Vent about "service" dog at WDW

[dclfun]

I just wanted to mention that while they *can* ask for certification ID, and I agree that most of us would be glad to provide it, this can hurt those guests who trained their own SD's by setting up a precedent for CM's to think it's required when it isn't. Some people train their own SD's because there are long waiting lists for legitimate training programs, others do it because they would like to raise the dog from puppyhood or perhaps they have other dogs in their households, and this is not allowed by several programs ( the SD must be the only dog). Some programs charge a fee which is expensive, and agencies that certify OTSD's ( owner-trained service dogs) always charge a fee which many cannot afford. Disney is in a real bind, as are other places of business. They don't want to offend a guest or challenge a guest, legally they can't ask for proof, and there are many invisible disabilities for which a trained SD could mitigate the disability. More and more people are using medical alert dogs, hearing dogs and autism dogs, for instance. Long gone are the days when the only SD's you'd see were German Shepherds guiding the visually impaired. So if they can't tell *why* someone has a dog by looking at the guest and seeing an obvious disability, then it gets touchy to ask someone those three allowable questions. I understand this difficulty, but still, they *need* to get comfortable asking those allowable questions, and comfortable in challenging a questionable situation, or asking a guest with a disruptive, ill-behaved dog to remove that dog from their parks and resorts.---Kathy and Skye

 

[SueM in MN]

Are you guys absolutely sure they're not allowed to ask for some type of identification that states that it is a trained certified service dog?

Yes, I am.
The ADA says that businesses are not allowed to require certification or proof.

Not Sue but here's clarification:
An Emotional Support Dog, because it does not meet the ADA definition of a service animal, is not a service dog and, as such, does not enjoy the legal protection required for public access.

Clarification:
A business may ask only 3 questions:
1. Are you disabled? (yes/no)
2. Is this a service animal? (yes/no)
3. What task(s) has the dog been trained to do to mitigate the disability?

Anyone asking for proof of service dog status is crossing the legal line.

Here is a link to an ADA Service Dog Brief for businesses that mentions the questions that may be asked.
(It used to actually list the questions as videogal listed them, but the questions are now covered in the text.)

It is my understanding they CAN ask for ID. I don't think it's illegal to ask for ID to prove that it is a service dog. I understand they can't ask for proof of a disability, but we were told when we went through training class that public places CAN ask for proof...that's why we have our ID. I could be wrong on this issue, but I believe they can ask and SHOULD, in my opinion, especially at a place like Disney.

If you do a search of the ADA website at www.ada.gov, you can see some reports of cases where people were asked for ID/proof that their animal was a SD and the place that asked lost the case.
Here is a link to another summary about service dogs and businesses from the ADA website.These are quotes from the business summary:
"2. Q: What is a service animal?

A: The ADA defines a service animal as any guide dog, signal dog, or other animal individually trained to provide assistance to an individual with a disability. If they meet this definition, animals are considered service animals under the ADA regardless of whether they have been licensed or certified by a state or local government.

3. Q: How can I tell if an animal is really a service animal and not just a pet?

A: Some, but not all, service animals wear special collars and harnesses. Some, but not all, are licensed or certified and have identification papers. If you are not certain that an animal is a service animal, you may ask the person who has the animal if it is a service animal required because of a disability. However, an individual who is going to a restaurant or theater is not likely to be carrying documentation of his or her medical condition or disability. Therefore, such documentation generally may not be required as a condition for providing service to an individual accompanied by a service animal. Although a number of states have programs to certify service animals, you may not insist on proof of state certification before permitting the service animal to accompany the person with a disability."

I know that some states do have laws that say a SD must be trained by a recognized SD training agency and must be certified (Minnesota, where we live, actually is one of the states that has a law like that). Requiring that puts the state out of compliance with the ADA and if anyone wanted to fight that in Minnesota, the state would lose.

Anyone who goes through Guiding Eyes for the Blind for a guide dog is issued a card with a pic of the dog and "user" stating that it's a service animal used to guide a visually impaired person. We've been asked for it at airports and at Disney, and the reason given to us has always been a "just making sure, people have gone as far as borrowing or stealing harnesses as "proof" or made phony certificates or even made fake blankets trying to pass off a pet as a service dog to avoid fees or just to take their dog with them" Personally I don't mind showing ID, I think its a good idea, but maybe they need to regulate what is "proof'' and whats not.

