What do you think about the Early Morning Magic Fantasyland ?

[5DisneyNuts]

IMO, you are missing the point. Bye bye

Yes I can understand being disappointed. What I don't understand is the attitude that your vacation is just so important that Disney should never change things during your 180 days. There is a difference, surely you can understand that.

 

[Planogirl]

Yes, there are some people missing the point here. If you plan carefully as Disney seems to suggest and then Disney changes the parameters then of course you're going to be disappointed. I don't see why that is so hard to understand.

I mentioned this before but I'd love to know the size of the crowds. Can one small restaurant and three rides handle several hundred people? I haven't seen anyone address that. People seem to assume that there won't be lines but I don't see how it can be any other way unless they sell few tickets.

 

[Mikie]

It seems so far Extra Morning Magic are Tues/Sat and requires a park admission so I have to believe the parks will be more crowded those days as everyone is going to stick around. Extra Evening Magic (or whatever it is called) seem to be Thursdays and Sundays. Ticket holders will be allowed in at 7pm making the parade/fireworks more crowded and reportedly FP are available from 7pm to official close for special event ticket holders. If the pattern continues only Monday,Wednesday,Friday would be open for regular am/pm EMHs.

So how the heck do you plan around these? We typically avoid EMH parks, but now I have no idea which will be the lesser of two evils. Guess time will tell as the reports come in.

Definitely reports of actual events will be incorporated into crowd calendars and touring plan blogs. However, for now, I'll say that I travel during party season, and this is getting to feel a lot like threading that needle - trying to avoid events that screw with crowd flow while still getting best available park hours and seeing all parades and fireworks offerings. Yet this involves doing it at a busy spring and summer time when you don't at least have the fall benefit of cooler weather!

For now, if I were trying to avoid EMH parks, I'd prioritize my days like this: Try to utilize any days that have no EMH or special events. Next, Avoid regular EMH days (a perk available to the largest number of people). Then, try to avoid Evening hours (I'm guessing much larger overall ticket sales plus that pesky 7pm entry time). Finally, if no days exist with NONE of these after-hours events, I think the Morning Magic ones would be the lesser of the evils to contend with and I'd choose those as my MK days.

 

[Planogirl]

Disappointment is one thing. Anger over the fact that you feel you are entitled to not have your vacation plans changed because of something Disney does is another. The only point I see that people are missing is the point that Disney is a business and they make it clear that the way the operate can change at any time. So, if you are going to plan your vacation knowing this why are still acting like an entitled brat if it happens to you?

And why chastise people for stating their feelings?

 

[5DisneyNuts]

Definitely reports of actual events will be incorporated into crowd calendars and touring plan blogs. However, for now, I'll say that I travel during party season, and this is getting to feel a lot like threading that needle - trying to avoid events that screw with crowd flow while still getting best available park hours and seeing all parades and fireworks offerings. Yet this involves doing it at a busy spring and summer time when you don't at least have the fall benefit of cooler weather!

For now, if I were trying to avoid EMH parks, I'd prioritize my days like this: Try to utilize any days that have no EMH or special events. Next, Avoid regular EMH days (a perk available to the largest number of people). Then, try to avoid Evening hours (I'm guessing much larger overall ticket sales plus that pesky 7pm entry time). Finally, if no days exist with NONE of these after-hours events, I think the Morning Magic ones would be the lesser of the evils to contend with and I'd choose those as my MK days.

Thank you! Makes sense. I have some time to see how things work out.

Disappointment is one thing. Anger over the fact that you feel you are entitled to not have your vacation plans changed because of something Disney does is another. The only point I see that people are missing is the point that Disney is a business and they make it clear that the way the operate can change at any time. So, if you are going to plan your vacation knowing this why are still acting like an entitled brat if it happens to you?

Name calling is really not called for.

 

[DebbieB]

I wonder if they are opening it to more capacity, seeing that it is popular and selling. It means more $ for them.

