What do you think about picking teams in gym class?

[Stacerita]

Someone is always going to be picked last.

 

[kaytieeldr]

I just wanted to chime in to this discussion. I teach health & PE to students K-6th grade. I value what I do and more importantly love what I teach.

I've only read this far, and I want to stop and thank you . No matter what else you've written after this, I appreciate your attitude. And now, I'm off to read the rest of the thoughts from someone actually teaching the subject

 

[happygirl]

Not a big deal at all. I was the girl that was picked last.

 

[kaytieeldr]

Someone is always going to be picked last.

But, again - does it always have to be the SAME students? Respectfully, I think a lot of posters in this thread aren't understanding how demeaning it can be, or how it can affect one's self-esteem - likely because they were seldom, if ever, among the 'leftovers'.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

But the math teacher is going to help the 'always picked last' student (although, generally, academic classes aren't run like PE classes; but if they were...) As for taunting and arguing? No, it's way more subtle than that - those loudly-whispered discussions: "Ugh, he stinks, he trips over his own feet, you gotta take him"; "No way, we were stuck with him last time, it's your turn!"; "Hey, why don't we ignore him and just start playing, maybe he'll just go sit over on the bench by himself and if the teacher says anything, we can say we forgot".

Once? Twice? A half dozen times? Okay. Two or three times a week, for eight months? Over a period of years? Eh, not so fine.

In the times that I was picked last and my skills were weak, I can honestly say I have no recollection of kids saying such things.

And if there is such a problem, then it is up to the PE teacher to resolve that issue.

Unlike academics, your skills in PE are there for everyone to see. If you excel, everyon can tell. If you can't, everyone will know. They wont' know why--but they all must learn good sportsmanship and respecting everyone regardless of skill.

At least that is what I though the purpose of PE class. It wasn't ever intended to be training ground for future Olympians. If star athlete is copping an attitude, it shoudl be dealt with.

Same deal if Suzy Shortcomings is pouting b/c she stinks at something. (ME in 5th grade b/c I couldn't get that ball in the hoop--I sat by teh wall and cried. But noone ever made fun of me and the PE teacher didn't have a counseling session on doing your best. I was being a sourpuss and correctly ignored b/c I was being essentially a sore loser.)

I loved it when I began training to do marathons that I found that my strength is endurance--going far and long at a snail's pace. The best sprinters have difficulty with doing that--even if there finish times might be faster. But I just go and enjoy my 26 miles--b/c I can do it.

 

[cheermom1]

But, again - does it always have to be the SAME students? Respectfully, I think a lot of posters in this thread aren't understanding how demeaning it can be, or how it can affect one's self-esteem - likely because they were seldom, if ever, among the 'leftovers'.

Yes I was always the last one picked but I never thought it was that big of a deal. Like I said before I can't even remember who the captions were or that much about gym

I still think that kids need to know life isn't always fair. I grew up that way and to be honest I think I am a stronger person b/c of it. I can stand on my own 2 feet and prefer it that way. It really is better for kids to learn these lessons early in instead of waiting till they are in the real world and get a job and not understand why they don;t get this or that they get arrested for something and don't understand why. I am generalizing here not saying that those who aren't ever picked last in gym is going to jail when they get older. I meant it as in the lessons that we need to let them learn early in life all in general that life it not fair.

 

[ICF]

as they get older they'll have much harder things to deal with then this....

It's been done that way forever, and I think we all survived it.

 

[kaytieeldr]

And if there is such a problem, then it is up to the PE teacher to resolve that issue.

But that's the thing - the PE teachers didn't resolve the issue. Every 'team' class was the same old story, same old rock and roll The difference between then and now is, back then, you sucked it up (and now you spend $150 three times a week for counseling... no, not really. $5 of drugs works just as well. No, not really. You live with it. You adapt.).

 

[kaytieeldr]

Yes I was always the last one picked but I never thought it was that big of a deal. Like I said before I can't even remember who the captions were or that much about gym

Oh, I don't remember, either. But if I went to a class reunion, I'm sure it'd come back to me. I don't go, though - even though they've almost all been held at a hall around the corner from where I live (note to self: see if they ever give out an award for who came the shortest distance) because I have no pleasant memories of high school. Always being picked last, or ignored, has a lot to do with that.

