Very disappointed withe the kid's programming

[piratejacksmom]

If your child is old enough to follow directions and wear a watch, you really don't need to worry about the kids club IF YOU COMMUNICATE WITH YOUR CHILD AND KNOW WHERE THEY ARE. I can't imagine going to dinner without first communicating with my child whether they were to meet me for dinner or eat with the club. We just returned form the Magic and I had kids in 3 age groups. My 9 year old had sign out priviliges, but never used them. She liked it when we picked her up. My 11 year old wore a watch and we told her when to sign out and where to meet us. She followed directions and we had absolutely no problems. My 11 year old loved the club and made lasting friendships, my 9 year old loved the club, but didn't go as much beacuse she is a little shy and sometimes uncomfortable around people she doesn't know. She loved her time there, though. My son, age 5, loved the club and the activities and spent a few hours a day (off and on) there. None of my kids ate meals with the club, we arranged to pick them up or meet them at mealtimes. I kept 3 differents kids activities and locations straight by carrying a daily list of where they were. I checked on them often enough to be sure they were happy, but not so often that they didn't have a chance to do the activity. I loved the program! We were never paged for any reason and the kids had a blast. Almost all of the cast members were wonderful and my kids loved playing with them!! Don't expect the kids to stay in all day long. A couple of hours a day is enough for them to enjoy it and for you to enjoy a family vacation!!

 

[Buschfan]

Anyone else see that the most common complaint about DCL is their children's program? I did see where Matt Ouimet did say in his chat last week that 20 new programs were being introduced soon. This may help the situation. Maybe DCL's one size fits all program will be changed. Not all children's (or adults for that matter) personalities are the same and there needs to be a choice of activites at each of the age groups. Some kids are happy to be on their own, while some need more structure.

I feel one reason for all of the complaints is that DCL creates an environment where children have to use the club. In our case, my child was denied use of the club for over half our cruise. Seems like they keep track of pages and will eject children of the parents who have been paged 3 times (we counted 2). They will also not be allowed back the rest of the day after each page. This is something you won't find in the brochure or hear discussed in the orientation onboard. It is just too 'un-Mickey' like to be mentioned I guess. You will be told in orientation that everyone will have a great time and the pager is for your convienence and not for the overworked counselors who will page you if your child needs any kind of extra attention they are not able to provide as a result. The program treated our children as a number compared to the more personal program on NCL. The pagers were a way for the counselors to more manage the number of children they had to deal with. They aren't tipped, so why should they care to try to go out if their way to spend extra time with your children should they need it. It was the feeling we got anyway.

Disney does not really create a kid-friendly ship at night. I really can't put blame on dmdeitz for his actions. Children are not permitted in Palos and if your children doesn't fit into DCL's one size fit all program, you really have few places to go as a family. I don't know of any other line that has this strict policy for their alternative dining or clubs for that matter. I think that is why you see a high approval rating among adults without children on DCL. DCL has zero tolerance for children in the evenings in many of their public areas. Sorry, but the sight of a child with their parents in the evening is not going to make me uptight. I can understand about children running loose without their parents disturbing others, but Disney takes their no children areas too far compared to the other lines. It is like they are desperately trying to make their ships attractive for adults who don't want to be in the company of children very much.

That is why the other cruise lines fit our style more. We do not have anything that restricts us as where we can and can't go as a family. I will say the ESPN club was the most kid friendly club on the ship though! DCL is not as family oriented as their advertising leads you to believe.

We have been on NCL and found their ships to be more family friendly. Never did I feel the need to write a letter to their main office after any of our 4 NCL cruises like I did with DCL. In fact, I continue to write them as their response has been very underwhelming. I can only resort to writing about our experience on various sites and let others know what they might encounter as Celebration could care less after they have your money. Anyway, they are not a premium line worthy of a premium price in our opinion.