That's going to be interesting for both the morning and evening events. They are saying limited attendance on one hand but then want to make more money on the other. If there are long lines, people are going to be upset.

 

[Huggups]

Thank you! Makes sense. I have some time to see how things work out.



Name calling is really not called for.

 

[whiporee]

Yes, there are some people missing the point here. If you plan carefully as Disney seems to suggest and then Disney changes the parameters then of course you're going to be disappointed. I don't see why that is so hard to understand.

I don't think anyone is missing the point, and I think everyone understands disappointment. What some take objection to is the idea that Disney did something wrong, or they callously messed up plans, because Disney didn't. If you made an ADR, Disney is going to serve you breakfast. That's all they ever promised to do. If you made the ADR with the intent of having Main Street to yourself, or to get an early jump on crowds, then your plans are messed up, but you were making plans based on assumptions that Disney is under no obligation to honor. I agree you've suffered a perceived loss, but the loss wasn't ever yours to really have. It was an added benefit that was nice, but not part of the package. WDW could have just as easily taken you the back way to your ADR, or escorted you back to the RD line, and you still would have gotten what you paid for. So the continual refrain if WDW screwing people over gets tiresome, because it's not true.

As for people upset because the benefits of RD are diminished, I say the same thing. Disney never ever promises that folks at Rope Drop will be the first and only ones in the park. Frankly, I think RD is the reason for this new program. It used to be Rope Drop was a cute little ceremony for those folks who wanted to get up early and see it. A few hundred people, maybe a thousand in the heart of the season. But now lines often go back much farther as people have learned about all the benefits of getting there early. And now they've had to put cast members in place to manage the throngs of people who want to sprint as soon as the doors open. They don't want people to have to think the only way to get tow of the most coveted rides in the park is to have to camp out the night before and they don't want their park's opening to continually be a stampede. So if this diminishes the viability of Rope Drop for some -- hopefully many -- people, WDW couldn't be happier.

Both this and the Evening event's purpose, in my opinion, is to even out the traffic flow during the day. They don't want 52,000 people arriving at opening and leaving at closing because that's a logistical nightmare. What they want is a nice even flow of people, maybe 5-7 hours at a time, because that makes the crowds more manageable. So they are going to give some of their crowd an early start with the hopes they'll get burned out by 3 or 4 (or earlier) and then give people who want to come later a chance to shorten their day, but get on more rides later at night. The crowds aren't getting smaller, and there's no indication they ever will. So WDW is trying to figure out a way to reduce the impacts of those crowds.

 

[jknc]

I am with you 3smithboys. If I had known this was going on at our 180 day mark of making ADRs or even the 60 day FP+ selections we DEFINITELY would have chosen another day to go to MK. As you said, there is no way we will get the ADRs or FP+ selections we want at this late date.

Disappointment is one thing. Anger over the fact that you feel you are entitled to not have your vacation plans changed because of something Disney does is another. The only point I see that people are missing is the point that Disney is a business and they make it clear that the way the operate can change at any time. So, if you are going to plan your vacation knowing this why are still acting like an entitled brat if it happens to you?

Since its Masters week, this is the best correlation IMO.

Say you plan a once in a lifetime trip to Scotland to play some of the worlds greatest courses. Like Disney those courses are businesses and the travel is costly. If the legendary St. Andrews decides 1 month before your trip to announce 3 of the courses holes will be closed while you are there, you may feel cheated by that business.

I learned long ago not to tell people how they should feel.

 

[Huggups]

I don't think anyone is missing the point, and I think everyone understands disappointment. What some take objection to is the idea that Disney did something wrong, or they callously messed up plans, because Disney didn't. If you made an ADR, Disney is going to serve you breakfast. That's all they ever promised to do. If you made the ADR with the intent of having Main Street to yourself, or to get an early jump on crowds, then your plans are messed up, but you were making plans based on assumptions that Disney is under no obligation to honor. I agree you've suffered a perceived loss, but the loss wasn't ever yours to really have. It was an added benefit that was nice, but not part of the package. WDW could have just as easily taken you the back way to your ADR, or escorted you back to the RD line, and you still would have gotten what you paid for. So the continual refrain if WDW screwing people over gets tiresome, because it's not true.

