"Virginia moving to eliminate all accelerated math courses before 11th grade as part of equity-focused plan"

[Southernmiss]

Yea. I read the article, especially the part where
“Pyle didn't provide an immediate answer to concerns that the new model would hold kids back.”

you made the statement that you believe that kids wouldn’t hold kids back and I was curious on how you came to your conclusion.

the only reason I am very interested in this is because I have a niece and a nephew that live in Virginia and will both be entering high school within the next few years.

Here's the full paragraph you quoted some of. Read the second part of the paragraph.

1. Pyle didn't provide an immediate answer to concerns that the new model would hold kids back. It's unclear how exactly the differentiation would occur.

2.When asked for more details, Pyle said, "Differentiated instruction is designed to provide the appropriate levels of challenge and academic rigor for each student."


Looks like the plan is in the development stages and I'm sure the districts considering this will be hashing out exact details.

 

[Nabas]

It sounds like the curriculum they are moving to is more practical. Data Analysis is a huge thing in the business world and learning how to analyze data is important.
I haven’t used the majority of high school math concepts since college.

Most of what is taught in college involves concepts and information that often is not used later in life. I can't remember the last time I used Shakespeare.

Most history courses.

Most English courses.

All the sciences (unless you go into a scientific field).

Most math courses.

Decades later, I still use what I learned in my major but that was only about one-fourth of the courses that I took.

Education should teach practical information but it also should exercise the mind.

 

[jen7233]

Honestly, I don't even know of any reputable sources anymore. They are all awful.

Anyone in Virginia with some inside information on this?

Nothing has been announced officially to parents yet. I'll say it's a very likely scenario, though.

 

[Nabas]

Here's the full paragraph you quoted some of. Read the second part of the paragraph.

1. Pyle didn't provide an immediate answer to concerns that the new model would hold kids back. It's unclear how exactly the differentiation would occur.

2.When asked for more details, Pyle said, "Differentiated instruction is designed to provide the appropriate levels of challenge and academic rigor for each student."


Looks like the plan is in the development stages and I'm sure the districts considering this will be hashing out exact details.

Virginia Department Of Education's webpage states:

The Virginia Mathematics Pathways Initiative (VMPI) will:​

• Improve equity in mathematics learning opportunities
• Empower students to be active participants in a quantitative world
• Encourage students to see themselves as knowers and doers of mathematics
• Identify K-12 mathematics pathways that support future success
• Collaborate with multiple stakeholder to advance mathematics education

The VMPI will develop an initial vision for mathematics education in K-12 that will require feedback from many different stakeholders across the Commonwealth. This feedback will be critical when the Mathematics Standards of Learning revisions in 2023 reflect the goals and recommendations of this Initiative. Possible piloting of high school level mathematics courses prior to full implementation is now being considered. This Initiative will establish an innovative direction for mathematics education in Virginia that will benefit all students.​

I've got to believe they are going to take into account feedback and adjust plans.

More than another other subject, children advance in mathematics at different paces.

 

[MillauFr]

The article is complete hogwash. Thomas Jefferson High School in Fairfax County is one of the top STEM high schools in the entire country. They are not dumbing down the curriculum at all....

 

[Deb]

I’m in my 40s and in we all took the same math classes until 11th and 12th.

I'm in my 50's and we didn't.

 

[Nabas]

The article is complete hogwash. Thomas Jefferson High School in Fairfax County is one of the top STEM high schools in the entire country. They are not dumbing down the curriculum at all....

Traditional math curriculums do need to be modified in some places. (Some would say "dumbed down.") A friend living in Virginia tells me that there are high schools where most students are failing math. So there is some basis of truth in the article, even if it's (most likely) being misrepresented.

 

[BayouQueen]

The article is complete hogwash. Thomas Jefferson High School in Fairfax County is one of the top STEM high schools in the entire country. They are not dumbing down the curriculum at all....

Well, keep a close eye out, never assume anything, and adjust accordingly.

When my kids were starting their education path here in California, "whole language" was the new "thing" to teach reading, rather than using phonics. We were alarmed and put our kids in private school. "Whole language" was eventually scrapped and they went back to a phonics-based system, but not until a whole lot of California kids hadn't learned how to read well.

