what makes parents kick their kids out?

[bluesaturn]

I'm just going to add my 2 cents to the the adult vs. child debate. The are biologically and legally adults, but mentally and emotionally still children. I also have a 21 year old who can't seem to grasp that the choices she makes now will impact her in the future. She sees she has a credit card to go make random purchases with, while I see her future credit score. I know, I know, some of you have perfect children, but the majority of us do not. These "adults" want to make adult decisions, but still don't want to accept the adult consequences that go along with them! There have been many studies that show the brain isn't fully developed until at least age 25, and before that they are more likely to make very risky, impulsive decisions.

I would not say the majority don't understand these things. Yeah there is certainly a sizeable portion, but I see no evidence that it is the majority. It probably depends on what kind of 21 year olds you are around.

Understanding the concept of a credit score doesn't make someone perfect, but it probably does make them more mature.

 

[snowywhite89]

Seriously? When did you graduate? I knew very few, if any, people who had "jobs waiting for them" when they graduated. (I graduated in the 1983) It was practically a given that you spent a few years working menial jobs while waiting for the right opportunity. While it would have been nice, it never occurred to me to "expect" otherwise.

I graduated that year too. What jobs were waiting for us? I was 21, married and I was the one to secure a job. We both work long hours and in DH's case odd jobs for the next few years.

My parents stopped supporting me financially just after my 19th birthday.

The lack of support just increased my drive to succeed in college and in life. I did both.

 

[jmpurdy]

But knowing the parents will save them is a huge factor too. If they know they are on their own with decisions, it is way different than knowing that they aren't 100% accountable, i.e., oh, I'm late for my rent/cell phone bill/credit card bill, but if I borrow from mom/dad/whoever, I'll be ok. But if they know they are on their own for rent and no one is going to help them - very different mindset. They will figure it out or not. Kids should struggle a bit and face problems so that they can solve them and know that they can. Not talking about a huge thing like pregnancy and throwing them to the curb. Just the attitude that 'everyone else has a cell phone, car, credit card', and not contributing to the cost. We've helped our kids too along the way, made mistakes and we've all learned how to let them go and they to let go of us. This is not easy stuff!

 

[rie'smom]

Seriously? When did you graduate? I knew very few, if any, people who had "jobs waiting for them" when they graduated. (I graduated in the 1983) It was practically a given that you spent a few years working menial jobs while waiting for the right opportunity. While it would have been nice, it never occurred to me to "expect" otherwise.

South Louisiana and anyone could get a job until the oil bust in the mid 80s. People came from all over the country to work here because jobs were plentiful both for college grads and those who weren't. The only people working menial jobs were those who dropped out of high school or junior high.

 

[luvsJack]

South Louisiana and anyone could get a job until the oil bust in the mid 80s. People came from all over the country to work here because jobs were plentiful both for college grads and those who weren't. The only people working menial jobs were those who dropped out of high school or junior high.

Yep anywhere down here in the gulf states, jobs were plentiful. Several of the guys I graduated with didn't attend graduation because they had already gone offshore. My ex got caught up in all that too. Had a wonderful job and never did go on to college like he promised his parents, now he is in his 50s and lives with his mom.

Oldest DS works offshore now, its still good money but more danger of being laid off now and a LOT more work overseas too. I would prefer him to go back to school and find something a bit less dangerous even if it means making less money. Offshore companies still hire right out of high school and at time there are lots of openings. But it is very dangerous work that takes you away from home at least half of every month, if not longer.

MrsPete: Judging people by their appearance and marrying for money came orginally came from the same post, that's where the connection came in. It was obvious what her opinion is. And, btw, I want dd to have all the nice things she want too but like most of the women in our family, my hope is that she will be able to provide them herself. Nothing wrong with both a husband and wife being successful but shouldn't be a prerequisite for a relationship.

 

[MrsPete]

Understanding the concept of a credit score doesn't make someone perfect, but it probably does make them more mature.

But understanding -- especially for young adults -- doesn't always equate to making better decisions.

For example, it's a rare teenaged girl who doesn't know how babies are made, but how many times have you heard the "I didn't think it would happen to me" line?

And to stick to your credit score example, my father was a CPA, a math whiz. He made his living keeping other people's finances straight. He was horrible with his own personal finance and spent impulsively. It was one of the things that led to my parents' divorce.

But knowing the parents will save them is a huge factor too. If they know they are on their own with decisions, it is way different than knowing that they aren't 100% accountable, i.e., oh, I'm late for my rent/cell phone bill/credit card bill, but if I borrow from mom/dad/whoever, I'll be ok.

I think a happy medium would be providing a parental safety net for the unavoidable, while refusing to help with things that stem from irresponsible behavior.

