What will WDW "cut" next?

I really just can't wait for the Fantasyland Expansion to open. I think they keep looking at the photos of that massively insane line from opening weekend of Harry Potter an assume they'll have the same unending stream of patrons.

Cut EMH? No biggie. More folks are coming to fill the resort spots.

Better change our FP approach so we can squeeze in all those huge numbers!

Higher prices scare folks off? No problem. There's a huge line of people willing to pay higher prices.

I think once the FLE opens and they have to "adjust" their expectations, they'll come back down reality again.

Don't get me wrong. I'm very excited about the FLE. It's just the sort of thing I will love. But I don't think it's going to do anything along the scale of WWOHP.
 
About 10 years ago, you had to pay for extra magic hours in the evening. I remember paying my $12 at the resort. Does anyone else remember that?
More than ten.
E-Ride Nights.
Resort Guests only.
Only at Magic Kingdom, only the ten top attractions, a minimal number of tickets sold (10,000-15,000 max). Characters available, if I remember correctly. Ended in 2001.
 
Senator Tressel said:
Well first of all you have to take into account all of the factors we presently are aware of. The first and most important being.....it was a joke.

Ok...so you're answer is "cause I say so?"

Gotta bring it a little more
 

Dude, they're not closing DHS. My answer is that it was a joke. You're still trying to argue the merits of something I just told you that I made up as a joke (which would be clear to 99% of the people reading it without it needing to be explained).
 
Senator Tressel said:
Dude, they're not closing DHS. My answer is that it was a joke. You're still trying to argue the merits of something I just told you that I made up as a joke (which would be clear to 99% of the people reading it without it needing to be explained).

Well played...got me there

I actually could see why someone WOULD argue that MGM "was a joke"

I guess after time around here my expectations are as low as citibanks stockprice...

I'll try to pay better attention next time...though my responses were more "playful" than serious...nonetheless
 
I wish it where that way...

But the reality is that for everyone person who has recurring, legitimate complaints about declining quality and no dedication to a coherent reinvestment plan (which there really isn't nor has been since people walked into animal kingdom and realized they were walking through what amounts to a municipal zoo's worth of entertainment)...there are a thousand that dump 5000 for a week in paradise and think that the parks/ wdw facilities have never been stronger...

The reality is that they are not....
They enjoy the "blessing of size"

And that now means that the sheer size allows slow but methodical erosion to occur with little blowback as prices elevate along a consistent price curve...

It's not that the have "cut drastically"...it's that they have lowered the public's expectations as to what they will add/renovate/ enhance/maintain to
Earn the repeat business on the money you're already spending...but that is no longer the deal they make with you. The bar is being lowered like a bad limbo scene in a 1988 beach movie.

But it's meticulously slow...steady...but ultimately deliberate.

The proof is in the pudding...Go back and track what they have done since 4/15/98...the rough opening of Animal Kingdom...the overall list combined with what's been taken out of
Service is actually disturbing...and they've still managed to increase fees, rake, increase overall attendance and profits...


Nothing changes until they are hit in the wallet - which does all the thinking.

I can't see that happening until the old style "Disney" reputation has long since been dead and buried

I'll do you one better...Go back to October of 1971 and look at all they have added! Three additional major gates, two major waterparks, dozens of resorts, hundreds of attractions, transportation options galore, restaurants by the oodles, shopping, and so on...

Things come and things go. Good things stay, bad things leave. Profitable things stay, unprofitable things leave. Products in demand are supported or enhanced, products without adequate demand diminish in scope and eventually depart. It is the nature of any business.

You cannot do accounting on only one side of the balance sheet and see the full picture. If you only look at the debits, and not the credits, you are not being fair to yourself or to WDW.

That is the point I, and others, are tying to make!
 
/
I'll do you one better...Go back to October of 1971 and look at all they have added! Three additional major gates, two major waterparks, dozens of resorts, hundreds of attractions, transportation options galore, restaurants by the oodles, shopping, and so on...

Things come and things go. Good things stay, bad things leave. Profitable things stay, unprofitable things leave. Products in demand are supported or enhanced, products without adequate demand diminish in scope and eventually depart. It is the nature of any business.

