Where have people manners gone?

[DadofTigger]

Personally, I find it hard to deal with most people from the East Coast. We have made trips to WDW 10 times in the last 9 years. Each time we seem to run into a group of people that think they are the most important and deserve to be first in line. About half the time I will confront them about waiting like the rest of us and most have been good about it, but some of come back with remarks and language that I would not say is typical of WDW. So being from the "Left Coast" and working for a 70 year old Brooklyn transplant, I write it off to living in the big city and move on.

 

[canwegosoon]

Hey Dadoftigger...LETS NOT EVEN GO THERE!!! I really think it's time to put this whole thread to bed. It has gotten way out of control.

 

[Hippychickali]

I agree to closing the thread. This thread from the beginning was not very useful to planning one's trip nor did it belong on the Theme Parks Attractions and Strategies board. There's really very little left to discuss.

I have to comment on misinterpreting the OP. If that were the case I would apologize. However, Rileysmom sent me a pm which basically echoed the sentiments of her first post. So, I won't apologize. The OP was given plenty of chances to clarify so that we really would understand what she meant and chose instead to stand by her original remarks just the way they were written.

Ali

 

[disneyjunkie]

Personally, I find it hard to deal with most people from the East Coast. We have made trips to WDW 10 times in the last 9 years. Each time we seem to run into a group of people that think they are the most important and deserve to be first in line. About half the time I will confront them about waiting like the rest of us and most have been good about it, but some of come back with remarks and language that I would not say is typical of WDW. So being from the "Left Coast" and working for a 70 year old Brooklyn transplant, I write it off to living in the big city and move on.

 

[J.C.&ALI'SMOM]

This is nuts!! I thought the OP was something and now this Where is the love???

 

[jay-nee]

Funny what people call able-bodied... You can't always see peoples disabilities! DH and I both have bad knees so we always wait for a bus that we can sit on and anyone else can do the same. No one says you have to get on the bus just 'cause it's there! Wait for the next one if you want to sit, it would be safer for everyone. I will not allow my children to stand on a bus either. I don't believe that anyone should stand, but if you get on a bus and it's too full, get off and wait for another.

Life is full of choices!

 

[Momto8]

I just have to comment here! I am usually the first to stand if an elderly or disabled person needs a seat, but I would not include pregnant women on buses at WDW. Pregnancy is a choice. Surely a woman can go for nine months without visiting Disney?? Especially if she's not feeling healthy!

Vicki.

Just wanted to clarify my post. I never said I went to WDW when I was pregnant & wanted someone to give up their seat because of my breathing problem. In fact, I've never been on a bus at WDW with this problem during a pregnancy. Only went once when I was expecting, but I was only a couple of months along & it wasn't an issue. However, I would never expect anyone to give up their seat for me. The reason I brought up the breathing problem was because a previous poster listed reasons for giving up a seat for pregnant women. I was just giving another reason that others might have the same problem that I did.

BTW, all my pregnancies were healthy. Breathing problems don't mean I had complications, which I didn't. The reason I had difficulty breathing while standing is because I'm short waisted with not much room for the baby to grow & the baby was always up against my diaphram.

Also couldn't you say that someone made the choice to smoke or not eat healthy or drink too much or do drugs & then end up being in a wheel chair also as much as you could say someone made the choice to get pregnant. Most who are in a wheel chair did not make that choice, but there are some that could have done something about it but chose not to. I know a couple of people in my family that ended up in wheel chairs because of their *choices* in life, including my brother and my SIL.

 

[beattyfamily]

Also couldn't you say that someone made the choice to smoke or not eat healthy or drink too much or do drugs & then end up being in a wheel chair also as much as you could say someone made the choice to get pregnant. Most who are in a wheel chair did not make that choice, but there are some that could have done something about it but chose not to. I know a couple of people in my family that ended up in wheel chairs because of their *choices* in life, including my brother and my SIL.

You make such a good valid point! There are certainly some people disabled in wheelchairs that are in that chair by choice. One example that came to my mind after reading your post is those who drink and drive and then crash their car and become disabled. That's a 'choice' too. We show them compassion and are expected to even though it was a 'choice'. Why can't we show a pregnant woman some compassion even though it's a 'choice'??

 

[Momto8]

You make such a good valid point! There are certainly some people disabled in wheelchairs that are in that chair by choice. One example that came to my mind after reading your post is those who drink and drive and then crash their car and become disabled. That's a 'choice' too. We show them compassion and are expected to even though it was a 'choice'. Why can't we show a pregnant woman some compassion even though it's a 'choice'??

Thanks Beattyfamily! I agree entirely.