 

[ckr]

First, I respectfully disagree with you, Buschfan. I think DCL is EXCEPTIONAL for alternatives to the kid's clubs! Have you really been on another cruise line that offers a family night club? Or family game shows? A family casino? Evening programs in the theatre that is G-rated? If so, please let me know which one for our experience has been quite the opposite!

IMO, Disney should not try to offer customized kids programs. I think they are doing a great job of providing both free and structured time. However, parents need to be aware of their children's preferences and schedule their (perhaps brief) adult time accordingly. I would fear that adding additional programming for the same age groups would lead to even MORE decisions for kids to have to make. For those that are happy in either type of activity, they would now need to choose between multiple kids activities on top of the other non-club activities. I think it just becomes more stressful over all. Plus, I liked knowing that I could pull out the Navigator (we also kept it with us at all times) and know where DDs age group was. If there were differing activities, how would you know which one your child was in and where to go to check on them? I hope the changes Matt was talking about was for adding new activities (especially with so many returning kid cruisers) rather than to offer additional concurrent activities.

And as far as Palo's -- that is a totally OPTIONAL event. If your kids don't like the clubs and want to be with you, don't do Palo's. That's simple. We found the other dining choices to be very kid friendly.

As for 8 year olds checking in/out, we, too, were offered that option. It was presented to us more as an exception that they allowed if parents wanted rather than the default which you had to insist your child wasn't allowed to have. Actually, we were surprised they would even allow it. These are ELEMENTARY SCHOOL aged children we're talking about. We definitely declined. Not because DD isn't prepared, but because we know she is only 8 and has ABSOLUTELY no business being unsupervised on a floating city.

As for the pagers, one thing we learned was that they are not really used for custom messages. Ours simply stated that "Your child has requested to be picked up from the Oceaneer's Club" or something to that affect. So, I'm not sure whether they are alpha pagers that can only send generic pre-coded messages, or whether they really could page you with details about where your child was headed once they checked themselves out. Perhaps someone can provide better info about the pagers and how they are used.

For our 4-5 pages, it always said the same thing. And half of those times our DD age 3 only wanted to see us to say she was having fun. She didn't really want to leave at all. But for me it was comforting to know that they would page us whenever DD asked for us. Was it awful timing when we had just entered the Rain Forest Room and had to get dressed to go see what she wanted? Sure, but that's not Disney's fault for 'paging us for every little thing'. She's OUR DD and OUR responsibility -- even on vacation.

Knowing that she was happy whether with us or with the clubs is SO much more important than Palo's chocolate souffle, or the dueling pianos, or the 70's Party at Wave Bands. Were we disappointed that we missed out on some fun due to the dreaded pager? Sure! Would we have it any other way? Not on your life!! JMO.

 

[Buschfan]

We had late seating and I didn't see any of the activities you mentioned after dinner. Maybe you have to be in early-seating to make it to the family activities you mention. The shows on NCL are not offensive. No skimpy Las Vegas like costumes or anything. I had no problem taking my children to them. I don't have any interest in a casino, so that is not a factor either. I did like the fact that we didn't have to walk through a smoke-filled casino on Disney to get to another part of the ship. Disney does have it's strong points. They have the best designed ships in the industry, it just that they almost try too hard to please people who don't want to be around children.

 

[Tarasmom]

I just wanted to add my 2 cents about the kids programming. I really think that all of this depends on the child's personality, mood, past experiences, etc... There is no way to pigeon hole children, no matter what. My DD3 is very social and totally loves going to her preK program and play groups. She is outgoing and I thought for sure that she would love the club and I was actually concerned that I might be lonely without her.
That is not what happened on our 3 day 12/13-16...first off, we met another wonderful single mom and her DS3. The two children quickly became inseperable. Because, the other boy was slightly shy, my DD decided to be like that as well. She also ended up with a bit of a cold. Because of these factors, she did not like the club at all. I was very surprised, but am sure that it was due to the influence of her new found friend. I didn't mind at all though. They went to the club for a short while so us moms could shop in Nassau and then for about an hour so that I could snorkel at Castaway Cay. Other than that, we all had a WONDERful time together! The CM's seemed great and the programming seemed like fun, but my DD chose not to participate. As I said before, I was very flexible about it and not disappointed at all, just surprised. There are many factors that play into all of it. I think that Disney does a spectacular job for kids and adults, but they won't ever be able to please everybody all of the time....can anyone really do that?? It is all personal preference and influenced by many things.....JUST MY OPINION!!!!