 

[Buckalew11]

My cousin was a phenomenal gymnast but she was AWFUL at volleyball. It was amazing. I always thought that athletic people were sort of generally good at everything.

But you wouldn't think a good basketball player would automatically be great doing a flip on the balance beam, right?!

Reminds me of the old saying, "Those who can't do, teach. Those who can't teach, teach gym."

What the heck does this type statement mean?

Are there any others that are reading this thread and wondering if there is some weird connection between being picked last in gym class and a love of Disney??? I've never seen so many people post about being pick last in gym in my entire life.

No connection between the two. I was always a first picked girl and love Disney. I also loved dodgeball.

My son says his PE teacher lets the kids who are picked last be the team leaders now and do the picking. Pretty smart if you ask me!

Sounds good to me. What's good for the goose is good for the gander, lol.

I just wanted to chime in to this discussion. I teach health & PE to students K-6th grade. I value what I do and more importantly love what I teach. My students look forward to PE class with excitement and energy. I do not just roll out the ball and let my students play while I am sitting in my office (although yes there are some who do in my profession).
I plan lessons for students to improve and develop skills, increase their conditioning level, learn cooperation, team work and sportsmanship and most importantly to have fun. I have seen countless times how students improve their skills by being taught properly, given constructive or positive feedback and time to practice in a physically and emotionally safe area. I don't have my students pick their teams. I divide students into teams a variety of different ways. For example, counting off is one way, grouping them by squad numbers (they are in squads for warm up exercises), picking up cards that have colors on and then teams are formed by all students having the card with the same color, I pick their teams, etc). I don't have students pick teams.

Also, my students learn fitness principals and concepts, lifelong physical activity skills, communication skills, self-control, motivation, work effort, sound nutritional principals, ways to reduce stress, etc. I focus on preparing students for the realities of life as they get older. When students become frustrated with themselves or with others, I teach them how to work through their frustration and how to deal with others in a positive, respectful manner. I teach students how to win with dignity and pride and to lose with grace and resiliency. Most importantly though, I allow them an opportunity to have fun!

Do I think Physical Education is important in schools? Oh yeah, I really do! Just ask your K-6th grade child. They would agree.

You are like my sister. What can't every child have this type of PE teacher???? I had some great PE teachers. My elementary one in NJ was outstanding. My DD has ALL lousy ones...every one of them.
I could have done better than they did!

And you forgot strategy. You all teach strategy. I took PE classes until my school said, "You cannot take anymore." I graduated in '83 and I'm still mad they did not allow me to take golf in HS. I often see the retired HS golf teacher and I told DH the other day I may see if Coach Powell will finally teach me something about golf.
Thank you for being the kind of PE teacher you are.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

But that's the thing - the PE teachers didn't resolve the issue. Every 'team' class was the same old story, same old rock and roll The difference between then and now is, back then, you sucked it up (and now you spend $150 three times a week for counseling... no, not really. $5 of drugs works just as well. No, not really. You live with it. You adapt.).

I've never had the problem...

Except once, in the part where we learned about tennis and some wise-bleep kid who's parents had the good fortune to pay for his private tennis lessons thought it hysterical when I held the racket like a bat.

But I was able to recognize he was an idiot AND correct my grip all at the same time. I forget the grade.

And it was pretty funny in retrospect that I can't remember to not hold the stupid racket like a baseball bat.

We did not pick teams that day, btw.

 

[Took]

I really don't think that eliminating this ONE tradition is going to turn kids into self-indulgent wimps.

I'm all for criticism and competition, but I think that the judging should be done by those in charge -- yes, the way it is in the "real" working world. The guy who sits in the next cubicle doesn't get to decide what project you're not going to work on; your boss does. About the only career field that I can think of where open competition that comes along with verbal praise and verbal humiliation deliberately delivered in front of a group of peers is sales. I don't work in sales; never have, and never will. Getting trash-talked about every day in gym did nothing to prepare me for the working world. (Dodgeball DID leave me with two unset broken wrists, though. That's a lasting legacy.)

