Villa booking rant

[UK~STU]

Its up to the reader to determine whether the villa owner deserves the benefit of the doubt or not...

Unfortunately though, the reader only has one side, your side, they do NOT know the full facts.

 

[T16GEM]

It's not that it is frowned upon at all.

Lets take this particular thread as an example.
1. The OP saw a special offer for a villa.
2. They then sent a message to the owner saying they would like to book the villa
3. The owner messages back (albeit some time later) to say that they have already taken a booking.

Now, understandably the OP is upset at missing out on the special, however the FACT is, the owner did not at anytime (as far as I'm aware) confirm the booking to the OP.

So the OP did not have a booking
The OP has not had a booking cancelled
The OP didn't even have a confirmation of a booking
The OP isn't out of pocket

The owner actually took the booking from a separate website that they also had the offer advertised on.

I think the OP was just annoyed about missing out, communications has been so quick up until that point that understandably he was upset that he now had to find another villa when it seemed this was what they were looking for. I don't believe his orginal post the OP mentioned being out of pocket. Just a general rant which we all have from time to time - part of life, it doesn't always go our way!

Yet here in this thread the owners reputation has probably been damaged, I know the owner or site hasn't been named, but it's not exactly hard to work out

What is important to one person isn't important to another. Should the reputation of a villa owner be allowed to be damaged by one unsubstantiated bad comment?

I think we are all grown up enough to understand that we all have our own minds and as you say what is important to one individual will not be important to another. I very much doubt that a 20 post thread on here is going to be remembered by people who are looking to book a villa in the future.

Forums are very powerful things and can easily sway the thoughts of it's readers and they have to be managed responsibly. A fourm owner can not allow unsubstantiated, un proven facts to be tossed around in public.

From what I can see, the OP has no proof of what they are accusing the owner of, they aren't out of pocket and they were not promised anything!

The OP hasn't accused anybody of anything, just presented the facts

On the site in question, it is stated that all transactions are explicitly between the renter and the owner. The site is just the advertising medium in the same way as advertising on TV, Radio or Newspapers.

If I came on here and said I've heard that "xyz Holiday Company" are going bust, how many people that read that would still book with that company? I think most wouldn't take the risk and would think twice, even though there is nothing to back up the claim! I would also expect the moderators to ask me for my source or remove my post.


This would be great in theory, however how can you trust the reviews?

As with this thread the OP may have left a bad review for the villa owner, yet the villa owner hasn't done anything wrong.

I have seen many really bad reviews for hotels that I have stayed in and found the hotels to be fantastic.

Think of a hotel you have stayed in and had a great time, now go and look at the reviews for that hotel on the review sites. In a lot of cases you will find bad reviews! You will see glowing reports and scathing reports for the same hotel.

People have different standards, some people book a 2 star cheap hotel and expect 5 star luxury.

Tesco Direct, Amazon, Trip Adviser, Ebay, all use a review system for the products or services that they sell, some will have good reviews, some will have bad reviews, again eople have different views on items, and it's up to the customer to decided based on what they read whether they should or shouldn't go with that particular service or offer. We all use reviews in everyday life to help influence our decisions, they are not gospel just a help.

There are ALWAYS two sides and unfortunately Forums very often only present ONE side and people get sucked into believing that one side!

Nothing derogatory has been said about anybody or any property and we are just having a discussion, on a discussion forum,

But I mention in my post the facts as they happened.

Its up to the reader to determine whether the villa owner deserves the benefit of the doubt or not...

We are all of our own mind and can make up our own minds about everything in life.

Hopefully this thread will remain open, as we are just discussing the topic. Nothing wrong with that.

 

[disney_princess_85]

Thing is I cant prove that this is what happened. It just looks like this....

Owner made no mention of anyone else interested and was really trying to get me to go for it. Looks like a previous interested party from a while back had jumped in not knowing it was on special offer now.

I guess the villa owner thought sod it, more money...

But then again, I cant prove. Maybe this other person was in contact too and emailed to book sometime between 9pm and 12pm? I dont think so though.

