Where has the Magic Gone??? Just back

[danalee]

I just dont get why people think that familys of wheelchair/ecv user's shouldnt all get to ride togther? I dont care if its Soarin, Small World or yes even the BUS

Yes my mom is in a wheelchair and we are mostly a group of six, we wait just like everyone else maybe in places you dont see, shop's, walkways and yes rides. but omg once the doors open and they allow the wheelchairs in people start having a hissy fit. We have waited many, many,MANY times for the right car, boat or section to open up and you never see a post saying "I was in a wheelchair at disney and they made me wait, how dare they"

You know why? We are all excited because all "gasp" SIX of us can sit/ride at the same time and get to enjoy disney as a family just like everyone else. I would never ever except any family to be seperated at a ride or even the dreaded bus line, thats kinda like saying to a family of say 3 "oh dad you can take this bus but mom and jr have to wait until the next one, so when you get off the bus dad, just hang outwait for the rest of your family for 10,15 or even 30 minutes THEN you can all meet up again and go about your merry way" yeah sounds fair huh? and even if its 10 people and five have to wait and five goes the next time why? They came all on vacation as a family wait times included.
As many have said, if we could go with out a wheelchair we all would in an instant so, so much easier oh and not to mention less stressful esp after reading post like these, I am just glad my mom dosent read them

Sorry to get my soapbox and I am climbing down now but when you are or have family members in wheelchairs these kind of post bring out the worst in us
and for the "No Bill" thing oh he would have so NOT gotten a tip, that was wrong on so many levels!

 

[meandtheguys2]

But, KIT, you only know part of every story. We didn't use an ECV this trip, but knew that if we wanted one we'd rent for a day. Had we gone to rent one, my mom would have turned down a reg wheelchair, because she wouldn't want one of us to have to push it, and she would be unable to. We would then have just changed our touring plans, or gone home. One year, if I had had the money I would have rented an ecv due to blisters...not normal blisters, but the whole front ball of both feet lost several layers of skin. It never occurred to me to get a reg wheelchair for the reasons I pointed out earlier, but we slowly strolled and limped thru the day. I really was the weak link that trip.

So, you don't know. It seems to me that the issue needs to be rude people (like Rmuilieri's jerk, and the one who almost ran your daughter over) rather than making assumptions about other people's lives and abilities. As I stated earlier, an ECV does not make the day easier. This trip was a piece of cake compared to having to deal with those things.

eta: I'm not trying to be difficult! It just irritates me when people make negative assumptions about others. ~~smile~~ Perhaps a character defect on my part!

 

[Lynn5700]

My mom and I did an ECV rental in the parks in august. my mom has super bad arthritis and can only walk/stand for so long before she gets really bad pain in pretty much her entire body. It made sense for her to have the scooter. But there were times when she DID feel like walking and we had this THING with us that we couldn't just leave around the park so I would drive it until she felt she needed it again. Anyway, it didn't matter which ones of us was driving other guests were SO rude and mean to us. Also, we had to wait in line just like everyone else.

Before my dad passed away we went with him in a regular push wheelchair (he couldn't operate the scooter) and it was really, really difficult getting him around the parks so when a cast member DID go out of their way to help us it was a welcome relief. My daddy LOVED Disney and it was really disheartening when other guests were rude to us even though he was obviously disabled. Like, we would board a ride from separate entrance after having WAITED there and people getting on from the normal ride would groan or roll their eyes or be huffy. It was awful! It made me feel so embarressed like we had done something wrong somehow!

It might appear that people with ECVs and Wheelchairs and their parties are just rolling right onto the ride but they aren't. They've waited too.

This made me so upset reading this.People can be so ignorant sometimes.I hate when I hear people complain about this and when people complain about having to wait longer to get on a bus. It's just sad.

Sorry your trip wasn't that great OP.Hopefully next time you can have a better trip

 

[Silverbelle990]

I think it depends on the person driving the ECV. Some people are very rude and "run people down" and who don't pay attention while backing up while we are walking behind them and then almost running my children down. I also think that they are the ones who give the EVC a bad reputation. I have no problem with wheelchairs or EVC's or whatever else there is. I do have a problem with those mentioned above and if the person who almost ran my child down goes to the front of the line then i will roll my eyes and be alittle upset but i get it over it.

I also totally agree with no bill no tip. Now that ddp does not include tip how are we going to know what tip? Great.....now i am confused. Anyone have a good idea?