 

[ckr]

Buschfan: We've not been on NCL. On DCL, we also had late seating. The activities mentioned were BEFORE dinner. DH and DD age 8 were able to play in (and won!) Mickey Mania, there was bingo, the shows, photo ops, etc. all before late seating. We did not expect there to be much in the way of scheduled family activities at 10pm (after dinner).

We were actually a bit bummed when the party on Nassau night featured the characters and was so family friendly, yet we had checked the girls into the clubs that night. I went down to get them, but DD age 8 especially was having so much fun doing the macarana and the YMCA on the stage of Studio Seas with her new friends, I couldn't bear to make her come up on deck even knowing she'd have loved it. So DH and I did the deck party alone, until DD age 3 paged us that she was ready to go to bed. We took her back to the cabin, tucked her in had to wait up until midnight for DD age 8 to page us from her club! Great night!

Again, I don't think the kids programs are broke or need to be segregated by activity type. I think DCL does a great job in providing a good balance. JMO.

 

[Buschfan]

Well, I must of overlooked the programs before dinner. I only knew about the shows.. Family programs after 10 should be available. If my children don't have to go to school, why can't they stay up and accompany us in a club? It is ok with the other lines. Why not Disney? Is some of their entertainment risque in the evenings? We never had a chance to see it except for one-night when a great poster from here (DVCNuts) was picked from the audience. Actually make that twice, I walked down to Rocking-D bar one night by myself while my wife watched my youngest son in our stateroom. They had a great band there. Just wish my wife and son could of been with me. I didn't see or hear any material that would keep me from wanting to bring my children there. This is all part of the great 'family experience' that we encountered on DCL. The midnight comedy even on NCL was not R-rated.

 

[jojomg]

I did not let my daughter wander the ship! I was told I would be paged if she was leaving. If I had any doubt of their system I never would have signed her up to be in their care anyway.I had no idea that it was run so poorly, again I would never have let her sign herself out If they hadn't told me that I would be paged . how can they just let kids go without letting the parents know they are leaving how can they find you,I don't think any child under 13 should have the option of wandering around the ship.

 

[dmdeitz]

First, Buschfan - I am in awe of your letter! You write so elequently (I can barely spell it!). It's really upsetting that so much pro and con can be written about Disney and their kid's program. Call me brainwashed, a fanatic, or whatever. But I figure Disney is the best in whatever they do. It's just hard to accept to see that isn't the case.

And Tarasmom - you are right - it really depends on the kids, their personallity and perception about what they and their folks want to get out of the program. No company - Disney or otherwise, can please all the people all the time. I think my comments on page 1 talk about a woman that wanted to be escorted to her room and complained about the food. I wound't want to be escorted to our room because I wanted to hit the buffet since the food for me was great!

One person mentioned that their kids loved hacking on the computer. Mine do too. But my thinking is to do something different on vacation. We have all the Disney games at home and all the Disney DVDs. My kids, as much as any other, given the chance, love to veg out in front of the big screen or help Tarzan on a computer game. When we go on vacation, we want new and exciting things for them and us. But given the chance, they really want to be drawn into an exciting program. Mr. Oiumet might be promising more programs. A little too late?! We are booking a RC cruise for next November. And a few friends in town that were waiting to hear our report are doing the same (there is a teacher convention at the start of November up here and it's a great time to get away). As a Disney Shareholder, I don't like that, but as a father with kids, I NEED to provide them the best experience I can. As much as my wife and I spoke to different castmembers on and off the ship about this (want some phone numbers / names to voice your opinion?), I don't feel they are responsive enough. And the amount of posts that agree with me on just this one thread is disheartening.