Specifically mentioned that the other booker was someone who was interested and then disappeared, and now has come back to book. Its only been up on special offer for 2 days so its likely they were interested at full price....

It could be a genuine mistake. I know it looks a little fishy but you never know. It's definitely possible that another potential customer got back to the owner quicker than you did.

Either way, it's just one of those things. I hope you find somewhere to stay soon.

 

[UK~STU]

It seems the Owner lists their property on a villa listing and booking site that has the facility to take INSTANT bookings, apparently this is what happened, someone made an instant booking on the other website.

As I said above, there are always 2 sides to a story and there are always people that will jump to the wrong conclusions.

Going public isn't always the answer! This is why I asked Paul and the Owner to conduct their affairs in private rather than bring the problem to the public domain on my site.

As I said above, Paul, my comments wern't aimed at you directly even though I did use this as an example.

I hope you find something suitable Paul

Regards
Stu

 

[paulfoel]

It seems the Owner lists their property on a villa listing and booking site that has the facility to take INSTANT bookings, apparently this is what happened, someone made an instant booking on the other website.

As I said above, there are always 2 sides to a story and there are always people that will jump to the wrong conclusions.

Going public isn't always the answer! This is why I asked Paul and the Owner to conduct their affairs in private rather than bring the problem to the public domain on my site.

As I said above, Paul, my comments wern't aimed at you directly even though I did use this as an example.

I hope you find something suitable Paul

Regards
Stu

In the interests of fairness, I'd better mention that the villa owner has contacted me and apologised for whats happened and explained that the other person did make an instant booking.

So, to be fair to them, I guess I've got to give them the benefit of the doubt here.

 

[buzz for boys]

Yes Paul,
I am the owner of the DIBB, I was actually trying to avoid saying that mainly because I didn't want to be seen as promoting my own site here on the DIS!

I'm Not having a go at you Paul, I just needed to explain, using this as an example, how going public with something that really should be sorted out in private just causes more problems than it resolves.

Paul,
I have a question for you !!

I have rented DIBB villas twice now and my main reason for using the DIBB as a source of finding a villa is that I believed the owners were in someway cautious of getting bad reviews on a forum so therfore less chance of getting a bad villa or a villa that doesnt exist !!
I have been lucky in that both villas have been excellent and without fauly however my peception of the way bad press would work on the dibb is unfounded !!
How do you ensure that he villas advertised do actually exist ? Or that they are of a standard that should be expected ??

I agree in your sentiments that everyone has a different view and poor feedback from a guest could be detrimental to the owner but where do you intervene and stop other users from having a poor experience?
If there are a number of complaints issued does the villa still stay on the list of available rentals ?
Like I said Im a fan of using DiBB for villa rentals and have in the past referred people to there to find a villa - I would know like to know if there are really any benefits from using DIBB or is it as unregulated as other villa rental sites ???

 

[Pegasus928]

Surley for peace of mind to exist for the consumer the forum should show ALL feedback - good and bad.
As I explained in a previous post I stopped using a particular villa site (not the DIBB may I add) purely because it was too one sided. If you had a bad experience with a villa you were expected to sort it out with the owner and leave the site out of it. If you had a good experience they had a section for you to post about it for the whole world to see. Didn't seem all that fair to me

 

[UK~STU]

I have a question for you !!

I have rented DIBB villas twice now and my main reason for using the DIBB as a source of finding a villa is that I believed the owners were in someway cautious of getting bad reviews on a forum so therfore less chance of getting a bad villa or a villa that doesnt exist !!
I have been lucky in that both villas have been excellent and without fauly however my peception of the way bad press would work on the dibb is unfounded !!
How do you ensure that he villas advertised do actually exist ? Or that they are of a standard that should be expected ??

I agree in your sentiments that everyone has a different view and poor feedback from a guest could be detrimental to the owner but where do you intervene and stop other users from having a poor experience?
If there are a number of complaints issued does the villa still stay on the list of available rentals ?
Like I said Im a fan of using DiBB for villa rentals and have in the past referred people to there to find a villa - I would know like to know if there are really any benefits from using DIBB or is it as unregulated as other villa rental sites ???

