What Would You Do? (Fender Bender) Update Post #133

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

That's called a "Counter Report". Doesn't change anything. OP is responsible for damage. The only unresolved issue is how much did that damage amount to.

We both know you knew what I was talking about

As to your Doesn't change anything and stuff after that please post where I was talking about that, please post where I said "OP is not responsible for damage" strange that you'd respond to me this way given that in several comments I've actually come to your defense of what you're saying when others have responded to you. We aren't in disagreement about certain things tv guy

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

A supposedly $900 value here, and yet the trailer guys verbally told OP not to worry about it. They just changed their mind and sent a bill two weeks later.

From the OP at the time of the incident they told her not to worry about it, that is without knowing anything about the damage (assuming the damage was from the incident itself) in terms of costs.

When I was rear-ended the paint job alone on a not nice car at all on a new bumper and spots around it was over $900 that was over 12 years ago. For the OP this was so-so looking trailer possibly jut handmade from what they say so who knows where they are getting the figures although thankfully lumber is not as high in costs as it was last year. This is also a business vehicle so it's possible if they are not the owners the management or owner said they were in the wrong for not taking it seriously.

If they did repairs in-house a question I would have would be their labor costs as that is one way to add things up or are they saying they didn't charge labor and the cost is just materials. Unknown answers right now.

Not at all saying that OP needs to get more involved,

Oh yeah no sorry on that it was to the several posters who had mentioned the OP should keep getting more information and asking more questions from these guys, not directed at you

If they knew they could get $900 from an honest insurance claim, they would have opted for insurance from the start.

A lot of people look at things like the expected damage, the deductible they may have to pay, etc. It's really not uncommon for two parties at the scene to negotiate an amount they'll pay outside of insurance, it's risky to do that but not all that uncommon and it's not dishonest people who do this as in the only type of people that do that. People tend to be wary of turning claims in because they don't want their insurance to increase in costs or they fear they may be dropped. It's my guess that the landscape company is banking on the OP being like this. The landscape company should have commercial insurance but it's possible they don't have insurance either.

That said I absolutely think there's a possibility it's a made up number designed to get what they think they could out of the OP. Money may be owed but that amount may not be.

I'm a tad less risk tolerant so I wouldn't negotiate with anyone or let someone say "hey just give me $500 bucks and we'll call it good". But this happens all the time.

 

[EACarlson]

The OP has the burden of proof because their actions created the situation. They have admitted guilt. Court costs are normally awarded to a winning Plaintiff.
From the latest post from OP they are moving forward requesting a breakdown of the costs. That is entirely reasonable and responsible. They may not owe the victim $900, but they DO owe they money for damages.
And while I did a very casual search on reporting accidents to your insurance, not reporting a potential claim situation to your insurance appears to be a violation of almost every insurance companies policies and can lead to your policy being canceled.

If you're claiming OP took on liability to prove their case by admitting liability at the scene, the landscaping employees released OP from that liability when they said "Don't worry about it."
Court costs are generally not attorney's fees. Court costs in the jurisdictions I am aware are generally the filing fee and process serving fees unless the claim is so malicious it needs additional punishment.

 

[AnnaS]

Following along. I hope the OP will keep us updated. Good luck and hope for the best outcome.

 

[Pink Partridge]

I hope you didn't paint yourself into a corner. If a reasonable person can read your email as "If I get an itemized bill, I'll pay", they could easily give you a bill that says "Parts: $20, labor: $880".

You win. This is EXACTLY what happened. Just got the itemized bill. I am shaking with anger. It states:

Hardware: $50
Labor: $850

Labor, by the way, done "in house". By them. I didn't agree to such high labor costs. My husband could have fixed this in minutes.

It is so obvious they are scamming me, but are confident enough to put this garbage in writing.

Why? What do they have up their sleeve that they would be so bold as to have such low hardware charge and such ridiculous labor charges?

Going to discuss with my husband after work.

And a very spiteful part of me wants to post this all on our very active and gossipy Neighborhood Facebook Page, under the guise of asking for advice. Including copies of the bill with company's name showing. I won't, but I want to so very badly.

I need to calm down and gather myself. Just wanted to tell @sam_gordon he should play the lottery, as he must have a crystal ball.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Labor: $850

Uh yeah while labor can be pricey even by the hour charging that much labor (which yes it's understandable for labor to drive up the cost just that's way out there that they are saying) for that small amount of materials cost and what the repair was it's even more egregious than most mechanic shops are. Clearly they have an ego the size of a galaxy to think their time is worth that much in ratio to the work done.

Going to discuss with my husband after work.

Honestly what's there to talk about? Are you really actually considering paying them? Is there a reason you haven't turned this into your insurance company already?

 

[sam_gordon]

You win. This is EXACTLY what happened. Just got the itemized bill. I am shaking with anger. It states:

Hardware: $50
Labor: $850

Labor, by the way, done "in house". By them. I didn't agree to such high labor costs. My husband could have fixed this in minutes.