 

[Disneylvr]

Yes, there is an ocassional bad ECV user. One of them backed over my husbands foot not once but twice because she didn't know how to use it. It was at a pin trading meet in the Polynesian lobby and his foot was quite bruised as a result. Did the ECV user apologize, no. BUT, did we use that to judge ALL ECV users, no we did not. The guests that are going to let ECV's, wheelchairs, GAC users and tantruming children RUIN their vacation "just because" then maybe a vacation on a private island would be a better choice, not Walt Disney World. Disney World welcomes guests of every ability, shape and size..... Abled bodied guests who run, shove, trip and step on people are just as capable of injuring somone as these so called out of control ECV drivers.

 

[Debbie Jean]

So, you don't know. It seems to me that the issue needs to be rude people (like Rmuilieri's jerk, and the one who almost ran your daughter over) rather than making assumptions about other people's lives and abilities.

ITA

For the past several years, I've used an ECV... in the beginning I rented in the parks but as time passed I needed to rent off site so I could have it at the resort, as well. Were it not for this, I couldn't go to Disney. Period. The physical challenges I have may or may not be apparent to others which could be an issue for others... though I would hope most people had better things to think about while at Disney... but it's no longer an issue for me.

I think part of the problem is that many folk who rent in the parks don't normally use an ECV so their driving "skills" are somewhat lacking. That doesn't account for rudeness which to me is simply inexcuseable. Honestly, though, I have to tell you as an ECV user myself who is very cautious, careful and polite, my biggest problem is the mom with the double wide Disney stroller who uses the dang thing like a battering ram!

Have I run into people? Yes, on occasion, it's happened and I've always apologized. But I have to tell you that it has always been when someone has tried jump in front of me and cut me off so I couldn't avoid hitting them.

BTW, I ususally travel solo or with DD (21) so we aren't one of the large accompanying parties... though honestly the number of times I've actually seen this occur are very few.

 

[Goofey Drool]

I hope I never run into one of those tour groups with thirty or forty people and one of them is in an ECV. That would take a while.

 

[Karnak]

Given the three points made in these posts ...

1. There seems to be (and perhaps there in fact are) more and more people using ECVs in the parks these days.

2. Some of these people really need to be using the ECV to get around in the parks.

3. There's no way to tell for certain which ECV users realy need the scooters, and which are simply taking advantage of others.

The solution is simple. Give everyone an ECV to use as they enter the park, and include the rental price in the price of admission. Problem solved!

Enjoy.

 

[Cindie-rella]

I could be wrong. but maybe the OP was just trying to say that maybe the ECV's aren't always used by individuals that actually need them. In other words, people will rent them thinking they will get to board rides and buses 1st. And all the people in there party are guaranteed a seat on the bus. I know of someone who had done this. I understand that there are many people who need assistance b/c of ill health or physical challenges. I would never think of complaining about these individuals. But hasn't anyone noticed all the "handicapped" parking spaces in all the parking lots anymore. What is shameful is how they are "abused" by people who are no more handicapped than myself. It is rare to see an actual handicapped person, or even elderly person get out of the cars with the little "blue & white" tags hanging off the rear view! People are also abusing the chairs if you ask me. Take a look at Walmart. Please don't flame me, but most of the individuals using the free rides should be getting the exercise by walking thru the store. I know, I know...some of these people might have some sort of muscle or bone or whatever health problem. I'm just going by some of the stuff that I witnessed and I also know of people that use a grandparents/parents handicap tag so they could take up a front parking space! That is abuse and taking away from individuals who might truly need that closer spot. Like I said, most of the cars in those spots should not be there. Some people are just plain L-A-Z-Y !
Perhaps what the OP is saying we are seeing a lot more of these chairs that are not really truly necessary and he feels it had been an inconvenience for him on more than one occasion and he just needed to vent and share his thoughts. I really don't think he meant to put those that are truly handicapped down in any way.

 

[meandtheguys2]

Gee, I'd pick the people i hang with better than that. I don't know of anyone abusing a handicap tag. And as far as the busses go, we waited for multiple busses on multiple occasions because the lifts didn't work or the drivers were incompetent. Then we (6 total) were given dirty looks by people just walking up and wanting to load. We gave up on them and started driving. As I've said before you seldomly know the whole story.

As far as strangers go, you don't have a clue as to whether they'd be better off getting their excercise, or whether they are coming off chemo. Unless you have some power to discern that the average person is missing.