It's serious stuff. One does need to stay informed. Perhaps they are doing a good thing in Virginia, but it certainly bears watching.

 

[DisneyJamieCA]

Well, keep a close eye out, never assume anything, and adjust accordingly.

When my kids were starting their education path here in California, "whole language" was the new "thing" to teach reading, rather than using phonics. We were alarmed and put our kids in private school. "Whole language" was eventually scrapped and they went back to a phonics-based system, but not until a whole lot of California kids hadn't learned how to read well.

It's serious stuff. One does need to stay informed. Perhaps they are doing a good thing in Virginia, but it certainly bears watching.

Except there are already places out there doing this that they can learn from. Again, they aren’t reinventing the wheel on this one.

.

 

[DisneyJamieCA]

I'm in my 50's and we didn't.

We can all be anecdotal. I’m in my 40s and we did, up until senior year.

 

[Mrs. Ciz]

That is how it works in my kids school currently.
Advanced courses are only available to 11th and 12th graders, along with other math courses like business math and others I can't recall. My ds (12th grade) is taking pre-calc but had his choice of several courses.

I live in Virginia. When my son was in 12th grade, he took AP Calc BC (which is the second part of AP Calc). To get there, he took Algebra I in 7th grade and Geometry in 8th grade. He was VERY good at math (which he did not inherit from me - I stink at math) and would have been bored stiff stuck in a regular 7th or 8th grade math class.

I’m also a teacher (English), and as I read I saw “enrichment opportunities” and “differentiated instruction”. That means that the teacher will not be able to teach just one lesson to the class. S/he’ll have to teach special content to pull the lower students up and special content to keep the smart kids challenged and engaged. That means individualized lessons for each student, and that makes it very hard on the teacher! I predict many will quit.

I 100% believe in equality and equal access, but we can’t close our eyes to the fact that every human has different gifts. Because of this the playing field will never be totally level.

 

[NYCgrrl]

Oye vey.
In a nutshell this article is much ado about nothing

 

[Makmak]

I am in education in VA, and if you think standardized math is a bad idea we are also seeing more districts move to a “teachers cannot give a zero” policy. That’s right, if a student hands in ANYTHING it’s automatic 50%. If they don’t hand in something you must personally contact them, give a time frame for the late work, if they still don’t, then a meeting with parents, if they still don’t do it then meeting with principal, etc..... This and the new standard curriculum are all being done because there is massive pressure to achieve a 100% graduation rate. I am not kidding.

 

[kdonnel]

The current system which aims to cover material over mastery is problematic. So often the teacher pushes forward before many of the students have mastered the material.

This sounds like a switch to mastery over volume of material.

But I think the switch is occurring too late and doing it in the name of equity is ridiculous.

Learning is never going to be equitable. Some will learn faster, some will learn slower.
Pushing past the slower learners is not right, removing opportunities for the faster learners is not right.

If mastery is to be the focus it should be the focus for all grades, not just starting in high school. And there should be a commitment to the plan for a minimum of 16 years. How else would you know if it worked if you don’t have a few years of students who made it all the way through their school career with the new technique? There needs to be data to compare. But parents and voters are never willing to let the schools stick to an idea long enough to know if it helps or hurts.

 

[ksanftleben]

The whole plan and the reasoning behind it are available at the Virginia Department of Education website:

https://www.doe.virginia.gov/instruction/mathematics/vmpi/index.shtml
The stated first goal of the planned change as listed on the VADOE website is to "Improve equity in mathematics learning opportunities"

If you read the supporting documentation, you'll find that the VADOE believes that "equity" requires "detracking" because "Tracking is a form of de facto segregation as students in higher tracks have historically been predominantly White or Asian American from affluent families, whereas students in lower tracks have been primarily students of color and students who are economically disadvantaged."

