Whats Wrong with Disney?

[btk2333]

You said you've been 3 times a year for the past 8 years, which means I'm assuming you've been at least once this year. Taking that into account
let's look at 5-18:

5) Be Our Guest Restaurant - Not new.
6) Under the Sea - Not new.
7) Enchanted Tales with Belle
8) Princess Fairytale Hall Different location. I'd hardly call that a new experience.
9) Festival of Fantasy Parade
10) Seven Dwarfs Mine Train
11) Celebrate the Magic Castle Show
12) Anna and Elsa
13) Star Tours (re-opened just over 3 years ago..) - Not new.
14) Sorcerers of the Magic Kingdom - Not new.

(only including things that we do/would do (haven't personally done the Mine Train yet)- there are other things at like Wilderness Explorers, the meet and greets in Storybook Circus, Legend of Jack Sparrow, that we don't do)
and things that cost more money but I still include because they're new... especially dining because that's a huge reason why we go to Disney... (if you can't tell Epcot is our favorite park)- again only including places at which we've actually eaten
14) Spice Road Table
15) La Cava - Not new.
16) Tutto Gusto - Not new.
17) The ice cream martini place in France - Not new.
18) refurbished Cali Grill - Yeah, OK.

Of course I haven't done everything. I have absolutely no desire whatsoever to go to Spice Road Table. Neither does my wife or kids. However, there ARE things that are new at Universal that we all want to do, which is why we spend a week there before going to Disney.

Does that mean I don't love Disney for the nostalgia? Absolutely not. On some levels, Universal won't ever be able to compete with WDW to me. I'm simply pointing out very obvious facts. With Universal, there actually are new things to see each trip that appeal to everyone. Most of what Disney has done as of late is open up a bunch of places to have a drink. That, to me, doesn't count as a new experience.

I never once claimed that there were 24 new things built since the last time I've gone- however over the last three years all of those things were new at one point which is what you asked me to find- There is no way if I go three times a year that I can expect Disney to build 24 new attractions every 3 months...

I'm a sucker for a new place to drink eat and soak up the atmosphere-Disney loves me- I'm the type of guest they want- I spend a ton of money at the parks

I challenge you to point out 24 new things that Universal is opening every 3-4 months

I didn't pick the number 24- you seem to arbitrarily be using it and changing what you mean by it

 

[sonofanarchy]

The problem with WDW is that Disney is treating it like a cash cow. Disney can spend money, and is spending money on great rides all around the world. It seems like WDW is being used as a giant ATM machine for expansion elsewhere.

Since 2008, Universal Orlando has had the following "major" expansions/rethemes.

2008 Simpson’s ride
2009 Hollywood Rip Ride Rocket
2010 WWOHP- Hogsmead
2013 Springfield retheme and Kudo and Kang ride
2013 Transformers
2014 WWoHP – Diagon Alley
2015-16 King Kong at IOA

They are definitely using Harry potter as a major calling card and selling point. But, they also seem to be adding, updating other properties into their arsenal. If we compare that to the "major" expansions/Rethemes at WDW during that time Frame.

2008 Toy Story Mania
2009 Sum of all Thrills
2011 Test Track 2.0
2012 Fantasyland phase I
2014 Fantasyland Phase II
2017-2018 Avatarland

I like both of both WDW and UO. From a nostalgia standpoint, WDW is still probably top dog. But looking at their recent work, Universal has been stepping up to the plate in a big way especially when you consider WDW has 1,076 acres of theme park space and 42,000 acres total to Universal's 234 acres of theme park space and 840 acres overall.

I thought Disney had just under 30,000 acres. Did they buy more recently?

 

[sonofanarchy]

I never once claimed that there were 24 new things built since the last time I've gone- however over the last three years all of those things were new at one point- There is no way if I go three times a year that I can expect Disney to build 24 new attractions every 3 months...

I'm a sucker for a new place to drink eat and soak up the atmosphere-Disney loves me- I'm the type of guest they want- I spend a ton of money at the parks

I challenge you to point out 24 new things that Universal is opening every 3-4 months

I didn't pick the number 24- you seem to arbitrarily be using it and changing what you mean by it

Oh brother.

This was your quote:

"I'm sorry but that is just not true- I've been to WDW over 30 times (8 times in the last 3 years) and every time we've done multiple things that we've never done before."

You claim you've been 8 times in 3 years and every time you find multiple NEW experiences. So, I assumed on the low side and picked 3 new experiences over each trip. 8x3 = 24.