I have yet to understand why they have 1/2 hour gaps between some programs and then the 15 miinutes before and after for roll call, and if the lab / club are staffed all the time, let those kids that want to just hang out, do that. And those that want more, can be in the groups. On our cruise, the most attended event was bingo, with the smoke and gambling that comes with it. That really isn;'t a place to bring the kids, but there were loads of them there - mine included. Where the others there to learn about gambling? Or just didn't want to be in the club / lab and were in tow with their folks?

On one other point about the kids programs - Take a look at the navigators for each group. It is a rare event when you can drop both kids off at the same time for the lone event of the morning , afternoon or evening. It seemed that everythign for the 8 and 5 year olds was off by 1/2 hour. So the rare times we could get them into the true 'activity'. we wound up runing back and forth to deck 5 - drop one off at 10, then leave then back again at 10:30 to drop the other one off. Then back 1/2 hr - 45 min later to get the first child, then back again 1/2 hour later for the second. I did get my excersize on the ship doing that.

 

[Buschfan]

Thanks dmdeitz... I love to cruise , but can't say I am a Disney fanatic. Haven't been to one of their parks in years. We feel Anheuser Busch's and Universal's parks are a better value. Not going to be a popular opinion here, but it is true. We booked DCL because of a good Florida resident rate. I just love to cruise with our children and Disney is not my idea of a good family cruise. The obsession with the segregation of the public areas is just too bizarre for us.

dmeitz - have you received any kind of response out of Celebration? I did use one of your e-mail addresses the other day from a previous post though... Thanks. I am not going to ask where you got it, but I am impressed. Anyway, I was met with lots of form letters and finally gave up and called direct. The form letters kept telling me to please sail with them again. It aggravated me to no end! Finally, got a hold of a real person in Celebration after a few phone calls. They basically said sorry, but we already have your child's fare and too bad about your experience, please book one of our overpriced cruises again. No certificate for a discount on a future cruise or onboard credit or anything. Just a package of items my son would of received had he been allowed in the program for the duration of our cruise. I followed up by asking straight out for a day pass for my family to visit a Disney park through planetfeedback.com. Must of been out-of-line with that, as the folks in Celebration said they couldn't possibly do that. Tell me what the real cost of something like that would of been... Heck, I was willing to pay for parking. I made the mistake of not getting our problem taken care of on our cruise and trying to find a supervisor of the children's program while onboard. I was relying on the Celebration folks to make things right for us. What a mistake! They will never sucker anymore money out of me though.

 

[ckr]

I am really surprised that other cruise lines allow children under 18 into their bars. On Carnival, we couldn't even walk that area of the ship with our kids. Nor could we go into/through the casino. NCL must be very different.

That being said, I do not think I would want children/teens under 18 in the bars. I think it is wonderful that DCL has Studio Seas/Beat Street for families who do want to experience a night club together, but would NOT want to see the rest of the clubs open to kids.

As we have seen many posts about Parents not attending to their children in the pool areas, can you just imagine if these same parents were allowed to drag their sleepy cranky kids to the clubs until 2am!! No Thanks!! (Not that any of OUR kids would be like that or that any of US would do that, but who is going to enforce the "Kids allowed as long as they're not cranky" rule?) I'll wait until my kids are older or find a time when they want to be in the clubs or bring along a babysitter to ENJOY the adult only areas of the ship.

JMO, but if you took a poll, I do not think I'd be alone.

 

[Buschfan]

I have heard that children are not permitted in the discos on Carnival. That is the only thing I have read on other boards.I know they aren't allowed on NCLs after midnight. We don't want to take our children to a disco anyway no matter what the time. I will add that RCI/Celebrity is similar to NCL in that there are no adult only clubs and childrencan dine with their parents in the alternative restaurants. We checked before we booked our Celebrity cruise for next month. The kids program on Celebrity may not be the best, but at least we won't be trapped in our stateroom in the evenings if our children don't participate in the program.

