, I know all that but I want to buy direct for a resort available resale anyway," well then I guess Welcome Home is ok too...

Just be aware that for many prospective buyers this is the only source of info out there that isn't filtered through a timeshare salesman (err, guide).

 

[luv2sleep]

When I purchased, I bought resale after spending months reading threads like this and seeing the advice posted by Dean, Doug, ELMC, Missy, and others. Because of their guidance I saved $18,000 in upfront cost.

If that isn't providing a service on a discussion board, then I don't know what is! So by all means, seeing past the pixie dust is an essential part of these forums.

And as an adult, if a buyer says, "yeah, I know all that but I want to buy direct for a resort available resale anyway," well then I guess Welcome Home is ok too...

Just be aware that for many prospective buyers this is the only source of info out there that isn't filtered through a timeshare salesman (err, guide).

I think it's great to be helpful and informative. It can definitely save people $$ and heartache. However, many of the posts in response to a new buyer come off condescending. That's how I've taken some of them. It's easy to be helpful without presenting it in a condescending tone. Again. Just my opinion. Other people may not feel that way and I completely respect that. I'm all about respect of other people's thoughts and feelings when posting on these boards.

 

[Missyrose]

I think it's great to be helpful and informative. It can definitely save people $$ and heartache. However, many of the posts in response to a new buyer come off condescending. That's how I've taken some of them. It's easy to be helpful without presenting it in a condescending tone. Again. Just my opinion. Other people may not feel that way and I completely respect that. I'm all about respect of other people's thoughts and feelings when posting on these boards.

Since you've clearly decided in your own head what is helpful and informative, could you outline it for us so we can begin to understand what you're looking for. Because I'm at a loss. You've had multiple people on this thread and others say they appreciate people chiming in with their purchasing experiences. And yet you paint all of us with the brush of condescension.

The funny thing is, I communicate a lot with the people who read my TRs and there are lots of questions and comments back and forth. And somehow, on that board, people don't call you condescending when you try and help someone with a question or a concern. If you're so set in your purchase, why all the brouhaha before you add on?

 

[luv2sleep]

Since you've clearly decided in your own head what is helpful and informative, could you outline it for us so we can begin to understand what you're looking for. Because I'm at a loss. You've had multiple people on this thread and others say they appreciate people chiming in with their purchasing experiences. And yet you paint all of us with the brush of condescension.

The funny thing is, I communicate a lot with the people who read my TRs and there are lots of questions and comments back and forth. And somehow, on that board, people don't call you condescending when you try and help someone with a question or a concern. If you're so set in your purchase, why all the brouhaha before you add on?

Oh I wasn't taking about here. I was taking about in some threads I have seen. Was responding to another post here on the subject. Sorry for the confusion. There have been great responses here in this one. Seems helpful to me anyway. Also sorry if I offended you or anyone else with my comments. I will refrain from commenting further because I think my thoughts are not coming across correctly.

 

[ELMC]

I think it's great to be helpful and informative. It can definitely save people $$ and heartache. However, many of the posts in response to a new buyer come off condescending. That's how I've taken some of them. It's easy to be helpful without presenting it in a condescending tone. Again. Just my opinion. Other people may not feel that way and I completely respect that. I'm all about respect of other people's thoughts and feelings when posting on these boards.

I don't disagree with you when you say that some posts can be interpreted as condescending. However, I believe that is a function of the message and not the delivery. A question such as "Do you realize that you can save $8,000 if you were to buy resale?" is as straightforward as can be and is actually non judgmental. But I think that many direct buyers read that and take offense at the possibility that someone is saying that they overspent by $8,000.

If I'm being frank, I think there is a certain element of insecurity and doubt in a lot of direct purchasers' minds and whenever they read anything that highlights the drawbacks of a direct purchase, they take it personally.

I have simultaneous respect and disagreement with your position on buying direct for the perks. I think it's a bad idea. But I respect the fact that you think it's a good idea. I'll debate that with you all day long, but what I won't do is tell you that you made a bad decision. You made a decision that is best for you, regardless of whether or not I agree with it. In the end, I think the perception of condescension is a function of the reader, not the author.