Unfortunately, there are places online you can go and PURCHASE certification that states that your dog is a service dog. That's sad, but true. Some people are always looking for ways to cheat the system.

Which is one of the reasons that certification is not required. It's probably as likely or even more likely that someone with a 'fake' SD will have certification cards or documents.

On another note, with service dogs the handler does not have to have a disability. Our oldest DD has a service dog and her dad and I are the handlers. She is not able to handle the dog independently, so we function as a team. We still have the same privileges as other people with service dogs. But, one main requirement is that we are a TEAM...thus our DD can't take the dog somewhere without us (like school) and we (her dad and I) can't take the dog out without our DD. We are very new to the service dog "thing" as we've only had our dog for about 2 months. Most of the responses we have received are very positive. It's somewhat funny because we live in a fairly small town. My oldest DD is one of two in her school in a wheelchair...so everybody knows her. Now, she has a service dog so she is getting very well-known outside of school, too!

There is no requirement in the ADA that the handler of the SD must be disabled. In many cases, the handler is the person with a disability, but there are cases where the SD is performing services for the person with a disability, but the person with a disability is not able to handle the SD independently. That still meets to definition of service animal from the ADA listed above.

One of the things businesses NEED to be aware of are these points from the business summary about service dogs and businesses from the ADA website.
"10. Q: What if a service animal barks or growls at other people, or otherwise acts out of control?

A: You may exclude any animal, including a service animal, from your facility when that animal's behavior poses a direct threat to the health or safety of others. For example, any service animal that displays vicious behavior towards other guests or customers may be excluded. You may not make assumptions, however, about how a particular animal is likely to behave based on your past experience with other animals. Each situation must be considered individually.

Although a public accommodation may exclude any service animal that is out of control, it should give the individual with a disability who uses the service animal the option of continuing to enjoy its goods and services without having the service animal on the premises.

11. Q: Can I exclude an animal that doesn't really seem dangerous but is disruptive to my business?

A: There may be a few circumstances when a public accommodation is not required to accommodate a service animal--that is, when doing so would result in a fundamental alteration to the nature of the business. Generally, this is not likely to occur in restaurants, hotels, retail stores, theaters, concert halls, and sports facilities. But when it does, for example, when a dog barks during a movie, the animal can be excluded."

If staff were trained to do these things, many of the 'fake' SDs would be removed because they would not be under control.

 

[LockShockBarrel]

This whole thing is so confusing sometimes! I know I'll probably get reamed out for this one but I really think that requiring proof for some of this stuff is a GOOD thing! So many people nowadays have such a "me first screw you" attitude, the rules don't apply to them and all that business. It's not fair to people who have legitimate issues when people cheat the system, renting wheelchairs when they don't need them, faking reasons for needing an SD, taking advantage of things that were put into place to give people with disabilities or what have you equal footing.

I find it so frustrating, part of me saying "take the high road" and the other saying "well no one seems to care if anything is really wrong anyway so cheat your way through". When we stand that handicap line, knowing we're in the right while we get mad at the cheaters, who's winning?

I also think this whole political correctness is way out of hand. When did it get to be that you're not handicap, you're differently abled, or you're not blind but visually impaired? In some cases I get it but it's gotten to the point where it's easier not to question someone who may be cheating or faking something because they'll probably wig out and try to sue because you're "discriminating''.

Let me also say that I don't think certain things are as serious as people make the out to be. I have ADHD, clinical depression, type 2 diabetes, insomnia and some recent fainting issues that's in the process of being diagnosed, and not to be all high and mighty but I don't walk around using those issues as a crutch and demanding special treatment. I really think people need to learn to make do, or use coping mechanisms rather than instantly playing the "medical issues" card.

So now as I step off my Disney themed soapbox, let me remind you this is all just my opinion, my frustrations, and by no means am I including any of you in these vents nor am I saying that every single person does this stuff. I expect someone to rant back at me, so bring it on!