 

[legs22]

As a single parent I think it is really great that DCL provides 'adult only' areas. It gives me some much needed kid-free time to relax and have some fun. I don't want to listen to someone elses kids when my kid is in the club.

 

[skeegan]

Everyone asking for all these changes concerns me, on our 7 day trip this summer, we thought it was the best vacation we ever had. I sure hope they don't change the kids programs very much, if at all, because my 6 and 12 years olds loved it.

 

[Buschfan]

Well, the kid's program doesn't appear to appeal to every child (or their parent's) in it's current form as past posts mention. My 9 yr old loved it, but our 4 year old couldn't handle the highly regimented program of his age group. DCL needs to offer more choices to children with different interests or open up more of their adult areas only areas to accomodate the families of children who are not in the clubs if they truly feel their program is perfect. There are different clubs for adults, why not have the same consideration for children? That way children will have fun and their parents will be happy having a choice of say a small group environment or a large one. One that is highly structured and one that is not. Parents know their children well enough to sign them up for the program that best suits their child's needs. I don't think this idea is that radical.

 

[skeegan]

Buschfan,

Did you go to Studio Sea? We did that a few times. Families could go there together, as it was not adult only. There were dances and quiz shows. There was also the game rooms, both the board game room/library and the arcade. There was ESPN club, the movie theater, in addition to the wonderful nightly program in the main theater. We would go play ping pong when the wind wasn't too bad. Actually we ran out of time to do everything on the 7 night cruise and never went to the adult clubs. We were out most nights until well after Midnight.

I just don't understand how much more variety you can expect. The ship had more than most kids programs at resorts we have been to in Hawaii, Aruba, and the US Virgin Islands.

What specifically are you looking for?

Susan

 

[Buschfan]

I truly did not see any family activities in Studio Sea. I remember that none of this activity was available to those with late-seating. Did I overlook it? I will be the first to admit when I am wrong. We dressed to see a show after a port visit and went to dinner afterwards. After dinner, we didn't see any family programs scheduled. I already did mention that the ESPN club was a great place for families. I still have my ESPN mug on my mantle to this day! Yes, DCL has a movie theater and I applaud them for having one, but the movies shown in the evening were too mature for younger children. Gone in 60 Seconds was shown during our cruise and that is rated PG-13.

 

[ChiTownZee]

Well, the kid's program doesn't appear to appeal to every child (or their parent's) in it's current form as past posts mention.

I've never run a cruise ship or created children's programs, but my guess is that it would NOT be possible to create a program that appeals to EVERY child and parent. I think that is too much to ask, even of Disney! LOL

 

[Buschfan]

Ok... if the thinking is DCL cannot possibly or is not willing to create more options to their children's program for the benefit of some, DCL should look into opening up more common areas in the evenings to families with children who do not 'fit in'. That is my whole point with all of this. I am on the side of the posters who think the program is 'broken'. At the time we had a bad experience with the program over a year ago, I really thought our experience was isolated. Posts from other families sharing negative details about the program has changed my mind in regards to this as our negative opinion of the program is shared by others. It may be difficult for some to digest that the program Disney hypes the most in it's marketing is 'broken'. I believe it is, based on our personal experience.

 

[skeegan]

Buschfan,

We were late seating also. In the navigator the programs at Studio Sea were listed as starting before we got out of the late dinner seating, so you would not have known about them from it. I had seen it on the promotional video, so I went looking for it. Since they started early we were never able to be the contestant in the quiz shows, but we did join the audience and watch them. They would usually last for about an hour or more from the time we got there after our dinner was over. After the show they would usually have general music where the kids and parents could dance. I think it closed around midnight, but I'm not sure about that. We only went there two or three nights after dinner.

Susan