You're the one who is changing what you mean by it. You're using different resorts and reopening of restaurants that have been there for years as new experiences. They're not new experiences that Disney has been building for the guest. They're simply things that you haven't done before. There's a big difference.

I never said Universal opens 24 attractions every 3-4 months. No idea where you got that from.

What has Disney done in the past 5 years? Fantasyland Expansion, which most people say is pretty disappointing. We got a Little Mermaid ride, which was a top to bottom clone of the Nemo ride (which is lame). We got Be Our Guest, which most agree is fantastic. We got a closing of a dark ride classic, and we got an opening of 7DMT, which has been another disappointment across the board. And then we get the obligatory pay extra to enjoy experiences. Oh yeah, more DVC.

In that time, Universal has given us Wizarding World Part 1, which was called by just about everyone, the most amazing theme park addition in the world. We got an entire new area for the Simpsons. We got Despicable Me. We got Rip Ride Rockit. We got Transformers. And now, we're getting what is already being called by all theme park insiders, the greatest addition ever to a theme park, in Diagon Alley.

If you'd like to discuss food options, Universal can hang right there with Disney in what it has opened in the same time.

This isn't rocket science.

 

[btk2333]

Oh brother.

This was your quote:

"I'm sorry but that is just not true- I've been to WDW over 30 times (8 times in the last 3 years) and every time we've done multiple things that we've never done before."

You claim you've been 8 times in 3 years and every time you find multiple NEW experiences. "THINGS THAT WE'VE NEVER DONE BEFORE"So, I assumed on the low side and picked 3 new experiences over each trip. 8x3 = 24.

You're the one who is changing what you mean by it. You're using different resorts and reopening of restaurants that have been there for years as new experiences. They're not new experiences that Disney has been building for the guest. They're simply things that you haven't done before. There's a big difference.

I never said Universal opens 24 attractions every 3-4 months. No idea where you got that from.

What has Disney done in the past 5 years? Fantasyland Expansion, which most people say is pretty disappointing. We got a Little Mermaid ride, which was a top to bottom clone of the Nemo ride (which is lame). We got Be Our Guest, which most agree is fantastic. We got a closing of a dark ride classic, and we got an opening of 7DMT, which has been another disappointment across the board. And then we get the obligatory pay extra to enjoy experiences. Oh yeah, more DVC.

In that time, Universal has given us Wizarding World Part 1, which was called by just about everyone, the most amazing theme park addition in the world. We got an entire new area for the Simpsons. We got Despicable Me. We got Rip Ride Rockit. We got Transformers. And now, we're getting what is already being called by all theme park insiders, the greatest addition ever to a theme park, in Diagon Alley.

If you'd like to discuss food options, Universal can hang right there with Disney in what it has opened in the same time.

This isn't rocket science.

I'm sorry but that is just not true- I've been to WDW over 30 times (8 times in the last 3 years) and every time we've done multiple things that we've never done before. If you're not finding something new to do each trip it is your choice.

Where in that message did I say that we're doing things that are new to WDW? I didn't say they were NEW TO DISNEY WORLD, just NEW TO ME- you added the new to WDW. I maintain that every time I go to WDW I do multiple things that are NEW TO ME, when I no longer can say that I will stop traveling to WDW simple as that. And yes, a themed restaurant, a new bar, a new resort, these are all new experiences that we plan our trips to take advantage of.

Of those things you mentioned at Universal , only Harry Potter appeals to me. No interest in the Simpsons, Despicable Me, Rip Ride Rockit or Transformers as themes.

To me you can't compare what Universal has opened to what Disney has opened- Disney has so much more on the ground right now. Disney can't expand at the rate Universal does because it needs to maintain and upgrade existing attractions. Do I wish Disney would move faster on Star Wars and Avatar? Sure, but word is that they're waiting to open things when the new movies come out to synchronize them together. Can I blame them for that?

Just because you chose to interpret my words as saying that I've done something NEW TO WDW every time I go is not my fault- you're the one putting words in my mouth.

 

[peaches00]

This...

Oh brother.

This was your quote:

"I'm sorry but that is just not true- I've been to WDW over 30 times (8 times in the last 3 years) and every time we've done multiple things that we've never done before."

You claim you've been 8 times in 3 years and every time you find multiple NEW experiences. So, I assumed on the low side and picked 3 new experiences over each trip. 8x3 = 24.

You're the one who is changing what you mean by it. You're using different resorts and reopening of restaurants that have been there for years as new experiences. They're not new experiences that Disney has been building for the guest. They're simply things that you haven't done before. There's a big difference.

I never said Universal opens 24 attractions every 3-4 months. No idea where you got that from.