 

[lunapnp]

This whole thing is so confusing sometimes! I know I'll probably get reamed out for this one but I really think that requiring proof for some of this stuff is a GOOD thing! So many people nowadays have such a "me first screw you" attitude, the rules don't apply to them and all that business. It's not fair to people who have legitimate issues when people cheat the system, renting wheelchairs when they don't need them, faking reasons for needing an SD, taking advantage of things that were put into place to give people with disabilities or what have you equal footing.

I find it so frustrating, part of me saying "take the high road" and the other saying "well no one seems to care if anything is really wrong anyway so cheat your way through". When we stand that handicap line, knowing we're in the right while we get mad at the cheaters, who's winning?

I also think this whole political correctness is way out of hand. When did it get to be that you're not handicap, you're differently abled, or you're not blind but visually impaired? In some cases I get it but it's gotten to the point where it's easier not to question someone who may be cheating or faking something because they'll probably wig out and try to sue because you're "discriminating''.

Let me also say that I don't think certain things are as serious as people make the out to be. I have ADHD, clinical depression, type 2 diabetes, insomnia and some recent fainting issues that's in the process of being diagnosed, and not to be all high and mighty but I don't walk around using those issues as a crutch and demanding special treatment. I really think people need to learn to make do, or use coping mechanisms rather than instantly playing the "medical issues" card.

So now as I step off my Disney themed soapbox, let me remind you this is all just my opinion, my frustrations, and by no means am I including any of you in these vents nor am I saying that every single person does this stuff. I expect someone to rant back at me, so bring it on!

I totally agree with you. It does get very frustrating to see people cheat the system EVERY DAY!!! Like you, I personally wouldn't mind having to show "proof" of my daughter's disability. But, unfortunately, hers is obvious by looking at her! However, I can see where some people would take offense in having to show proof of disability...some people are just more private and personal want to disclose that information. But, I also think that the ones who would throw the BIGGEST fit are the ones who don't truly need the accommodations to begin with. But, like you, that's just my opinion anyway.

 

[kristenrice]

This thread caught my eye and I think I have found the place to get my question answered. Please bear with me as this is not Disney related, but it is in reference to service dogs.

I work as a paramedic and we recently encountered a call involving an alleged service dog. The dog was skittish, shaking and cowering in the corner so we really doubt it was trained as anything more than a companion. The patient insisted that the dog must accompany her in the ambulance to the emergency room. (FWIW, there was no "emergency" involved) So, my question is, can we, as health care providers, prohibit a service dog from riding in an ambulance?

My thought was "yes" for several reasons. First, the disabled person is in constant care of a medical professional. There *should't* be an acute need for the service animal in that setting. Second, there is no way to secure a dog in the back of the ambulance. Turning a corner could be enough to turn them into a projectile, even if they were crated. Third, some of the procedures we do could be construed as "aggressive" by the dog and our safety may be in danger if the dog decides to defend its owner.

In the recent case, there was a high level of suspicion that the dog was NOT a service animal, but what about when the dog clearly IS a service animal? How would we go about getting a service dog to the hospital with it's owner in a manner that is safe for all involved? I think if it were a small dog and a crate was readily available, it would be a little easier. But with a larger dog (golden, shepherd, etc) there would not be room for a crate in the back of the ambulance. Then what?

 

[lunapnp]

This thread caught my eye and I think I have found the place to get my question answered. Please bear with me as this is not Disney related, but it is in reference to service dogs.

I work as a paramedic and we recently encountered a call involving an alleged service dog. The dog was skittish, shaking and cowering in the corner so we really doubt it was trained as anything more than a companion. The patient insisted that the dog must accompany her in the ambulance to the emergency room. (FWIW, there was no "emergency" involved) So, my question is, can we, as health care providers, prohibit a service dog from riding in an ambulance?

My thought was "yes" for several reasons. First, the disabled person is in constant care of a medical professional. There *should't* be an acute need for the service animal in that setting. Second, there is no way to secure a dog in the back of the ambulance. Turning a corner could be enough to turn them into a projectile, even if they were crated. Third, some of the procedures we do could be construed as "aggressive" by the dog and our safety may be in danger if the dog decides to defend its owner.

In the recent case, there was a high level of suspicion that the dog was NOT a service animal, but what about when the dog clearly IS a service animal? How would we go about getting a service dog to the hospital with it's owner in a manner that is safe for all involved? I think if it were a small dog and a crate was readily available, it would be a little easier. But with a larger dog (golden, shepherd, etc) there would not be room for a crate in the back of the ambulance. Then what?