For example, I'd say that a college student who goes hog-wild with a first credit card should have to pay it off herself. She made the mess, she should figure out how to clean it up. If her parents save her, what's going to stop her from repeating the mistake? If necessary, I'd let her come home to live, but I wouldn't pay off the bills.

On the other hand, I'd always help if my adult child were to become ill, or if she lost her husband, or if some other tragedy occured. In some horrible situations, there are no lessons to be learned -- just the messes to clean up, and I'd never turn my girls away in those circumstances, and I would be quicker to offer money as well as a place to live.

And, btw, I want dd to have all the nice things she want too but like most of the women in our family, my hope is that she will be able to provide them herself. Nothing wrong with both a husband and wife being successful but shouldn't be a prerequisite for a relationship.

I disagree somewhat -- the husband and wife need to be on the same page concerning careers and finances. If one's career-driven and has big financial goals, while the other is quite satisfied with just getting by, even carrying debt . . . well, if they're not in agreement, then there's going to be friction in the marriage. Don't turn that into an extreme statement like, "I insist that they find men with trust funds" or, "If he can't buy a beach house by the time they're 35, he's not good enough." What I'm saying is that I want them to find men with good work ethics, who've cared enough about themselves to become qualified for jobs that'll allow them to support their families.

And when my girls are older, when it becomes apparent that they're getting serious with someone, I'm going to encourage them to discuss finances at length before they commit themselves. I want them to know what their future husbands think about saving vs. spending, how much of their income they each envision spending on a house, what kind of vacations they see themselves taking, how they think they'll spend on their kids, whether they see themselves as a career couple or one of them being a stay-at-home-parent, their comfort levels with debt. It's very important that they choose someone who's compatible in these things.

I know that my girls are hard workers and are working towards successful things in life, and they wouldn't be happy with a husband who thought differently.

 

[bluesaturn]

But understanding -- especially for young adults -- doesn't always equate to making better decisions.

For example, it's a rare teenaged girl who doesn't know how babies are made, but how many times have you heard the "I didn't think it would happen to me" line?

And to stick to your credit score example, my father was a CPA, a math whiz. He made his living keeping other people's finances straight. He was horrible with his own personal finance and spent impulsively. It was one of the things that led to my parents' divorce.I think a happy medium would be providing a parental safety net for the unavoidable, while refusing to help with things that stem from irresponsible behavior.

Ok well my point was about not actually ruining your credit score. So I would change that to - making the decision to use credit wisely doesn't mean you're perfect, it probably means you're probably more mature.

I agree that there are plenty of 21 year olds that don't understand how their current choices impact their future financial status. But I wouldn't say the majority, that's what annoys me. I think there's a good number of 21 year olds who get it. And you don't have to be perfect either.

For every 18 year old that gets pregnant, ten times as many don't. Clearly the majority figured it out, even if dumb luck is involved with some of them.

 

[bluesaturn]

This is an interesting article that's sorta on the topic this thread has started to turn into.
http://msittig.freeshell.org/articles/FinT_TribalWorkers.html

 

[Took]

This is an interesting article that's sorta on the topic this thread has started to turn into.
http://msittig.freeshell.org/articles/FinT_TribalWorkers.html

A very interesting article. The author is talking about a different kind of maturation than the one being stressed in this thread, but it's a maturity issue nonetheless.

 

[bluesaturn]

A very interesting article. The author is talking about a different kind of maturation than the one being stressed in this thread, but it's a maturity issue nonetheless.

Yeah, the article felt related in a tangential way.

 

[dyna]

I wanted to kick my oldest out for years DH would not let me.

1 She has always been very difficult to get along with
2. She had no job, was not in school
3. Griped about what I cooked, how I cooked it, when I cooked it.
4. Did not help around the house.

Then about 8 yrs ago my youngest got very sick for 2 yrs could not be left alone, could not go to bathroom by herself, need 24/7 care. I honestly do not know what I'd have done without my oldest there she did step up an help with her baby sis who at the time she got sick was 13 yrs old an bigger than me taller an weighed more. At times it took both my oldest DD an myself to restrain DD when she was trying to do things that was dangerous to herself an others.

I soon came to realize while DD#1 did not work did not help around the house etc She never asked for anything, she managed to do enough babysitting to keep herself supplied in gas for her car an her food an what little clothing she bought.

When the younger DD got well enough to go back to school an play sports DD was there to haul her if I was busy cooking supper or wanted to go out etc. DH filled her gas tank once a week in return for helping out with her sis.

At 34 DD#1 is still at home living in the basement the same as she did at 13 yrs old. I've now sold my house moved away DD #1 lives with DD#2 an her DH an 2 kids They all 3 both DD's an SiL bought my house. DD#1 babysits for the Gsons while their parents work.