My feeling about the whole PE-pick tradition is that it is bad because it encourages children to publicly unleash their baser instincts, something that we normally tell them that they should not do. In the working world we normally don't get to choose who we work with; our supervisors do that. In my working world, grownups also learn to keep their personal opinions of same-level coworkers to themselves, and when we critique work within a group, we do it politely.

So yes, critique students' work, even let them critique in groups so long as everyone gets to voice an opinion. Let them compete, let them win and lose. Just don't regularly deliberately give them opportunities to publicly humiliate one another -- save that privilege for yourself.

Yes, the boss's evaluation of an empolyee is crucial, but in the 'team concept' work world nowadays, a person really needs to learn how to get along with others and to solve both professional and personal disputes. Children who are "sheltered" from any peer criticism or disappointments miss the problem-solving skills that are crucial to adult life.

As I said before, I say offer a mix of child-chosen teams and teacher-designed teams. Occasionally, we really need to let our kids work out their own issues--without adult interference.

 

[Stacerita]

But, again - does it always have to be the SAME students? Respectfully, I think a lot of posters in this thread aren't understanding how demeaning it can be, or how it can affect one's self-esteem - likely because they were seldom, if ever, among the 'leftovers'.

Sure its demeaning, but so is PE in general. You know what, I was always picked last. I wasn't athletic, I wasn't popular, but my self esteem wasn't wrapped up in when I got picked. Being picked last shouldn't be the end all for someone. I think some people just need to grow thicker skin.

 

[Bluestars]

I don't have my students pick their teams. I divide students into teams a variety of different ways. For example, counting off is one way, grouping them by squad numbers (they are in squads for warm up exercises), picking up cards that have colors on and then teams are formed by all students having the card with the same color, I pick their teams, etc). I don't have students pick teams.

Also, my students learn fitness principals and concepts, lifelong physical activity skills, communication skills, self-control, motivation, work effort, sound nutritional principals, ways to reduce stress, etc. I focus on preparing students for the realities of life as they get older. When students become frustrated with themselves or with others, I teach them how to work through their frustration and how to deal with others in a positive, respectful manner. I teach students how to win with dignity and pride and to lose with grace and resiliency. Most importantly though, I allow them an opportunity to have fun!

Do I think Physical Education is important in schools? Oh yeah, I really do! Just ask your K-6th grade child. They would agree.

You sound like a wonderful teacher. I'll bet you are making a positive impact on their lives.

 

[kaytieeldr]

Yes, the boss's evaluation of an empolyee is crucial, but in the 'team concept' work world nowadays, a person really needs to learn how to get along with others and to solve both professional and personal disputes. Children who are "sheltered" from any peer criticism or disappointments miss the problem-solving skills that are crucial to adult life.

Conversely, though, children who are never picked, or are always picked last (with even the PE teacher sometimes saying, "you take her, and you take her") don't get a whole heck of a lot of problem-solving experience, other than to go off in a corner and pretend they have no feelings.

 

[hopemax]

In sixth grade, our class used to have a "recess" where we'd go out and play baseball. It wasn't an official recess, because the sixth grade teachers had discretion on whether to do it, and most didn't.

She'd pick 2 captains, and they'd pick. I was the youngest in the class, also the shortest and a girl, so I got quite used to being picked last or near the end. I don't remember it bothering me, because I was really a pretty bad baseball player, and I knew I was good at other things.

But what I remember, is that there was one kid in the class who had learning disabilities and would leave our classroom for 3 periods a day to be in a "special class." So you could imagine how he would have felt. But he was an awesome baseball player. He was always the first person picked. He was normally a very quiet person, shoulders slumped and you could tell he was trying to be invisible. But when it was time for the baseball game you could see him perk up, smile, talk with the other kids in class, and he would remain more engaged the rest of the day. So much of a difference that I can remember the change 24 years later.

 

[cheermom1]

I think we are WAY underestimating our kids...I really think they can cope with a lot of this stuff on their own. We need to let our kids think for themselves and battle their own battles. For little things like being picked last in gym class is something that we to let our kids deal with. YES this IS a little thing in the grand sceame of life.