As a medical professional myself (nurse practitioner) and as the parent of a child with a SD, my first and foremost concern would be with the patient. I can see why someone would want their service dog with them, but from a medical standpoint, what happens IF the patient takes a turn for the worse and is unresponsive. Then what? What are you going to do with the dog when you get to the hospital? Who is going to watch after the dog while the patient is receiving care? To me, at that point the person is no longer able to be in control of their SD. I, personally, would not want to take the liability of taking the SD in the ambulance. If there is a kennel or crate in the house, I would rather place the dog in the crate and leave it at home. Hopefully, the patient will have someone to call to come take over the care of the SD. But, I just wouldn't want the liability of taking the dog in the ambulance then to the hospital. I'm sure the nurses and docs in the ED will LOVE you for leaving a SD with them!

 

[kristenrice]

As a medical professional myself (nurse practitioner) and as the parent of a child with a SD, my first and foremost concern would be with the patient. I can see why someone would want their service dog with them, but from a medical standpoint, what happens IF the patient takes a turn for the worse and is unresponsive. Then what? What are you going to do with the dog when you get to the hospital? Who is going to watch after the dog while the patient is receiving care? To me, at that point the person is no longer able to be in control of their SD. I, personally, would not want to take the liability of taking the SD in the ambulance. If there is a kennel or crate in the house, I would rather place the dog in the crate and leave it at home. Hopefully, the patient will have someone to call to come take over the care of the SD. But, I just wouldn't want the liability of taking the dog in the ambulance then to the hospital. I'm sure the nurses and docs in the ED will LOVE you for leaving a SD with them!

That is my line of thought too. My co-worker who encountered this situation was unsure if she had the legal right to refuse to transport the SD in the ambulance. We certainly do not want to set ourselves or our company up for a discrimination suit, but we also want to protect everyone involved. Even our supervisors were unsure. It seems to be a bit of a gray area.

 

[LockShockBarrel]

This is an interesting question. My father was taken by ambulance after being in a car accident just to be checked out because of his slew of medical problems, and the dog was allowed to ride in the back with him, but he wasn't in a critical situation or anything.

I can see where this could be a REALLY touchy situation. If someone is in a critical condition and can't respond if the dog is a service dog or not, if they're just panicked and want the companionship. Plus if you were picking this person up at their home or another home, chances are the dog wouldn't have the harness or blanket on, and if it sensed the owner was hurt or injured they could become very agressive out of a protection instinct, or just scared because they don't know what's happening.

If memory serves hospitals have to allow a SD to remain with the owner should there be no one else to care for it, but the whole ambulance thing is a big

 

[SueM in MN]

That is my line of thought too. My co-worker who encountered this situation was unsure if she had the legal right to refuse to transport the SD in the ambulance. We certainly do not want to set ourselves or our company up for a discrimination suit, but we also want to protect everyone involved. Even our supervisors were unsure. It seems to be a bit of a gray area.

Your organization should have a policy that deals with this (if they don't, they should write one because this could come up again). I wrote our hospital system's policy on service animals, so did do some thinking and reading into the subject. Our policy also passed the system's legal and risk assessment department. I am not a legal expert, but I do know that SD's can be banned from certain areas, based on the risks.

The ADA says that people with disabilities may bring their dog into public places (or another way to put it, places where anyone is allowed). The inside of an ambulance is not a public place (someone can't just walk up to an ambulance and jump in). For non-public places, someone would need to do an assessment of risk to see whether or not it is safe for the animal to be inside the rig (this can be in your policy).

There are a lot of concerns regarding an animal inside the ambulance (along with the ones which were already mentioned):
- Infection Control; you could potentially be doing some invasive procedures. Having a dog present during an invasive procedure would increase the risk of infection to your patient.
- Space is a consideration. The inside of an ambulance is small and packed with equipment. The dog would potentially impact the ability of the ambulance staff to be able to reach and/or use equipment that is necessary to care for the patient.
- You can take into account that either the animal or the handler may act in an unexpected and unpredictable manner, which may put your patient in danger.
Here is a reference having to do with service animals in hospitals which may be helpful.