As for people upset because the benefits of RD are diminished, I say the same thing. Disney never ever promises that folks at Rope Drop will be the first and only ones in the park. Frankly, I think RD is the reason for this new program. It used to be Rope Drop was a cute little ceremony for those folks who wanted to get up early and see it. A few hundred people, maybe a thousand in the heart of the season. But now lines often go back much farther as people have learned about all the benefits of getting there early. And now they've had to put cast members in place to manage the throngs of people who want to sprint as soon as the doors open. They don't want people to have to think the only way to get tow of the most coveted rides in the park is to have to camp out the night before and they don't want their park's opening to continually be a stampede. So if this diminishes the viability of Rope Drop for some -- hopefully many -- people, WDW couldn't be happier.

 

[Huggups]

Since its Masters week, this is the best correlation IMO.

Say you plan a once in a lifetime trip to Scotland to play some of the worlds greatest courses. Like Disney those courses are businesses and the travel is costly. If the legendary St. Andrews decides 1 month before your trip to announce 3 of the courses holes will be closed while you are there, you would likely feel cheated by that business.

I learned long ago not to tell people how they should feel.

 

[bcrook]

My first reaction to the late night and early morning tickets was meh ... not changing our plans, won't be buying the extra tickets.

But with the advent of the FP+, we have become diehard rope droppers. It is the best way for us to get a good number of rides in and attractions visited.
However, by bringing many more people into the park early, there will potentially be an impact on our ability to follow this plan. Where previously we arrived to short or non-existent standby lines, we may now arrive to longer lines.

And for regular visitors, the more time Disney expects us to stand in lines, the less we will do so. The more difficult/challenging/time consuming they make it to enjoy the park's attractions ... well, I can actually see us looking to spend our time elsewhere. It will be interesting to see how this plays out.

So FP+ made rope drop more necessary.

And now they are going to charge for rope drop.

Interesting...........hmmmmm

 

[bcrook]

Read most posts, not all so I apologize if this was already discussed.

It seems so far Extra Morning Magic are Tues/Sat and requires a park admission so I have to believe the parks will be more crowded those days as everyone is going to stick around. Extra Evening Magic (or whatever it is called) seem to be Thursdays and Sundays. Ticket holders will be allowed in at 7pm making the parade/fireworks more crowded and reportedly FP are available from 7pm to official close for special event ticket holders. If the pattern continues only Monday,Wednesday,Friday would be open for regular am/pm EMHs.

So how the heck do you plan around these? We typically avoid EMH parks, but now I have no idea which will be the lesser of two evils. Guess time will tell as the reports come in.

Sorry to all of you that had this thrown on top of your carefully planned days.

I will avoid all three times. That is why it still affects me, even though I will never pay for EMH.

 

[bcrook]

Honestly? At first my reaction was like everyone else's (majority anyways), "Great, another over priced offering". But the more I think about it, yes, we would definitely do this, and I hope they're still offering it next summer. It's no different, or more expensive than CRT. At CRT you get a meal and a chance to meet several princesses without having to wait in line or use a FP+. With this, you get a meal, and then the chance to ride those three rides (which are pretty big ticket rides) as many times as you want, during the time offering. So you'll definitely get 3 rides, but probably even more. Not to mention the fact that you'll be in the park and have the ability to be in line for other big ticket rides before the main rope drop rush, which the time savings there could get you an extra ride. Plus, those are rides that we would definitely use FP+ on, so it saves us having to do so, so for us, it's the equivalent of getting 3 extra FP+. Which for us, traveling in summer when it's hot and busy is definitely worth while. Plus, we like Pinocchio Village Haus. So yeah, definitely would consider doing it if budget allows.

It's a lot of money...