I also found out there are worse things than deadbeat kids. My youngest has done many things to her father an I such as reporting us for things that never happened, things that could have put us behind bars for many yrs.

She has left home several times without telling us an not made contact for weeks or months at a time. When it was weeks we found out where she was an that she was safe in a few hours. When it was months we did not know for months where she was at or if she was laying dead somewhere...Our relationship will never be the same again..we cannot keep letting her into our hearts onlyto have them broken again....we suspect the girl is mentally ill but until she figures that out for herself an seeks help there not much we can do. She is now 20 yrs old it's out of our hands....

 

[MrsPete]

Ok well my point was about not actually ruining your credit score. So I would change that to - making the decision to use credit wisely doesn't mean you're perfect, it probably means you're probably more mature.

I agree that there are plenty of 21 year olds that don't understand how their current choices impact their future financial status. But I wouldn't say the majority, that's what annoys me. I think there's a good number of 21 year olds who get it. And you don't have to be perfect either.

For every 18 year old that gets pregnant, ten times as many don't. Clearly the majority figured it out, even if dumb luck is involved with some of them.

Yeah, I got that the credit score thing was an example to prove the point.

I agree that plenty of 21 year olds don't understand things, but I think more of them DO understand this or that . . . but understanding isn't the same thing as taking action.

Examples:
We all know how to lose weight, but we don't all take the steps that'd lead us in that direction.
We all know how to make a budget, but we don't all live within our means.
We all know that we should read to our kids every single day, but we don't all make the effort.
We all know that saving for retirement now is a good idea, but we don't all do it.

We're all prone to understanding things, knowing they're good for us, knowing exactly why we should do this or that . . . and just not following through. Young adults are even more prone to this than us old folks.

This is an interesting article that's sorta on the topic this thread has started to turn into.
http://msittig.freeshell.org/articles/FinT_TribalWorkers.html

Interesting article. I recently read a free Kindle book that was very similar (sorry, don't remember the name, but it was something like The Cure of Choices). It was about very young (think 20-26 or so) women who are intelligent, well-educated, and motivated. It was an interesting insight into a mindset very different from my own generation.

Basically it said that they have too many options, too many good choices, and they're afraid to choose because they're afraid of making a mistake. It talked about how they are better educated, more travelled, and more in debt than any generation before them. Mistakes are not acceptable. Mistakes mean you're not a good person. It talked about how they're terrified to marry because they might choose wrong, and they're fine with putting off marriage and blaming it on finances. Slightly less fear was associated with children. It talked about their huge desire for travel and how girl-friends have essentially replaced family for them.

I was fascinated by this very different mindset, but by the time I finished the book I was not impressed in the least. I wouldn't want to be one of those people. I wouldn't seek them out as friends. The author made her generation seem like whiney excuse-makers who had no idea about the world, yet at the same time they're quite sure they're well on their way to running it.

At the same time, I'm not at all convinced that the book captured the personality of the majority of the young 20s girl generation today. The people I know in real life don't seem like the people described in that book.

 

[Acklander]

I know contrary to popular belief here on the dis Ack, there are millions of parents who do educate their kids and actually do do all the right things.
You can talk to your blue in the face, morning, noon and night and you have no guarantees that the kid will make the best decisions.

so what your saying is that if that happens, you educate, educate, educate and the kid screws up, you simply wash your hands of the kid, toss them out, say see ya later Jr, hope you make it and what?

Real world is much like childbirth, you can take classes and prepare until the cows come home but until you start having those contractions you have no idea what it feels like

No, you don't have a guarantee that the kid will make the best decision - as a matter of fact, many times they won't make the best decision - however, it's their decision to make, and they live with the results of their decisions. It's called living their own life. I can't live it for them.
I'm always available for advice if they want it, I'll always be their biggest cheerleader, I'll always wish them luck and hope it works out for the best, but they have to find their own path in the world and follow their own heart.

 

[luvsJack]

But understanding.I disagree somewhat -- the husband and wife need to be on the same page concerning careers and finances. If one's career-driven and has big financial goals, while the other is quite satisfied with just getting by, even carrying debt . . . well, if they're not in agreement, then there's going to be friction in the marriage. Don't turn that into an extreme statement like, "I insist that they find men with trust funds" or, "If he can't buy a beach house by the time they're 35, he's not good enough." What I'm saying is that I want them to find men with good work ethics, who've cared enough about themselves to become qualified for jobs that'll allow them to support their families.