What has Disney done in the past 5 years? Fantasyland Expansion, which most people say is pretty disappointing. We got a Little Mermaid ride, which was a top to bottom clone of the Nemo ride (which is lame). We got Be Our Guest, which most agree is fantastic. We got a closing of a dark ride classic, and we got an opening of 7DMT, which has been another disappointment across the board. And then we get the obligatory pay extra to enjoy experiences. Oh yeah, more DVC.

In that time, Universal has given us Wizarding World Part 1, which was called by just about everyone, the most amazing theme park addition in the world. We got an entire new area for the Simpsons. We got Despicable Me. We got Rip Ride Rockit. We got Transformers. And now, we're getting what is already being called by all theme park insiders, the greatest addition ever to a theme park, in Diagon Alley.

If you'd like to discuss food options, Universal can hang right there with Disney in what it has opened in the same time.

This isn't rocket science.

 

[surferdave]

Why should I include Book sales when I'm looking at movies.? I would expect that the popularity of the Harry Potter books would be reflected in the popularity of the movies seeing as how the books came out first and were well received. As for any Avatar books, I wouldn't expect them to be that popular. When movies come out first, the popularity doesn't usually extend back to books like it does the other way around from books to movies. Moreover, I wasn't saying Potter wasn't popular nor really getting into a blow for blow comparison of mine is more popular than yours. My point was let us not pretend that Avatar wasn't popular. Similarly to the Potter movies, the figures show it was.

Where are the Avatar fans? The week the new theme park addition was announced I wondered if there was a hotbed of Avatar fanatics somewhere comparable to what Harry Potter has and looked for a message board or a subreddit but couldn't find anything with more than a few hundred members (and most of those were out of date with few recent posts). In fact, the TV show Avatar, the Last Airbender looks to be vastly more popular now, every time I thought I had found something it turned out to be a fan site for that. I was especially surprised that there was no subreddit for it on reddit.com, I thought there was a fan site there for everything.

 

[btk2333]

Where are the Avatar fans? The week the new theme park addition was announced I wondered if there was a hotbed of Avatar fanatics somewhere comparable to what Harry Potter has and looked for a message board or a subreddit but couldn't find anything with more than a few hundred members (and most of those were out of date with few recent posts). In fact, the TV show Avatar, the Last Airbender looks to be vastly more popular now, every time I thought I had found something it turned out to be a fan site for that. I was especially surprised that there was no subreddit for it on reddit.com, I thought there was a fan site there for everything.

Isn't Avatar like crazy popular in Japan? I thought I heard something about that when they announced it in Japan... Anyone pretending the Avatarland will be a Harry Potter answer is delusional.

Star Wars has the potential to rival Harry Potter but Avatar does not- unless the next movies are epic.

 

[sonofanarchy]

Isn't Avatar like crazy popular in Japan? I thought I heard something about that when they announced it in Japan... Anyone pretending the Avatarland will be a Harry Potter answer is delusional.

Star Wars has the potential to rival Harry Potter but Avatar does not- unless the next movies are epic.

I agree with you on that. Problem is, I believe Disney thinks it's the answer. I have no reason to believe a Star Wars land is in the works. I only say that because it seems such an obvious thing to do, that would be what they are working on, not Avatarland. Especially since as you said, it would tie in with the new movie. If I am correct, we'll see the new Star Wars movie before the new Avatar.

 

[btk2333]

I agree with you on that. Problem is, I believe Disney thinks it's the answer. I have no reason to believe a Star Wars land is in the works. I only say that because it seems such an obvious thing to do, that would be what they are working on, not Avatarland. Especially since as you said, it would tie in with the new movie. If I am correct, we'll see the new Star Wars movie before the new Avatar.

The rumored closing of American Idol and Indiana Jones combined with the Sounds Dangerous area all contiguous to Star Tours seems mighty tempting...

 

[sonofanarchy]

The rumored closing of American Idol and Indiana Jones combined with the Sounds Dangerous area all contiguous to Star Tours seems mighty tempting...

Idol is definitely closing. Indiana Jones is just message board rumor. I hope you're right. Star Wars is certainly a good answer to Potter.

 

[jformica]

I think what many folks are not taking into consideration is the long run. I agree the last five years Universal has outdone Disney in many areas. We always spend 6 days at disney and 3 at universal (usually stay at hard rock hotel). I wont get into the pro's and con's only to say that Disney still has a tremendous amount of undeveloped land and universal has very little left. They can continue to change ride experiences etc but at the end of the day Disney could add 5 more parks or 10 more resorts if it wanted too. I'd put my money on Disney over the next 20 years. Disney wont do anything "major" until other parks close the gap significantly and right now universal is a DISTANT 2nd. It's business 101.