You can probably find more policies on line, but here area couple to look at:
New York State EMS

This is a pretty good article also.

The main things are safety and whether having the animal in the ambulance would 'fundamentally alter the service provided."

 

[dclfun]

This is an interesting question. My father was taken by ambulance after being in a car accident just to be checked out because of his slew of medical problems, and the dog was allowed to ride in the back with him, but he wasn't in a critical situation or anything.

I can see where this could be a REALLY touchy situation. If someone is in a critical condition and can't respond if the dog is a service dog or not, if they're just panicked and want the companionship. Plus if you were picking this person up at their home or another home, chances are the dog wouldn't have the harness or blanket on, and if it sensed the owner was hurt or injured they could become very agressive out of a protection instinct, or just scared because they don't know what's happening.

If memory serves hospitals have to allow a SD to remain with the owner should there be no one else to care for it, but the whole ambulance thing is a big

According to my dog's trainer, NO SD can EVER show ANY aggression for ANY reason( pardon my caps, but this is very important). The reason for this is the exact above situation. A dog could easily misconstrue medical assistance as an aggressive act towards his/her handler and respond inappropriately. So, no... if the dog is a legitimate SD, you wouldn't need to be concerned about that . Most handlers would not want their dog to be crated however SD's should be trained to lay in a designated area and to stay there upon command, even inside an ambulance. SD's are not allowed in operating rooms but are allowed in ER's, but it should not be the hospital or paramedic's responsibility to care for the dog. If a patient is hospitalized he/she has to be able to take the dog out to relieve itself and provide food/water OR have another person come to perform those tasks regularly. If a paramedic arrived on the scene and found a cowering, shaking dog, then the dog would not be behaving like a SD. A dog that is in a fear state cannot usually follow commands or assist anyone, so no, I'd not have wanted to transport the dog either as it could be unpredictable. Since someone needs to be able to handle the dog besides hospital staff, if the patient was unconscious or otherwise unable to give commands, then no, I'd not have wanted to transport the dog. Sounds more like an ESD perhaps who is a comfort animal . ESD's do have the right to be in housing where pets are not allowed but do not have rights to accompany a person in public where pets are not allowed. The reason for this is that they are usually not trained and there is no requirement for them to be temperament tested since they are only in the home with the person wanting the emotional support.---Kathy

 

[ireland_nicole]

This whole thing is so confusing sometimes! I know I'll probably get reamed out for this one but I really think that requiring proof for some of this stuff is a GOOD thing! So many people nowadays have such a "me first screw you" attitude, the rules don't apply to them and all that business. It's not fair to people who have legitimate issues when people cheat the system, renting wheelchairs when they don't need them, faking reasons for needing an SD, taking advantage of things that were put into place to give people with disabilities or what have you equal footing.

I find it so frustrating, part of me saying "take the high road" and the other saying "well no one seems to care if anything is really wrong anyway so cheat your way through". When we stand that handicap line, knowing we're in the right while we get mad at the cheaters, who's winning?

I also think this whole political correctness is way out of hand. When did it get to be that you're not handicap, you're differently abled, or you're not blind but visually impaired? In some cases I get it but it's gotten to the point where it's easier not to question someone who may be cheating or faking something because they'll probably wig out and try to sue because you're "discriminating''.

Let me also say that I don't think certain things are as serious as people make the out to be. I have ADHD, clinical depression, type 2 diabetes, insomnia and some recent fainting issues that's in the process of being diagnosed, and not to be all high and mighty but I don't walk around using those issues as a crutch and demanding special treatment. I really think people need to learn to make do, or use coping mechanisms rather than instantly playing the "medical issues" card.

So now as I step off my Disney themed soapbox, let me remind you this is all just my opinion, my frustrations, and by no means am I including any of you in these vents nor am I saying that every single person does this stuff. I expect someone to rant back at me, so bring it on!

I'm ever so slightly concerned that it seems assumed that some kind of argument would be a desired outcome... but will only comment on the "faking" part of the post. Unless you hear someone say that they have no medical condition and are simply choosing to ride around in a wheelchair for some perceived benefit, or you have psychic abilities, you cannot possibly know if they are faking. This is an issue in which those in the disabled community need to cooperate more fully and stand united in. My children and I face no fewer challenges because our disabilities aren't obvious to the very casual observer. In the same way that our justice system encourages us to consider someone innocent until proven guilty, we must as a community consider someone disabled until proven not. Otherwise we actually contribute to the discrimination.