 

[ilikemike]

I haven't read all the responses in this thread but I can say that
'Rileyroosmom' I am with you! Yes I thank God every day that my child is very healthy and has physically developed properly and I feel for the people whose children aren't but Rileyroosmom is right -- just because the kid is in a wheelchair doesn't mean they are more important than my kid. (Everyone should be given an equal shot at getting those autographs) No matter how much time you have here on this earth, you still don't have to be rude and cut in front of people. God has decided why you were put here, what you are to do while you are here AND when your time is up. Teaching the wheelchair kids to be repectable human beings is much more valuable then it is to teach them to cut in front of people and/or be rude. A life of rudeness is not worth anything. AND what makes everyone else think that the parents of the wheelchair kids don't "play" on that handicap all the time just so everyone else "moves out of their way"????? (I have seen this stuff happen before a few times at our "local" Six Flags park)

I am also impressed that you didn't rip the "pushy" lady a new one!! I have to say with my 'protective mothers instinct' in combination with my extremely big and loud mouth (ask the hubby - he'll verify) that I could have contained myself!!! Kudos to you on that one!!!

As for the scooter people, they shouldn't be allowed to rent if they cannot drive (I feel the same about car drivers also) and also I think the rental place should put some sort of "noise" on them so the dim-witted or star gazing idiots would be woken up out of their temporary stupor to avoid stepping in front of the scooter drivers (though I recently witnessed a person at the mall that looked right at the scooter driver and STILL stepped in front of her as if she wasn't there and was then shocked when she got hit!!!!)

 

[Bojangles]

No one says you have to get on the bus just 'cause it's there! Wait for the next one if you want to sit, it would be safer for everyone.

I totally agree. I would never expect someone to give up their seat for be because I chose to board a crowded bus. There are 2 choices...either stand or wait for the next bus.


As far as scooters go, a lot of people that use them only do so because they can't do all the walking involved the parks. They aren't used to driving one on a daily basis. I really wish they would practice in the parking lot or something before trying to navigate a crowded themepark.

 

[rigsby25]

I tried to post this morning but had trouble. Maybe this is a repeat but I couldn't find this morning's post. I had an idea for all you stroller and scooter people. Why don't you have members of your own party walk in front of you? That way, no one can cut you off, and if you run into someone in your own party, I'm sure they would understand. Just don't use your stollers and scooters as people movers!

 

[llandaff]

You make such a good valid point! There are certainly some people disabled in wheelchairs that are in that chair by choice. One example that came to my mind after reading your post is those who drink and drive and then crash their car and become disabled. That's a 'choice' too. We show them compassion and are expected to even though it was a 'choice'. Why can't we show a pregnant woman some compassion even though it's a 'choice'??

I agree it's a valid point. However, only a small proportion of people are handicapped because of a life choice whereas 100% of women are pregnant by choice.

And again, I'm not saying I wouldn't stand for a pregnant woman if I was seated nearby; I'm merely pointing out that pregnancy is not a disability and that visiting WDW whilst pregnant is not a necessity (and indeed, according to some of your insights, should be discouraged) and therefore the situation is entirely different to that of most handicapped people.

I think we all agree that compassion for ANYONE is a good trait, but at the same time no one should EXPECT preferential treatment. (I hope that comes across how I intend it!).

Vicki.

 

[Bojangles]

I'm merely pointing out that pregnancy is not a disability and that visiting WDW whilst pregnant is not a necessity .

Standing on the bus is also not a necessity for a pregnant woman. They can easily sit down and wait for the next bus.

 

[WillCAD]

On the subject of courtesy, I respectfully submit my humble and inconsequential opinion that everyone in this thread who told someone that they owe someone else an apology owes an apology to the person they told to apologize in the first place.

Meaning, of course, that I owe an apology to all those people I just told to apologize because they told someone else to apologize.

So, I'm sorry.

What was I saying?

 

[ToriLammy]

I haven't read all the responses in this thread but I can say that
'Rileyroosmom' I am with you! Yes I thank God every day that my child is very healthy and has physically developed properly and I feel for the people whose children aren't but Rileyroosmom is right -- just because the kid is in a wheelchair doesn't mean they are more important than my kid. (Everyone should be given an equal shot at getting those autographs) No matter how much time you have here on this earth, you still don't have to be rude and cut in front of people. God has decided why you were put here, what you are to do while you are here AND when your time is up. Teaching the wheelchair kids to be repectable human beings is much more valuable then it is to teach them to cut in front of people and/or be rude. A life of rudeness is not worth anything. AND what makes everyone else think that the parents of the wheelchair kids don't "play" on that handicap all the time just so everyone else "moves out of their way"????? (I have seen this stuff happen before a few times at our "local" Six Flags park)

The OP didn't say whether the two children in wheelchairs pushed to the front were escorted by cast members or not but if they were then Disney decided that those two children were more important and that's their right, their park, their rules. Most children in wheelchairs in situations like that don't expect "special" treatment just a fair chance.

As for whether their parents are cheating the easiest way to tell that they are not - if the child has a custom or personal wheelchair (not rented from Disney or your "local" six flags) then there is a 99.9% chance the child is really disabled and requires the wheelchair. No parent is going to pay between $8,000-$12,000 for a wheelchair just to scam a few autographs at Disneyworld. It's not that hard to tell for sure in the majority of cases.