 

[NYCgrrl]

The whole plan and the reasoning behind it are available at the Virginia Department of Education website:

https://www.doe.virginia.gov/instruction/mathematics/vmpi/index.shtml
The stated first goal of the planned change as listed on the VADOE website is to "Improve equity in mathematics learning opportunities"

If you read the supporting documentation, you'll find that the VADOE believes that "equity" requires "detracking" because "Tracking is a form of de facto segregation as students in higher tracks have historically been predominantly White or Asian American from affluent families, whereas students in lower tracks have been primarily students of color and students who are economically disadvantaged."

So what do you deduce is the reasoning and plan?

 

[amylevan]

So for those of you who say a similar plan is already in use in your area, how does a plan like this meet the needs of kids on either end of average? Are all students in the same math classes? From those who need repetition and drilling to instill concepts/methods to those who innately understand them because they are mathy kids?

This would have been the first year my son could have tracked up in math, since our school district starts is tracking in middle school. But due to COVID, some things had to give and that what was one of them. He gets his math aptitude from me, and we both love the problem solving challenges of math. Guess what he didn’t love? Being in a general math class reviewing concepts from last year. Yes, they were done in a deeper way but since he already understood the concepts fully, he was just bored. So much for his love of math.

I’m also not sure that equity in math education is the way we keep pace with other countries. They aren’t afraid of accelerating those who can handle it.

 

[kanerf]

Wonderful, we can all be equally dumb, while China teaches Calculus to sixth graders.

 

[DisneyOma]

I'm not really sure if I agree with it being crazy. It seems that the students capable of "higher" math will still be able to choose to take those courses in 11th and 12th grade.
If they eliminated them all together I could see it being a problem, but they aren't.

The students who are gifted in math will be bored out of their minds by 10th grade, and will not have the exposure to more complicated concepts when they get to the proposed grade for the "harder" stuff.

I am all for eliminating math wherever and whenever.

Yeah, no need for math to work on the best cures for cancer, right? Want to talk to my daughter getting her PhD in BioInformatics?

The plan will.not.hold.anyone.back.

Yes.it.will. Unless you expect teachers to teach multiple levels of math in one classroom, which is stupid.

Here's the full paragraph you quoted some of. Read the second part of the paragraph.

1. Pyle didn't provide an immediate answer to concerns that the new model would hold kids back. It's unclear how exactly the differentiation would occur.

2.When asked for more details, Pyle said, "Differentiated instruction is designed to provide the appropriate levels of challenge and academic rigor for each student."


Looks like the plan is in the development stages and I'm sure the districts considering this will be hashing out exact details.

Of course this is how they do it - come up with some wishy-washy plan (remember open classrooms? Dumbest thing ever) and then toss it at the schools to figure it out (or not). Basically, they are asking a teacher to teach remedial, regular, and honors math in one classroom at the same time. It's stupid.

Most of what is taught in college involves concepts and information that often is not used later in life. I can't remember the last time I used Shakespeare.

Most history courses.

Most English courses.

All the sciences (unless you go into a scientific field).

Most math courses.

Decades later, I still use what I learned in my major but that was only about one-fourth of the courses that I took.

Education should teach practical information but it also should exercise the mind.

'Tis torture and not mercy..." I quote Shakespeare all the time. We learn from history so we can learn from our mistakes as human beings (hopefully) and English classes maintain a standard of language that allows more efficient communication. Biology teaches about life on this planet, as does Chemistry and Physics. I agree that education should teach practical stuff too, and exercise the mind.

Traditional math curriculums do need to be modified in some places. (Some would say "dumbed down.") A friend living in Virginia tells me that there are high schools where most students are failing math. So there is some basis of truth in the article, even if it's (most likely) being misrepresented.

Then those schools need to look at who teaches, what is taught, and how, all the way back to pre-K. It's not the math curricula, per se, but the way it is taught that matters. It really needs to be hands on at an early age, and parents need to be on board, not just say "I am all for eliminating math wherever and whenever."

 

[kdonnel]

It doesn't meet the community guidelines for DISboards or I would have posted the opening scene to Idiocracy.

If you have not seen the movie, head to YouTube and search for idiocracy opening scene.

I am looking forward to the year 2505 and hope to bear witness to President Dwayne Elizondo Mountain Dew Camacho.