It is so obvious they are scamming me, but are confident enough to put this garbage in writing.

Why? What do they have up their sleeve that they would be so bold as to have such low hardware charge and such ridiculous labor charges?

Going to discuss with my husband after work.

And a very spiteful part of me wants to post this all on our very active and gossipy Neighborhood Facebook Page, under the guise of asking for advice. Including copies of the bill with company's name showing. I won't, but I want to so very badly.

I need to calm down and gather myself. Just wanted to tell @sam_gordon he should play the lottery, as he must have a crystal ball.

What can I say, I'm a little diabolical. lol Actually I would have added line for "loss of service" for a couple of hundred dollars.

I still think contacting your insurance company for advice (not to file a claim) is a good thing to do.

 

[Disturbia]

Don’t the trailer guys have to prove that the damage was caused by OP. What if they accidentally hit a tree a month later? Did they take photos date stamped? There could be security cameras but the damage was probably minor.

I had an entire front door repaired and painted for that kind of money. This seems like a scam to me. A bent metal rod can’t cost more than $200 unless it was a Porsche. Ask for pictures of repair, make and model.

I think they’re trying to scam you; so personally I would direct them to your insurance co. Most likely they can’t prove anything and will back off. If you owe them something, it would definitely be less than what they’re suggesting.

Plus what’s to say they won’t come back another month or two later and claim medical bills for neck pain from someone who was sitting in the car while you backed up.

 

[wenrob]

You win. This is EXACTLY what happened. Just got the itemized bill. I am shaking with anger. It states:

Hardware: $50
Labor: $850

Labor, by the way, done "in house". By them. I didn't agree to such high labor costs. My husband could have fixed this in minutes.

It is so obvious they are scamming me, but are confident enough to put this garbage in writing.

Why? What do they have up their sleeve that they would be so bold as to have such low hardware charge and such ridiculous labor charges?

Going to discuss with my husband after work.

And a very spiteful part of me wants to post this all on our very active and gossipy Neighborhood Facebook Page, under the guise of asking for advice. Including copies of the bill with company's name showing. I won't, but I want to so very badly.

I need to calm down and gather myself. Just wanted to tell @sam_gordon he should play the lottery, as he must have a crystal ball.

Nothing to discuss. Tell them to take it up with your insurance company. They’re counting on you not doing that. Seriously, I bet they’ll forget your phone number.

 

[focusondisney]

Not sure where you live, but I know in NY you can get your car repaired anywhere you want. So doesn’t matter what your husband could have done to fix it. Although the insurance company will want to do an assessment or pictures before the damage is fixed. You might be on the hook with your insurance company for not reporting it 2 months ago when it happened.

What’s your insurance deductible OP? You may end up paying the majority of this even if you go thru insurance. Is it worth the risk of problems with your insurance carrier?

At this point, I’d probably offer them $750. Close enough that they might take it. Or just pay them what they’re asking. And consider it a lesson learned.

 

[mylilnikita]

You win. This is EXACTLY what happened. Just got the itemized bill. I am shaking with anger. It states:

Hardware: $50
Labor: $850

Labor, by the way, done "in house". By them. I didn't agree to such high labor costs. My husband could have fixed this in minutes.

It is so obvious they are scamming me, but are confident enough to put this garbage in writing.

Why? What do they have up their sleeve that they would be so bold as to have such low hardware charge and such ridiculous labor charges?

Going to discuss with my husband after work.

And a very spiteful part of me wants to post this all on our very active and gossipy Neighborhood Facebook Page, under the guise of asking for advice. Including copies of the bill with company's name showing. I won't, but I want to so very badly.

I need to calm down and gather myself. Just wanted to tell @sam_gordon he should play the lottery, as he must have a crystal ball.

Oh wow, lol. That is the total opposite of an itemized bill. Even with Labor there is how many hours at $ per hour. These guys are real amateurs.

About the part of you didn’t agree to such high labor costs, you would have no say in that even if it were another car.

 

[wenrob]

Not sure where you live, but I know in NY you can get your car repaired anywhere you want. So doesn’t matter what your husband could have done to fix it. Although the insurance company will want to do an assessment or pictures before the damage is fixed. You might be on the hook with your insurance company for not reporting it 2 months ago when it happened.

What’s your insurance deductible OP? You may end up paying the majority of this even if you go thru insurance. Is it worth the risk of problems with your insurance carrier?

At this point, I’d probably offer them $750. Close enough that they might take it. Or just pay them what they’re asking. And consider it a lesson learned.

Deductible would only apply to damage done to the OP’s vehicle.

 

[focusondisney]

Deductible would only apply to damage done to the OP’s vehicle.

Sorry, wasn’t thinking that. You can tell it’s been awhile since I needed to file a claim. (Knock on wood. ).