Hi,
Please keep in mind I do not want to turn this thread into a pro or anti DIBB, it's not really fair for me to discuss another forum site including my own here on the DIS.

By all means contact me privately if you need a more complete answer but I will say we have removed 2 villa owners from our advertising and we will not be renewing a 3rd which expires shortly.

1 was because they were spamming our members, in other words they were offering their villa via the PM system to members that hadn't specifically asked for a quote.

Another was because their villa was being repossessed and it wasn't fair to our members to leave them as advertisers.

The last one is because we have had a couple of complaints about the level of customer service.

First off, villas that you see on a lot of rental sites do not have any checks made on them, we take positive steps to make sure the person signing the advertising contract (and we only accept a real signed contract not an online signup) with us does actually own the Villa.

Secondly we do not always remove bad comments about villas, we do normally ask renters to sort out any problems privately with the villa owners though as we believe this is the best way to sort things out. Once something is being talked about in public and the gossips start to twist things it can be hard for both the renter and the owner to come to a resolution.

Renting a Villa from any site always involves a big element of trust from both the owner and the renter. We do allow the members to see which owners are active on the forums which does allow trust and confidence to grow. There is even a rating system shown for each owner which shows their level of activity on the site.

 

[2Tiggies]

Unfortunately though, the reader only has one side, your side, they do NOT know the full facts.

The whole point of discussion boards is to discuss. Newbies frequently have it pointed out to them that when they post a statement or a question, they have to expect a wide range of personal opinions in the response that follows. I expect to hear the bad as well as the good. I think I am capable of exercising my own judgment as to whether I feel the information on any given thread is biased and fuelled by the tone set at some point in the thread, perhaps by a strong opinion expressed by a poster. Just to be very clear, this is not an attack on you and you have not made any comments to offend me either (I have never rented a villa so I don't lean to one side or the other on this discussion). Just my take on it.

Surley for peace of mind to exist for the consumer the forum should show ALL feedback - good and bad.

This is what is important to me.

 

[skelfbsfb]

Yes Paul,
I am the owner of the DIBB, I was actually trying to avoid saying that mainly because I didn't want to be seen as promoting my own site here on the DIS!

I'm Not having a go at you Paul, I just needed to explain, using this as an example, how going public with something that really should be sorted out in private just causes more problems than it resolves.

Hi Stu as you know Ive also had issues with a member who advertises on your website. I have tried several times to rectify the many issues I had with their villa, however the owner does not want to take any responsibility. How can we sort it out if they do not want to except to use theats of solicitors letters.

 

[UK~STU]

Hi Stu as you know Ive also had issues with a member who advertises on your website. I have tried several times to rectify the many issues I had with their villa, however the owner does not want to take any responsibility. How can we sort it out if they do not want to except to use theats of solicitors letters.

Hi Wil,
Let me ask you something.
If you had seen an advert on TV, heard it on the Radio or seen an advert in a newspaper, who would you be complaining to?

The only person you can complain to is the villa owner. If you have a genuine case against the owner and the owner is unwilling to talk to you then you only have one option and that is to seek legal advice and and start proceedings against that particular owner.

You have one set of facts and the owner has a different set of facts.

How is the public going to decide if you or the owner is telling the truth! They can't

The fact that this is now being discussed in public probably isn't going to help your case.

As the site owner I have on record your complaint. Although it's no help to you, we now have a history record should other problems occur with that particular owner.

I can tell you that we have not had any bad reports other than yours for that owner.

Whilst you do have my sympathy, I really do think discussing this in public is a bad idea. You should resolve your complaint through proper legal channels.

Remember the DIBB isn't a Villa advertising site, the DIBB is a UK Based Disney and Orlando holiday planning site that just happens to run some adverts from various companies including villa owners.

 

[skelfbsfb]

Hi Wil,
Let me ask you something.
If you had seen an advert on TV, heard it on the Radio or seen an advert in a newspaper, who would you be complaining to?

The only person you can complain to is the villa owner. If you have a genuine case against the owner and the owner is unwilling to talk to you then you only have one option and that is to seek legal advice and and start proceedings against that particular owner.