 

[cheermom1]

In sixth grade, our class used to have a "recess" where we'd go out and play baseball. It wasn't an official recess, because the sixth grade teachers had discretion on whether to do it, and most didn't.

She'd pick 2 captains, and they'd pick. I was the youngest in the class, also the shortest and a girl, so I got quite used to being picked last or near the end. I don't remember it bothering me, because I was really a pretty bad baseball player, and I knew I was good at other things.

But what I remember, is that there was one kid in the class who had learning disabilities and would leave our classroom for 3 periods a day to be in a "special class." So you could imagine how he would have felt. But he was an awesome baseball player. He was always the first person picked. He was normally a very quiet person, shoulders slumped and you could tell he was trying to be invisible. But when it was time for the baseball game you could see him perk up, smile, talk with the other kids in class, and he would remain more engaged the rest of the day. So much of a difference that I can remember the change 24 years later.

Good that is an awesome story!

 

[luvsJack]

I just wanted to chime in to this discussion. I teach health & PE to students K-6th grade. I value what I do and more importantly love what I teach. My students look forward to PE class with excitement and energy. I do not just roll out the ball and let my students play while I am sitting in my office (although yes there are some who do in my profession).
I plan lessons for students to improve and develop skills, increase their conditioning level, learn cooperation, team work and sportsmanship and most importantly to have fun. I have seen countless times how students improve their skills by being taught properly, given constructive or positive feedback and time to practice in a physically and emotionally safe area. I don't have my students pick their teams. I divide students into teams a variety of different ways. For example, counting off is one way, grouping them by squad numbers (they are in squads for warm up exercises), picking up cards that have colors on and then teams are formed by all students having the card with the same color, I pick their teams, etc). I don't have students pick teams.

Also, my students learn fitness principals and concepts, lifelong physical activity skills, communication skills, self-control, motivation, work effort, sound nutritional principals, ways to reduce stress, etc. I focus on preparing students for the realities of life as they get older. When students become frustrated with themselves or with others, I teach them how to work through their frustration and how to deal with others in a positive, respectful manner. I teach students how to win with dignity and pride and to lose with grace and resiliency. Most importantly though, I allow them an opportunity to have fun!

Do I think Physical Education is important in schools? Oh yeah, I really do! Just ask your K-6th grade child. They would agree.

If we could get a PE teacher like you, I would be a happy parent!

The football coach is our PE teacher right now and he couldn't be less interested. He sits in a corner of the gym while the kids play all over the gym. He doesn't handle any problems between the kids and only gets up to actually break up physical fights. The teachers are usually just glad the kids all get back in one piece.

He doesn't even split up any kind of teams in any way. At least the ones before him did have the kids learning a game of some sort (even if I didn't agree with the way they split the teams.)

 

[nuttylawprofessor]

But, again - does it always have to be the SAME students? Respectfully, I think a lot of posters in this thread aren't understanding how demeaning it can be, or how it can affect one's self-esteem - likely because they were seldom, if ever, among the 'leftovers'.

Respectfully, I don't think you understand that many of us HAVE been in those shoes. In one breath you claim that its not something you dwell on, but the rest of your posts belie this assertion. You were hurt. We get it. But it wasn't a grand conspiracy to throw your esteem in the dirt. Perhaps you should examine why it affected you so profoundly such that you're still angry and decrying it how many years later with strangers on a discussion board. The issue is far deeper than being picked last in gym class.

But the math teacher is going to help the 'always picked last' student (although, generally, academic classes aren't run like PE classes; but if they were...) As for taunting and arguing? No, it's way more subtle than that - those loudly-whispered discussions: "Ugh, he stinks, he trips over his own feet, you gotta take him"; "No way, we were stuck with him last time, it's your turn!"; "Hey, why don't we ignore him and just start playing, maybe he'll just go sit over on the bench by himself and if the teacher says anything, we can say we forgot".

I'm sorry, but I don't understand the point of your first comment. As to the other comment regarding whispers, do you think that teacher-chosen teams are going to end the whispers? They won't. And if its loud enough for the leftovers to hear, it's loud enough for the teacher to hear. Again, congratulations to the "whisperers," they can work on their calisthenics by running laps.