 

[5DisneyNuts]

I agree with a lot of what you are saying. I have never been to rope drop except when we were on the Keys to the Kingdom tour and seeing the people running in was insane. Our guide took us off to the side to watch. I think Disney would have to be concerned about the safety factor at this point. I never had a pre-park ADR either, and do agree all that gets you is breakfast.

I think what most people are disappointed about is the fact that having to plan so much in advance pretty much locks you into a touring plan. You can't book dining in other popular park restaurants or FP+ at this late date. Now MK is going to be busier with the event ticket holders staying for the entire day or getting in 2-4 hours before the event starts.

It is absolutely Disney's business to add/subtract/change things with little or no notice. Social media is a way for customers to express dissatisfaction at the new policies.

I don't think anyone is missing the point, and I think everyone understands disappointment. What some take objection to is the idea that Disney did something wrong, or they callously messed up plans, because Disney didn't. If you made an ADR, Disney is going to serve you breakfast. That's all they ever promised to do. If you made the ADR with the intent of having Main Street to yourself, or to get an early jump on crowds, then your plans are messed up, but you were making plans based on assumptions that Disney is under no obligation to honor. I agree you've suffered a perceived loss, but the loss wasn't ever yours to really have. It was an added benefit that was nice, but not part of the package. WDW could have just as easily taken you the back way to your ADR, or escorted you back to the RD line, and you still would have gotten what you paid for. So the continual refrain if WDW screwing people over gets tiresome, because it's not true.

As for people upset because the benefits of RD are diminished, I say the same thing. Disney never ever promises that folks at Rope Drop will be the first and only ones in the park. Frankly, I think RD is the reason for this new program. It used to be Rope Drop was a cute little ceremony for those folks who wanted to get up early and see it. A few hundred people, maybe a thousand in the heart of the season. But now lines often go back much farther as people have learned about all the benefits of getting there early. And now they've had to put cast members in place to manage the throngs of people who want to sprint as soon as the doors open. They don't want people to have to think the only way to get tow of the most coveted rides in the park is to have to camp out the night before and they don't want their park's opening to continually be a stampede. So if this diminishes the viability of Rope Drop for some -- hopefully many -- people, WDW couldn't be happier.

Both this and the Evening event's purpose, in my opinion, is to even out the traffic flow during the day. They don't want 52,000 people arriving at opening and leaving at closing because that's a logistical nightmare. What they want is a nice even flow of people, maybe 5-7 hours at a time, because that makes the crowds more manageable. So they are going to give some of their crowd an early start with the hopes they'll get burned out by 3 or 4 (or earlier) and then give people who want to come later a chance to shorten their day, but get on more rides later at night. The crowds aren't getting smaller, and there's no indication they ever will. So WDW is trying to figure out a way to reduce the impacts of those crowds.

 

[bcrook]

Yes, there are some people missing the point here. If you plan carefully as Disney seems to suggest and then Disney changes the parameters then of course you're going to be disappointed. I don't see why that is so hard to understand.

I mentioned this before but I'd love to know the size of the crowds. Can one small restaurant and three rides handle several hundred people? I haven't seen anyone address that. People seem to assume that there won't be lines but I don't see how it can be any other way unless they sell few tickets.

If 7DMT can handle 1400 people per hour and Peter Pan and Pooh can handle 700 each. I don't think it would be unreasonable for 2000 people. 400 capacity at Pinnochio could absorb the crowds over a period of 2.5 hours. If not, they can offer breakfast at Gastons Tavern or CHH.

 

[SmallWorld71]

I don't think anyone is missing the point, and I think everyone understands disappointment. What some take objection to is the idea that Disney did something wrong, or they callously messed up plans, because Disney didn't. If you made an ADR, Disney is going to serve you breakfast. That's all they ever promised to do. If you made the ADR with the intent of having Main Street to yourself, or to get an early jump on crowds, then your plans are messed up, but you were making plans based on assumptions that Disney is under no obligation to honor. I agree you've suffered a perceived loss, but the loss wasn't ever yours to really have. It was an added benefit that was nice, but not part of the package. WDW could have just as easily taken you the back way to your ADR, or escorted you back to the RD line, and you still would have gotten what you paid for. So the continual refrain if WDW screwing people over gets tiresome, because it's not true.