Im awaiting on their letter from their solicitor for the slanderous remarks which they claim Ive made on the thread and also for any loss of earnings they claim my thread may cause. Once this comes I can take it forward.

You have one set of facts and the owner has a different set of facts.

How is the public going to decide if you or the owner is telling the truth! They can't

Thay cant but they can make their own mind up as they will see I have been honest in all Ive written

The fact that this is now being discussed in public probably isn't going to help your case.


That maybe the case but if it prevents others from getting their holiday ruined then it has done some good. remember we pay a lot of money to rent villas.

As the site owner I have on record your complaint. Although it's no help to you, we now have a history record should other problems occur with that particular owner.

I can tell you that we have not had any bad reports other than yours for that owner.

Whilst you do have my sympathy, I really do think discussing this in public is a bad idea. You should resolve your complaint through proper legal channels.

Remember the DIBB isn't a Villa advertising site, the DIBB is a UK Based Disney and Orlando holiday planning site that just happens to run some adverts from various companies including villa owners.

And its a very good site which I have participated on a regular basis and hope to continue to participate. I have also been given great advice through the years that is why I booked the villa as I thought I could trust the person as he was an active member.

 

[UK~STU]

Im awaiting on their letter from their solicitor for the slanderous remarks which they claim Ive made on the thread and also for any loss of earnings they claim my thread may cause. Once this comes I can take it forward.

Hi Wil,
reading what you posted in the other thread, it is my opinion that you wont receive anything from their solicitor, i would guess that that was just a knee jerk reaction after seeing your public post about them.

 

[NicolaUK]

To the OP, I really do feel your pain, we've rented loads of villas over the years and only ever really had two problems. The first, like yours, took our booking AND a deposit and cancelled on us two weeks later with excuses of 'my business partner took a booking for someone else' - we did get the deposit back but I was pretty annoyed.

The second was a few days before Christmas a couple of years ago, we get in quite late at night to the villa to find no water/power as the owner hadn't paid the bills, now that was a fun lead up to Christmas.

Remember the DIBB isn't a Villa advertising site, the DIBB is a UK Based Disney and Orlando holiday planning site that just happens to run some adverts from various companies including villa owners.

To be fair, if you're prepared to take advertising money from whoever to present to the general public, you have a duty of care to at least step in and remediate if something goes wrong and the advertiser's stonewalling the complainant.

In reference to the no water/power problem I mentioned above, I had excuse after excuse after excuse from the owner and it wasn't until a 3rd party, the site owner the villa was advertised on, stepped in did I get anywhere with the complaint which was eventually settled to my satisfaction.

 

[Head_in_the_clouds]

To the OP, I really do feel your pain, we've rented loads of villas over the years and only ever really had two problems. The first, like yours, took our booking AND a deposit and cancelled on us two weeks later with excuses of 'my business partner took a booking for someone else' - we did get the deposit back but I was pretty annoyed.

The second was a few days before Christmas a couple of years ago, we get in quite late at night to the villa to find no water/power as the owner hadn't paid the bills, now that was a fun lead up to Christmas.



To be fair, if you're prepared to take advertising money from whoever to present to the general public, you have a duty of care to at least step in and remediate if something goes wrong and the advertiser's stonewalling the complainant.

In reference to the no water/power problem I mentioned above, I had excuse after excuse after excuse from the owner and it wasn't until a 3rd party, the site owner the villa was advertised on, stepped in did I get anywhere with the complaint which was eventually settled to my satisfaction.

Nicola, to the DIS!

I really agree with the above !

Also, I have no doubt that Stu is doing a heck of a lot to try and make sure his site is running well so that there are no problems and if people are willing to break forum rules etc, it isn't really his fault. However, I really do think that it is a good idea for forums that advertise villas (and ANYTHING really) to take some responsibility too to try and resolve situations. I think it is just a shame it has all come to this, it shouldn't have had to.

 

[UK~STU]

Hi,
I am going to step down from this thread as i can't really defend my position without showing examples of the policies we have and the great lengths we do and have taken to support our members.

