US police officer rebuked for drawing gun in snowball fight

[happygirl]

AFter all those poor police officer were shot in Seattle maybe you should there families if this police officer should have pulled his gun or not. After all that guy wasn't doing any illegal when those police officer saw him either

I'm out of this thread and won't be back.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

Like I said earlier he sees a mob of people and feels something hit his car, There is no reason to being throwing snowballs where they could hit a moving car or a parked car.

A group of people alone is not a justifiable reason. He could have flashed his badge and likely have been just as effective. The distance he was from the crowd, if they happened to have in anyway shown they were of legitimate danger, he would have had time to pull his weapon. Noone was doing anything to him that was a threat to his life or his safety. And on the video--it even looked like while holding the gun, he was going to the ground to get a snowball himself. (I really could not tell easily--but that is what it seemed.)

So for him to be concerned about his safety, he has time to point his gun to the ground to fetch some snow?

Hence, why he had his weapon taken away and he assigned desk duty.


You are right--no reason to throw snowballs--but his reaction was over the top and he was punished accordingly.

That would be like taking your serving position and placing you at the hostess stand. While some may see that you would have enjoyed the break, it was not the job you were hired to do and likely nothing you'd really enjoy if it was done as a response to a poor decision you made on the job.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

AFter all those poor police officer were shot in Seattle maybe you should there families if this police officer should have pulled his gun or not. After all that guy wasn't doing any illegal when those police officer saw him either

I'm out of this thread and won't be back.

Review the video--how he holds his weapon is indicative of an individual who isn't concerned for his life or safety.

 

[SwedishMeatball]

Alright Rich, grab the rum and put everyone back in good cheer.

 

[agnes!]

One thing is drilled into your head when you handle guns.... NEVER, and I mean NEVER ever point a gun at someone unless you intend to kill them. If it's out of your holster you sure as heck better intend to cause bodily harm. You can't just threaten someone with an unholstered weapon unless you intend to pull that trigger.

agnes!

 

[ginna74]

Review the video--how he holds his weapon is indicative of an individual who isn't concerned for his life or safety.

I agree it was SCAREY looking...

 

[diznygirl]

AFter all those poor police officer were shot in Seattle maybe you should there families if this police officer should have pulled his gun or not. After all that guy wasn't doing any illegal when those police officer saw him either

I'm out of this thread and won't be back.

Translation please?

I think someone already had the eggnog.....

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I reviewed the vidoe again--the guy wasn't arrested for throwing the snowball at the Hummer. He pelted the cop after he had shown his weapon and was already calling for backup. (clarified by the commentary of the observers.)

 

[Jennasis]

Show dominance?? With a gun?? Maybe the officer could've just peed on them or humped somebody's leg instead? Far less dangerous...though just as likely to get him put on desk duty.

 

[Jex]

Show dominance?? With a gun?? Maybe the officer could've just peed on them or humped somebody's leg instead? Far less dangerous...though just as likely to get him put on desk duty.

How was him pointing his gun at the ground dangerous? You saw how they treated him even after they saw he was a LEO, so how do you think the mob would have responded if he had got out unarmed?

 

[DarthKTrava]

How was him pointing his gun at the ground dangerous? You saw how they treated him even after they saw he was a LEO, so how do you think the mob would have responded if he had got out unarmed?

It's the fact that when he brought out the gun, it upped the ante on things. And the crowd's mood changed as a result. Now THEY felt threatened.

 

[krcit]

It's the fact that when he brought out the gun, it upped the ante on things. And the crowd's mood changed as a result. Now THEY felt threatened.

Exactly!! I showed the video to my DH(a cop) and even he thought the cop handled the situation very poorly.

 

[Jennasis]

How was him pointing his gun at the ground dangerous? You saw how they treated him even after they saw he was a LEO, so how do you think the mob would have responded if he had got out unarmed?

Anytime a gun is drawn it's dangerous. I'm no anti-gun nut. I have several. You don't pull it out unless you intend to use it. And he shouldn't have gotten out of his car in the first place. I would not classify a group snowball fight as a mob.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

How was him pointing his gun at the ground dangerous? You saw how they treated him even after they saw he was a LEO, so how do you think the mob would have responded if he had got out unarmed?