You cannot do accounting on only one side of the balance sheet and see the full picture. If you only look at the debits, and not the credits, you are not being fair to yourself or to WDW.

That is the point I, and others, are tying to make!
I don't know if that's exactly fair though. You could theoretically go all the way back to when there was nothing there and based on that anything would be a plus.

Where do you draw the line? When do you say that Disney added an enormous amount of items but don't seem to do much of that any more? When is it OK to set aside the amazing past and just look at the now or at least the recent past?
 
I'll do you one better...Go back to October of 1971 and look at all they have added! Three additional major gates, two major waterparks, dozens of resorts, hundreds of attractions, transportation options galore, restaurants by the oodles, shopping, and so on...

Things come and things go. Good things stay, bad things leave. Profitable things stay, unprofitable things leave. Products in demand are supported or enhanced, products without adequate demand diminish in scope and eventually depart. It is the nature of any business.

You cannot do accounting on only one side of the balance sheet and see the full picture. If you only look at the debits, and not the credits, you are not being fair to yourself or to WDW.

That is the point I, and others, are tying to make!

Great post :thumbsup2

I went in 1988 age 16 and bought a hardback souvenir book - dug it out the other week and was astounded at just how little there was comparatively.
 
Every company's #1 goal is to make money for the stockholders. It's not fair for the consumer, but that's how it works. If things can get cut to save money without causing a lost in revenue, it will get cut. That means monorail hours, fancy napkins, etc.

If you feel that it's not worth the money you are paying, go somewhere else for vacation.
 
Planogirl said:
I don't know if that's exactly fair though. You could theoretically go all the way back to when there was nothing there and based on that anything would be a plus.

Where do you draw the line? When do you say that Disney added an enormous amount of items but don't seem to do much of that any more? When is it OK to set aside the amazing past and just look at the now or at least the recent past?

That is the counterargument that you saved me from making...and it is a valid one. Excellent

But to elaborate...you can't take the whole history and lump it as one because of the different periods in construction...

The reality is that WDW was in a state of continually development (though at varying rates based in a number of factors) from 1965 through the opening of the west side and animal kingdom in 97-98...and it has not been so since.
I'm not saying that's wrong...it's probably the right move...but that means you can't lump
It in with the expansion.

The reality is that the costs have and continue to rise above inflation, price index, and reasonable appreciation...each year barring economic collapses...and that why you must now ask if they are - in fact - cutting you.

And that was my point. Because make no
Mistake...you are paying for cruiseships, park bailouts, chinese trade deal negotiations (more Disneylands), and John Carter's...

You (we) are...and it is therefore your responsibility to ask if you are overpaying.
 
I don't know if that's exactly fair though. You could theoretically go all the way back to when there was nothing there and based on that anything would be a plus.

Where do you draw the line? When do you say that Disney added an enormous amount of items but don't seem to do much of that any more? When is it OK to set aside the amazing past and just look at the now or at least the recent past?

I see your point, and I understand what you mean, but that is where the subjectivity of this thread and this mindset as a whole comes into play. I look at what has been added since 1998 and see it as far outstripping what has been removed. For example, EMH and the dining plan were added after 1998! The fact that they have continued to evolve does not belie or negate the fact that they were additions post-1998.

Expedition Everest, Toy Story Midway Mania, Osborne Family Lights, Soarin', Test Track, Mission: Space, the Fantasy Land Expansion, multiple resorts, Magical Express, etc. have all happened since 1998, as well as many other additions, so it hasn't been 14 years of retrograde devolution, in my opinion.

The additional challenge is that as things mature, they will always evolve more slowly, and so arguments that only look at the "debit side" instead of both sides, in my opinion, do an injustice to the conversation. For example, I understand that WDW added a park about every 10 years, but that is an unsustainable model, so they have been adding parks around the world and focusing on other parks since that time. They do not want a fifth park in Orlando right now because there is no business purpose in adding one. Does that mean they are "cutting" or simply using good business sense? What about after five gates; would we need a 6th?

Can you imagine ticket prices if they invested $25,000,000,000+ in a new park?

That is the counterargument that you saved me from making...and it is a valid one. Excellent

But to elaborate...you can't take the whole history and lump it as one because of the different periods in construction...