I really dont want to promote my site here as its not fair on the DIS.

I will be happy to reply to PM's If anyone has any concerns.

Thank you for your time, lets get back to what we enjoy, Disney and Holiday planning.

Regards
Stu

 

[skelfbsfb]

Hi Wil,
reading what you posted in the other thread, it is my opinion that you wont receive anything from their solicitor, i would guess that that was just a knee jerk reaction after seeing your public post about them.

The annoying thing for me was that, If I never made them aware of these issues then the owner was wasting their moneypaying for a service they were not getting. I was not looking for a full refund but for them to say sorry and here was refund of £xxx for the inconvienece caused to you. All that I got was a threatening email and them saying the matter was closed as far as they are concerned. When I first contacted them the first thing the owner said well these have not been reported before who can I charge for these. Then when I get home she emailed me asking if I knew how these issues happened. Now if someone was renting from me and they made a complaint I would mark this against their booking so that I knew it was them who reported issues. As you also know they have seen the thread in question but have not made any reply to anything I have said.

 

[skelfbsfb]

Hi,
I am going to step down from this thread as i can't really defend my position without showing examples of the policies we have and the great lengths we do and have taken to support our members.

I really dont want to promote my site here as its not fair on the DIS.

I will be happy to reply to PM's If anyone has any concerns.

Thank you for your time, lets get back to what we enjoy, Disney and Holiday planning.

Regards
Stu

Stu we appreciate you taking the time to explain your position, thats what this and you site is about, helping each other to get the best out of holidaying at our favourite place Disney, but its also about letting others know when things go wrong so that it helps prevent others from experiencing the same.

 

[NicolaUK]

Nicola, to the DIS!

I really agree with the above !

Also, I have no doubt that Stu is doing a heck of a lot to try and make sure his site is running well so that there are no problems and if people are willing to break forum rules etc, it isn't really his fault. However, I really do think that it is a good idea for forums that advertise villas (and ANYTHING really) to take some responsibility too to try and resolve situations. I think it is just a shame it has all come to this, it shouldn't have had to.

Thanks for the welcome but I can't pretend to be a total newbie, I'm just a professional lurker

The annoying thing for me was that, If I never made them aware of these issues then the owner was wasting their moneypaying for a service they were not getting. I was not looking for a full refund but for them to say sorry and here was refund of £xxx for the inconvienece caused to you. All that I got was a threatening email and them saying the matter was closed as far as they are concerned. When I first contacted them the first thing the owner said well these have not been reported before who can I charge for these. Then when I get home she emailed me asking if I knew how these issues happened. Now if someone was renting from me and they made a complaint I would mark this against their booking so that I knew it was them who reported issues. As you also know they have seen the thread in question but have not made any reply to anything I have said.

From what you've posted I can't see you've done anything wrong, if your accounts have been honest then there is no justification for any sort of threats to be made against you.

I really do hope you get it resolved, until you've been in the middle of something like this it's difficult to understand just how upsetting and then infuriating it can become, you have my sympathies.

 

[FloFlo71]

Nicola, to the DIS!

I really agree with the above !

Also, I have no doubt that Stu is doing a heck of a lot to try and make sure his site is running well so that there are no problems and if people are willing to break forum rules etc, it isn't really his fault. However, I really do think that it is a good idea for forums that advertise villas (and ANYTHING really) to take some responsibility too to try and resolve situations. I think it is just a shame it has all come to this, it shouldn't have had to.

And as much as I love the Dibb I agree with the post above, the reason people want their adverts on theDibb is because they know that people trust the dibb and have a great deal of respect for the site. When things go wrong then the Dibb need to apply a little pressure to the villa owner to put things right.

I also think that people should be able to post good and bad reviews of villas they have stayed in, only allowing good comments is a little unfair. Its ok to say sort it out between themselves but if it isn't sorted out then no future customers are warned at all that there are problems. I think it would be far more honest if people could post about a problem and then say how it was resolved rather than it never being posted it all. I doubt anyone would have thought any the less of an owner who had a problem but sorted it out promptly.