Karnak, I agree. I'd love to see those witching about the ECV's have to live with them for a day or two...

 

[angelmav]

I also think that the issue is that 'some' rent/use them for convenience and ease to get around the parks (like putting your 6 yr old in a stroller) that dont really need them. I see people all the time that walk into grocery stores, get into the powered cart, ram there way through the store, stop it in the middle of the isle, get out, grab what they need, put it in cart and continue. (in fact, just the other day I was looking at the DVD play kiosk at safeway and a lady in one asked me to watch her groceries, got out, went to whatever isle she forgot, bought said item, came back, grabbed her bag out of the cart and walked to her car). Now 'these' people really dot care what anyone else thinks because there just rude. Of course we have also seen several able bodied people leave a vehicle with a handicapped sticker and a prime spot.
I think people that take advantage of these things are the real problem, but there not confined to the parks. Things are tough enough for those with disabilities without having these jerks to contend with. To the OP, sorry to hear that the trip wasnt what you were hoping for.

 

[meandtheguys2]

. I see people all the time that walk into grocery stores, get into the powered cart, ram there way through the store, stop it in the middle of the isle, get out, grab what they need, put it in cart and continue. .

Unless someone helps, there isn't any way to reach the majority of items on the shelves without getting out. They are difficult to maneuver, also. Ever tried it. It might create some well needed empathy.

 

[angelmav]

Unless someone helps, there isn't any way to reach the majority of items on the shelves without getting out. They are difficult to maneuver, also. Ever tried it. It might create some well needed empathy.

Considering the number of times I have been on crutches and had my ability limited, you dont need to lecture me. I have witnessed on a few occasions, relatively able bodied (I/E they walked in/walked out, had no problems getting around outside the cart) individuals using them. Not only are they taking them away from someone who may actually need them, but they do nothing to help the cause of those with legitimate disabilities.

 

[glitterkittyy]

It's difficult (impossible) to tell if someone needs an ECV or not...whether at the World or Wal-mart. For example, I have tachycardia. You would not know anything was wrong with me if you looked at me. I can walk just fine 95% of the teime, and I don't use an ECV. However, when my tachycardia acts up, my pulse goes from 60-70 bpm to 160-180 for no reason whatsoever. When it does that, you'd better bet that I'll need a wheelchair at the very least, or I'll pass out. If I'm having a tachycardia episode, I try not to go anywhere. But if one happens while you're already there, there very well may be some looks from people who don't think I *really* need help.

So basically, you don't know so don't judge. Just be happy you're at the World and be thankful that you're healthy enough to stand in line. I've not had to use an ECV before...and reading these responses makes me not want to even if I should need one in the future. I don't want to ruin my family's time because of being embarassed by rude people or something like that. So I'd likely just go home instead.

 

[Legend]

When you're in WDW, just remember, you're on VACATION! Try and relax, and don't let little stuff get to ya! Are all CM's going to be superfriendly, nope! I had a pretty ignorant one kind of irk me a bit on the Congo River Rapids, but I brushed it off and concentrated on the more plentiful, very friendly CM's. Another thing to consider, dealing with the public isn't always easy. These CM's deal with a TON of people, and coming from the public relations field, sometimes they just get on your nerves and you'd like to choke them. A few of those in a day, and it can put your good mood on ice. Always keep that in mind! The magic is always there, if you accept everything for what it is!

As for the scooters, I think some people do take advantage. I'd opt for a policy of not forwarding them to the front of the line, and making them wait for the rest of their party to make their way through the Q with the rest of the World.

Have a nice day!

 

[meandtheguys2]

I've not had to use an ECV before...and reading these responses makes me not want to even if I should need one in the future. I don't want to ruin my family's time because of being embarassed by rude people or something like that. So I'd likely just go home instead.

I've met some of the nicest people waiting in lines with my mom and her ECV. If the others are ignorant enough to be rude, just remember that most people aren't crabby and judgmental. Just like most people aren't trying to run people over with scooters!

 

[angelmav]

I dont think anyone is being crabby or judgemental by commenting on the people who use them that dont need them. If you think that doesnt happen then your not paying attention. My comment is that those that use them or take parking spaces with their handicapped sticker that dont truly need them are taking advantage of those who do.