 

[kristenrice]

Thank you so much for all the helpful information posted here!

You have really answered a lot of my questions pertaining to SD's in my line of work. I will be sure to relay the information to my supervisors and OPM and recommend that they instill a formal policy regarding the transport of SD's. Luckily, it is not something we frequently encounter, but it is good to be prepared.

 

[Stellapedia]

It's not fair to say that a SD can never be scared. My dog is impeccably trained and Mickey's Philharmagic terrifies him. I can't train that out of him. He can go to a movie, he can sit through a rock concert, he can ride a train, he can go on the spinning teacups... but Philharmagic scares him. I don't know why. So we avoid it. Which sucks because my son LOVES it. But I can make concessions to the dog, lord knows he makes enough concessions to us. He used to also be scared of the bridge to the monorail at the polynesian. I have no clue on that one either, but he's gotten over that.

There are some situations that can't be trained into a dog. You can prepare for most, but not all, eventualities. I can't train Disney into a dog. I can't train an ambulance ride into a dog. They might be stellar dogs. They might have wonderful behavior and talents. They might not act like any dog anyone has ever seen. They might put up with things other dogs never would. But they are still dogs. They're not people, they're animals. Wonderful animals, but animals nonetheless. Animals do not have logic, they have instinct. You can't train logic into them or instinct out of them. If my dogs instinct tells him to do something, no training in the world can (or should) override that.

 

[dclfun]

It's not fair to say that a SD can never be scared. My dog is impeccably trained and Mickey's Philharmagic terrifies him. I can't train that out of him. He can go to a movie, he can sit through a rock concert, he can ride a train, he can go on the spinning teacups... but Philharmagic scares him. I don't know why. So we avoid it. Which sucks because my son LOVES it. But I can make concessions to the dog, lord knows he makes enough concessions to us. He used to also be scared of the bridge to the monorail at the polynesian. I have no clue on that one either, but he's gotten over that.

There are some situations that can't be trained into a dog. You can prepare for most, but not all, eventualities. I can't train Disney into a dog. I can't train an ambulance ride into a dog. They might be stellar dogs. They might have wonderful behavior and talents. They might not act like any dog anyone has ever seen. They might put up with things other dogs never would. But they are still dogs. They're not people, they're animals. Wonderful animals, but animals nonetheless. Animals do not have logic, they have instinct. You can't train logic into them or instinct out of them. If my dogs instinct tells him to do something, no training in the world can (or should) override that.

Absolutely! Many dogs have fears- mine doesn't like the busses at WDW and although she tolerates them and stands beside me, I know she's having a hard time. When she is in this fearful state though, she is NOT behaving like a SD and would likely not be able to assist me due to where her mind is at the moment. Fear brings out the survival instinct which then moves to the forefront of the brain and once in that mode, it is difficult if not impossible for a dog to respond to the handler. I didn't mean that fear would mean a dog is not a SD, just that a dog cannot behave as one if they are in the midst of being terrified. I don't mean a small amount of fear or trepidation....but shaking and cowering ( as mentioned by the PP) means they are very fearful.---Kathy

 

[LockShockBarrel]

I wasn't trying to invoke an argument, I was just playing the odds that someone would probably disagree with what I had to say.

As far as not everyone's issues being evident by sight, I get that, my point is that some people could easily take advantage of something like that and just say they have something wrong, you just can't see it.

On another note, I completely agree that you can't say a SD cannot EVER EVER EVER be aggressive, you simply cannot always predict a dogs behavior in an unknown environment. For instance, at Guiding Eyes for the Blind where both of our dogs have been raised, a part of their training is noise sensitivity. The dogs are taken to a field where guns are shot into the air, plates are smashed, fireworks are set off, all to watch for animals who react badly toward this who are then weeded out of the program, and to show them that not all loud noises are bad. Even with this training, our dog still barked and was not comfortable with the JAMMinators, especially when they started walking towards him. Not growling or snarling by any means, but a good warning "back off buddy" bark. Outright aggression is another matter, if an SD is snapping or growling at things on a regular basis, obviously there's something wrong there. In my opinion, I wouldn't mind knowing that if someone was threatening my or someone in my family's safety, that our SD would get aggressive in that type of situation, even if it were just growling, just enough to say "hey these are my people and I mean business!.