 

[anniemae]

I don't understand what insurance would do at this point. Wouldn't they need to see the vehicle before the repairs are done? At this point it's too late. How would they know the extent of the damage if it's been fixed. Isn't that why they send out an adjuster to look at it prior to repair? I know OP said she took photos, but it's hard to know without seeing the vehicle in person.

It's sketchy and I feel like they are trying to get OP to pay them so they will go away. Giving that ridiculous bill is insulting. They know what kind of bill she is looking for. They are being bold.

 

[wenrob]

I don't understand what insurance would do at this point. Wouldn't they need to see the vehicle before the repairs are done? At this point it's too late. How would they know the extent of the damage if it's been fixed. Isn't that why they send out an adjuster to look at it prior to repair? I know OP said she took photos, but it's hard to know without seeing the vehicle in person.

It's sketchy and I feel like they are trying to get OP to pay them so they will go away. Giving that ridiculous bill is insulting. They know what kind of bill she is looking for. They are being bold.

This is *why* I’m saying to tell them she’ll refer it to insurance. They KNOW they should have contacted her before any repairs and given her a bill before any work was done. It will most likely get them to back off.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

I don't understand what insurance would do at this point. Wouldn't they need to see the vehicle before the repairs are done? At this point it's too late. How would they know the extent of the damage if it's been fixed. Isn't that why they send out an adjuster to look at it prior to repair? I know OP said she took photos, but it's hard to know without seeing the vehicle in person.

It's sketchy and I feel like they are trying to get OP to pay them so they will go away. Giving that ridiculous bill is insulting. They know what kind of bill she is looking for. They are being bold.

It's why I think it could go a few ways ways either the insurance company pays it as it's presented or they deny the claim due to insufficient evidence or they inquire for more information. Depreciation and prior damage are all things that are listed in my insurance policy that can affect the payout. Prior damage does not also preclude a settlement of a claim but can affect the end amount someone gets.

A little known fact is states have Statute of Limitations that vary by state. I cannot remember what my state is maybe 3 or 5 years but in any case it was something I became very familiar with at the time when I was calculating someone's auto/home discount for 10 years worth (and yes some states have that and even more). This is just what the state would have, insurance companies can have their own rules. It is normal for policies to state you need to inform them immediately it does how not mean "what can they do at this point". Rules vary by insurance company and state laws but are hard to make blanket statements.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

This is *why* I’m saying to tell them she’ll refer it to insurance. They KNOW they should have contacted her before any repairs and given her a bill before any work was done. It will most likely get them to back off.

While I don't disagree with you it's a risk that the OP would take if they haven't actually notified their insurance company. If these people call her bluff and call her insurance company that could present problems for the OP. Until she files a claim the insurance company does not represent her. Of course what could happen is if they call the insurance company a claim is opened right there and that does happen where the claim is turned in the by the Other party rather than the insured.

 

[Mysterian]

Don’t the trailer guys have to prove that the damage was caused by OP. What if they accidentally hit a tree a month later? Did they take photos date stamped? There could be security cameras but the damage was probably minor.

I had an entire front door repaired and painted for that kind of money. This seems like a scam to me. A bent metal rod can’t cost more than $200 unless it was a Porsche. Ask for pictures of repair, make and model.

I think they’re trying to scam you; so personally I would direct them to your insurance co. Most likely they can’t prove anything and will back off. If you owe them something, it would definitely be less than what they’re suggesting.

Plus what’s to say they won’t come back another month or two later and claim medical bills for neck pain from someone who was sitting in the car while you backed up.

I agree with all these points. I thought about security cameras from nearby buildings too. But for something like this, this late over something this minor, the Trailer guys would likely be out of luck.

The police can’t do much for them either. They aren’t going to canvas the area for witnesses. Even Detective Mendoza, who cracked the infamous $31.63 U-haul scraped bumper case, cannot help them.

As I mentioned in a previous post, there’s no evidence they repaired the trailer. Imagine if OP spotted them again, same trailer, same condition.

 

[Imzadi]

Don’t the trailer guys have to prove that the damage was caused by OP. What if they accidentally hit a tree a month later? Did they take photos date stamped?

TIP: Almost ALL photos are time & date stamped nowadays if taken with a smartphone. (Maybe not really old cellphones.) Even if one doesn't set the camera up to date stamp it on the photo. It's called the metadata. One just has to go to the photo file, right mouse click "Properties" and it will bring up the date and time a photo was taken.

 

[wenrob]

While I don't disagree with you it's a risk that the OP would take if they haven't actually notified their insurance company. If these people call her bluff and call her insurance company that could present problems for the OP. Until she files a claim the insurance company does not represent her. Of course what could happen is if they call the insurance company a claim is opened right there and that does happen where the claim is turned in the by the Other party rather than the insured.

That’s why I said the OP would refer it. How would they know what insurance company to call?