We'll never know.

And in the manner in which he held his gun--it is clear that he wasn't doing it for his safety, but rather--to be a butt and misuse his authority with a dangerous weapon.

So there goes the argument that he was worried and felt threatened.

He was miffed and inappropriately utilized his weapon to gain the upper hand.

Had he just shown his badge, likely he would have had a similar response and not gotten into trouble.

A cop can't just whip out a gun whenever he/she feels like it. There has to be just cause and the way he handled his weapon demonstrated that even he didn't feel the need to have it out for his own personal safety.

Can't say I've seen to many cops draw weapons, but in all real life footage (news and/or survelliance--not reality tv shows) of any gun draw where a gun may be needed, I've never seen a cop hold their weapon in that manner in a dangerous or perceived dangerous situation.

So while his gun *may* not have been dangerous to the spectators, he essentially put a target on himself in the event someone might have been armed...by drawing his weapon and not being prepared to use it--especially by taking his eyes off the crowd, and kneeling to the ground to get some snow while the gun was pointed down.

So those that try to defend his actions of saying the weapon was necessary over some fear of safety--his body language in no way indicates that.

 

[bumbershoot]

AFter all those poor police officer were shot in Seattle maybe you should there families if this police officer should have pulled his gun or not. After all that guy wasn't doing any illegal when those police officer saw him either

I'm out of this thread and won't be back.

OK I get where you're going with this. You have the thought that the 4 cops were witnessing something innocent and innocuous, and were surprised by the guy's true intent.

But that certainly isn't what I have heard about it. (meaning...they barely had the *time* to notice the guy...not that they weren't surprised...surprised is certainly what they were...that first sentence before editing in this parenthetical thought sounded really really wrong)

But backing up, it happened in Lakewood, not Seattle. Almost an hour south of Seattle.

The cops were just sitting there reviewing stuff before their shift, at a coffee shop. I haven't been to the Lakewood one, but I've been to 3 other Forzas in the area. It's a nice open space where you can see the outside b/c of full wall windows, and the tables are well spaced and there's no hidden space.

The BIG scary dude walks in, with a gun, while on parole....so right there, that's doing something illegal. I don't know if he had it out in the open, but I'm assuming it wasn't totally hidden b/c he had to have brought it out FAST. So I figure it was behind his back.

Big scary dude walks in, right up to those cops, shoots repeatedly. From what I heard, only one managed to fight back at all. He was FAST. (and should I repeat scary? I drive a Grand Marquis, a silver one, and people react to the car as though I were a police car ALL the time...I didn't drive anywhere until the dude was gone)

Big scary dude was not carrying snowballs. He can't have been carrying *anything* but that gun. And he was frighteningly bold and scary and aughhhhhhh.


I'm sure that the police officers in the area (and many civilians, like the ones that drive police style cars) have re-learned vigilance and being on alert.

But I do NOT think that the legacy of that should be...if people are having a snowball fight it could be a Lakewood/scary criminal moment, and I should respond as though it were such a situation.


And if a police officer is going to start reacting in that way...they need to have a time out in the form of desk duty. IMO.

 

[declansdad]

So he was a detective so that explains why he didn't have a uniform on and probably drove a unmarked car. It sounds like you have a personal issues with this guy?

You always have a unique perspective on these issues.

 

[Plannin'Shannon]

You always have a unique perspective on these issues.

I hate to say...I was just thinking the same thing.

Nice summary, Lisa loves Pooh. Spot on.

 

[livie1205]

my dh is a cop and No WAY would he have acted that way!! They teach them to start with a certain type of force given the situation and THAT was NOT life and death at that point.

 

[Pugsley]

How was him pointing his gun at the ground dangerous? You saw how they treated him even after they saw he was a LEO, so how do you think the mob would have responded if he had got out unarmed?

Interesting that you're so new here and you feel so strongly about this. Is that YOU Officer Baylor? Is desk duty so boring that you are surfing the net and have found the DIS?

P.S. Even the DC chief of police called what he did "totally inappropriate"

 

[DancingBear]

I'm pretty sure police training for dealing with mob situations does not include standing there challenging folks to "Throw another snowball. Go ahead..." Dude was way out of line.