 

[inkkognito]

As a counselor, I have provided letters for airlines for clients with emotional support dogs; because ESAs are not protected under the ADA or its airline counterpart, they do not have to just take a person's word and some are very strict.

On the service dog front, I pity people with real service dogs as I agree with the PPs who have said that a real SD (or a person for that matter) is going to get hurt someday by a fake. We were at a theme park this summer and saw a dog with a bright, pretty Autism Dog vest, probably purchased off Ebay the week before the trip. How do I know it was BS? The child was having a major meltdown, and the dog was lunging, struggling, and nearly pulling the kid's mother's arm off to get AWAY from the kid in the other direction. So there she is trying to juggle a freaking out kid on one end and a freaking out dog on the other. True trained service dogs do not behave that way.

 

[christymarie]

As a counselor, I have provided letters for airlines for clients with emotional support dogs; because ESAs are not protected under the ADA or its airline counterpart, they do not have to just take a person's word and some are very strict.

On the service dog front, I pity people with real service dogs as I agree with the PPs who have said that a real SD (or a person for that matter) is going to get hurt someday by a fake. We were at a theme park this summer and saw a dog with a bright, pretty Autism Dog vest, probably purchased off Ebay the week before the trip. How do I know it was BS? The child was having a major meltdown, and the dog was lunging, struggling, and nearly pulling the kid's mother's arm off to get AWAY from the kid in the other direction. So there she is trying to juggle a freaking out kid on one end and a freaking out dog on the other. True trained service dogs do not behave that way.

Our Autism Service dog is trained to go down on her belly when our DS starts melting down or trying to run away and she resists him. It's hard to run when you are dragging a 80lb dog behind you. I will say, however, that if he does become aggressive towards her I will unhitch them and just deal with him but even then she stays in her "down" until I release her. I have no idea why anyone would want to take an untrained SD anywhere with a child who has special needs. I can imagine people lying about their dogs service dog status to avoid having to place them in the kennel but you really don't gain that much.

It's just baffling.

 

[dclfun]

As a counselor, I have provided letters for airlines for clients with emotional support dogs; because ESAs are not protected under the ADA or its airline counterpart, they do not have to just take a person's word and some are very strict.

On the service dog front, I pity people with real service dogs as I agree with the PPs who have said that a real SD (or a person for that matter) is going to get hurt someday by a fake. We were at a theme park this summer and saw a dog with a bright, pretty Autism Dog vest, probably purchased off Ebay the week before the trip. How do I know it was BS? The child was having a major meltdown, and the dog was lunging, struggling, and nearly pulling the kid's mother's arm off to get AWAY from the kid in the other direction. So there she is trying to juggle a freaking out kid on one end and a freaking out dog on the other. True trained service dogs do not behave that way.

How sad for this family. I've unfortunately heard of organizations who claim to train SD's for people with autism, charge quite a bit of money for the dogs, and then the dogs are totally untrained or are glorified pets who have only had basic obedience. Sounds like this family got one of those dogs vs. one that could actually help their child. You are right of course, either way, fake or untrained, this dog was NOT behaving as a SD.

As to aggression, from my dog's trainer ( at Paws with a Cause, a large SD organization training mobility assistance, hearing, autism, and guide/mobility dogs), SD's cannot show an ounce of aggression or they will be washed out immediately if/when they do. A CM at Disney that I met trains dogs for PWAC from puppyhood. All of his dogs were successful and were placed with people to assist...except one. She made it all the way through a YEAR of intense and specialized training and then the day before being placed, she snapped at someone. She was retired on the spot from being a SD. If my dog were ever to become aggressive by growling or snapping, I would have to retire her. I could not take the risk of her hurting anyone and myself or PWAC being liable if she did. ---Kathy

 

[SueM in MN]

We were told by the trainer for DD's dog that the dogs often become very protective of their 'person', but that protective was a lot different than agressive.

 

[LockShockBarrel]

Protective! That's the appropriate word, thanks Sue! Good to be protective, bad to be aggressive.