As for people upset because the benefits of RD are diminished, I say the same thing. Disney never ever promises that folks at Rope Drop will be the first and only ones in the park. Frankly, I think RD is the reason for this new program. It used to be Rope Drop was a cute little ceremony for those folks who wanted to get up early and see it. A few hundred people, maybe a thousand in the heart of the season. But now lines often go back much farther as people have learned about all the benefits of getting there early. And now they've had to put cast members in place to manage the throngs of people who want to sprint as soon as the doors open. They don't want people to have to think the only way to get tow of the most coveted rides in the park is to have to camp out the night before and they don't want their park's opening to continually be a stampede. So if this diminishes the viability of Rope Drop for some -- hopefully many -- people, WDW couldn't be happier.

Both this and the Evening event's purpose, in my opinion, is to even out the traffic flow during the day. They don't want 52,000 people arriving at opening and leaving at closing because that's a logistical nightmare. What they want is a nice even flow of people, maybe 5-7 hours at a time, because that makes the crowds more manageable. So they are going to give some of their crowd an early start with the hopes they'll get burned out by 3 or 4 (or earlier) and then give people who want to come later a chance to shorten their day, but get on more rides later at night. The crowds aren't getting smaller, and there's no indication they ever will. So WDW is trying to figure out a way to reduce the impacts of those crowds.

Wouldn't the fact that people are already in the park make it even MORE important to be at rope drop? You are already losing out on getting a jump on the Fantasyland crowds so you have to be there early to head to Frontierland/ Tomorrowland and so on. I don't think this will have a positive effect at all on rope drop at all. I am one of those people who often arrived about 10 min. or so after opening with no noticeable effects. There is no way I would do that now. With something like this, I would be absolutely sure to get there earlier to position myself at the front of the regular people.
IMO, this has zero to do with crowd control and 100% to do with making $.

 

[bcrook]

I agree with a lot of what you are saying. I have never been to rope drop except when we were on the Keys to the Kingdom tour and seeing the people running in was insane. Our guide took us off to the side to watch. I think Disney would have to be concerned about the safety factor at this point. I never had a pre-park ADR either, and do agree all that gets you is breakfast.

I think what most people are disappointed about is the fact that having to plan so much in advance pretty much locks you into a touring plan. You can't book dining in other popular park restaurants or FP+ at this late date. Now MK is going to be busier with the event ticket holders staying for the entire day or getting in 2-4 hours before the event starts.

It is absolutely Disney's business to add/subtract/change things with little or no notice. Social media is a way for customers to express dissatisfaction at the new policies.

Not just express dissatisfaction but understand the new challenges better and see if there is a work around.

I'm not seeing any silver lining in this one, just less access to the park for people like me who won't pay for EMH.

 

[bcrook]

Wouldn't the fact that people are already in the park make it even MORE important to be at rope drop? You are already losing out on getting a jump on the Fantasyland crowds so you have to be there early to head to Frontierland/ Tomorrowland and so on. I don't think this will have a positive effect at all on rope drop at all. I am one of those people who often arrived about 10 min. or so after opening with no noticeable effects. There is no way I would do that now. With something like this, I would be absolutely sure to get there earlier to position myself at the front of the regular people.
IMO, this has zero to do with crowd control and 100% to do with making $.

Or avoid the parks on those days.

How soon until we have this at Epcot? DAK? And it will probably be standard operating procedure for Star Wars Land if it ever opens.

 

[SmallWorld71]

So FP+ made rope drop more necessary.

And now they are going to charge for rope drop.

Interesting...........hmmmmm

Brilliant, isn't it? WDW created the need for these 'events' by implementing FP+, slashing CM's hours, reducing ride capacity and reducing hours. Then they ask for $ (a lot!) from guests to enjoy things at a level that they were already enjoying things before WDW took them away.