 

[sonofanarchy]

I think what many folks are not taking into consideration is the long run. I agree the last five years Universal has outdone Disney in many areas. We always spend 6 days at disney and 3 at universal (usually stay at hard rock hotel). I wont get into the pro's and con's only to say that Disney still has a tremendous amount of undeveloped land and universal has very little left. They can continue to change ride experiences etc but at the end of the day Disney could add 5 more parks or 10 more resorts if it wanted too. I'd put my money on Disney over the next 20 years. Disney wont do anything "major" until other parks close the gap significantly and right now universal is a DISTANT 2nd. It's business 101.

Again, Universal is a distant 2nd to the Magic Kingdom, not to the other parks. Also, Universal is owned by Comcast who has more money than Disney. They have recently bought more land and all rumors say they plan to buy a whole lot more.

 

[jformica]

Again, Universal is a distant 2nd to the Magic Kingdom, not to the other parks. Also, Universal is owned by Comcast who has more money than Disney. They have recently bought more land and all rumors say they plan to buy a whole lot more.

Good, then we'll all benefit. The more the parks compete, the better the experiences for all us tourists will get.

 

[surferdave]

Idol is definitely closing. Indiana Jones is just message board rumor. I hope you're right. Star Wars is certainly a good answer to Potter.

I don't see much potential here any time soon. Disney hasn't demonstrated that they'll surprise us with new additions that weren't planned and announced years in advance, but they have demonstrated that they'll let attractions sit idle for years after closing.

 

[mom2rtk]

Also, Universal is owned by Comcast who has more money than Disney.

After looking at my latest cable bill, I have to say I'm not surprised.

 

[johde]

I thought Disney had just under 30,000 acres. Did they buy more recently?

I know I was thinking it was 43 square miles or about 27,000 acres. When I look at Wikipedia (I know not the best source), it had the 42,000 acres.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walt_Disney_World

 

[DisUniversal]

After looking at my latest cable bill, I have to say I'm not surprised.

Might be looking at this the wrong way, but if I look up the stock symbols, Comcast has a market cap of 137.11B and Disney is at 143.43B so it's pretty darn close.

 

[BuzzinDownToDisney]

For the "Disney takes too long on new attractions" crowd, this was 7DMT less than 9 months ago, a mound of dirt and a crane:

http://instagram.com/p/eRMvGhCYvC/

 

[agavegirl1]

During a conversation with DBF this weekend, I was touting the new Diagon Alley attractions and themeing since we are going in October. He then asked: "Which one is going to do Avatar?" I told him it was Disney and it would be at Animal Kingdom. I was very stunned to hear him say..."If they do that right, it will be a game changer."

I am wrapped up in my own geek world I guess. I mentioned that Avatar was just a re-hash of plot lines in a bunch of other movies and he then said: "No it's not. It is unique. The creatures that live on Pandora including the Navi are all interconnected to the planet itself in a real way. I know that we will be at the IMAX on a Friday, front and center for the next movie. It is the only IMAX movie I ever thought was worth it."

All this from a 45 year old guy who loves thrill rides. Yup. Pandora is what he is looking forward to. So...a trip for 2018 is in the cards.

We will still have a great time this October. I know he will love it. I just didn't realize how much he liked Avatar until this weekend. Weird.

 

[Edgehopper]

To me you can't compare what Universal has opened to what Disney has opened- Disney has so much more on the ground right now. Disney can't expand at the rate Universal does because it needs to maintain and upgrade existing attractions.

This is an interesting comment because Disney's not even doing a great job with that! Let's see how many attractions we can find in desperate need of repairs or changes:

MK:
Carousel of Progress
Stitch's atrocity
Splash Mountain (AAs frequently aren't operating)
Country Bear Jamboree (last time I went, the sound quality made it incomprehensible)

Epcot:
Wonders of Life
Soarin' (needs improved video)
The entire Imagination Pavilion

DHS:
The Great Movie Ride (no movies after 1990 here!)
Backlot Tour!
Sounds Dangerous (at least bring back the Monster Sound Show!)

AK:
Dinosaur (broken AAs)
Primeval Whirl (hasn't been open the last two times I was there)

And that's just a list of things seriously outdated, broken, or closed. I didn't include minor outdated things that are still enjoyable like Ellen's Energy Adventure, most WS attractions and movies, or the Swiss Family Robinson Treehouse and Tom Sawyer's Island.

But Disney's put their money into hard ticket events, hotels, and MagicBands.