The reality is that WDW was in a state of continually development (though at varying rates based in a number of factors) from 1965 through the opening of the west side and animal kingdom in 97-98...and it has not been so since.
I'm not saying that's wrong...it's probably the right move...but that means you can't lump
It in with the expansion.

The reality is that the costs have and continue to rise above inflation, price index, and reasonable appreciation...each year barring economic collapses...and that why you must now ask if they are - in fact - cutting you.

And that was my point. Because make no
Mistake...you are paying for cruiseships, park bailouts, chinese trade deal negotiations (more Disneylands), and John Carter's...

You (we) are...and it is therefore your responsibility to ask if you are overpaying.

See the above. Things have changed since 1998, just evidently not in the way you have wanted them to, hence the subjective nature of your perspective. Disney Corporation is a global, multi-channel conglomerate, and if all you want them to focus on is another gate in Orlando, then I understand why you are dissatisfied, but unfortunately you're likely to remain that way for a while because there is no business purpose to adding a fifth gate. In Epcot alone, since 1998 they have added their three headliner rides in Soarin', Test Track and Mission: Space. That is change.

Also, to suggest that the parks are propping up all of WDW is wildly off-base. The cruise ships, Chinese parks, etc. are paying for themselves and for shareholder dividends, the same way ABC, ESPN, WDW, DLR, etc. are, as well. Yes, there have been disasters, but it's a multi-billion dollar corporation so it's not like they're pooling their pennies.

We're going to continue to disagree, of course, and that's fine, but your opinion, as well as mine, are just that--opinions.
 
The only thing I'm worried about cutting is my filet at Le Cellier :thumbsup2
 
About 10 years ago, you had to pay for extra magic hours in the evening. I remember paying my $12 at the resort. Does anyone else remember that?

Yes! We used to always do E-Ride atleast once a trip. It was well worth it to us to get to be in a near-empty Magic Kingdom. I remember being able to stay on rides like Space Mountain and Big Thunder Mountain, riding 4 or 5 times in a row.
 
Those things should be eliminated...and that not a cut

Discounts are just that...discounts...not mandatory privileges.

Many gripes are valid...this one wouldn't be


:thumbsup2 I have to agree with this. I know many people depend on it, but I personally would be glad if they stop offering them. This would even mean I dont get them anymore, but I would be okay with that.

Discounts should be special, not expected. People sit on message boards constantly asking when they will be released. There was a time it was a special thing you came across in the Sunday paper, through a travel agent or a special mailing....now most everybody expects it.
 
KrazeeK120 said:
I don't see AoA as a cut...I see it as an expansion.

I would agree with this statement. We are not always a party of 5 but when we are (bring my Mom or my step-son along) I am happy that they have added AoA to my options. Previously there were not many choices especially when there are 3 adults as opposed to 3 children.
 
I think that what's been cut pales in comparison with what's been added.

That's a great way to look at it! :thumbsup2 I love the news stuff and improvments in areas. Sort of like looking at just reallocating sources. :goodvibes Not to belittle the losses. Just trying to stay positive. :goodvibes
 
I really just can't wait for the Fantasyland Expansion to open. I think they keep looking at the photos of that massively insane line from opening weekend of Harry Potter an assume they'll have the same unending stream of patrons.



Don't get me wrong. I'm very excited about the FLE. It's just the sort of thing I will love. But I don't think it's going to do anything along the scale of WWOHP.


BINGO! :thumbsup2
 
The Fantasyland expansion...including the Be Our Guest restaurant, The Little Mermaid ride, Gaston's Tavern, Beast Castle, Prince Eric's castle, Seven Dwarves Mine Train, Dueling Dumbo's, Casey Jr. Splash & Soak, Princess Fairytale Hall.

The new HM queue and ending of the ride.

Mickey M&G at Town Hall.

Avatarland

Test Track II

Star Tours 2.0

Art of Animation Resort

Grand Floridian DVC


Oh I'm sorry...I thought you asked about all the wonderful things they ADDED or are ADDING. Well we lost purty napkins and white bread buns, so I'd say we're all still well ahead of the game.
 

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