I raised my daughter to realize that while she requires a wheelchair it does not entitle her to "special" priveledges or rights. But I have also raised to her to realize that there are some really nice people in the world who wish to help her or make her life a little easier, if they offer and it is something she can use she is to accept gracefully and with gratitude. Who knows maybe she was put on this earth, in a wheelchair because of cerebral palsy, to teach other parents to appreciate their "normal" children more or maybe to teach them just a little more patience

 

[dwkwootton]

Hi WillCAd. If I respond to your apology for apology post, it could be looked at as continuing the argument that many folks, including myself (and I think you too but if I've misquoted you, I apologize, the thread is so long I can't remember for certain) think is best stopped. If I had post nothing, it could be looked at that I am uncomfortable with my posts that I feel are in similar to yours in favoring courtesy, understanding, fairness, and all that other good stuff. How's this for a suggestion ~ if you are offended by me or my words, could you take it to the PM forum instead?

 

[goofy4tink]

Okay, I haven't read all 10 pages. We just got home last night from our T-day WDW trip. I also noticed a lot of people being rude. This year seemed to be worse but I'll chalk it up to the huge crowds. Much pushing and shoving. We had waited in Japan for Miyuki the Candy Lady for 45 minutes. My dd was patiently waiting right at her cart, out Miyuki came and the crowd swelled!! Several mothers told their kids to just push up to the front. One parent even left their double stroller right behind their dd, about 12, in order to not allow anyone to get close to her!! Of course, they were right next to us, so it blocked for us too!! But a lot of grousing and complaining was going on all over the resort.

As far as the scooters go....thank God none of us need them. BUT.....perhaps the character handler could have allowed those already waiting in line to see the character? We have been told that we are officially the 'end of the line' before. Yes it's horrible to have to need a wheelchair but it's hard to explain to a child that has waited patiently that they aren't as 'deserving' as the wheelchair bound person. And then again there are those families of 14 that travel with a challenged person and all sit together at a show. THen others, in wheelchairs, can't find a spot to sit. I guess there is no easy answer. But simple politeness goes a long way. We ran into (not literally!!) a lot of very nice people in scooters. They were careful about how they drove and navigated. To them I say thank-you!!! The other few, who feel it is their god given right to slam into me, well, I won't go there. It's not always a case of the person not being able to navigate. Sometimes it's just a case of 'I need to be closer than I am and since I have a vehicle, I can shove to the front'. Yes, I saw it. Several times. The driver was incredibly good at driving through the crowds, until it came to being in a que. Then, kept apologizing for their 'ineptness' as they crept forward. Too funny.

 

[WillCAD]

Hi WillCAd. If I respond to your apology for apology post, it could be looked at as continuing the argument that many folks, including myself (and I think you too but if I've misquoted you, I apologize, the thread is so long I can't remember for certain) think is best stopped. If I had post nothing, it could be looked at that I am uncomfortable with my posts that I feel are in similar to yours in favoring courtesy, understanding, fairness, and all that other good stuff. How's this for a suggestion ~ if you are offended by me or my words, could you take it to the PM forum instead?

I think I may have confused you somewhat. My apologetic post was a joke, designed to try to bring a little bit of humor and lighthearted whimsy into what has become an extrememly serious and heated thread.

I apologize if my apology offended you. I am very sorry that I said I was sorry.

 

[goofyernmost]

I suspect this whole crowd could use a little sensativity training. (Just Kidding).

Listen, why not just live and let live. Everyone that has posted has had a point or two in thier arguements. We just need to role with the punches. Disappointment is a pretty large part of life. We cannot all get what we want whenever we want it. I myself would like to be 25, thin and have a full head of hair but that is not likely to happen. I'm sure those in wheelchairs occasionally think life has been pretty unfair to them as well.

I had a good friend that I used to escort to WDW. He had CP! It wasn't difficult to tell that he needed the chair so I never got any stares or wondering glances. WDW went out of their way to accommodate him and since very little in life had gone his way it didn't seem wrong for that to happen. I do feel sorry for the child that was unable to see the charactor that they wanted but, as in so much of life, timing is everything. Crap happens.

My friend was one of the happiest, nicest people that existed on this planet. Plagued with a multitude of physical problems, he never complained and always had a smile and always showed gratitude whenever someone did anything for him. I was his only friend, as I held his hand as he passed on, (Bladder Cancer) I thought about those times in WDW when he was treated special and people seemed to care. He was in a coma those last hours and I spoke to him about those good times as he faded away. I don't know if he heard me or not but I hope he did because I know those were his happiest moments.

I don't know what it does for others but for me, I became a little more tolerant of things that didn't fall just right and a lot more appreciative of the relative good health and good fortune I possess. In life, some people are rude, some intentionally and others just thoughtlessly. If you let their behavior influence yours, that is no ones fault except your own. Relax a little, life is painfully short.