And when my girls are older, when it becomes apparent that they're getting serious with someone, I'm going to encourage them to discuss finances at length before they commit themselves. I want them to know what their future husbands think about saving vs. spending, how much of their income they each envision spending on a house, what kind of vacations they see themselves taking, how they think they'll spend on their kids, whether they see themselves as a career couple or one of them being a stay-at-home-parent, their comfort levels with debt. It's very important that they choose someone who's compatible in these things.

I know that my girls are hard workers and are working towards successful things in life, and they wouldn't be happy with a husband who thought differently.

You can be on the same page without it being important what one spouse's career choice is.

Take my niece for example, she has a wonderful, high paying, high pressured career. Her husband is older than she and did not go to college when he was younger. At her encouragment he went back to school to do what the loves. He will NEVER make enough money to give them the lifestyle that they want so she is really the breadwinner of the family. She is happy in what she does for a living and enjoys the high powered career, he is happy in what he does and perfers the more laid back approach to making a living. They are wonderfully happy together. Now, if she had chosen a husband by the career he had chosen or even that he had chosen one; she would have never married this man that she is so happy with.

I am not the other extreme that says "nothing matters as long as there is love" though. What I am saying is that as long as the two people in the relationship are in agreement with how money is to be made and how it is to be spent, it really doesn't matter who makes it. I agree with you completely about the discussions about finances and goals for the future. I just don't agree that they need to choose a mate by what career path he has chosen.

 

[MrsPete]

I just don't agree that they need to choose a mate by what career path he has chosen.

That's not what I said at all.

 

[allison443]

I don't believe you feel that way because your dd's have expensive taste though

Also, what does an eight year old have "expensive tastes" in? Barbies?

 

[NHdisneylover]

Also, what does an eight year old have "expensive tastes" in? Barbies?

Sadly, mine was already find of imported cheese, lobster an crab by that age (I blame the Disney cruise ships for the seafood and our French friends for the cheese). There was a point when those who knew her gave her cheese shop gift cards for her birthday as she wanted that more than toy It was never something she HAD to have though.

 

[DisneyBamaFan]

As the father of two boys, my only hope for my son as he looks for a spouse is that he find someone that cares about him, not money. In the Northeast, women and men seem to care more about money than anything else. IMO, it is far less important that a man or woman be able to provide for their family financially than they they be able to provide for their family emotionally.

Most of the girls up here are looking for husbands to provide for them financially. They discount poor earners, with no regard for the man behind the job or degree. I have pointed them out to my boys as women to avoid. They will only tear you down, not lift you up - and they will be gone the second that tough times fall upon you.

For the women out there - you should also beware of men who place money first. They are not the type of ment that you can trust. They will break your daughters' hearts time and again. When anything comes ahead of the relationship, pain becomes a chronic reminder of our poor choice in a spouse.

 

[Arielle22]

As the father of two boys, my only hope for my son as he looks for a spouse is that he find someone that cares about him, not money. In the Northeast, women and men seem to care more about money than anything else. IMO, it is far less important that a man or woman be able to provide for their family financially than they they be able to provide for their family emotionally.

Most of the girls up here are looking for husbands to provide for them financially. They discount poor earners, with no regard for the man behind the job or degree. I have pointed them out to my boys as women to avoid. They will only tear you down, not lift you up - and they will be gone the second that tough times fall upon you.

For the women out there - you should also beware of men who place money first. They are not the type of ment that you can trust. They will break your daughters' hearts time and again. When anything comes ahead of the relationship, pain becomes a chronic reminder of our poor choice in a spouse.

Speaking as a mom of 2 daughters in the Northeast, I disagree that women are looking for men to support them. I have not taught my daughters to expect their spouse to provide for them financially but to share the financial burden with them. Poor earners can qualify under a couple of categories. If the man is working helping people (say a counselor) and makes low wages then I see nothing the matter with him. If he works only low wage jobs because he is lazy then I would encourage my daughters (and nieces) to steer away from him.

You don't want your son viewed as a meal ticket with no thought to who he is and I do not want my daughters viewed that way either.

 

[DisneyBamaFan]

Speaking as a mom of 2 daughters in the Northeast, I disagree that women are looking for men to support them. I have not taught my daughters to expect their spouse to provide for them financially but to share the financial burden with them. Poor earners can qualify under a couple of categories. If the man is working helping people (say a counselor) and makes low wages then I see nothing the matter with him. If he works only low wage jobs because he is lazy then I would encourage my daughters (and nieces) to steer away from him.

You don't want your son viewed as a meal ticket with no thought to who he is and I do not want my daughters viewed that way either.

You can disagree all you want - it doesn't make it any less true. There are exceptions, but it is absolutely true for the population in general.

As for the lazy comment - how would you make such a determination?