 

[glitterkittyy]

Thanks Michelle

Usually when my tachycardia acts up, I take a pill and rest until it settles down. But there have been times when my pulse just won't slow down. And I'd hate for the rest of the family to miss out because of me. Walking and high pulses just don't go together, though. lol

I just hate to see how rude some are to the ECV people. I don't mean those on this board, but the ones I witness at the parks. I've seen people do and say rude things to people. And the truth is you just don't know their situation. You *think* you do, but you don't. So as the saying goes "If you can't say something nice, shut your pie hole." Or was it only my grandma who said it that way?

Again, just for clarification sake, I'm talking about people in the parks.

 

[CheshireVal]

I haven't noticed it on rides in parks, but the ECV thing can be unfair when it comes to buses. I don't think it's fair when I've been standing in line for 10 minutes, only to have an ECV roll up at the last minute with thirteen family members in tow and have them all get on the bus first and take up most of the seats. And yes this has happened!

I have traveled with a "grand gathering" with one member in an ECV. We let her immediate family get on the bus with her first, and the rest of us waited in line with everyone else, out of consideration for others who had been waiting longer.

 

[bumbershoot]

THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT MY ONLY BEEF IS ABOUT THE GROWING NUMBER OF WHEELCHAIRS/EVCS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Especially when it's pouring, I've been out from 7:30 AM-10:00 PM, I have to carry my 5 year old sister in law, there's a hella long line just after Wishes! I just wish there was a way that EVERYONE had to wait in the queue.

But otherwise, I don't care. I know it takes longer to get set up for shows and stuff...

For you and the person you were agreeing with about the bus line...


This is about the Americans with Disabilities Act. The ADA makes it so that people with problems do not have to be grilled every time they ask for help. So they don't have to reveal private medical information to just anyone who asks. It protects them in that they don't have to give that info.

I looked into it when dealing with a neighbor who was very obviously abusing the service animal rules (any animal can be a service animal, there is no training necessary to be considered a service animal, the person doesn't have to provide proof that they have a condition or that the animal helps with that condition). The neighbor used to be an apartment manager elsewhere and knew the rules, and managed to come up with a condition that dogs are, indeed, used for, but she never took the dogs anywhere with her (quite dangerous if she had that condition and if those dogs could help her with that (not questioning if dogs can help with the condition, I know they can, just questioning HER)). The dogs were big, aggressive, and had gone protective of the whole building, and there were 8 units in the building, not just the owner of the dog. The dogs were let outside alone with the ineffective boyfriend calling for them when, oh, they cornered my 300 lb hubby inside his car. Twice. They were dangerous dogs and I couldn't go outside b/c I didn't know when the 5 year old who lived with the dogs would randomly open her door to let them out (they protected her, but saw me and my infant as dangerous predators). Since the management was aware of her, they wanted to take down all the incidents so they could ultimately take action, but we decided we didn't want to be their guinea pigs, so we left at the end of our lease rather than be in danger anymore.

Would I want the ADA to be watered down because of her? NO. I just wish it were easier for the management to prove, after all the incidents (and her never EVER taking the dogs with her).


I digress.

With that knowledge, that the ADA is about protecting those with disabilities (try to imagine your dear parent or child being forced to divulge all sorts of private medical information to anyone who asks; when asking for help in reaching a tall shelf, when renting an apartment, when renting a wheelchair, etc), I read a very interesting discussion of the buses at WDW the other month. Drivers and former drivers were involved in the discussion, and it really made me think!


Because the buses need to have the chairs/ECVs loaded first, they need to get those in chairs/ECVs on first. If they let people on as the line goes, they will either have to take people OFF the bus once they get to someone in a chair, or they actually have to stop loading *anyone*. If memory serves, because the ADA officially gives equality to those it protects, if a bus is too full to take a person in a chair/ECV, then the bus is too full to take anyone. So if going strictly with the line, once the chair/ECV user got to the line, if they can't be put on, the bus must close its doors and leave.

But this results in buses that aren't full, and it's ridiculous (to leave if there's still room).

Therefore, they load the chair/ECVs first, so that those spots are taken up, and then they fill in around them. That allows for a more full bus.

If you really think about that, it makes sense. If you think about your wonderful Aunt Jinnie having to divulge private info to any joe who thinks he needs it, you can understand why the ADA is a good thing.

And when you put those ideas up against the occasional person (like our former neighbor) who abuses the equality enforced by the ADA, I'm sure that any reasonable person will just relax the next time the WDW bus driver puts on a wheelchair/ECV user (and family) first, so they can get the bus more full than they would if they just shut the doors to anyone if they can't put the chair/ECV user on.